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Why most contemporary US and British literature sucks.
- Thread starter princealfie
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"There is one motive for quoting other people, it prevents them having to say anything intelligent themselves" - Me
I'll give you all those except for this one.
That book is terrible. Awful. Horrendous. Dan Brown -- whether he researched it thoroughly or not -- clearly aimed to profit from the controversy that the book would create. He put little or no effort into the actual plot or writing style.
The language is so simplistic. I would let a kid read it, but for an adult it is purely regressive. The ubiquitous mini-cliffhangers read very similarly to a short story I wrote in third grade about a super-hero team fighting aliens in outer space. (Maybe I have a national best seller on my hands!) In short, it rots your brain.
As somebody else mentioned, it reads like a movie script, but not even a good movie script. It reads like a movie script which has no substance or complexity, but some Hollywood suit gives it a free pass because he knows if he pumps a few hundred million dollars into special effects, high-profile stars, and hype marketing, then it will turn a profit anyway. I have no doubt in my mind that Dan Brown wrote the book with the idea of turning it into a movie.
Reading is a great thing to do, but reading stupid literature isn't. That book didn't make me think at all, because I didn't believe that a word of it was true, I didn't get absorbed by the flat characters or predictable story line, and the language itself is so flat and amateurish that I couldn't even enjoy the act of reading itself. The whole time I was wondering to myself why the story was in novel form and not movie form.
There is some good contemporary literature out there, but not much. I would imagine that the same could have been said at almost any point in human history since the invention of the printing press. Most people just don't have the talent or dedication to write excellent literature. And even those who do possess the requisite qualities don't write a masterpiece every time.
I've not read the Harry Potter books, but if kids like to read them then I see nothing wrong with letting them read. Then again, I'm still young myself (24) and not anywhere near being a parent, so I reserve the right to change my mind when I have my own kids. I loved to read the Hardy Boys when I was young. I probably read 80 of the books, to the point where I would sometimes read an entire novel in a day. I have no idea if I would still think the books were good if I read them today, but they were written well enough that I absorbed spelling and grammar. Most Americans can't spell the word "grammar". So it seems to me that getting kids to read anything that at least develops their language faculties is probably worthwhile.
"There is one motive for quoting other people, it prevents them having to say anything intelligent themselves" - Me
"A witty saying proves nothing." - Voltaire.
Sorry, couldn't resist.
I agree with this to some extent.
If I meet someone who says he enjoys fine cinema and proceeds to tell me how Independence Day was his favourite of all time, I'm going to question his capacity to appreciate the finer aspects of the art. And I'll probably think he's a douchebag.
I love good movies, but at the same time I occasionally indulge in a little bit of mindless crap. Recognising the difference is key.
I think many people think of any reading as a higher pusuit than watching rubbish on TV and that's simply false.
princealfie, I'd be much more interested in reading a thread about why you think any of the books you've listed are "great literature" and a must read, rather than read a list and a sneer at other's tastes. Heck, if you actually made an argument for any of these books, I might even agree with you.
And he or she will probably think that anyone who doesn't recognise that art (and all it's 'finer aspects') are entirely in the eye of the beholder is a douchebag.
The thread you started is titled Why most contemporary US and British literature sucks. All we have so far is a list and a few tendentious generalisations. Are you not going to share your insights after all?
George R.R Martin
is fantastic
read it
he's contemporary
his ice and fire serious is absurdly good.
is fantastic
read it
he's contemporary
his ice and fire serious is absurdly good.
I think I am inclined to disagree, at least with example. The movie was well paced and visually stunning. The acting may not have been the best and there were places where plot lacked but the holes in the plot were done to give the movie a certain feel.
I am not saying that its my favorite movie, far from it, but in most categories the movie was very good or excellent. Additionally if you are someone with whom the theme resonates it might very well be their favorite.
As for the finer aspects of the art, there is a point where excessive detail can actually get in the way of the production.
Demolition Man btw, is one of my Favorites.
