Will Apple continue to optimize OS 3.x for non-3GS iPhones?

Discussion in 'iPhone' started by TheSpaz, Jul 24, 2009.

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  1. TheSpaz macrumors 604

    TheSpaz

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    #1
    I don't have an iPhone 3GS anymore so I'm back to using my iPhone 3G.

    Today I was wondering. Is this the best performance we're going to get for now on? Do you think Apple is going to do anything about the performance of 3.0 on the iPhone 3G or do you think they're only going to focus their attention on making it run nice on the iPhone 3GS? I have this feeling that they beefed 3.0 up for running great on the iPhone 3GS, and just let it run however it runs on the iPhone 3G.

    A lot of us do not have upgrades coming up or we can't afford to buy the iPhone 3GS at the early upgrade fee. It's kinda like Apple just said to heck with us and focused all of their attention to the newest iPhone. I mean, you would think they'd still have interest in making it run nice on the iPhone 3G because they still sell the 8GB iPhone 3G.

    I went back to 2.2.1 for a couple of weeks and it seems like everything is smooth as butter on it. The graphics aren't choppy and it's rather speedy. I think this is because 2.2.1 was optimized to run well on the iPhone 3G and 3.0 was optimized to run well on the iPhone 3GS. Why should the 3G owners suffer with crappy performance when we know darn well that it was able to handle 2.2.1 with ease.
     
  2. vinay427 macrumors 6502a

    vinay427

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    #2
    I feel for you. Unfortunately, Apple [cough]Steve Jobs[cough] is known for doing this. I don't want to accept the fact that Apple just ditches it's loyal customers in favor of others, but I guess it's true. For now, we'll just have to suck it up and deal with it. :mad:

    Another reason why I'll probably be moving to Android come mid-2010.
     
  3. andyblila macrumors 65816

    andyblila

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    #3
    No way to answer this question effectively or accurately. Who knows. I have both a 3G and a 3GS and I feel that 3.0 runs the same on each. If you don't want the added features of 3.0, which people have been complaining about since iPhone 1.0, then downgrade. I believe that Apple will continue to work the software so that it works on all iPhone platforms be it 2G, 3G or 3GS.
     
  4. TheSpaz thread starter macrumors 604

    TheSpaz

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    #4
    It definitely works the same on both the iPhone 3G and iPhone 3GS, but it's not very fluid on the iPhone 3G. It doesn't have the same *feel* as 2.2.1. I wish I could have 2.2.1 with Apple's copy and paste. That would be ideal.

    In other news... why do I *have* to have Voice Memos installed? Does anyone else wish there was a check box in iTunes like "Use Voice Memos" or something so that we could choose whether we want it or not? I also wish I could delete Contacts... I have contacts in my Phone app... why do I need a stand-alone app for that?
     
  5. benflick macrumors 68020

    benflick

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    #5
    Couldn't agree more.
     
  6. samcraig macrumors P6

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    #6
    Interesting question.

    Also interesting is "A lot of us do not have upgrades coming up or we can't afford to buy the iPhone 3GS at the early upgrade fee."

    You HAD a 3GS. You didn't like the build. You returned it. So in essence, any lack of improvements to the software on your older 3G is now technically based on YOUR decision.

    The 3GS and 3G have different processors and ram. The only way to solve an OS improvement issue is to release different versions because you can't take advantage of the improvements AND "dumb" the same down for a device which doesn't have the same specs. I honestly don't see Apple doing that. So yes.. unfortunately, the OS improvements will be tailored more towards their newer devices.

    THAT being said - I DO think that Apple should make available all previous OS's (or at least 1 generation worth) so that if you do upgrade on an older device, you can roll back if you want to.
     
  7. TheSpaz thread starter macrumors 604

    TheSpaz

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    #7
    I see what you're saying. Also, I didn't return the iPhone 3GS *just* because of the crappy build quality. My HDTV broke just after I bought it, so I made the decision to save the $500 and buy a new TV.

    The iPhone 3G is perfectly capable of handling the software much better than it does. To say that it has a slower processor and less RAM doesn't make much sense because 2.2.1 ran smooth as butter. They built 2.2.1 to take advantage of the low specs and optimized it so that it ran well.

    Now, with 3.0, the iPhone 3G is choppy most of the time because (I believe) Apple decided to focus their optimization efforts on the iPhone 3GS only. We both know the iPhone 3G is capable of better performance. Don't be blinded by Apple. You're falling into the same group of people who say stuff like "Well, the original can't handle MMS because of the EDGE network" because Apple said the hardware on the original iPhone isn't capable, but everyone knows that the iPhone 3G can send and receive MMS while on the EDGE network and jailbreakers have a way to enable MMS in Messages.app on the original iPhone and it works.

    I wonder how many people are getting so fed up with 3.0 on their iPhone 2G/3G that they go out and buy an iPhone 3GS.
     
