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Will people still buy now you cant upgrade?

S

sc25893

macrumors member
Original poster
Sep 2, 2012
86
0
Hi everyone,

This has been bugging me for a few days now and I thought I'd ask what the other members here think about how non-upgradeable the new Macbooks are going to be.

I have a early 2011 13" MBP and it suits me just fine, I have bumped up the RAM and am considering buying an SSD (although I may sell this first, then upgrade to a 2012 13" MBP before getting an SSD).

I find it depressing reading that the future of Macbook is soldered in RAM (!!), stuck in battery (?!?!) and no way to upgrade anything. Basically, you have to buy now, what you intended to buy in the future, or else. To me, that attitude just stinks!

I want to ask everyone here, are you going to stop buying Macbooks from 2013 onwards and buy one up to 2012, (possibly the last of the upgradables) or go ahead and get a shiny new Macbook and put up with no upgrades?

I find this a real dilemma and am very interested in what you all think.
 
I "built my own" in the 1980's and 90's but by about 2001 I decided that it wasn't worth my time and switched to buying Dells (at first) and now Macs which I never upgrade. Life is much easier! I also don't feel that computer technology is advancing at nearly the pace it used to and that by the time a computer feels "slow" it's also quite old anyway. Of the seven Macs here at home, only one is younger than 3 years and they all perform fine. I still have a 10 year old Dell as well that was just replaced with an AppleTV.
 
Eventually, Apple will ween everyone off the cMBP's which are currently upgradable. While I have no facts to back this up, I'd make a guess that the retina versions outsell the non-retinas by a huge margin.

So... the writing is on the wall. Get used to it.
 
I don't have to get used to it. I can buy a laptop and run windows/linux. However, I am really pleased with my Macbook which makes all this so much more depressing.

I suppose I can let other people max out a retina at a stupid price and then I'll be more than happy to take it off their hands on eBay in a couple of years time.
 
sc25893 said:
I don't have to get used to it. I can buy a laptop and run windows/linux.
Click to expand...
Well, there you go then. But ask yourself... how long to you think it will be before other laptop makers follow the same path? (Those that haven't already). No, I don't like it either but the smaller/thinner they get will require this.

So yes. Unless you're some old geezer that can live off of ebay throwbacks your remaining years I repeat, get used to it. Regardless, you're better off pissing and moaning about it to Apple than here.
 
I wanted to know what people intend to do. I don't think me moaning to Apple will make a difference.
 
I just bought the rMBP two weeks ago and at first I didn't know if I wanted to keep it. The more I worked with it though, the more it grew on me. Especially the display. I went back to the Apple store to take a second look at the cMBP and after about 20 minutes of using it it became very clear that I would miss that display.

As for upgrading, that was why I wanted to get the cMBP originally but since you can upgrade the SSD the memory became less important considering that it might be better optimized http://macperformanceguide.com/mbpRetina2012-speed-memory-bandwidth.html. I bout the 2.7GHz/16/512 version. If you look at the RAM prices from Apple they are a little more inline with aftermarket good quality SODIMM's. 16GB costs $200 from Apple while good quality CL9 from Amazon cost about $150 so it's really not as bad as it used to be. I figure that by the time I need more RAM I'll more than likely want a new machine. With the one I have I figure I'll probably want to upgrade the SSD in about 2 years, by which time there should be more blade SSD's available at lower prices.

If this rMBP proves to be a mistake I will then have to reconsider my options. For now since I prefer OSX over Windows (I like Windows a lot so please don't misunderstand me) for my daily work and when I'm on the road I decided to go all in with the retina. I guess we'll see what happens in a couple years.
 
That bad boy costs £2,299.00 here in the UK though, that's a LOT of money for a laptop (albeit one you don't have to spend extra on for upgrades). I hope you enjoy it though, it's a gorgeous machine :)
 
Upgradability on most laptops is pretty much an illusion anyway, unless you're talking about a workstation-class machine like a Dell Mobile Precision that has a modular Quadro GPU, 4 RAM slots, etc. The lack of serviceability is an issue, but considering I've never needed a major repair on a MacBook we'll see how much of a problem that really is.
 
