Im a one computer at a time kind of guy. I dove into intel in 07 with a macbook. I liked it but ended up selling. Been back with powerpc ever since. I love my current ibook. Got it for 100 and have invested 150 more. Right now im debating between adding a superdrive or removing the optical drive and adding a 2nd hard drive. Most likely an ssd for a start up drive. Thats 100-160 bucks that could bring my grand total to 410. Its not worth it from a resale standpoint obviously but when do we give up on ppc and move on for good? For the sake of conversation why do you all stay with ppc? Please no "it does all that i need" type answers. Real techies have a much closer connection to hardware than what it can do.
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When do we bite the intel bullet?
- Thread starter jchase2057
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Some of us use both architectures - with Intel around for heavy number crunching (Mathematica and Final Cut Studio + Logic Studio + ProTools in my case), and PowerPC around as Servers, or for a Photography Laptop. The reason Im not still all PowerPC is a lack of rendering speed on PowerPC, but for some things I do (OS 9 apps) - I still use my 8100/100 and 7500/132, and I still use my MDD as my iTunes Machine because it enhances what I can do with my setup. I also use some PowerPC Machines for other purposes for hardware reasons (PB1400s keyboard for instance), or for simplicity (Dedicated Outlook Machine for instance - Outlook 8.2.1 for OS9 works just fine with Exchange 2003, so no need to migrate)
The time to move to Intel is when your current setup no longer fullfills your need speed wise, or software wise.
The time to move to Intel is when your current setup no longer fullfills your need speed wise, or software wise.
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Personally, I've stuck with PowerPC as I haven't the incentive to move to anything more recent.
The Power Mac G4's were built like a tank, and although the G5 was plagued with issues from the start, they can still hold their own against the modern desktops in terms of normal day to day use, i.e email, internet, videos, music.
I can still surf the internet, watch Youtube, code applications, compose Keynote presentations, work with iMovie/Final Cut Pro, load gigs of music/videos in iTunes.....you get the idea. On my G5, with some of that on my G4's.
As mentioned by chrismacguy, the PowerPC Macs are great for servers too when one does eventually migrate to newer, Intel Mac machines. Especially the G4's, their very good overall reliability ensure they last for many more years even after all PowerPC support is cut (if it isn't already the case).
They are perfectly capable machines, so just run them into the ground. Then you won't have a choice but to to Intel
The Power Mac G4's were built like a tank, and although the G5 was plagued with issues from the start, they can still hold their own against the modern desktops in terms of normal day to day use, i.e email, internet, videos, music.
I can still surf the internet, watch Youtube, code applications, compose Keynote presentations, work with iMovie/Final Cut Pro, load gigs of music/videos in iTunes.....you get the idea. On my G5, with some of that on my G4's.
As mentioned by chrismacguy, the PowerPC Macs are great for servers too when one does eventually migrate to newer, Intel Mac machines. Especially the G4's, their very good overall reliability ensure they last for many more years even after all PowerPC support is cut (if it isn't already the case).
They are perfectly capable machines, so just run them into the ground. Then you won't have a choice but to to Intel
I agree with whats been said. I just thought it would make a good conversation thread because the way i see it, the people who change systems every 5 to 10 years are usually more passionate about their computer than those who upgrade every 1 to 3 years. I have more admiration for a heavily upgraded powermac than a mac pro. I understand some people need the mac pro or the new quad core mbp but a lot of people do not. People still running ppc hardware seem to be the passionate mac users and its interesting to hear from those users.
I have both, i use my mac pro for studio design and windows gaming, and i use my Powermac G5 2.3 x800xt for ppc gaming and stuff like NWN. In all honesty, i could use the powermac also for my studio design, but i does run my cintiq a lot better on the pro.
That said my ppc PM rocks and i love using it
That said my ppc PM rocks and i love using it
My ibook g4 is still working like a charm, no dead pixel, long battery life, os is very stable compared to windows where you always need to format .
It's also built like a tank , i dropped it two times and brought it everywhere with me and it has never let me down. Considering i am the second owner of this laptop since i bought it on ebay, this is pretty impressive.
It's starting to have a lot with of difficulties with flash though (youtube ,etc)but it's still doing everything else fine.
I am interested in your ssd thing, i did'nt know it was compatible ,is it ? Since i won't buy the 13' inch model because of the intel graphics i'd be interested in investing couple bucks in that thing.
But is it that hard to change the hard drive, i heard it,s pretty complicated, is there some user here who already did it ?
It's also built like a tank , i dropped it two times and brought it everywhere with me and it has never let me down. Considering i am the second owner of this laptop since i bought it on ebay, this is pretty impressive.
It's starting to have a lot with of difficulties with flash though (youtube ,etc)but it's still doing everything else fine.
I am interested in your ssd thing, i did'nt know it was compatible ,is it ? Since i won't buy the 13' inch model because of the intel graphics i'd be interested in investing couple bucks in that thing.
But is it that hard to change the hard drive, i heard it,s pretty complicated, is there some user here who already did it ?