  8. samcraig macrumors P6

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    #8
    Well you never mentioned the HDTV issue back in your older posts - you just kept saying how you felt you needed to use the 3gs all the time to justify its cost. Now it appears that you needed to justify its cost VERSUS having a new TV. Don't you think that bit of information might have helped people NOT get all over your case? You said the money wasn't the issue - that you have/had an iphone "addiction". You FAILED to inform the readers that there was another KEY element to the story. And that KEY element was a KEY motivator for your actions apparently.

    And don't presume to think I am believing Apple and/or falling into any group. My opinion as stated had nothing to do with anything other than facts. The 3GS and 3G have different processing speeds and internal memory. Both of which DO make a difference when building an OS. The 3G might be capable of better performance but not with the OS (3.0) they build according to you. What you want is a lower build 2.2.1 with the features of 3.0. And as I said - I don't see Apple going backwards or building various versions for their product line...
     
  9. vinay427 macrumors 6502a

    vinay427

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    #9
    Couldn't agree more. I'm really tired of people blindly defending Apple when, if they took the time to assess the situation, would agree. Statements like "I hate complainers" and "Just buy a 3GS" make me SO mad. :mad:
     
  10. Small White Car macrumors G4

    Small White Car

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    #10
    Not even close.

    After I upgraded my 3G to 3.0 the Safari browser got WAY worse. Scrolling around pages 'catches' a lot and makes me wait all the time now. Things used to load faster and scrolling was smoother under the old OS.
     
  11. vinay427 macrumors 6502a

    vinay427

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    #11
  12. TheSpaz thread starter macrumors 604

    TheSpaz

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    #12
    Well... here's the thing. Apple *COULD* optimize 3.0 to run well on an iPhone 3G (even with all the features of 3.0), but they chose not to.

    To tell you the truth... the first few betas of 3.0 ran just like 2.2.1... if not a little better. That was probably before they really started cranking things up for the 3GS. I wish I could go back and try 3.0 beta 1 again, but it's expired.

    About the HDTV situation. My Westinghouse 32" HDTV would not turn on one day. I figured it was probably just some fuse inside the TV that went bad and it was an easy fix. I had it at the TV repair shop (not knowing at the time if I would definitely need a new TV or not) when I returned my iPhone 3GS. I figured, if I did need a new TV, I would be saving some money and I figured I'd stick it out with my iPhone 3G for a little while longer and upgrade again when the 3GS issues were sorted or (or wait until the NEXT iPhone model comes out with a new design). Then I found out that my TV couldn't be fixed cheaply (unless you consider $450 to be cheap) so I decided to buy a better TV instead (I chose a Sony Bravia 40" 1080p, 120Hz Motionflow™) and it was a good decision. I love my blu-ray movies.

    I really want to use 3.0 for the new features but I'm compromising speed over function and 2.2.1 was great.

    The question I had in this thread was: Do you think Apple will continue to optimize 3.0 to run well on BOTH iPhone 3G and iPhone 3GS or do you think they'll just concentrate on the 3GS and the iPhone 3G will remain slower (than it's potential) to create incentive for people to upgrade to the iPhone 3GS.
     
  13. agirton macrumors regular

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    #13
    Who knows

    I do not think anyone really knows for sure the answer to your question. However in my experience Apple has been very good in the past in its computer market to not only support its older hardware in the newest versions of it's operating system, but also make performance improvements for that older hardware. I am surprised at the speed which one of my older non intel macs runs the latest OS. Yes they will be dropping support for that one in the fall, but it is 8 years old and I can always run Leopard on it.
    As for your question, I do not think they are purposefully making the 3G perform slower to force an upgrade. Size, feature-set, and performance is enough to push most to upgrade that can.
     
  14. Mad Mac Maniac macrumors 601

    Mad Mac Maniac

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    #14
    Well maybe we should switch iphones. I haven't had the contacts app since last october. my iphone was jb and I used bosspref or whatever it was to hide a bunch of my apps. I restored when the next update came out and never jb again because i didn't really care for it. my contacts app has stayed hidden. I have restored twice and... (here's the shocker) GOTTEN A NEW IPHONE. just 2 weeks ago i traded in for a refurb because my old one had cracks. The app is still missing.

    I don't really care, but it does kinda bother me, because i'm wondering why it's not there...
     
  15. samcraig macrumors P6

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    #15
    "Do you think Apple will continue to optimize 3.0 to run well on BOTH iPhone 3G and iPhone 3GS or do you think they'll just concentrate on the 3GS and the iPhone 3G will remain slower (than it's potential) to create incentive for people to upgrade to the iPhone 3GS. "

    Those are different questions.

    "Do you think Apple will continue to optimize 3.0 to run well on BOTH iPhone 3G and iPhone 3GS"

    "do you think they'll just concentrate on the 3GS and the iPhone 3G will remain slower (than it's potential)"

    Do you think Apple is trying to create incentive for people to upgrade to the iPhone 3GS.


    They aren't necc related, mutually exclusive or inclusive.
     
