iPad Pro Why does the iPad Pro 2018 need FaceID ?

Discussion in 'iPad' started by TheRealAlex, Nov 13, 2017.

  1. TheRealAlex macrumors 65816

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    Sep 2, 2015
    #1
    All I know about Face ID is that it helps you Unlock your Device since TouchID was removed. Keep in mind that FaceID is much less secure than TouchID it’s already been defeated by a mask and some pictures and can be fooled by taking pictures or a quick 3D Scan of the targets face.

    All that aside

    IPads also don’t send Text Messages even LTE ones. And Animojis are great but useless on iPad.

    The only reason to have Face ID on the iPad is the Home Touch ID button being removed. Why not Shrink the Home Button to a Rectangle or Oval still slim the Bezels but keeping the Superior Touch ID.

    Here is an example skip to. 3:25.
     
  2. kissfan macrumors regular

    kissfan

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    #2
    I send text messages to Android users all day long on my iPad 10.5. Not sure why you say it doesn’t.
     
  3. TinyChip macrumors regular

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    Sep 19, 2015
    Location:
    California
    #3
    I receive and send text messages on my iPad, iMac desktop, and MacBook Pro. Also, when my iPhone is near iPad, phone calls will route to my iPad because of FaceTime. It’s been this way since iOS 10. How could you not be aware of this handoff tech in iOS?

    Face ID requires the True Depth camera which, in turn, requires A11 Bionic chip to process all the biometric calculations. The significance of Face ID tech in an iPad is gaining access to augmented reality applications, which Apple has big plans for. (But they’ve yet to reveal those plans—obviously due to competitive reasons.)
     
  4. JPack macrumors 65816

    JPack

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    Mar 27, 2017
    #4
    That's like asking why iPad even needs Touch ID.

    The answer should be obvious with just a moment of thought.

    Face ID is not just for security and protection of information, it's also for convenience.
     
  5. Absrnd macrumors 6502

    Absrnd

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    Flatland
    #5
    Your assumtion is wrong, FaceId is more secure, a finger print can be copied and used faster and more accurate then getting a 3d scan of a person without them knowing :)

    making the homebutton smaller, or on the edge, just like Samsung ?
    The iPad is a mobile device, so Touch-ID or even better Face-ID is very convenient for safety on the go.
    Face-ID will be implemented in all Apple devices, it takes up less space, and can be build into everything without much trouble.
     
  6. MandiMac macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2012
    #6
    Reviewers found that FaceID does not work reliably when the phone is lying on a desk, because the camera scans the ceiling (which is a logical thing). You hold your phone up to your face (because that‘s your natural behaviour, turning your face towards the screen when using it), and that‘s it because the phone is light-weight.

    Imagine your iPad lying on the desk. Would you take the probably huge 12,9“ iPad, hold it to your face (or even tilt it towards you), just to slam it down again? Don‘t know about that, I guess Touch ID is gonna staying for a while until the front camera lens has way more angle to it.
     
  7. ApfelKuchen macrumors 68030

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    Between the coasts
    #7
    Consistent user interface. If the Home button is going away on iPhone, then it goes away on iPad. For that matter, Macs will likely also use True Depth/Face ID. It makes sense for many reasons, unlocking the Mac being just one of them.

    There are going to be many apps that will use the True Depth sensor array, such as the cosmetics shopping app that "applies" makeup to the shopper's face. If iPad lacks that sensor array, then those apps are dead on iPad. And since AR apps of that sort are likely to push iPad farther into corporate/retail deployment... Whether the True Depth sensor array is also used for unlocking the iPad is almost besides the point. It reminds me of the first generation iPad (which I still have) - it didn't have a camera at all, so there was no way to use it for FaceTime. The lack of a camera was, by far, that model's biggest shortcoming.

    Others have already pointed out that Text Message Forwarding already puts SMS messages on iPad (and Mac) - fabulous feature - I have "green" conversations on every Apple device I own (except my Apple TV) - all nicely synchronized.

    FaceTime on iPad is very popular, so why would Animoji on iPad be pointless? Yeah, there are people who believe iPad is just for media consumption, but how many ways does that old saw have to be debunked? The surest way for iPad to be less-than-iPhone or less-than-Mac is for Apple to withhold features from iPad.
     
  8. Jsameds Suspended

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2008
    #8
    People still believe this? Christ.

    Go do some research.
     