Perhaps someone should PM you to explain to you the point of a forum
The point of a forum is to pontificate, yelp, and keep up the entertainment in this particular thread. I don't think that there must be anything else except the theater of the absurd.
my english is not good enough to participate in this thread.
but when it comes to children i think reading is one the best things a kid can do. joanne k. rowling or umberto eco, it doesn't matter.
i never was into reading, but i enjoy it a lot these days and i wish i would read more.
but when it comes to children i think reading is one the best things a kid can do. joanne k. rowling or umberto eco, it doesn't matter.
i never was into reading, but i enjoy it a lot these days and i wish i would read more.
J K Rowling actually does write very well. I saw a literary critique of her work and one of its complaints was the overuse of adverbs, one of the hallmarks of a starting writer. The latter books are better written as well.
When you mentioned Eco, my first thought was how much better Foucault's Pendulum was than the DaVinci Code. Essentially the same subject matter but worlds apart in terms of quality.
As for your English is seems to be of an acceptable quality. Better than a some of the 1337 types you see around.
Amen... but who cares about grammatical structure to begin with? Some of the best books written don't have proper grammar... Allen Ginsberg, Kerouac, Mark Twain, etc. etc.
The point is whether the book is provocative or not to me. For example, the scenes from Piano Teacher by Elfriede Jelinek remain indelible in my imagination. It revulsed and fascinated me at the same time.
Thus a good work of literature must provoke. And Harry Potter fails to do that. It's not like I will cause an uprising due to reading it.
What about the deconstruction of ideas? That's more interesting to me.
You've still got to start with an idea, or you have nothing to deconstruct. Don't be shy. Why does most contemporary US and British literature suck?
I think I understand the point being made by the OP. Too often, we let our determinations on what is "quality" and what isn't be made by those around us. The hype that has built the HP empire into what it is has told those who may venture into Rowling's world that it is great and wonderful and that to think otherwise is folly. The same holds true for Dan Brown's series of novels.
When we let our decisions on quality be made by another, we cease to look for quality that speaks to us. We forget to look for inspiration at its source and rely on pride in being seen with fame or the exclusivity that comes with being seen with something considered superior. We all seek it (remember the iPod explosion?), but acknowledging it is essential.
I read W&P in junior high for fun over the course of a week and enjoyed it so much I read it almost every year until my freshman year of college. I believe that Catch-22 is the greatest modern American novel available. I laughed that the HP craze until I sat down with three Whoppers (it was a 99 cent sale) my junior year of college and finished the first book before I finished the thrid Whopper. I found a book that isn't serious, but builds a world that is fun and an escape from the dreary headlines that we see at Google News. But, in the end, my favorite book? The Animals of Farmer Jones.
When we let our decisions on quality be made by another, we cease to look for quality that speaks to us. We forget to look for inspiration at its source and rely on pride in being seen with fame or the exclusivity that comes with being seen with something considered superior. We all seek it (remember the iPod explosion?), but acknowledging it is essential.
I read W&P in junior high for fun over the course of a week and enjoyed it so much I read it almost every year until my freshman year of college. I believe that Catch-22 is the greatest modern American novel available. I laughed that the HP craze until I sat down with three Whoppers (it was a 99 cent sale) my junior year of college and finished the first book before I finished the thrid Whopper. I found a book that isn't serious, but builds a world that is fun and an escape from the dreary headlines that we see at Google News. But, in the end, my favorite book? The Animals of Farmer Jones.
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I'd agree that the test of a good book on the individual level is "Is this interesting or boring?", but if you want subjectivity, you can't ignore the wonder Harry Potter inspires in a 12 year old. It most certainly provokes -- it provokes wonder, imagination -- and maybe most importantly, it provokes response (written, thought, drawn, whatever) -- entire psychological uprisings in developing minds.
Such that:
You're not Rowling's audience, and that's fine. A middle schooler -- and most high schoolers -- weren't Joyce's audience, either. Adolescents need adolescent fiction if they're going to make the jump from Amelia Bedelia to Marianne Moore. If you start your kid with Joyce and Beckett (thinking back to your first post), I think you may have trouble provoking a love of reading.
By the way, I thought The Corrections was overrated. Good, but not that good. Good to be reminded of it at this time of the year though.