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It's not a hobby, it's the future, why have multiple screens others can see when you could put on a pair of glasses and work. The size of your workspace is unlimited and the way you interface with your applications is much more intuitive.

Don;t be Intel and claim you see the future and make the biggest mistake of their organizations history. Do not dismiss the next wave of technology just because you dont understand it.. Crap same could be said about Blackberry, fail to see the future and you wont make it to the future.

How is mobile computing working out for Intel? Talk about missing the mark eh?! :p
 
It's not a hobby, it's the future, why have multiple screens others can see when you could put on a pair of glasses and work. The size of your workspace is unlimited and the way you interface with your applications is much more intuitive.

Don;t be Intel and claim you see the future and make the biggest mistake of their organizations history. Do not dismiss the next wave of technology just because you dont understand it.. Crap same could be said about Blackberry, fail to see the future and you wont make it to the future.

How is mobile computing working out for Intel? Talk about missing the mark eh?! :p
Here is the thing Apple isn’t doing anything different from what Meta or the other guys are doing just much higher quality (with a price to match). When Apple did the Macintosh it was the right amount of everything and paved the future, and it was clearly the future. When the iPhone came out it wasn’t perfect but it got the main points right and that became the future of phones. The iPad when it was released a lot of naysayers said “its a big iPod touch” but at the same time that price tag, its simplicity, etc it got all key parts right and changed tablets. And besides all of these were actual true innovations that no one else was even coming close to when they were released.

Everything that Apple has created has one thing in common, it melts into your life seamlessly and unintrusivley. From the AirPods, to the Mac. This is a big dumb gaudy headset that I guess is cool if you want to isolate yourself off from the rest of the world inside a box it’s rad. The only other thing about it that I could possibly foresee is Jackasses wearing it around in public to flex, and the minute there’s a millisecond of lag time in how the cameras work and someone goes tumbling down an escalator, Apple will have to make it even more clear that this is just for you to stay how and isolate yourself.
 
Tim Cook: “It’ll do anything your Mac or iPhone can do, and more.”

He makes it clear on Apple’s goal with this product. Now that it’s abundantly clear Vision is not a “side project,” you can discuss about design issues and execution risks.

 
Tim Cook: “It’ll do anything your Mac or iPhone can do, and more.”

He makes it clear on Apple’s goal with this product. Now that it’s abundantly clear Vision is not a “side project,” you can discuss about design issues and execution risks.


Of course he will say that. Apple isn’t going to say anything negative about something, even if internally they have doubts and from my understanding they do. If Apple’s goal truly is to replace the Mac it sounds like another product that they claimed would do the same..was released in the early 90s…can’t quite remember what it was.

Don’t get me wrong man before this was revealed I was very much excited to see this before it was revealed as I am with anything Apple unveils but it doesn’t even compare to something like iPhone or Mac. It’s a product in search of a problem no one has, we will see if they find a problem to solve.
 
It may make some money in the future, but it won’t make so much that they put it in it’s own separate category. By all accounts Apple’s wearable industry does very well, with the Apple Watch for example being the best selling smart watch out there and even that they bunch together into wearables, and they will with this as well I guarantee it.
Doesn't matter what category Apple classifies its own revenue for it in. It will be a hundreds of billions/yr ecosystem industry, inclusive of Apple. No niche, no hobby.
 
Are you sure you didn't steal this comment from the the 2001 Macrumors iPod launch thread? Or the 2007 iPhone intro keynote thread?
I wasn’t a member in 2001 but LOL there wasn’t one person interested in tech that wasn’t obsessed with the iPhone in one way or another. It completely ruined CES that was going on at the same time as that Macworld. It’s kind of offensive that you are comparing the “Jesus phone” with an expensive VR headset that no one is really even talking about.
 
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Doesn't matter what category Apple classifies its own revenue for it in. It will be a hundreds of billions/yr ecosystem industry, inclusive of Apple. No niche, no hobby.
So are you basing this off of “because it’s Apple” or what? Because even though the whole category is doing better than it was say ten years ago, and definitely making billions now, it’s still a relatively small market compared to computers, game consoles, phones, etc, so still pretty niche.
 
