Why I use Apple Pay. Why do you?

Discussion in 'Apple Music, Apple Pay, iCloud, Apple Services' started by spinstorm, Jul 18, 2015.

  1. spinstorm, Jul 18, 2015
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2015

    spinstorm macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2007
    #1
    I've been reading comments on various news articles and speaking to friends and they all say that they don't t understand the point of Apple Pay as they can just use their cards.

    Maybe it's just me but I find getting my wallet out of my pocket to be a huge inconvenience. I always have stuff in my hands which I have to put down to get my wallet out but my phone is always either in my hand (or my watch "on hand").

    If I am driving and I stop at a drive through for example it is super inconvenient to get my wallet out as my wallet is full up and my jeans are tight (I can't empty my wallet although I suppose I could buy bigger jeans!).

    Either way having my cards on my phone and watch save me time and are much more convenient and ultimately that is what Apple Pay is about for me.

    Sure I understand some people don't always have their phones in their hands; some people only have one contactless card they can get out of a pocket in seconds; but I think if they really thought about it they would realise that using their phone would make it much easier.
     
  2. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #2
    It's important to understand that the vast majority of Americans seemingly have no problems with the current credit/debit card system in spite of the breaches that have been in the news; people still use their cards at places like Target and Home Depot for instance. Even if you were to be hit with fraud, all it takes is a phone call and the money is back in your bank account/the charge is removed from your credit card statement. Yes, Apple/Android/Samsung Pay have superior security compared to magnetic stripe and to a chip-enabled cards to a lesser extent, but why would consumers care about that when the consequences of fraud are effectively shielded from them already*?

    That leaves the main supposed advantage for consumers: convenience. Even here phone/watch based payments isn't compelling enough for most for a few reasons. One reason is that in other countries NFC/contactless payments at least allowed for people to not have to enter their PINs for small purchases; in the US most places already don't bother asking for a signature** when you swipe unless the purchase is large enough. Even when chip transactions become more common in the US, they won't be nearly as annoying as elsewhere simply because we're doing chip and signature instead of chip and PIN; as a result the same signature waiver for small transactions will still apply.

    Another is that transaction times aren't annoying enough as they are now. Most of that is because we're still on the swipe and sign system, which takes about the same amount of time or maybe less compared to an Apple Pay transaction (assuming you're using an iPhone and not the Apple Watch. More on that in a bit.) Chip will take longer than swiping but I'm going to guess that people won't be annoyed enough by it to look into NFC as an option, especially since the only thing that will be changing is how the card's put through the terminal.

    Third, a phone is still something that needs to be taken out of a wallet or purse. It takes the same amount of time to remove a phone as does a wallet. Touch ID has to be authenticated before it will transmit card data, which takes about a second or so. There is some time savings if you have a ton of cards that you have to sort through but that doesn't seem to be a common use case. Here an Apple Watch does save significant time compared to the iPhone simply because it's already out and there's no extra authentication step necessary.

    What does all that result in? Fairly slow growth of NFC based payments in general IMO. The one plus is that way more places accept it than before Apple Pay came out, but even then a fair number of places just aren't going to turn on NFC support at the same time as chip or possibly ever. Target and Walmart are big examples of such retailers--Target supposedly to do so "eventually" and Walmart never. It's even possible that it will grow too slowly for those banks and retailers who signed up early on, causing some to end support altogether.

    Don't get me wrong, I love Apple Pay and contactless/NFC. Paying with the Apple Watch is awesome and is one of the main reasons why I got it. I want those solutions to succeed regardless if it's Apple, Samsung, Google or someone else providing them. But that technology has a lot of challenges that it needs to overcome before it becomes ubiquitous in the US.

    *For debit cards, fraud does cause money to come out of your account right away so that may be an issue for those living paycheck to paycheck. This is partly why the general recommendation from most people is to use a credit card instead. You'll still get your money back eventually though and the coming adoption of chip should make debit cards safer to use for purchases. There's also the issue of updating recurring billing but most issuers seem to mail you a list of recurring charges after reporting a breach to help with that.

    **Debit cards have PINs but it's actually possible to avoid ever having to enter one for purchases, either by only visiting stores that can't run them as "debit" and/or by always choosing "credit"/canceling the PIN prompt. It doesn't look like this behavior will change for chip-enabled debit cards.
     
