iPhone 15 Pro Max Why so many media spread false information about the iPhone cameras?

[DaveXX]

Nearly all pages including MacRumors spreading false information about iPhone 15 Cameras.
You can read nearly everywhere about a 3x or 5x optical zoom.
The Iphone 15 Pro Max has 3 fixed prime lenses and no optical zoom.
- 13mm fixed prime lens with 12MP
- 24mm fixed prime lens with 48MP
- 120mm fixed prime lens with 12mp.
The iPhone 15 Pro has a 77mm fixed prime telephoto lens with 12MP instead of the 120mm.

This means for macro the phone take a 13mm shot and crop the picture (including digital processing). So a macro shot has NOT 12MP it is a upscaled 3MP image and using 1/4 of the sensor surface.
100mm with 15PM is a digital zoom which has just 3MP with 1/16th of the sensor surface (means less light and lower resolution)! The iPhone 15 Pro will use a digital zoom of 1.3 from a 77mm 12MP shot and use 62% of the sensor surface and around 7.5MP.
So for focal lengths in this area the 15 Pro outperforms the 15 Pro Max by a lot.
That is the reason why an optical zoom or a prime focal length with digital zoom makes a huge difference. If the IP 15PM would have a 5x optical zoom between 24mm and 120mm would mean sth completely different. You would have at any focal length nearly the same sensor surface and the same resolution….

Any information about 5x optical zoom is misleading and wrong. Even on the technical data page Apple stated “48mm through quadpixel sensor” which means nothing else than digital crop. With 24mm pixel-binning is used so it just have half of the resolution (24MP) but the full sensor surface.
Apple is trying to confuse ppl by saying “you can optical zoom in and out of 24mm”. But the optical focal lenghts are just 13mm, 24mm and 120/77mm.

I think it is very important to make this clear especially if you see how many ppl are buying an iPhone 15 Pro Max because of the camera (its better isn’t it?). If you use very often focal lengths around 80-100mm this would be a huge disappointment.

 

[sstiwari]

Nearly all pages including MacRumors spreading false information about iPhone 15 Cameras.
You can read nearly read everywhere about a 3x or 5x optical zoom.
The Iphone 15 Pro Max has 3 fixed prime lenses and no optical zoom.
- 13mm fixed prime lens with 12MP
- 24mm fixed prime lens with 48MP
- 120mm fixed prime lens with 12mp.
The iPhone 15 Pro has a 77mm fixed prime telephoto lens with 12MP instead of the 120mm.

This means for macro the phone take a 13mm shot and crop the picture (including digital processing). So a macro shot has NOT 12MP it is a upscaled 3MP image and using 1/4 of the sensor surface.
100mm with 15PM is a digital zoom which has just 3MP with 1/16th of the sensor surface (means less light and lower resolution)! The iPhone 15 Pro will use a digital zoom of 1.3 from a 77mm 12MP shot and use 62% of the sensor surface and around 7.5MP.
So for focal lengths in this area the 15 Pro outperforms the 15 Pro Max by a lot.
That is the reason why an optical zoom or a prime focal length with digital zoom makes a huge difference. If the IP 15PM would have a 5x optical zoom between 24mm and 120mm would mean sth completely different. You would have at any focal length nearly the same sensor surface and the same resolution….

Any information about 5x optical zoom is misleading and wrong. Even on the technical data page Apple stated “48mm through quadpixel sensor” which means nothing else than digital crop. With 24mm pixel-binning is used so it just have half of the resolution (24MP) but the full sensor surface.
Apple is trying to confuse ppl by saying “you can optical zoom in and out of 24mm”. But the optical focal lenghts are just 13mm, 24mm and 120/77mm.

I think it is very important to make this clear especially if you see how many ppl are buying an iPhone 15 Pro Max because of the camera (its better isn’t it?). If you use very often focal lengths around 80-100mm this would be a huge disappointment.

If this is indeed the case, at least some honest reviews shall be showing this in camera sample comparison.

 

[clg82]

Umm media spouts all kinds of false information everyday.....why are you surprised this would be any different.

 

[sack_peak]

People with money will look at Apple activities.

People without money look elsewhere.

Value of eyeballs matter.

 

[DaveXX]

i think not everyone has an understanding about cameras. i would just wish that pages like macrumors clarify and explain that problem.
Especially for ppl who want to know the difference between normal, pro and pro max its very important to explain the difference. Instead they are talking about improved 120mm and optical zoom which is misleading.
I see in hundreds youtube videos as well praising this “huge” upgrade e.g. “photographers opinion about the great camera upgrade…
I found just one singe youtube video of an actual photographer which is explaining the differences… nearly all other ppl are just repeating apples marketing **** without even thinking about that.

