grandmachar2002
macrumors member
Im thinking early 08 mbp is where its at then
which : USB or Firewire audio interface + MB or MBP ??
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Im thinking early 08 mbp is where its at then
Yes, but he has a voucher for an Apple store, and they don't have early MBPs, unfortunately. So it's kind of a hit'n'miss affair, unless he goes for the whitebook (which he prefers not to).
marbles
macrumors 68000
So basically speaking neither the macbook nor macbook pro will be suitable for my audio requirements.
No firewire on macbook.
Dodgy chipset on the MacBook pro firewire port .
No point getting a Expresscard firewire adapter because that probably won't work either .
Looks like I will have to rethink buying this Apple Mac .
hmmmm.
rj
Yes, but it _might_ work. You will have to research on a specific adaptor with a specific interface, just like you will have to research on a specific interface with the "ordinary" FW connection. Some will most likely have tested it for you. However, the next interface you buy could be having problems with either of them.
The whitebook WILL work, though.
There is also an option to buy a PC. Yes, heresy I know, but the computer is but a small part of your setup. Personally, my next computer will be a PC because I think it's all over for Mac laptops used for video and audio work.
grandmachar2002
macrumors member
ah... what about a 17"?
marbles
macrumors 68000
thanks for trying to help , I appreciate it , very much .
but ...
Have you seen the price of the 17"
, not only that , they are the ones which have the time bomb graphics I've read so much about recently , I really wanted a machine that would give me little to no hassle (a Mac supposedly), not one with an officially noted issue , that's why I was thinking of getting a [late 2008] MacBook pro but.....The thing is , I was anticipating buying one of the black 2.4 Macbooks but then the new metal ones came out .
( the extra cost because of the colour/ bigger HD wasn't really an issue on the black MB because of the voucher ) .
BUT
when the new macbooks came out , no firewire ! and more expensive !! ? ,also the macbook pro firewire is to all intents and purposes useless apparently for connecting audio gear.
So looks like I'm screwed in respect to buying a Mac for what I want to do , from the looks of it a Mac might be alright if I just wanted to use the machine for messing about on the net or watching videos but I don't .
sorry for the rant , I'm just peeved that I have spent months researching Mac and software etc only to find I might have to buy a windows PC box of some sort just to make audio
this is crazy !
but what to do ?
cheers
rj
*edit , what about a macmini ? they are small enough to take to gigs and such but I hear the mini may be updated in January and I cannot really wait that long . maybe .
if I where to buy a mini now and hope that the laptops have a refresh not soon after January ? that might work as it'd give me time to get used to how it all go's with gear and such , then , IF these current laptops get refreshed I could then sell the mini and put the money into a refresh ....phew
thoughts please
oh,
before you give thoughts ,I'd consider the current white macbook if they had the newer cpu and DDR3 RAM , not sure what to make of the pricing of that machine , isnt it more than it was before the alu macbooks came out ?
rj
xparaparafreakx
macrumors 65816
I just did a party last night, early morning today. DVS + Macbook Air, what a dream.
I do not understand why you need a machine with firewire if your going DVS. If your looking to save money, a used or last gen machine will be fine. I DVS with a Air Gen 1, so anything is better then that. (Air screen is way better then a normal macbook screen )
Mac mini requires you to bring a screen, keyboard and mouse. Laptops are all in one and that it is easy to carry. You should be able to find a last gen Macbook for the price of a new mini.
I do not understand why you need a machine with firewire if your going DVS. If your looking to save money, a used or last gen machine will be fine. I DVS with a Air Gen 1, so anything is better then that. (Air screen is way better then a normal macbook screen
)Mac mini requires you to bring a screen, keyboard and mouse. Laptops are all in one and that it is easy to carry. You should be able to find a last gen Macbook for the price of a new mini.
marbles
macrumors 68000
I just did a party last night, early morning today. DVS + Macbook Air, what a dream.
I do not understand why you need a machine with firewire if your going DVS. If your looking to save money, a used or last gen machine will be fine. I DVS with a Air Gen 1, so anything is better then that. (Air screen is way better then a normal macbook screen
Mac mini requires you to bring a screen, keyboard and mouse. Laptops are all in one and that it is easy to carry. You should be able to find a last gen Macbook for the price of a new mini.
cool
The firewire [I think] I need is for recording dj sets and work done with Ableton & Logic Express , just for better audio quality really , most say firewire is best , although not with the dodgy firewire in the late 2008 MacBook pro notebooks?. let me know if you know different .
I hear what you say about the screen to take with the Mini but sure one would/could be provided at venues .