  3. Rigby macrumors 601

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    Aug 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    #3
    To some extent I share your friends' view. Using Apple Pay at a check-out does not seem more convenient to me compared to swiping a card. And from time to time it's actually much less convenient because sometimes the reader doesn't work reliably, or a cashier unfamiliar with the process presses the wrong button (the latter will hopefully go away over time as mobile payments become more common).

    That said, I use it when I can for the added security. But due to the lack of retailer support, my current main use is actually paying in-app (e.g. I frequent Panera Bread and usually place a "rapid order" through the app prior to getting there to avoid the lines). That's where it really shines compared to entering credit card numbers etc.
     
  4. flur macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2012
    #4
    I use it because it's more convenient and more secure. My local grocery store now has some terminals with NFC (and I assume will be adding more). My local drugstore and food co-op both take Apple Pay. So I use it where I can (which is pretty often), and ask for it where I can't yet in hopes they'll get enough requests to add it.
     
  5. iGeek2014 macrumors 68000

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    Jun 29, 2014
    Location:
    === Nowheresville ===
    #5
    Why do I use Apple Pay? Because it's quick, convenient and much more secure.

    Although it's only a recent addition to select Apple devices here in the UK since last Tuesday I'm happier using my registered finger/thumb prints to complete the transaction.

    I had no qualms in using contactless payments before the service launched (I actually enjoy using contactless because no one sees you enter your PIN, unless it's to confirm you're the card-holder from time to time) and Apple have designed it to be user-friendly and secure.

    It isn't going to be for everyone and not everyone is going to trust the service. I'm not slating Google here but I know Apple are less likely to 'monetise' my data and use it to target me.
     
  6. nebo1ss macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2010
    #6
    Call me old fashion but I still use Cash for transactions less than £20. None of the three banks I do business with are yet on board with Apple pay. However, when I look at the use of my card this weekend none of the four transactions would have worked on apple pay. These included £60 diesel fill up of the car. £157 at a restaurant, and other misc use all exceeding £40.
     
  7. chabig macrumors 68040

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2002
    #7
    "...they all say that they don't t understand the point of Apple Pay as they can just use their cards."

    When cards were new they probably said they didn't understand the point of a plastic card when they can just pay with cash or check.
     
  8. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #8
    I feel like I was a Debbie Downer in my last post and didn't quite answer the question as to why I use it. I use it because on the Apple Watch it is easier than pulling out a wallet. :D It's also the only way to use any sort of contactless in other countries since American banks for the most part aren't issuing cards with that feature. The security aspect is nice but considering my cards were all used on websites (which Apple Pay might not have prevented) the couple of times I saw fraudulent charges, it probably isn't as big of a deal for me.

    There was a much higher jump in convenience from checks (the previous leader in non-cash payments) to cards too compared to AP vs. chip and ____. AP vs. magstripe is a pretty big jump security-wise.
     
  9. Rigby macrumors 601

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    Aug 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    #9
    Tip: Some issuers (e.g. Bank of America and Citi Bank) offer "virtual numbers" for some of their cards. That provides many of the same security benefits. I use BoA virtual numbers when ordering from sites that I don't use frequently. Also, quite a few online stores now offer Apple Pay in their apps, which is super convenient.

    Regarding the convenience, I guess there is also a difference between the US and Europe. In Europe people are used to entering PINs for credit card transactions, which is usually not the case in the US (only for debit transactions). If Apple Pay avoids having to enter a PIN, that's of course a major advantage.
     
  10. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #10
    I used BofA's once actually; it was pretty inconvenient so I stopped. The weird thing is that I almost always use my cards on reputable websites and I never heard about any of them being breached. There do seem to be a fair number that don't do complete checks (Amazon for instance doesn't ask for the 3 digit code on the back) so a skimmer could have still been the primary vector.

    I tried to talk about the PIN thing in my first post in this thread actually but maybe that wasn't too clear. Unlike signature, PIN isn't waived when using a physical card in Europe for small purchases. However, it is when tapping it. Perhaps if we forced signatures for even $1 purchases NFC might be more convincing?

    The one stickler is PIN based debit networks in the US. They don't support on device cardholder verification, which is what's used to suppress signature for all transactions with Apple Pay. Since some stores heavily discourage customers choosing "credit" so that they can save money on card fees, people who use debit cards with Apple Pay will probably still have to enter a PIN with it, eliminating any convenience with it at those stores.
     
  11. flur macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2012
    #11
    AP is still more convenient for those of us with the watch. Debit or credit, it's still faster than taking out my wallet, and I can buy a drink after a run without having to stop home for my wallet.
     

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