I don't mean to critique the thread title but there is no time that we all bite the bullet as each of us is an individual and will make different choices.
I already have bitten the Intel bullet as I have a 1.83GHz C2D mini I never speak of running my living room media centre. When on the sofa though I prefer to use the ibook G4 1.2GHz my girlfriend donated to me for all my couch computing. I use the mini strictly for playing 720p/1080p h.264 and also rip DVD's on it now and then.
For personal use though I will use PowerPC for as long as I possibly can and still do everything I need. My Sawtooth is already more powerful than what I really need so I still have room to grow with it.
I think the money I have invested into my Sawtooth and the fact I have 2 spare towers shows my dedication to the architecture. I am actually thinking of buying one more spare for 3 or maybe even 2 more for 4 total spares. Add that to the fact that I also have great hardware like a G4 1GHz upgrade just as another spare part and plan to still buy the dual 1.8 7448 and single 1.6 7447. I embrace the architecture and want to use it as far as I can into the future.
I already have bitten the Intel bullet as I have a 1.83GHz C2D mini I never speak of running my living room media centre. When on the sofa though I prefer to use the ibook G4 1.2GHz my girlfriend donated to me for all my couch computing. I use the mini strictly for playing 720p/1080p h.264 and also rip DVD's on it now and then.
For personal use though I will use PowerPC for as long as I possibly can and still do everything I need. My Sawtooth is already more powerful than what I really need so I still have room to grow with it.
I think the money I have invested into my Sawtooth and the fact I have 2 spare towers shows my dedication to the architecture. I am actually thinking of buying one more spare for 3 or maybe even 2 more for 4 total spares. Add that to the fact that I also have great hardware like a G4 1GHz upgrade just as another spare part and plan to still buy the dual 1.8 7448 and single 1.6 7447. I embrace the architecture and want to use it as far as I can into the future.
Ive changed the hard drive on my g4 ibook to the 250gb. Its a little tricky to do but if youre good with computers it shouldnt be a problem. There are how to guides online if you need it. Yes they make ide ssd drives. Not many and theyre a little more expensive but they make them. What i might do is replace the optical drive and put a ssd in there. It allows plenty of room for an ide to sata adapter. A buddy of mine has a tb drive in his with an ide ssd as his startup drive.
Yeah, sorry.
The day to bite the bullet and migrate is the day that Apple stops shipping security updates for OSX 10.5 Leopard.
Having a secure and supported computing platform > an irrational attachment to a particular CPU architecture.
Spending hundreds of dollars on spare parts, $400 for a single 1.8ghz G4 upgrade, or $800! on a Dual G4 Upgrade doesn't make sense for anyone but the most zealous collector-fanboy.
The value proposition for the average user is absolutely terrible.
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10.5 is already far more secure than any other mainstream OS out there and equal to BSD/Linux. Even 2-3 years after Leo stops getting updates it will still be more secure than some.
The main thing that makes a secure computer in the first place is a discriminating knowledgeable user. If someone is ignorant to proper security in the first place then even the most secure modern OS on earth won't save them.
Obviously I am zealous. My solution is for me and me alone and I recommend everyone's be their own. Pardon me for not letting the industry dictate what I use and actually having a preference that goes beyond performance I don't need.
I am obviously no average user. Apparently you're a little slow at picking things up.
You can only speak for yourself as can anyone else..
For me personally i like making my computer my own. An old ibook that is different than all the other mac laptops in the room is more important to me than having the latest os. Even if it cost me more than a nice used macbook. If im a fanboy for buying non cost effective upgrades then fine. Personally i think a fanboy is one who thinks what they prefer is somehow superior to another persons preference.
I can kinda play both sides here... I have intel machines that I use for pro work and PPC macs that I use as 'toys.' Now before you start flaming me... I love the PPC macs... it's the only reason I still have them around since they were the first macs I used. However... lets be real... they are old, they are slow, and they simply cannot keep up with anything more intensive than a text based website.
I have an SSD inside and iBook and it did make it much much faster... snappier than my MacBook Pro when it comes to loading files, however it is still hamstrung by the lack of memory, the slow CPU... and I can say the same for almost everything else... in my opinion, any ppc slower than 1Ghz.. isn't that useable for modern day tasks... I have and have had PPC ranging from 500Mhz all the way up to Dual G5's... the G5's are still very capable machines but anything less than that is simply not worth it...
For the most part... the PPC's I keep around (my iMac G4s and iBooks) are simple mementos... although I don't plan on getting rid of them... I have more powerful machines to suit my needs... they are not ideal machines any longer... and I have to say... the time of the PPC mac is long gone.
I have an SSD inside and iBook and it did make it much much faster... snappier than my MacBook Pro when it comes to loading files, however it is still hamstrung by the lack of memory, the slow CPU... and I can say the same for almost everything else... in my opinion, any ppc slower than 1Ghz.. isn't that useable for modern day tasks... I have and have had PPC ranging from 500Mhz all the way up to Dual G5's... the G5's are still very capable machines but anything less than that is simply not worth it...