 

[sstiwari]

i think not everyone has an understanding about cameras. i would just wish that pages like macrumors clarify and explain that problem.
Especially for ppl who want to know the difference between normal, pro and pro max its very important to explain the difference. Instead they are talking about improved 120mm and optical zoom which is misleading.
I see in hundreds youtube videos as well praising this “huge” upgrade e.g. “photographers opinion about the great camera upgrade…
I found just one singe youtube video of an actual photographer which is explaining the differences… nearly all other ppl just repeat apple marketing **** without even thinking about that.

If indeed there are no improvements in the camera of iPhone 15PM; means Apple intentionally withheld better available camera sensor for next year’s iPhone.

At least I will do my part, No improvement, no upgrade. I will cancel my order for iPhone 15 PM 256

 

[DaveXX]

If indeed there are no improvements in the camera of iPhone 15PM; means Apple intentionally withheld better available camera sensor for next year’s iPhone.

At least I will do my part, No improvement, no upgrade. I will cancel my order for iPhone 15 PM 256

It depends. I wouldn’t call it improvement but the cameras are just different.
For 120mm its definitely and improvement. For 100mm its a Backstep.
Optical zoom has moving lenses which let you zoom between focal lengths. The iPhone (and this is nothing new) can just make photos on 3 different focal lengths. And if you make a photo on these specific focal length you get the full sensor surface and resolution…
Every other “zoom” is just digital. So 120mm on the IP15PM is definitely better than 120mm on the IP15 Pro. And 100mm is definitely better on the IP 15 Pro. So you can get just the full performance on 13mm, 24mm and 120mm (or 77mm).
i can make today a shot with my IP14PM with 77mm and zoom in 10times and call it 770mm super tele zoom. But its just digital…

 

[cateye]

Apple sells an over-complex, often compromised set of camera features packaged in marketing glitter-throwing B.S. to a cherry-picked set of low-hanging-fruit influencers and you're blaming the media for Apple's excesses? On the contrary: The miasma of confusion about how everything really works is by design. Apple, like any company, is not interested in selling specs, they're interested in selling aspirational targets.

The detailed cost/benefit rundown of the iPhone 15 lineup cameras will come, but that takes hardware in-hand bought independently (not provided early with strict talking points from Apple) and put through a time consuming set of tests and presentations. There are plenty of influencers and review sites that stick to this kind of rundown, but none of that is available now for the low-impulse-control crowd that orders iPhones on announcement day like it's some kind of race.

Literally any review or rundown that comes out this week can be completely discarded. None of it is critical or reflective of anything more than Apple's marketing because there's no time to do anything but lean on what Apple provides. The reviews that come out in a month are the ones to pay attention to.

As with any generation, there will be amazing strengths and eye-rolling weaknesses/tradeoffs to the cameras of the iPhone 15 lineup. Don't expect Apple to ever, in any way, through any channel, accept any awareness of those weaknesses.

 

[Torty]

If indeed there are no improvements in the camera of iPhone 15PM; means Apple intentionally withheld better available camera sensor for next year’s iPhone.

At least I will do my part, No improvement, no upgrade. I will cancel my order for iPhone 15 PM 256

Depends on where you come from. From 14p you need to chose between 15p and 15PM because cam is different. From 13p and older it’s an improvement.

 

[DaveXX]

There are sensor or digital processing improvements over the generations... there is no doubt about that and there are a lot of comparisons you can check yourself how big they are or not.
In this particular case you just should know that the 120mm comes with a huge compromise. Everything between 77mm and 120mm is definitely worse by a lot than before. If it matters or not depends just on the focal lengths you actual use.

 

[The Game 161]

Buy 15 pro and 15 pro max and all camera issues are fixed. You get your 3x and 5x 😎😂

 

[DaveXX]

To understand it better a real word example.
Crop of an image 77mm iPhone 13 Pro Max:

Crop of an image 76mm iPhone 13 Pro Max:

The same will happen if you make a photo with an iPhone 15 ProMax and 100mm. And here is why:

You see in the information 76mm but the lens was a 26mm f1.5.
But on the shot with 77mm you can see this:

You can do the test on your own phone. Just go below a prime focal length (long pressing x3) and change it e.g. to x2.9

 

[Siliconguy]

In this particular case you just should know that the 120mm comes with a huge compromise. Everything between 77mm and 120mm is definitely worse by a lot than before. If it matters or not depends just on the focal lengths you actual use.

That's good information. My Canon has an 18-55 and a 55-250. I'll be sticking with that. Not that I'm in the market for an iPhone anyway, but it's nice to understand the options.