I wasn’t a member in 2001 but LOL there wasn’t one person interested in tech that wasn’t obsessed with the iPhone in one way or another. It completely ruined CES that was going on at the same time as that Macworld. It’s kind of offensive that you are comparing the “Jesus phone” with an expensive VR headset that no one is really even talking about.
You’re offended? I’m not the one comparing a phone to a religious figure :D
 
Is this just a complaint that Apple Vision Pro was “Pro” as part of its name?
No more of an observation that it is similar to AppleTV when it debuted in that Apple wasn’t quite sure what would stick with it, and called it a “hobby” at the time.
 
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It's a long way until mass adoption of this technology, but if its only 3500$ today for a vision pro. If you consider the costs of 2 screen + computer, it starts to be much more costs efficient. It was crazy to think we would have handheld computers that have more processing power then a super computer from the early 2000s but it happened. I suspect this will be one of the biggest leaps in PC tech
Here is the thing Apple isn’t doing anything different from what Meta or the other guys are doing just much higher quality (with a price to match). When Apple did the Macintosh it was the right amount of everything and paved the future, and it was clearly the future. When the iPhone came out it wasn’t perfect but it got the main points right and that became the future of phones. The iPad when it was released a lot of naysayers said “its a big iPod touch” but at the same time that price tag, its simplicity, etc it got all key parts right and changed tablets. And besides all of these were actual true innovations that no one else was even coming close to when they were released.

Everything that Apple has created has one thing in common, it melts into your life seamlessly and unintrusivley. From the AirPods, to the Mac. This is a big dumb gaudy headset that I guess is cool if you want to isolate yourself off from the rest of the world inside a box it’s rad. The only other thing about it that I could possibly foresee is Jackasses wearing it around in public to flex, and the minute there’s a millisecond of lag time in how the cameras work and someone goes tumbling down an escalator, Apple will have to make it even more clear that this is just for you to stay how and isolate yourself.

Yes they are actually, META isnt developing its own CPU, its taking one off the shelf, its not design the sensors that go into this device, they are taking it off the shelf.

META is doing a COTS custom off the shelf, taking already produced parts and make your own product out of it.

Apple is Engineering this device from ground up, with new high precision screens, low latency sensors and the OS to boot.

META is putting on a show to be apart of the 3d bandwagon... Apple is leading the charge.
 
It's a long way until mass adoption of this technology, but if its only 3500$ today for a vision pro. If you consider the costs of 2 screen + computer, it starts to be much more costs efficient. It was crazy to think we would have handheld computers that have more processing power then a super computer from the early 2000s but it happened. I suspect this will be one of the biggest leaps in PC tech


Yes they are actually, META isnt developing its own CPU, its taking one off the shelf, its not design the sensors that go into this device, they are taking it off the shelf.

META is doing a COTS custom off the shelf, taking already produced parts and make your own product out of it.

Apple is Engineering this device from ground up, with new high precision screens, low latency sensors and the OS to boot.

META is putting on a show to be apart of the 3d bandwagon... Apple is leading the charge.
Designing your own chip doesn’t equate to sales. The most bullish forecast for this thing peg sales at 20 million in 5 years which sounds great until you realize that Meta has sold about the same amount in 5 years as well (at least what they have reported) and these are at far cheaper prices so 20 million is a huge stretch. I doubt Apple will ever create one that cost $500 or less.

That sounds like a lot of units either way, but by Apple’s standards that’s a drop in the bucket and far less sales than any other product they produce in the same time.

The fundamental problem this thing faces is people just inherently do not like putting stuff on their head. They REALLY hate putting stuff on their eyes. I’m sure Apple is well aware of this and is trying to solve problem but I’m not convinced they’ve gotten it there yet.

Also the input methods may be slightly different and the resolutions not as high, but the higher end and even to an extent lower end Meta headsets are capable of doing similar things to this headset. It’s not doing anything completely groundbreaking here, and no amount of Apple shine and hype will change that.
 
Designing your own chip doesn’t equate to sales. The most bullish forecast for this thing peg sales at 20 million in 5 years which sounds great until you realize that Meta has sold about the same amount in 5 years as well (at least what they have reported) and these are at far cheaper prices so 20 million is a huge stretch. I doubt Apple will ever create one that cost $500 or less.

That sounds like a lot of units either way, but by Apple’s standards that’s a drop in the bucket and far less sales than any other product they produce in the same time.