That's another thing about the current white macbooks & the previous gen , the screen is not great , cracks are a high possibility , intel integrated graphics card is somewhat slow etc etc etc , so I feel stuck in that there is not really a machine for me from Apple .for the purpose I intend .
rj
xparaparafreakx
macrumors 65816
You do not need a graphic card unless you plan to use Logic Studio's Mainstage. An integrated card is good enough unless you plan to DVS with Video.
Firewire is only needed if you are doing multiple channel recording. According to what your doing, your going to hook up the REC out from the mixer to the input on the Audio Interface to record what your doing. A USB audio interface should be able to do that.
Then with that same device, hook that up to your mixer or monitor and use that with Logic Studio or Ableton or both with rewire.
Firewire is only needed if you are doing multiple channel recording. According to what your doing, your going to hook up the REC out from the mixer to the input on the Audio Interface to record what your doing. A USB audio interface should be able to do that.
Then with that same device, hook that up to your mixer or monitor and use that with Logic Studio or Ableton or both with rewire.
24bit/96kHz is good enough for just about anything. And for most things 44.1 kHz is plenty.
The Novation SL keyboard controllers are highly regarded. I'm thinking of getting one myself.
I'm currently using a Focusrite Saffire LE with a Mac Mini and a 2007 MacBook Pro, but I'm thinking about buying a new MBP. I checked with Focusrite tech support and although they generally recommend TI chipsets, they don't foresee any problems with the new MBP. So I'd say that once you settle on an interface you should check whether it'll be a good match and you might not have any problems.
marbles
macrumors 68000
You said "for most things " what would you say requires 24/192 not being funny or anything just curios to what people think about what requires what level of recording .
Either the Novation 25 SL(poss the 49) looks to be the top runner just now but the Akai MPK49 has recently caught my eye too .
Have you looked at the Akai mpk49 ? , if you did , whats making you go for the Novation ? , I cant decide .
The trouble is "might not have any problems " is in no way good enough to make me part with my hard earned . Like you said though mate I'm gonna have to 'make sure' by contacting audio interface manufacturers ....
* rant alert *
oh this is a pain to have to do all this really , I was hoping for more from Mac machines .
any further thoughts appreciated ,
cheers
rj
marbles
macrumors 68000
when you say "multiple channel recording" I guessed I will be doing that with the decks , keyboard , mic and MIDI all going in or is that not multichannel recording ?
see I just don't understand this bit , how exactly will all the gear I mentioned above be hooked up through an audio interface and then into the computer ?
what makes it multi channel recording exactly .? ( and no one say recording multiple channels lol ).
I might not always hook up all of it at the same time but I probably will for the most part .
cheers
rj
xparaparafreakx
macrumors 65816
USB is going to be fine for what your doing.
Don't let these people throw you off. Unless your not DVS, do not listen to their adivce on interfaces. Serato won't run on them, Traktor will run but you can't use your tables with a different mixer.
Don't let these people throw you off. Unless your not DVS, do not listen to their adivce on interfaces. Serato won't run on them, Traktor will run but you can't use your tables with a different mixer.
marbles
macrumors 68000
now this is getting confuzzling , your telling me not to listen to him and he's telling me not to listen to you
look at post No.23 in this thread , the edit at the bottom specifically .
It looks like this below
I havent been able to link to the thread , I'm crap a that stuff but...
I'm really confused here guys .
I just want the most suitable computer machine for my work , and to be able to get the audio gear I need to earn a living this coming new year . and to teach me kids how to play piano in spare time
cheers
rj
side note ,sort of ! : ...Tosser I notice your in 'time out ' at the moment ?,
man I hope you come back soon to help clear this up a bit.
cheers guys
rj
mugtastic
macrumors regular
if you're plugging everything into a mixer and just recording the stereo output in the computer, usb might be okay. if you are plugging everything into the interface (several stereo inputs, a mic etc. plus controlling midi) - that is multichannel recording (with the live "monitoring" being the sound of your live performance).
ableton is great, you'll need at least an 8 input interface, it has to be firewire and if the voucher is a deal breaker then the still offered new whitebook is the best choice - that version is locked down and solid - when the new firewireless macbooks were announced i immediately bought a refurb 2.4 white. just like my original whitebook except better performance with ableton.
you could use the 4 input (2 preamp) presonus firebox if you sum the turntables to a stereo bus in a mixer. i went with the 8 input motu ultralite, but i record drums to 8 tracks.
ableton is great, you'll need at least an 8 input interface, it has to be firewire and if the voucher is a deal breaker then the still offered new whitebook is the best choice - that version is locked down and solid - when the new firewireless macbooks were announced i immediately bought a refurb 2.4 white. just like my original whitebook except better performance with ableton.
you could use the 4 input (2 preamp) presonus firebox if you sum the turntables to a stereo bus in a mixer. i went with the 8 input motu ultralite, but i record drums to 8 tracks.
marbles
macrumors 68000
Thanks for chipping in mate .