 

[SteveJobs2.0]

To understand it better a real word example.
Crop of an image 77mm iPhone 13 Pro Max:
View attachment 2267248
Crop of an image 76mm iPhone 13 Pro Max:
View attachment 2267249

The same will happen if you make a photo with an iPhone 15 ProMax and 100mm. And here is why:
View attachment 2267273
You see in the information 76mm but the lens was a 26mm f1.5.
But on the shot with 77mm you can see this:
View attachment 2267276

You can do the test on your own phone. Just go below a prime focal length (long pressing x3) and change it e.g. to x2.9

Honestly, I plan to use the 5X tele only for distant objects. I will use the wide camera 95% of the time and do any minor cropping after.

 

[GMShadow]

Why are there so many people coming out of the woodwork on this? There’s been a dozen threads screaming the same thing. Somehow the prior zooms weren’t an issue but this one is?

Feels very fake.

 

[DaveXX]

Why are there so many people coming out of the woodwork on this? There’s been a dozen threads screaming the same thing. Somehow the prior zooms weren’t an issue but this one is?

Feels very fake.

there is no issue with prime lenses… there is an issue if on the front page of many news portals is written that the iP15 Pro max has an improved camera with 5x optical zoom. And this is just plain wrong. There is no fake here.
I have a lot of iphones and i bought btw 2 ip15 Pro phones… so don’t worry i don’t have any intention to make the phone bad or whatever.. so where is actual the fake? can you clarify that?

 

[ItachiSBT]

I'll try to explain everything here, it's not that complicated.

You have 3 cameras on you phone:

- The ultra wide (13mm): this year is exactly the same, no changes.
- The main camera (24mm): this year is exactly the same, no changes. During the presentation apple tried to sell some "changes" as new but no, it's exactly the same camera with some software updates that were ALSO added on the iphone 14.
- The tele (77mm on pro and 120mm on pro max): This is new on the pro max and a little bit better on the pro (because the sensor is a little bit bigger than the tele on the 14pro).

So to be short, this year the cameras on the iphones were NOT updated in any way with the exception of the tele on the pro max and a slightly bigger sensor on the pro.

Now, let's try to understand how this works.

- Optical zoom is, in fact, the wrong word. Optical zoom means that if you have a 20-50mm lens (for example) the lenses will move and let you shoot at every focal between 20 and 50mm. This is NOT the case on smartphones. On smartphones you have only the 20 and the 50mm as 2 separate cameras and when you zoom between those 2 you are just cropping the image of the previous one (so if you have a 20 and 50mm and you shoot at 30, you are only digitally cropping the 20).
-new 120mm. Here it's really important to understand something. 120mm ARE NOT better or worse than the 77mm. It's just a different focal lenght. Some people are saying that is worse because 77mm is more close to what you could need everyday (for portrait for example) and 120mm is too far for a generic use. So you will actually end up having less possibilities than before. This is why some people are even choosing the normal 15 pro because they don't want the 120mm.

You have to keep in mind that as explained smartphones don't have optical zoom. When you have 3 cameras you can only shoot with those 3 focal lenght and as explained everything in between is just a crop.
In the past iphones had a 13mm, a 26mm and a 55mm. That was, at least in my opinion, the best setup because the space between those focal lenght is not too big so the digital zoom in between was "usable". That was already stretched a lot when they went from 55 to 77 for the tele, bringing the difference between the last 2 cameras on more than 40mm.

Now it's even worse, the main camera is a 24mm and the tele is a 120mm. You have almost 100mm of nothing in between and the digital zoom CANNOT compensate 100mm difference. This is why a lot of smartphones with 10x cameras ALSO maintain the 3x. To have something in the middle.

A lot of people i know are going with the 15pro and not the pro max exactly for this reason.

If you need a 120mm then the one on the iphone 15 pro max is definitely GOOD because they were able to maintain an aperture of 2.8 that is HUGE for a 120mm. But like i said, it's not better or worse than other camera, it's better if you need a 120mm, it could be worse than a 77mm if you don't need to shoot at 5x.

 

[wolfboy]

The big takeaway is just don't use any zoom levels outside of the preset 0.5x, 1x, 2x, and 5x as that's what has all the processing. Treat them like swapping between prime lenses. Even better that it's 24mp now (12mp base + info/data from 48mp = 24mp)

The telephoto lenses on all iPhones I've learned is pretty bad, equivalent to roughly F/22 on a full frame. I tested this yesterday on the the 14 Pro's 3x lens, and there's zero bokeh (hence why portrait mode exists). So if you're used to shooting with a regular camera doing portraits at 85mm and expecting bokeh, don't bother using the 3x (or 77m). Use the new auto portrait mode with the 1x and 2x instead.

