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Why can Apple do this?

T

Tech198

Cancelled
Original poster
Mar 21, 2011
15,915
2,152
I know the reason I'm guessing anyway, on why Apple can make thin, good looking stuff based on the companies/manufacturing, but instead of PC's trying to compete by bring out the ASUS, or similar devices/laptops etc... They always skimp on materials, or the fact "it's not AS thin as the Mac"

Can't these manufactures who manufacture for PC components just go after those companies who do it forA Apple? Rather than competing, and getting nowhere.

Those same manufactures might be make stuff for PC's to... The same way intel does the same chip for Mac and PC (technical details aside).

So what's the story? I bet PC people would gladly pay extra $$$ just for the same look if the same manufacturing can done from one.
 
So what's the story? I bet PC people would gladly pay extra $$$ just for the same look if the same manufacturing can done from one.
Click to expand...
That is the one biiig problem for those manufacturers. They wouldn't or not enough would. Most people just care about the price primarily.
Apple's designs work with the few products they have and the huge quantities they sell but PC manufacturers cannot sell such quantities also they need their parts to be more reusable and not develop one for each new notebook.
Apple also has the benefit of many sales to people who really don't care much about the good screen or whatever but just because it is an Apple. If you have a big base of such buyers there is much more freedom in what you can spend money on R&D in manufacturing and design.
 
You mean: why can't PC manufacturers mimic Apple's designs?
Because they don't have the designers.
Because there are patents out there.
Because they don't have the skills to engineer a very tight design in a very small space.
Because they don't have as much cash flow as Apple to invest in research and development.
Apple is releasing things that might been "created" 3 or even more years ago, until those 'new' things hit the market they went through an enormous quantity of design review iterations until they are finally approved by Steve.
 
Of course they can, and have. Gateway has long copied apple. HP has copied apple on the MBP designs and Acer is copying the MBA design.
 
McGiord said:
You mean: why can't PC manufacturers mimic Apple's designs?
Because they don't have the designers.
Because there are patents out there.
Because they don't have the skills to engineer a very tight design in a very small space.
Because they don't have as much cash flow as Apple to invest in research and development.
Apple is releasing things that might been "created" 3 or even more years ago, until those 'new' things hit the market they went through an enormous quantity of design review iterations until they are finally approved by Steve.
Click to expand...

PC's tend to be a lot more powerful, especially the GPU. So more power = more space required for cooling etc. You just can't have a wafer thin powerhouse PC unless it's a VAIO laptop and to get a high-end VAIO you have to pay the premium price.

MacBook's struggle to keep cool under heavy load, hence the reason why they get crappy GPU's and why the MacBook Air's run a ULV i5 & i7 instead of a 'proper' i5 & i7 like you get in a thin VAIO S or Z.

iMac's don't even use desktop components, instead they rely on mobile components. It's why PC's completely wipe the floor with them when it comes to performance.

But performance doesn't matter that much these days. Even a basic specification is good enough for 95% of users. It's only professionals & enthusiasts that pay through the nose for power they don't really need if the truth be told.
 
maflynn said:
Of course they can, and have. Gateway has long copied apple. HP has copied apple on the MBP designs and Acer is copying the MBA design.
Click to expand...

It could be strongly argued that Apple copied Sony's X505 for the original MacBook Air, but what does it matter? Everyone gets their ideas from elsewhere. The only truly unique design feature of the MacBook is the touchpad, which is quite simply light years ahead of anyone else's take on it. But Apple didn't invent the touchpad, they just perfected it.
 
McGiord said:
You mean: why can't PC manufacturers mimic Apple's designs?
Because they don't have the designers.
Because there are patents out there.
Because they don't have the skills to engineer a very tight design in a very small space.
Because they don't have as much cash flow as Apple to invest in research and development.
Apple is releasing things that might been "created" 3 or even more years ago, until those 'new' things hit the market they went through an enormous quantity of design review iterations until they are finally approved by Steve.
Click to expand...

That's nonsense.

It's 2011, there's nothing remarkable about producing a sleek looking laptop. Plenty manufacturers are perfectly capable.

The reason other manufacturers don't bother is simple ... People are still buying their stuff. They haven't taken a significant hit in sales/profit. Companies only exist for profit, and if they are making profit, they won't change a thing.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
 
Apple charges more (a lot more), but provides a product and software combination that seems to support their strategy. You can spend more and get better build quality PC's. Sony use to this but have also chased the lower priced market and they have laptops that show it. Business class machines are a much better build.

