When will be the next OS jump?

Discussion in 'macOS' started by gustavopi, Mar 28, 2017.

  1. gustavopi macrumors member

    Oct 29, 2008
    I still didn't try to upgrade to de all new Sierra, to install El Capitan was traumatic enough. Today I did the latest update, not before a Carbon Copy backup. It was... usual: the system won't restart (are you sure wanna restart?), than black screen, white screen... I pick my guitar to keep my mind clean meanwhile the MacBook go crazy! But after half hour (even with SSD) it was completed, so it was usual!

    I lived the jump from Classic to the Unix version that Apple take almost a decade to accomplish (for real). I remember it was a shock! We lost speed and some "newer" aspects of Classic, we had to learn unix and type commands, etc., but Mac OS X really changed the world, all other system has basically tried to be like this.

    But we have reached two limits, thought:
    • Mac OS X is not getting any better every new version as system, as before. I don't think they don't have qualified people inside Apple to improve it, maybe the model has reached the limit. Every project has a limit.
    • it's a heavy 64 bit system single version with all you might want or like, with a lot of process that does not work in old or week machines and there is no flavors as Ubuntu, not even a 32 bit version as Windows. But unlike before, old machines are still very capable machines. Mac OS X is "free" because the cost is inside Mac price, a limitation in a world full of used Macs. The marketing plan has a limit either.
    I know a jump like this is painful, but my body is asking for it, soon! When do you think we will be shocked again by Apple?
  2. CoastalOR macrumors 68010


    Jan 19, 2015
    Oregon, USA
    My guess would be that 10.13 would be released sometime the end of September 2017.

    Here is the recent history of past OS release dates:
    9-30-2015 OS 10.11.0 released
    9-20-2016 OS 10.12.0 released
  3. kissmo macrumors 6502a

    Jun 29, 2011
    Budapest, Hungary
    The next jump...
    Well in terms of OS - the next jump is very hard to predict. Who's to say it is going to be Apple?
    From where I stand it's not a matter of good developers, it's a matter of visionary.

    We all wish for next jumps - Apple got us used to it to the point that sometimes we embrace it without too much thought.

    It may have something to do with Augmented Reality but I see the next big jumps more like steps towards it.
    People are already on that trend. We expect yearly updates, each increment gets us closer.

    Believe me, I am also ready for a change. A big one! But somehow I have the feeling these changes are not going to be what we imagine.
    Palo Alto is no longer the only source and home of the WOWs. Companies grow, startups appear like mushrooms after rain, many of them coming up with interesting products - they just lack Apple's approach when it comes to polishing and fine tuning.

    Apple - shocking us? Maybe in terms of HW sooner than SW - but this is just my point of view.

    For the sake of excitement - I hope I am wrong about it and Apple will prove me wrong on WDDC!

  4. maflynn Moderator


    Staff Member

    May 3, 2009
    I don't think Apple is going to spend a lot of time, money and energy to undertake a major rewrite/upgrade/improvement of OS X given that the PC market is in a steady decline.

    Imo, they seem to be positioning iOS as the future of computing and not Macs. I mention this, because it doesn't make business sense to undertake a major over haul on a product that has a limited future (at least in their eyes)
  5. Morpheo macrumors 65816


    Feb 26, 2014
    I was wondering the same thing... Seeing the last Sierra update bringing yet another iOS feature to macOS makes my eyes roll, again. macOS is a desktop OS, and so far Sierra has proven to be a useless upgrade for me - in fact many of the background tasks are slowing things down quite a bit, at least at login. Apple has said many times that OS X and iOS are too different animals, yet they keep bringing iOS features to their desktop OS. Nightshift.....:rolleyes:

    If it weren't for 2 of my major applications that now requires Yosemite or later, I would still be on Mavericks, the last OS X/macOS version that truly felt like "Mac OS". I'd like macOS to have some exclusive and attractive new features, features only made for desktops Macs (and laptops obviously), just like iOS should continue to add exclusive features made for mobile devices. I'm not saying that they should be radically different, I like the visual consistency and everything (despite that stupid font change...after all Lucida Grande would look great on an iPhone too...), but if iOS and "the mobile world" is leading the march now, they're still covered by the tanks in the background...
  6. Ebenezum macrumors 6502a

    Mar 31, 2015

    I agree that many of the features implemented in the latest OS versions have very little benefit (I don't care about iOS, Siri etc.)