Deffo will need the firewire then like you say , thing is though how do this all work regarding DVS ? , the other guy above was saying that only each specific DVS companys software will work only there own hardware ? and not with something like the ultralite mkIII
why 8 input for Ableton ?, please
also
**** do I wish I hadn't waited and got the blackbook now
, ah well ... maybe I will go for the 2.1 but it's such a bitch when a few weeks back a more powerful version was available for less money , that stinks , arrrgghh still , the voucher does make it a little easier to swallow.still not sure
cheers
rj
" sum the turnatbles to stereo bus in a mixer " ...what you mean like use a real dj mixer or ...?sorry mate don't really understand ...I'm crap at this words on screen thing ..
cheers ,
rj
24bit recording is a very good thing. The extra headroom is very useful even if it's going to end up as 16 bit.
I don't think you need to worry about 192kHz at all. If every element of your recording chain is top end pro gear, you're an experienced pro recording engineer yourself and you're recording jazz or classical in a properly designed studio or concert situation, then you might want to consider it, but you'll quite possibly be happy with 24/96.
Some studio engineers don't see a need to go beyond 44.1kHz. If the final product is a CD then it keeps things very simple...there's no sample rate conversion necessary. I work in radio and record everything at 44.1 as there really wouldn't be any advantage in going any higher.
The Akai may be just as good, or could be even better for your needs. It's been a while since I tried the Novation, but at the time it seemed like it had plenty of functionality, a good quality keyboard with a nice action and it got a lot of good reviews. I was going to buy the SL61, but got too busy with other things to worry about getting more music gear. I now have a little more time, so I'm looking at keyboards again. I should really check whether something better has come along though.
grandmachar2002
macrumors member
what are peoples feelings on the apogee duet?
mugtastic
macrumors regular
always record at 24 bit (you'd think it wouldn't make a diff. if it ends up on a cd (16 bit) or mp3 - but it does.
the summing and bussing stuff just means putting all you're sources into a little mixer and then just recording a "premixed" stereo output. this is only good if you want a record of your performance - you can't mess with stuff later - this is called mixing and is the whole point of using a home studio creativey. this "summed" stereo recording method is the only way you could get away with a usb interface.
the "new" less powerful whitebook will be plenty powerful.
i use 8 inputs at a time for recording drums in ableton. how many will you use? 2 turntables (stereo), and a mic (without any "summing") is 5 already!
apogee makes great stuff - the duet is 2 channels - so you could record one stereo turntable, or a voice mic and guitar, plus whtever midi you have going on.
the summing and bussing stuff just means putting all you're sources into a little mixer and then just recording a "premixed" stereo output. this is only good if you want a record of your performance - you can't mess with stuff later - this is called mixing and is the whole point of using a home studio creativey. this "summed" stereo recording method is the only way you could get away with a usb interface.
the "new" less powerful whitebook will be plenty powerful.
i use 8 inputs at a time for recording drums in ableton. how many will you use? 2 turntables (stereo), and a mic (without any "summing") is 5 already!
apogee makes great stuff - the duet is 2 channels - so you could record one stereo turntable, or a voice mic and guitar, plus whtever midi you have going on.
marbles
macrumors 68000
I thought it was better to get the highest recording possible , so was going to go for 24 / 192 for just the reasons you suggest ( there are some many differing opinions on this thread tho ').are you sure I'd be using 5 channels by just having the decks going or are you assuming I would not be running through a dj mixer ?
I guess I've 'summed' for years then as I've used 2 or 3 decks and a mixer for like well over 20 years now.
I was a pro club/event dj in the late 80's early 90's but never had to set up any gear like this ( mentioned earlier in the thread I think) someone did it for me back then , times have changed now so....
What I need to be able to do is record my sets which will include me using DVS of some sort ( probably traktor Scratch pro or Serato I'm just waiting to see what the recent serato/ableton collaboration announcement comes up with ya know ) playing time coded vinyl using 2 or more likely 3 Technics tt's. added to this will be Ableton Live with a keyboard / controller / punch pad / sampler of some description and a mic .
Also have Logic Express 7 which I may or may not keep depending on this purchase.
still no clearer
rj
xparaparafreakx
macrumors 65816
Okay. I been reading up how to add ableton live to my set up and now with all the BS info being given to you, I am going to have to try TSP + Ableton Live on my own and prove that it works.