The Dell XPS 15z laptop also tries to charge more for the design. I have one I just received from their outlet ($810). Sandy bridge i5, 1080p display, aluminum case, discreet graphics. The keyboard is plastic/cheesy - why you do this for the thing the customer touches everyday I'll never know. But it's a nicely designed machine that I'm going to have trouble returning (13" MacBook pro on the way).
 
the only comparable pc laptop ive seen thats good is the hp envy laptop.

its not unibody but ive seen it in store, its pretty solid
 
Because somebody has to make cheaper computers for the general public, and the majority of the market. I'm sure PC manufacturers can go out and focus on design, quality, and form factor... But that would mean they'd have to pay more money for top designers, great engineers, and high quality parts... Then what happens to the general consumer who walks into best buy and just wants a cheap computer? Or the consumer who just cant afford to pay over $1200 for a computer? This is probably the majority of America, and is the reason why the PC market will continue to dominate no matter how popular Apple computers continue to get.
 
It has more to do with market and price positioning than product design capability.

Most PC makers are competing on price....they do not command the brand equity that Apple does.

Apple charges a pretty substantial price premium for their products, however, the Apple brand has enough equity to justify the price in the minds of Apple customers. Also, Apple commands a monopoly over OSX, unlike the PC manufacturers who are constantly competing against one another. If you want to run OSX, you're going to have to pay the Apple tax. No questions asked.

The PC market is very much driven by specs and performance, and in order to keep prices competitive and squeeze out the most performance for the buck, design and build quality often take a back seat.

It wasn't until recently that Apple became a competitive threat to PC makers, and they've recently gone all out and are starting to released products built to stand toe-to-toe with Apple from a design standpoint, while also being well spec'd. Interestingly enough, as much as PC users bark at the price premium that consumers pay for Apple products, the recent offerings from Sony, Samsung, and Dell that are aimed at Apple, cost as much or more than Apple equivalents.

Many of these products are very, very nice, but I'm wondering how consumers will react to PC's priced in the range of Macs. From a design and spec standpoint, they're worth the money, however, brand equity and the 'coolness' factor mean a lot to consumers...particularly when they're dropping a lot of coin on 'premium' electronics. I'm not sure that anyone, outside of Sony, has the brand equity to pull that off.
 
Maybe also because sometime Apple is more radical (or brave) in mindset changing. Recent samples are fixed memory on main board, SSD modules not in standard size ( at that time), lack of optical devices, no user replaceable batteries ...

Sometime Apple is also more stubborn: Blue ray, USB 3 ...

The other manufacturer might not fully understand and adopt to those ideas; that's why they fail.

Expecting many -1 on this one :(
 
I think this only applies to their mobile products, but from what I read (i cant source sorry), apple funded the equipment to produce the retina display in return for a contract that said the retina display wont be sold to any other manufacturer for x amount of time. Other companies capable of producing a retina-like display have too high costs/too slow production time for it to become a significant part of the market.
 
Xgm541 said:
I think this only applies to their mobile products, but from what I read (i cant source sorry), apple funded the equipment to produce the retina display in return for a contract that said the retina display wont be sold to any other manufacturer for x amount of time. Other companies capable of producing a retina-like display have too high costs/too slow production time for it to become a significant part of the market.
Click to expand...

And also long term contract for flash memory which just sucks the market empty and don't leave enough for the competitors.
 
God > Apple > Rest of the World

Some even say, God = Steve

That would probably explain everything.
 
Last edited:
Tech198 said:
I know the reason I'm guessing anyway, on why Apple can make thin, good looking stuff based on the companies/manufacturing, but instead of PC's trying to compete by bring out the ASUS, or similar devices/laptops etc... They always skimp on materials, or the fact "it's not AS thin as the Mac"

Can't these manufactures who manufacture for PC components just go after those companies who do it forA Apple? Rather than competing, and getting nowhere.

Those same manufactures might be make stuff for PC's to... The same way intel does the same chip for Mac and PC (technical details aside).

So what's the story? I bet PC people would gladly pay extra $$$ just for the same look if the same manufacturing can done from one.
Click to expand...

Can you reword that? I have trouble understanding you.
 
There was an article somewhere recently about the CNC (computer numerical control) machines that are used to make the aluminum Apple case. the article said there are only so many of them around, and the companies that have them are fully involved working for Apple.
 
bigjnyc said:
Because somebody has to make cheaper computers for the general public, and the majority of the market. I'm sure PC manufacturers can go out and focus on design, quality, and form factor... But that would mean they'd have to pay more money for top designers, great engineers, and high quality parts... Then what happens to the general consumer who walks into best buy and just wants a cheap computer? Or the consumer who just cant afford to pay over $1200 for a computer? This is probably the majority of America, and is the reason why the PC market will continue to dominate no matter how popular Apple computers continue to get.
Click to expand...
Yeah true, I agree with this.
 
Tech198 said:
So what's the story? I bet PC people would gladly pay extra $$$ just for the same look if the same manufacturing can done from one.
Click to expand...

They can, it's called Bootcamp... Macs can run Windows just as well.

But seriously, most of the PCs laptops are playing catch up to Apple in terms of design. I was recently at a Sony store and alot of their laptops are just plain ugly. And it shows cuz there was only like 5 customers in there, compared to hundreds at the Apple store nearby.
 
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