The fundamental problem this thing faces is people just inherently do not like putting stuff on their head. They REALLY hate putting stuff on their eyes. I’m sure Apple is well aware of this and is trying to solve problem but I’m not convinced they’ve gotten it there yet.

Also the input methods may be slightly different and the resolutions not as high, but the higher end and even to an extent lower end Meta headsets are capable of doing similar things to this headset. It’s not doing anything completely groundbreaking here, and no amount of Apple shine and hype will change that.
We dont make leaps in technology for everyone, it has to be adapt to todays use.

But the PC would be a great example of this, why would anyone need a PC in their house? You had mainframes the size of buildings, why would anyone want that in their home? But yet we have nearly as many PC in a house as light bulbs.

Who would want a powerful handheld devices? But yet we have billions of them on this planet now.

Who would want to put something on their head? I'm not sure Id want something strapped to my head 8 hours a day, but then again it might be worth it for the innovations it brings.

Like the iphone, its not just a single devices with 1 use. The vison pro will be your desktop, communication device, TV replacement, and this is just what we can think of today. What about people who cant use a keyboard or a mouse, imagine the world vison pro could open up for them?

Meta and Apple arent even on the same league, apple is a R&D company that makes stuff for them selves. Meta doesnt have the OS experience, CPU experience or anything worth investing into hardware wise. If this was a race to moon and back, Meta is still designing their rocket and Apple has already taken multiple laps around the moon. Its simple as that.

Vision Pro will be one of the largest leaps in technology we've seen in 20 years, I'm almost certain of it.
 
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We dont make leaps in technology for everyone, it has to be adapt to todays use.

But the PC would be a great example of this, why would anyone need a PC in their house? You had mainframes the size of buildings, why would anyone want that in their home? But yet we have nearly as many PC in a house as light bulbs.

Who would want a powerful handheld devices? But yet we have billions of them on this planet now.

Who would want to put something on their head? I'm not sure Id want something strapped to my head 8 hours a day, but then again it might be worth it for the innovations it brings.

Like the iphone, its not just a single devices with 1 use. The vison pro will be your desktop, communication device, TV replacement, and this is just what we can think of today. What about people who cant use a keyboard or a mouse, imagine the world vison pro could open up for them?

Meta and Apple arent even on the same league, apple is a R&D company that makes stuff for them selves. Meta doesnt have the OS experience, CPU experience or anything worth investing into hardware wise. If this was a race to moon and back, Meta is still designing their rocket and Apple has already taken multiple laps around the moon. Its simple as that.

Vision Pro will be one of the largest leaps in technology we've seen in 20 years, I'm almost certain of it.
There is a lot I agree with you on here and I appreciate that you didn’t get hostile about my original post. The high order bit you mentioned is that you aren’t sure about keeping this thing strapped to your face for hours at a time. Apple isn’t stupid and knows this as well. They also know that unlike all their other devices that just melt into your lifestyle this one will be a choice.

This is one of the instances also that apple has made a device and there isn’t a race by others to try and replicate it, mostly because they already got the basics down. Apple had to invent the basics with devices like the Mac, iPod, iPhone, iPad, and Apple Watch. With this they are just taking a bunch of already existing concepts that have been given to consumers for quite some time and “Appleizing” it.

To your point about Meta not being a hardware company you are 100% right but they are certainly a software company and Meta gets enough right that it mostly fills the AR/VR niche. They work with partners and have some pretty decent offerings, at least from a hobbyist perspective. And I think Apple knows without saying that this will be for those folks, but those folks that want the utmost best experience. So for that and many other reasons I wonder why they don’t just say that.

I do think that it’s 100% possible Apple creates the next paradigm, but this is not it.
 
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The fundamental problem this thing faces is people just inherently do not like putting stuff on their head. They REALLY hate putting stuff on their eyes.
I agree with this. On the flip side 10 years ago, naysayers were preaching that no one wants to watch anything on tiny screen for more than 3 minutes, yet people are watching full movies on their phones instead of on a TV. :p
 
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Vision Pro as a form factor is likely not "the future", it is just the best that can be done now, at a price point that is likely still too high for most consumers to handle.