Do you have a DJ mixer? How many channels does it have?
Are you going for:
Channel 1: 1200 timecoded
Channel 2: 1200 timecoded
Channel 3: Ableton Live
Or were you going to have the master out from the mixing from two tables go back to ableton where you were going to add effects to it?
Please tell me so I can try it out and show the wiring and set info for you. Ill test it out before you even drop a dime on your system.
Do you have a DJ mixer? How many channels does it have?
Are you going for:
Channel 1: 1200 timecoded
Channel 2: 1200 timecoded
Channel 3: Ableton Live
Or were you going to have the master out from the mixing from two tables go back to ableton where you were going to add effects to it?
Please tell me so I can try it out and show the wiring and set info for you. Ill test it out before you even drop a dime on your system.
marbles
macrumors 68000
Top man yourself , thanks for taking the time man . much appreciated .
Well , I don't exactly know how I'm going to integrate it all (DVS+Ableton)
all I know is I need the functionality that Ableton gives to both remix and create + loop etc on the fly , it would be great to be able to do this & add effects to everything like whatever is playing through the DVS & Ableton etc....everything man ...., I want it all
sorry , I'm really greedy when it comes to my music .At present I have a 2 channel mixer BUT am about to buy another ( check me other threads )
More than likely what ever mixer I buy will have 4 or 5 channels .
cheers
rj
PS .
Would you record what your doing on video ? no bother if not , just a thought , just I know a guy who is looking for 'online dj kit demonstrators ' and you have been very help full as has everyone who has responded so far .
A little conflicting info here and there but I guess that is just you guys getting to know what I'm actually going to do with all this kit and as I'm probably about as clear as mud when it comes to explaining , well .... anyway , thanks all , I look forward to carrying on this conversation , I am learning a lot about the digital dj world( gord I feel old ) , and digital music as a whole and am sure searchers in the future will find this thread helpful .
cheers
rj
mugtastic
macrumors regular
right, i guess i was thinking of putting all your sources to the computer and using ableton to manipulate from there. goes to show the problems of an recording guy giving advice to a dj guy.
if a dj guy knows this compatability stuff i'd go his way - i'm sure it would be fine. the "still offered white macbook" will handle so much more than any usb recording option can throw at it.
if you want to record any more than 2 channels of audio at a time (more than just the stereo output of your turntable mixer) i'd be wary of usb. if someone says that, from experience, they've added a mic or something to make it 3 tracks i can't argue.
just know that if you delve further into multitrack recording the first thing you'll replace is a usb interface.
(p.s. - after looking at my 1st response i've no idea why i said you needed an 8 channel interface...sorry)
if a dj guy knows this compatability stuff i'd go his way - i'm sure it would be fine. the "still offered white macbook" will handle so much more than any usb recording option can throw at it.
if you want to record any more than 2 channels of audio at a time (more than just the stereo output of your turntable mixer) i'd be wary of usb. if someone says that, from experience, they've added a mic or something to make it 3 tracks i can't argue.
just know that if you delve further into multitrack recording the first thing you'll replace is a usb interface.
(p.s. - after looking at my 1st response i've no idea why i said you needed an 8 channel interface...sorry)
xparaparafreakx
macrumors 65816
rjsfnd, I got some good news for you.
While in the bathroom reading Computer Music, I must be the only american that reads this AWESOME UK magazine, I reread the review of Deckadance and how I can run it as a VST. That mean you can run it inside Ableton Live 7 and still have time code control and use all those great things about Live. Im downloading the program and reinstall Live 7 right now.
Im going to try TSP also since it is my favorite DVS program to use.
Ill take pictures and maybe make a video if I have time. Being in college and this only being a hobby makes it hard for me to put all my time into it.
Yea I know, it is a hobby but I DJ only for close friends because iTunes smart playlist sucks.
UPDATE:
I shall let the picture do all the talking. I need to buy serato vinyl to try out the timecoded part.
While in the bathroom reading Computer Music, I must be the only american that reads this AWESOME UK magazine, I reread the review of Deckadance and how I can run it as a VST. That mean you can run it inside Ableton Live 7 and still have time code control and use all those great things about Live. Im downloading the program and reinstall Live 7 right now.
Im going to try TSP also since it is my favorite DVS program to use.
Ill take pictures and maybe make a video if I have time. Being in college and this only being a hobby makes it hard for me to put all my time into it.
Yea I know, it is a hobby but I DJ only for close friends because iTunes smart playlist sucks.
UPDATE:
I shall let the picture do all the talking. I need to buy serato vinyl to try out the timecoded part.