    As for will Apple release a new seriously improved desktop/laptop OS I don't think that is likely since they seem to think all the money is in the iOS.

    I would be delighted to see real groundbreaking features but given the direction Apple has been following I don't think thats likely... :(
  7. Fishrrman macrumors G5


    Feb 20, 2009
    Coastal wrote:
    "My guess would be that 10.13 would be released sometime the end of September 2017."

    Might even come sooner than that...
  8. gustavopi thread starter macrumors member

    Oct 29, 2008
    By reading those comments, it seams to me iOS - mobile products is a reason (although not the only one) for don't invest in huge changes - cultural changes. The mobile "invention" was already a change and it is jumping inside desktop / notebook, that is descending in market share. But I must remind that those awesome mobiles are kinda dependent on Macs. When the iPhone die, you just don't have to take it to nearest iPlace (sometimes not so near) because you can attach it to your Macbook and heal it. Also, large Internet and funcional cloud are not real for most of the world - we still need notebooks and desktops as we need cars.

    Also, I don't see big difference between iOS and MacOS for years, both have similar issues. Is not only Apple's fault, as we see, for instance, the Uber app too heavy for a iPhone 4 (I've just sold one, still a good machine). But Apple got the mission of to lead software development to a new better place.

    Last year, I sold an old PC (really old). I'd install a Windows 7 and Xubuntu on it. Also, I did install some simple games to demonstrate how that old machine was still funcional. You know, when playing Virtual Rally 2, Odd World or Dark Colony I was thinking why do we need to trow in the garbage old Macs with so much more quality that this Pentium 4? I know Apple will not put the A team to develop a system for old machines, but this is a abandoned market all around the world, unexplored because of the marketing model. This won't happens with old cars, I have a 2002 Ford Fiesta fully functional. Why not making some Mac Linux for those machines for a reasonable price or a light version of newer MacOS?

    I think more than a new awesome system, there is a space today for a new model of software development. This could be a new big jump.
  9. Superspeed500 macrumors regular


    Jul 25, 2013
    I do not belive that computers will go off the market any time soon. Power users and gamers still need powerfull computers, and a tablet can't replace that. I have a desktop-Pc for gaming, iPad Pro for taking notes and reading light documents on the go and a MacBook Pro for everything else.

    The average user won't need computers, but not everyone is an average user.
  10. Jyby macrumors 6502

    May 31, 2011
    I disagree, you can expect Apple to rewrite major components in Swift. The Doc is already rewritten for example.

    I imagine a macOS + iOS merge at spme point. All the signs of this are emerging... APFS, Swift, Metal, 64-bit only apps, and Apples plans to create their own graphics. I see a future where our phones can dock and become our desktops for productivity. Apple said they wouldn't do it, but it's going to happen eventually.
  11. maflynn Moderator


    Staff Member

    May 3, 2009
    Switft is a programming langauge, its not part of the operating system.

    I think APFS is definitely a great thing, but they didn't do it just for the macs but they also did it for iOS, becaue they needed something more modern for those devices.

    Metal is definitely a nice move and was quite unexpected when they rolled out it. As for 64 bit only, I would hope because it is 2017 and we've had 64 bit machines for a very long time at this stage.

    None of what you wrote however is compelling evidence to suggest that OS X is a major focus for Apple. I hope we will see a major update to it in WWDC but I fully expect some minor tweaks to the yosemite code base.
  12. Jyby macrumors 6502

    May 31, 2011
    Your point on Swift is true, it is a language... And Apple is using it to rewrite their codebase. I have software friends doing this now for Apple. Question for you is, why would they rewrite the code, just in Swift, without considering the opportunity for improvement. It's a no brainer.

