Will OSX 10.15 support 5,1 mac pros ?

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by macguru9999, May 1, 2019.

  1. macguru9999 macrumors member

    Aug 9, 2006
    Will OSX 10.15 support 5,1 mac pros ? I was just wondering if any developers had clues they can discuss that would rule the 5,1 in or out of the next OSX upgrade .....
  2. bookemdano macrumors 65816

    Jul 29, 2011
    I'm sure anyone privy to actual info at this point is not able to divulge it here. But I am sure you'll get some opinions.

    I'll start (and I've posted this several times before):

    I think chances are good that the MacPro5,1 gets 10.15. And my reasoning is based on Apple's history of OS X/macOS releases. Since they moved to yearly releases with 10.7 (Lion) they have never dropped Macs from the compatibility list two years in a row.

    So if history is any guide (and with Apple it often is), macOS 10.15 will support the exact same Macs as Mojave does. Time will tell, of course.

    Consider also that there's still no word on the modular Mac Pro. I don't think Apple sh!tcans the cMP until the mMP is ready to go.
  3. crjackson2134 macrumors 601


    Mar 6, 2013
    Charlotte, NC
    I have no insight to this, but I think it will happen to work without issue, even if not officially supported. Just my opinion .
  4. Demigod Mac macrumors 6502a

    Apr 25, 2008
    All the recent BootROM updates don't make sense if they planned to abandon the 5,1 on the OS side soon.
  5. tsialex, May 1, 2019
    Last edited: May 1, 2019

    tsialex macrumors 601


    Jun 13, 2016
    Sorry for delivering bad news, but recent HighSierra Security Updates brought BootROM updates for Macs that don't even have Mojave support.

    No one should take BootROM updates for a sign of future 10.15 support.

    Weirdly, Apple recently sent NVMe EFI modules to every supported Mac, even to Macs that you can't connect a PCIe blade in any way.
  6. SoyCapitanSoyCapitan macrumors 601


    Jul 4, 2015
    Those updates were part of wider code base for building future products, not just specifically the 5,1.

    I believe those updates were issued to 5,1 owners to help support your hardware upgrades. Then you take those hardware upgrades and use them in a new Mac Pro.

    5,1 is listed on the obsolete and vintage page now so don’t expect support. You can still use it as a storage server or data back up system.
  7. redheeler macrumors 604


    Oct 17, 2014
    Apple dropped Macs in Lion (10.7) followed by Mountain Lion (10.8) the next year. It was a decision meant to obsolete some capable Macs like the Mac Pro 1,1 and iMac 6,1, though workarounds are possible to install ML on this hardware and it runs just fine.

    I hope Apple doesn't drop support for 2012 Macs (including Mac Pro 5,1), but I'm not going to rule out the possibility. I've been wrong about this before; a year ago I was not expecting Apple to try and obsolete a quad-core iMac or MBP from 2011, but they did.
    --- Post Merged, May 2, 2019 ---
    Any Mac with an upgradable GPU is in a good position to receive workarounds for installing unsupported versions of MacOS. I'm going to guess the 5,1 will be able to run the next couple versions, whether supported or not.
  8. thomasthegps macrumors regular

    Sep 23, 2015
    Something tells me mac os 10.15 will require avx. So all macs shipped with cpus before sandy bridge will be dropped.
  9. bookemdano macrumors 65816

    Jul 29, 2011
    D'oh you're correct. I forgot they dropped the 32bit Intel Macs with 10.7. But I think my point is still valid--that in the last six (rather than seven) years of annual releases of macOS Apple has shown a definite pattern of avoiding dropping Macs from the compatibility list (which causes grief and anger amongst owners of those Macs) two years in a row. The Metal requirement neutered a ton of Macs last year. I would be honestly surprised if they drop another hardware bomb this year. They're already going to piss off customers who have older 32bit drivers and apps that will never be upgraded to 64bit. Apple has plenty of PR problems as it is. Plus, the mMP is not out yet and we've had pretty much zero leaks about it, which indicates to me that it is not imminent. I don't think Apple puts the 5,1 out to pasture without a new product for its users to upgrade to.

    But then again I'm also the one who really thought Apple was going to enable boot screens with the RX 580 & 560 with Mojave. :)
  10. bsbeamer macrumors 68020

    Sep 19, 2012
    I'm skeptical on official MP5,1 support for 10.15 (Lake Mojave?) but can see it happening at least in BETA unless testing shows a horrendous user experience with the OS on official MP5,1. How this impacts 4,1>5,1 machines would also be up for debate. If enough of those users experience issues in BETA and report them erroneously (saying they're on 5,1 hardware when they're actually not) it could have an impact on broader support or restrictions for any machine that ID's as MP5,1.

    Maybe there is a RAM or VRAM requirement implemented, or a mandate for SSD to be present for system drive? Have to remember, not all these machines are upgraded like the majority on this forum have done. Some are still running a spinning HDD for system drive with entry-level processor and minimum RAM. I'd argue those are the users who should likely move to MacMini's but that's a different topic...