  9. KeepCalmPeople macrumors 65816

    KeepCalmPeople

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    #9
    It's coming whether you/we like it or not. As others have said, not least so that apps work the same way across iPhone/iPad devices.

    The argument for eliminating bezels is less clear on iPads IMO however.
     
  10. Richard8655, Nov 15, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017

    Richard8655 macrumors 6502a

    Richard8655

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    Mar 11, 2009
    Location:
    Chicago
    #10
    Well, all this Face ID and advanced security features for an iPad I keep at home and never leaves the house. That includes the unneeded added cost. Oh well, I know my cat can’t sneak off with it at night and make high end purchases from PetSmart.
     
  11. Macintoshrumors macrumors regular

    Macintoshrumors

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    Oct 18, 2016
    #11
    You do know iPhone and iPads are two separate devices? You are aware Apple improves upon its technology every year. You do know what’s inside the iPhone is not going to be inside the next iPad. You do know these are just rumors as iPhone rumors is an actual business.


    As far as op throwing that bs about Face ID. That is the most ignorant garbage I have seen today.
     
  12. aevan macrumors 68020

    aevan

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    Serbia
    #12
    No, it’s more secure. Someone made an expensive mask after scanning a face, just like someone managed to create false fingerprints after scanning a finger. That doesn’t say anything.

    I am constantly amazed how bad people react to change. Face ID is more secure, but it’s not even about that, it’s about convenience. It would work great on an iPad Pro.
     
  13. subjonas macrumors 65816

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    Feb 10, 2014
    #13
    I personally don’t like Face ID for 3 reasons:

    1. I don’t like cameras pointing at my face all the time. I physically cover the cameras on all my devices except when I need to use them, which is rare.
    2. The idea of my device scanning and storing a super accurate 3D model of my face is creepy to me. A fingerprint is abstract, a face is basically someone’s identity. It’s an example of technology being too personal and invasive for me.
    3. It unlocks even when I don’t want it to. For example, sometimes at my desk I want to glance at my screen for the time, notifications, etc. without unlocking. With Touch ID I’m able to separate looking from unlocking.

    I doubt neither face scanning nor fingerprint scanning are inherently more secure than the other. In Apple’s case it just seems their Face ID technology happens to be more advanced than their Touch ID. In any case, the two technologies are not far apart in terms of both security and convenience, they each simply have trade offs. In my case I simply prefer the Touch ID strengths over the Face ID strengths. It will be disappointing to see Touch ID go.
     
  14. aevan, Nov 19, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2017

    aevan macrumors 68020

    aevan

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    #14
    Erm.... I think I’ll regret asking - but why would you do that? You think they are secretly recording you? But if you think that, you should probably disable/cover up half of your device, turn off most of its features - because if they wanted to spy on you, they wouldn’t need a camera to do it effectively.



    You don’t know how Face ID works. It IS an abstract and it’s NOT storing a super accurate 3D model of your face. It is storing a series of numbers that are, in essence, the same as on Touch ID. There are some differences since Face ID stores this information and adapts it with machine learning over time - but in both cases it’s an abstract set of numbers stored in a secure, offline enclave. It’s not a 3D model of your face, just like Touch ID doesn’t store a picture of your fingerprint.

    Since you’re covering up cameras, I’m guessing you don’t trust what Apple says, but then you shouldn’t trust Touch ID either. In other words: if you trust Touch ID, you should trust Face ID.

    I remember all these privacy concerns when Touch ID arrived with iPhone 5S. “They are not storing my fingerprints!” Now, no one talks about these things anymore. It will be the same with Face ID.

    People are scared of cameras for some reason. Even though I am 100% certain Apple devices are not spying you in secret, if they were - there would be MUCH better ways to do it then using the camera. They could track your movement (better disable that GPS, and Wifi while you’re at it.... and 4G come to think of it), they could record all your conversations (better tape over all those microphones) and they could use all your data, like credit card and health info and email correspondence, etc.

    So, my question is - why the camera? If you don’t trust Apple, why is the camera where you draw the line? You should ditch phones and iPads alltogeather. Get off the grid and all that.


    I would agree, if I saw any Touch ID strenghts over Face ID. Other than “it’s familiar vs it’s new” - but that’s not a strenght for me.
     
  15. Abazigal macrumors 604

    Abazigal

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    Singapore
    #15
    I believe that Face ID will eventually be used for more than just authenticating your device. It's a full-blown Kinect sensor, and may one day allow you to control your iPad with gestures, amongst other uses. Think long term. Think big picture.
     