The 3x and 5x are best for taking shots that are far away it seems, used literally as a zoom.

In summary:
0.5x: wide shots
1x (24, 28, 35): regular shots
2x (48): portraits
5x: zoomed shots
Don't use anything in-between

 

[kstotlani]

Nearly all pages including MacRumors spreading false information about iPhone 15 Cameras.
You can read nearly everywhere about a 3x or 5x optical zoom.
The Iphone 15 Pro Max has 3 fixed prime lenses and no optical zoom.
- 13mm fixed prime lens with 12MP
- 24mm fixed prime lens with 48MP
- 120mm fixed prime lens with 12mp.
The iPhone 15 Pro has a 77mm fixed prime telephoto lens with 12MP instead of the 120mm.

This means for macro the phone take a 13mm shot and crop the picture (including digital processing). So a macro shot has NOT 12MP it is a upscaled 3MP image and using 1/4 of the sensor surface.
100mm with 15PM is a digital zoom which has just 3MP with 1/16th of the sensor surface (means less light and lower resolution)! The iPhone 15 Pro will use a digital zoom of 1.3 from a 77mm 12MP shot and use 62% of the sensor surface and around 7.5MP.
So for focal lengths in this area the 15 Pro outperforms the 15 Pro Max by a lot.
That is the reason why an optical zoom or a prime focal length with digital zoom makes a huge difference. If the IP 15PM would have a 5x optical zoom between 24mm and 120mm would mean sth completely different. You would have at any focal length nearly the same sensor surface and the same resolution….

Any information about 5x optical zoom is misleading and wrong. Even on the technical data page Apple stated “48mm through quadpixel sensor” which means nothing else than digital crop. With 24mm pixel-binning is used so it just have half of the resolution (24MP) but the full sensor surface.
Apple is trying to confuse ppl by saying “you can optical zoom in and out of 24mm”. But the optical focal lenghts are just 13mm, 24mm and 120/77mm.

I think it is very important to make this clear especially if you see how many ppl are buying an iPhone 15 Pro Max because of the camera (its better isn’t it?). If you use very often focal lengths around 80-100mm this would be a huge disappointment.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

The big takeaway is just don't use any zoom levels outside of the preset 0.5x, 1x, 2x, and 5x as that's what has all the processing.

There’s nothing really coming out of ANY smartphone camera that doesn’t have a big chunk of processing being done on it. Using zoom levels outside those presets? It’s not adding a whole lot of processing outside of the massive amount being done prior to the zoom level change.

 

[OneBar]

The big takeaway is just don't use any zoom levels outside of the preset 0.5x, 1x, 2x, and 5x as that's what has all the processing. Treat them like swapping between prime lenses. Even better that it's 24mp now (12mp base + info/data from 48mp = 24mp)

The telephoto lenses on all iPhones I've learned is pretty bad, equivalent to roughly F/22 on a full frame. I tested this yesterday on the the 14 Pro's 3x lens, and there's zero bokeh (hence why portrait mode exists). So if you're used to shooting with a regular camera doing portraits at 85mm and expecting bokeh, don't bother using the 3x (or 77m). Use the new auto portrait mode with the 1x and 2x instead.

The 3x and 5x are best for taking shots that are far away it seems, used literally as a zoom.

In summary:
0.5x: wide shots
1x (24, 28, 35): regular shots
2x (48): portraits
5x: zoomed shots
Don't use anything in-between

There's no bokeh because there's no shutter. I think what you actually mean is there's no depth of field.

 

[JohnRckr]

Wait so essentially you're saying that iphones cameras are a big scam?

 

[Sami13496]

For average iPhone users those software improvements (like auto portrait) mean a lot more than slightly bumped up physical specs. They won’t notice a difference in quality between iPhone 11 and current models when taking selfies and pics of receipts. Now the 1% who are on MR the photography experts will make noise about camera being not good enough and regular users will actually think that, despite that for them it’s probably the best smartphone camera they can have. They might skip buying it because thinking camera is bad. As an AAPL owner I don’t like that.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

The miasma of confusion about how everything really works is by design.

I think the confusion centers around those that “know what these terms mean”. The public, as a whole, have been pinching to zoom with their fingers for years and have been satisfied with the results. On FAR less capable phones than these. (I’ve seen it with my own eyes and it’s not worth telling them that “you won’t get good quality that way” because they’re getting the quality they expect)

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Wait so essentially you're saying that iphones cameras are a big scam?

They’re a scam the public has bought into and are the reason why the casual camera industry has collapsed! The Lytro camera with its lightfield capturing technology showed a physical brute force way to computational photography, and everyone’s been walking that path since then, only leaning more on the computational side with the hardware available today.