    It also could turn out to be a handcuffed situation where the OS is officially supported, but some major features are not. We already partially see this with 10.14 in some aspects.

    Doubtful 10.15 will require it, but 10.16 or 10.17 (if that's even what they're still called) may mandate a T2/T3/Tx chip be present. I think that's where the line will really be drawn on abandoning support for older machines. A lot can change before then. IF the move to ARM is indeed happening with macOS, that could be the line in the sand.

    As with everything lately, the MP7,1 will show a lot of what the immediate future will bring. Apple will likely officially support that machine for at least 5 years through OS updates.
  11. redheeler macrumors 604


    Oct 17, 2014
    Given the amount of people still using 2012 Macs (including the Mac Pro 5,1, last generation of cMBP, and first generation of MacBook Pro with Retina Display), I definitely hope you're right. But Apple has done back-to-back hardware drops on iOS plenty of times in the interim, including iOS 11 which caused a lot of grief for users of discontinued 32-bit apps at the same time. And the massive Mojave unsupported Macs thread shows a lot of people are still using 2011/2010 Macs even today, yet Apple couldn't care less.

    Of course, none of this speculation would be necessary if Apple were to give older Macs the proper decade of support they should get. But to Apple, caring about the environment is only worthwhile when profits aren't affected...
  12. MarkC426 macrumors 6502

    May 14, 2008
    It’s really not the end of the world ‘for me’ if there wasn’t any support (unless you use a lot of native apple software which tends to move the goalposts when updated).
    I only upgraded to Sierra/HS in order to run my RX580.
    No reason at the moment to even upgrade to Mojave.
  13. bookemdano macrumors 65816

    Jul 29, 2011
    iOS is a different story and Apple has different pressures & incentives for that platform. I don't think its history is all that applicable to the Mac side of things as Apple has to push the envelope more with each release of iOS as things are changing rapidly and they've got a lot of competition.

    Whereas the desktop/laptop computer market has been in decline for quite some time now. Sure, Apple throws us a few scraps each year with new features or improvements to existing ones. But there's not a whole lot of impetus to radically change things on that front (at least in terms of usability). With macOS they tend to be on a revolution/evolution cycle. I would argue Mojave was the revolution with Marzipan, forced APFS and Metal requirements (and other stuff I'm sure I am overlooking). My hunch is that 10.15 is going to be concentrated on refining and fleshing out the stuff introduced in 10.14 (hopefully beginning with the Marzipan apps as the ones included with Mojave suck).

    So like:

    Yosemite > El Capitan
    Sierra -> High Sierra
    Mojave -> 10.15

    I'm conveniently ignoring Mavericks because it doesn't fit into this pattern. But it also didn't drop any Macs from the compatibility list.

    Of course they could majorly shake things up again this cycle. I'm not trying to argue that's impossible, just that it's unlikely given their recent history of yin/yang macOS releases.
  14. MisterAndrew macrumors 65816


    Sep 15, 2015
    Portland, Oregon
    I think it probably will. Apple knows a lot of people bought new graphics cards so they could update to Mojave. It would be a shame to only get 1 year for that expense. If not then I think a nice gesture would be if they sold the new Mac Pro with a 'no graphics card' option so users could transfer it to the new system.
  15. MisterAndrew macrumors 65816


    Sep 15, 2015
    Portland, Oregon
    I’m changing my prediction on this one. Given the CPU vulnerabilities with no microcode fix, I think it’s unlikely Apple will continue to support the 5,1 with new software. Probably the whole list of Macs on Apple’s support page that have vulnerabilities that can’t be mitigated will be axed.
  16. LightBulbFun macrumors 68000


    Nov 17, 2013
    London UK
    all the ones on that list have already been axed, so that does not really change things

    its pretty clear apple is supporting the MacPro5,1 begrudgingly

    (usually if a GPU cant support what apple wants from it apple will just axe that machine rather then tell the user to upgrade their GPU, its the whole reason the MacPro1,1/2,1 Xserve1,1/2,1 are not officially support above 10.7.5)

    given the effort apple has put into supporting the MacPro5,1 with Mojave, and given now with upgraded GPUs apple does not really have a good reason to depreciate support.

    (as a side note one thing I find curious is, when Sierra introduced the SSE4.1 requirement, the first Betas would boot on First generation C2D CPUs but KP due to no SSE4.1, eventually Apple removed First generation C2D CPU support entirely from Sierra so the kernel wont even boot, however despite Mojave not supporting any Core 2 Duo macs, it still supports Penryn CPUs, go figure that one out)
  17. MisterAndrew macrumors 65816


    Sep 15, 2015
    Portland, Oregon
    That’s true lol. They have been axed. It’s late and my brain is already asleep I guess. :)
  18. Manzanito macrumors 6502


    Apr 9, 2010
    I’ll give my two cents.

    If the next mac pro is ready by the time 10.15 is released, we won’t get support for the 5,1. If it’s not, then maybe.

    Anyway, I’ll stick with mojave for a while just because of aperture. Not that I use it anymore, but just in case I need to browse old projects.

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17 May 1, 2019