    My points suggested unification across platforms. Of course the devices have their specific differences, but unlike the Apple watch, the iPhone and Mac have a lot of crossover. Major optimization achieved on iOS can definitely improve the Mac. Greater crossover and probably unification is a major upgrade.
  13. maflynn Moderator


    Staff Member

    May 3, 2009
    Mostly because when you change too many things at once you open the door to some significant bugs. To put it another way, you're converting over to a new language AND making changes to the code, that will make it harder to debug. Most developers I know prefer to get the new code locked down and working and then update the code with new features. I work in the IT industry and I was a developer back in the day. I'm now a system admin and work closely with a team of developers. I see how if they make too many different changes in the code because that leads to bugs and difficulty in rooting them out. They generally avoid such major conversions while adding features.

    I agree, but I think its more about making OS X more like iOS instead of making a more powerful OS as they march towards each other.

    How? What specifically in iOS can be used in OS X that will be a major optimization?

    Given that you cannot do much in iOS, its much more locked down, i.e., no visible file system, I'd say that OS X will be less feature rich in any unification and that's not something I want.
  14. gustavopi thread starter macrumors member

    Oct 29, 2008
    I had my own experience that is a small demonstration (at list as concept) of the problem of rewriting code. When I write the code for a website, I obviously got my modules, my library, and for many years AS3 were included. Some media tasks, file managing, etc. works good and Flash got a nice productivity. But I had to move on an now I only use JavaScript and PHP (I work alone). I didn't have a chance to improve usability of my admin modules, they are functional but ugly and simplistic. I was a hard decision, but necessary to keep bugs in a level I can manage.

    I doubt Apple will perform a jump as Classic to OS X because that time was unique, Jobs sacrificed Next to do it - an all company were burned to make it possible! Even so, wasn't easy, should I mention Adobe software running only in emulators? But I believe is possible to take advantage of some new technics, new programming resources and new hardware customizing possibilities. Apple could think about to sell an OS inside a flash drive with processing capabilities to make it possible to run needed resources (have you seen this around). What I think can't be done and keep upgrading the same OS forever.
  15. zarathu macrumors regular


    May 14, 2003
    I don't know what you are asking. I recently jumped from Snow Leopard to Sierra. At first, I thought that the newer operating system was junk, but now the features of it are functional for me. I think some of them have devolved, like the desktops, but the increase is security is substantial.

    The problem is that if you have old hardware, then some of the features will not be implemented, and some of it will be slow. Using Snow Leopard on my old iMac i5, it took an hour to make a 55 minute movie. Now on my very late 2013 MBP 15 quad i7 2.6, it does the movie in 6 minutes.

    You may need to consider a hardware upgrade. Even though Apple allows you to run the latest systems on some very old machines, sometimes its just not worth doing that due to speed and quality issues.
  16. Zarniwoop, May 5, 2017
    Last edited: May 5, 2017

    Zarniwoop macrumors 6502a

    Aug 12, 2009
    West coast, Finland
    I've mentioned this before on some other threads here, but:

    MacOS is waiting for Metal to be completed. It will be a big jump and it will make more powerful apps possible and GPGPU programming easier. No more separate GPU drivers for openGL and CL and Metal. Just one driver, and old GL and CL will become legacy api's, that'll work as an emulation layer on top of Metal. Apple will save millions. Nvidia could make a return after that too...

    One driver to rule them all...

    APFS joined with security enclave ARM chip will take care of encryption and security in future Macs. That could be considered as a jump too? Intel CPU wouldn't have direct access to internal SSD & external drives any more... Touch bar was just en extra feature of security ARM chip, that was finished before APFS... Also, webcam and Siri will start their lives inside the ARM chip. Intel CPU will have more free time for real work and ARM can take care of the rest.

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