  16. nightfly macrumors newbie

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    #16
    It's because you did not set the phone as new, instead you're restoring from your last backup, that's why the contact is still hidden :)

    With 3.0 I agree on most here...

    my 3g seems like a crappy phone right now... have done everything restored, set as new phone etc... in safari its slow as hell when switching window and when charging sometimes its very very hot..

    Maybe its because Steve Jobs was on leave and everything messed up...
    Apple is sooo deadd without Jobs i guess :p
     
  17. MikePA macrumors 68020

    MikePA

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    #17
    Q: Does Apple have a different version of the OS for 3Gs 3Gs iPhones?
    A: No.

    Q: Is Apple still selling 3G iPhones?
    A: Yes.

    Q: What the heck does "optimized" mean anyway?
    A: Nothing

    My 3G runs 3.0 just fine. Oh, I am jailbroken, too.
     
  18. -aggie- macrumors P6

    -aggie-

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    #18
    My 3G also runs 3.0, just fine. At least to ME, it does, but I know one person that would say different.

    When I opened this thread, I thought it was going to be about future OS versions supporting the 3G, like OS 3.0 supporting the 3G when it was written for the 3GS. I'm hoping with the next model, which will have a new OS, perhaps OS 4.0, that it will still work for the 3G (if I don't buy the new model). I was really hoping that some future OS version adds voice recognition for the 3G. Anyway, I know the OP would say that'll make the 3G have even more lag.
     
  19. kerbero9 macrumors member

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    #19
    Q: Does Apple have a different version of the OS for 3Gs 3Gs iPhones?
    A: YES!
    3G OS: iPhone1,2_3.0_7A341_Restore.ipsw (230MB .ZIP)
    3GS OS: iPhone2,1_3.0_7A341_Restore.ipsw (297MB .ZIP)
    They look pretty different to me!

    Q: Is Apple still selling 3G iPhones?
    A: Yes.

    Q: What the heck does "optimized" mean anyway?
    A: It means fine tuning the software code to get the best possible performance on your targeted hardware platform. Or at least give the user the option to do so (Windows Performace settings for example). Apple can most certainly "optimize" the 3G firmware to run better on the 3G...

    My 3G runs 3.0 just fine. Oh, I am jailbroken, too
     
  20. err404 macrumors 68020

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    #20
    I don't feel that my 3G runs much worse then it did in the past with the 2.x OS. There has been some performance hit, but these seem to be the result of features that users have been demanding since the initial launch (spotlight, Copy and Paste...) that would have been added regardless of the new hardware. I would expect that Apple will continue to optimize the OS and that it will lead to 'some' improvements over the course of the 3.0 lifespan on both platforms. Apple has identified that particularly heavy functions like video and voice recognition are not practical on the old hardware and therefore are not enabled. Ideally I'd like to see this go a bit further and include a toggle for other memory intensive functions like spotlight.

    The reduced performance is a result of assumptions made during the original project. The iPhone was not originally designed to run native apps and development was intended to be in the form of web apps. The hardware and memory are based around this initial assumption. Unfortunately it turned out that they were wrong and they had to squeeze in the ability to run native apps. The phone is so restricted on RAM that it is barely to be able to run the OS and a single native app, yet alone multitask (typical available RAM after the OS is loaded is ~20MB). The 3Gs positions the iPhone as an optimized platform for native apps and possibly multitasking in the 4.x OS (pure speculation).
     
  21. MikePA macrumors 68020

    MikePA

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    #21
    And you know the core OS code is different how? Additional code to support things like the compass, but different core OS code?

    Thanks, I was being facetious. :rolleyes: I know what optimized mean. However, you have forgotten the OP is one of the few people who see lag where none exists and sees video problems where none exists.

    Someone would have to be a real boob to think Apple could 'optimize' the OS to such a point that people would notice a performance improvement, hardly 'most certainly'.

    If someone thinks 2.2.1 was the zenith of 3G OS performance, they can run that OS until he11 freezes over.
     
  22. kate-willbury macrumors 6502a

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    #22
    welcome to the world of apple. where your opinions and choices are limited to what steve jobs tells you.
     
  23. MikePA macrumors 68020

    MikePA

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    #23
    Until there is more than 1 processor in the iPhone, it wont be doing multi-tasking.
     
  24. goosnarrggh macrumors 68000

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    #24
    Tell that to the millions of multitasking computer systems that existed prior to the arrival of mainstream multicore consumer computing.

    Likely the more severe limiting constraints are RAM capacity and battery life. Even the iPhone 3GS's doubled 256 MB is pushing it for modern software demands. And with increased multitasking comes decreased downtime for the CPU (or CPUs); if the CPU has less downtime, it cannot enter its idle mode as frequently, therefore the battery life will decrease.
     
  25. TheSpaz thread starter macrumors 604

    TheSpaz

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    #25
    The iPhone 3GS is not running the same OS as the iPhone 3G.

    My proof? Look at this:

    If both OSes were exactly the same... why wouldn't the graphics be the same. It's obvious that Apple works on it separate.
     

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