For the most part... the PPC's I keep around (my iMac G4s and iBooks) are simple mementos... although I don't plan on getting rid of them... I have more powerful machines to suit my needs... they are not ideal machines any longer... and I have to say... the time of the PPC mac is long gone.
Of course you're not an average user, you're quite simply an odd iconoclast who is willing to spend an inordinate amount of money and make all sorts of usability and productivity compromises in order to keep PPC as your primary platform far into the future. And you vision of computer security as being completely up to user behavior is quite flawed, this isn't ten or fifteen years ago when the vast majority of malware relied on user behavior to initiate infection. Most modern malware actively seeks to infect, either scanning the internet for networks with open ports and known security vulnerabilities or malware is embedded into webpages and launches direct injection attacks.
Users running older unsupported versions of Java or older TCP/IP stacks ARE vulnerable, you DRASTICALLY overestimate the security of the platform.
And the needs of the Average user are easy to estimate.
They are security, vendor support, cost-effectiveness, compatibility with work or school, and the ability to get tasks done in a timely manner.
Not being able to use a promising program that one encounters, work requires, or one might want to use because its 'Intel Only', or not being able to get a bug that inhibits the usability of a program fixed because "sorry PPC is no longer supported" is a significant affront to usability as it is, and it will only get worse over time.
The functionality of a system starts to evaporate when the software eco-system that has been supporting it evaporates.
Adobe just shipped its last version of PPC-Flash, which works fine for right now, but what happens when it ships Flash 11 or Flash 12 and the vast majority of the content out there no longer accessible to you because you are told to install an updated plugin that doesn't exist?
What happens when web-content over the next few years becomes an order of magnitude more demanding, rich web applications start to appear and browsing the web on your machine becomes painfully slow?
These are the signs that for the average person, a PPC Mac is no longer going to be suitable as their primary machine, but you'll overlook all of that the way a creationist overlooks the fossil record.
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I understand what youre saying crammedberry but i dont have "pro" work that i need to do. For those who need more powerful machines they should get them. I do more than just text based websites on my ibook. I rip dvds, use imovie hd a bit, use some emulators, and lots of other every day things. I would like to up to a 1.33 logicboard if i can find it cheap enough but until then im fine. Most things people do today they were doing in 05. They cant run all the latest software but theyre still very capable machines. Im sure ill go intel agin eventually but when i do ill prolly get an 07 macbook and use the money i save doing upgrades/mods.
for me it's simple matter of $$$....i just can't see paying $1000-2000 for a computer (just use computer for basic internet)....i also love taking things apart (for no reason other then the joy of doing it),so i don't feel afraid to rip into a $100-200 pp....
Okay so you value having a conversation piece and being noticed while you're in the coffee shop over anything else.
Why even start this thread then?
Computer choice as a fashion statement.
Venomz, everyone has a certain budget for computer parts. What they buy is up to them. To some owning a computer is more than just having it to do your work. Its their hobby. I would never invest the money to completely trick out a ford escort, but ive seen it done and its still cool. And to that person its completely worth it because they want more than then newest and fastest car on the road. I know a guy with a g3 imac that he completely gutted and filled it with an intel mini and a lcd display. Some say you voided your warranty or you wasted your money or youre wasting desk space and are stuck with a 15 inch display. A hobbyist that sees the same thing thinks its the coolest thing ever. Youre leaving out the fun factor in computers.
No, I do all of that.
I have projects.
I just don't use a PPC mac as my primary machine for all of the reasons listed above, those are relegated to "toy status."
Moving on doesn't mean throwing out all of my older stuff, it means knowing when to move on from it as my primary platform.
The fact of the matter is that almost every average user could easily get buy on a PowerPC of at least 700MHz. Current intel Macs offer many times the power you need to do web/email etc. which is all most people do.
Some buy more than they need out of ignorance but most do it just for how pretty it is or to brag about the specs.
Some buy more than they need out of ignorance but most do it just for how pretty it is or to brag about the specs.
But if the most serious work someone needs to do can be done on their "toy" machine then why buy a new one when they could spend less modifying and upgrading what they have?
You missed the part about the clock ticking when it comes to being able to get security updates or as it relates to them being viable web-browsing machines, huh?
You're constantly dictating your standards as if they are everyones. Don't speak for me for anyone else you delusional goon.
You do not have to use my or anyone else's PowerPC hardware so leave us to your own devices. You seem surprised and confused about the fact that people who hang out in the PowerPC forum like PowerPC.
Honestly.. what do you care what computer hardware I or anyone else uses. You're so goonish that you can't imagine anything outside your own delusions.
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no one is saying ppc forever. Of course eventually well all have to upgrade. That doesnt mean theyre not fine for right now. Plenty of people are still using 10.4 and even 10.3. You are underestimating a capable users ability to keep themselves secure.
You have proven a few times to us here that you are inept and probably not capable of using your judgement to protect yourself online and need software to do it for you.