  16. The Game 161 macrumors G5

    The Game 161

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    UK
    #16
    well i use my ipad pro alot on my desk at work and often just use the touch ID to open. I won't ever lift it up to use it. So for this reason I would have to use a passcode i guess.
     
  17. democracyrules macrumors 6502a

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    Nov 18, 2016
    #17
    I wish the Face ID iPad could come very soon. It will be the best iPad ever made in the history.
     
  18. aevan macrumors 68020

    aevan

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    Serbia
    #18
    It depends. I use my iPad Pro laying flat on the desk a lot - and I just activated the front camera while I'm in a normal position. It sees my eyes and nose, which is enough for Face ID. I do believe it wouldn't be an issue.
     
  19. Mrs.G macrumors newbie

    Mrs.G

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    NM
    #19
    I’ve been wanting to upgrade to an iPad Pro for several months now. Got the iPX and the face ID/no home button is game changer in a good way. I’m holding off on my iPad upgrade till next year.
     
  20. subjonas macrumors 65816

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    Feb 10, 2014
    #20
    I'm inclined to trust Apple's intentions but I don't trust their devices are 100% impenetrable by others. Features and security risks usually have a trade off relationship. There is a balance that different people are comfortable with. For me, cameras that are always looking at me are where I feel uncomfortable enough to (so far) not want any features that it provides. Everyone is different.

    No, I don't have a deep technical knowledge of how Face ID nor Touch ID work. But a fingerprint itself is abstract. When I look at it, it means nothing to me. When I look at a face, it is much more personal. Technically, all digital information is abstract, being made up of 1s and 0s, if that's what you mean. But regardless, if somehow the data was accessed and somehow reconstructed, I would rather someone end up with my fingerprint rather than a model of my face. I don't know what benefit either would be for someone (I'm sure people are creative), but my face is much more personal to me. Also if someone really wants, they can already get my fingerprint from a number of other places, including Best Buy, which required a fingerprint scan to trade in an old iPad for some reason (which I didn't like, but it was a trade off I made for the convenience of not having to sell my iPad myself, also they caught me off guard). There is no place that has an accurate scan of my face.

    Why not the mic, gps, and other tracking, you ask? I do minimize on all those as much as possible (giving permission only to apps that I deem to require it), but it's like I said, convenience has privacy/security risk trade offs and this is where I find my personal balance. I do use the cameras of course. But when I'm not using them, they are covered. It's easy to uncover/cover them with the frequency that I use them. With Face ID, I would have to leave the camera uncovered all the time for (arguably) slightly more convenience than Touch ID.

    Another reason why I find a camera always looking at me to be a problem is that I don't want my device to know where I'm looking. I don't want it to read my reactions. I want my device (and anyone who may have access to my device) to know as little about me as possible. That's just how I am. I'm not on social media for the same reason.

    I do make compromises if I see something as significantly beneficial. Then I accept the risks that come along with it because it's worth it to me. Touch ID was that type of compromise. I was getting very tired of punching in my passcode, so when it was announced I saw it as potentially very beneficial. I learned as much about the risks as I could, and it easily seemed worth it. On the other hand, I simply haven't seen Face ID provide anything I want.

    Again, to each their own. I'm probably more extreme than most.
     
  21. DNichter macrumors 601

    DNichter

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    #21
    More secure, slim down the bezels, add features, get rid of home button, great for entering passwords/signing into apps. Lot's of positives with Face ID. Can't wait for it to come to the iPad.
     
  22. dojoman macrumors 65816

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    Apr 8, 2010
    #22
    Stop spreading BS false info. FaceID cannot be defeated by picture or 3D scanned mask. It’s already proven impossible by Wired.com. Stop this nonsense! Go troll on another topic.

    https://www.wired.com/story/tried-to-beat-face-id-and-failed-so-far/
     
  23. augustya macrumors 68000

    augustya

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    #23
    Minus the OLED Display :( like on the iPhone X !!
     
  24. chedder’mac macrumors member

    chedder’mac

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    Oct 25, 2017
    #24
    until the next one comes out...
     
  25. ZEEN0j macrumors 65816

    ZEEN0j

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    Sep 29, 2014
    #25
    Well it won't come to the iPad until it works in all orientations. Right now it only works in portrait on the X.
     

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