But the software development for this platform is 100% the future of computing. Giving a computer the ability to see and understand the environment the user is in will open up entire new worlds of computing. Spatial computing is the next frontier and it will open up entire new possibilities. Think about things like product visualization/design, home building/design, engineering, 3d modeling. And that is just the low-hanging fruit.

The vision pro is really quite restrained in it's initial launch, but that is just to get people in the door. Floating 2d iPad apps and mac screen mirroring are just the beginning.
 
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It's not a hobby, it's the future, why have multiple screens others can see when you could put on a pair of glasses and work. The size of your workspace is unlimited and the way you interface with your applications is much more intuitive.

It's not "the future". It's a niche device. You cannot in any way use a VR headset for all day computing without suffering consequences to your health in the long term, or maybe even medium term.

One of these consequences is the displacement of cellulite in parts of the face making contact with the headset. This is called 'Oculus Face' by Oculus users. It's a displacement of cellulite and skin tissue that leaves marks on your face.

It doesn't matter how lightweight the device gets. As long as contact and pressure is made tissue displacement occurs. Even your regular eye glasses leave little indents on the sides of your nose that become permanent with age.

If you used a headset like these as your main all day computer, over time those marks and the displacement of cellulite would become permanent. Your would develop a permanently disfigured ugly face.

Who the hell is going to walk around in life with marks on their face?

Which company would want a mass lawsuit from millions of customers who become disfigured and claim because of their scars they are treated badly and laughed at in society?

Only in the idiotic world of Mark Zuckerberg, on of the most parasitic and careless people ever, can this be ignored.

Most people are not like that. People do not want to walk around with scars and disfigurement.
 
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To kind of borrow a thought from Robert X Cringely, why doesn’t Apple just say that like Apple TV started out, that it is a hobby that they aren’t really quite sure about?
there’s a lot of context that needs to be put here.
First of all, when Steve first introduced the Apple TV, he absolutely did not call it a hobby product.
Not At the first preview in September 2006:

And Not at the actual introduction in January 2007:

The product hit the market in March 2007, without the word “hobby” being used once to describe it by Steve.

At MacWorld 2008 he gave another presentation on an updated version of the first generation Apple TV with new software and iTunes rentals, at a lower price. Again, he did not use the word “hobby” to describe it. He used the words “Accessory to iTunes” to describe it, and he also called it a “revolution” but he absolutely did not call it a “hobby”.

However, the first time he called it a “hobby” openly was in June 2010 at the all things digital conference, and he even gave an explanation…



Pay close attention to his explanation.
He doesn’t call it a “hobby” because it’s a low volume product.
He Doesn’t call it a “hobby” because he didn’t believe in it.

He explicitly calls it a “hobby” because at the time, the cable companies had such a stranglehold on the industry that there was absolutely no room for innovation. Because of that, any product Apple released was going to be compromised in some areas, and they instead decided to focus on phones and tablets more than the television due to these limitations.

The Apple Vision Pro does not have this difficulty at all.
The AR/VR market pretty much has limitless possibilities for innovation an improvement at the moment, and Apple is dumping billions and billions and billions of dollars into it every year. And has been for the better part of a decade.
I’d say that Apple’s current “hobby” products are like… The HomePod and AirTags, kind of wild card products they sell and people like but they are absolutely not the priority.

Apple Vision Pro definitely is the priority product right now, and come 2024 I think Apple is going to try to push this thing as much as they can.
And given that they’ll probably be able to sell as many units as they can make, things like unit sales and high prices aren’t really going to be a factor at first when even people who want them and can afford them just can’t seem to get them.

Meanwhile, does the Apple TV ever go out of stock?
 
Instead of anyone important at Apple proudly showing it off, it was shown off by a bunch of “red shirts” that we’ve never seen before.
Who do you mean by “important”?
Do you mean… Who have frequently appeared in Keynotes in the past?
Tim did partially introduce it, Johnny Ive and Phil Schiller are both gone, and Craig Federighi wasn’t in charge of the software in the same way he is for iOS and macOS.

The people that presented were the leaders of the different teams who worked on AVP, I don’t understand how they’re not important.
They will probably be the faces of that product going forward.

Alan Dye is lead of human interface, and Mike Rockwell is pretty much in the same position with the Vision Pro as Tony Fidel was with the iPod or Scott Forstall was with the iPhone.
 
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