I bought a rMBP at the weekend. Delivery tomorrow or Wednesday - excited!

I went backwards and forwards between the cMBP and rMBP for ages before taking the plunge and the lack of upgradeability was a big factor in that. I came to the conclusion that upgrades are far less of an issue than they used to be. My parents upgraded their first two PCs but not their 3rd and I suspect that they won't upgrade their current (4th) one either. I upgraded my first PC but not my 2nd, nor have I upgraded this laptop which is about to be replaced.

I went for the 256GB option and will use an external HDD with it. If I can get a large capacity blade SSD for reasonable money in a couple of years, I'll consider it but I can't see needing more than 8GB RAM for my uses.
 
Aftermarket upgrades make it cheaper than BTO-ing everything from Apple at time of purchase, the other pain is Apple SSD/HDD changes based on production... some customers prefer one brand over the other for storage.
Unless the 2013 rMBP can be bought with 16GB of RAM and two 500+ GB SSDs, I'll be sticking with a cMBP with two drives. The other thing I dislike about the rMBP is lousy two TB ports, bad enough I deal with lack of USB ports(my old Thinkpad has 3 USB ports) but if I use a FW800 adapter(HDD), external monitor adapter(DVI) and two USB audio interfaces... I'm quite screwed :(
Many owners of 15"/17" PowerBook G4 to MacBook Pros used them as desktop replacements, since Apple keeps dragging their feet on the Mac Pro most of us have settled on cMBPs as mobile workstations.

If Apple wants to give the rMBP a standing chance against the cMBP, give an official mobile dock like IBM/Lenovo offered with the X-series--the dock snapped onto the bottom, gave "extra ports & legacy ports" and an ultrabay(CD/DVD or HDD).

rMBP is just an ultrabook on steroids, when the hype dries up like the Netbook era you'll see Apple scramble in panic of what next. While the retina screen is great, offer it on the cMBP and avoid the backlash of lost features or adapter overload.
 
The demand for thin, light, gorgeous looking portable notebooks that just work far exceed the number of people that want to crack it open and tinker with internals. Thus, Apple has chosen to cater to the former's wallets.

Apple is including double the base RAM in the rMBPs compared to the lower end MB Airs to account for the lack of user upgrade-ability. The vast majority of people who buy a 13" rMBP will never need more than 8GB of RAM, and those who buy a 15" will likely not need more than 16GB (32GB of RAM in a notebook is overkill and only necessary for a tiny % of users). By the time that much RAM is needed, the computer will be long past it's prime anyway.

On drives, again, a tiny % of people want swap out drives and Apple offers plenty of size options if you're willing to pay for them. They shouldn't be in the business of making it easy for you to rip out their stock drive for an aftermarket replacement that they don't see a dime for. So if you want more storage in an Apple computer you'll have to pay Apple to make it happen. Makes sense to me.
 
this is the market... Up to know I decided to stay with my 2011 MBP with ssd... but only because i need the ports available and don't feel my machine slow, compared to the latest... in future, when battery will start failing and specs will be outdated the only solution will be a retina.... I can't switch to windows.... it looks two iterations older than mac....
 
happyfrappy said:
Aftermarket upgrades make it cheaper than BTO-ing everything from Apple at time of purchase, the other pain is Apple SSD/HDD changes based on production... some customers prefer one brand over the other for storage.
Unless the 2013 rMBP can be bought with 16GB of RAM and two 500+ GB SSDs, I'll be sticking with a cMBP with two drives. The other thing I dislike about the rMBP is lousy two TB ports, bad enough I deal with lack of USB ports(my old Thinkpad has 3 USB ports) but if I use a FW800 adapter(HDD), external monitor adapter(DVI) and two USB audio interfaces... I'm quite screwed :(
Many owners of 15"/17" PowerBook G4 to MacBook Pros used them as desktop replacements, since Apple keeps dragging their feet on the Mac Pro most of us have settled on cMBPs as mobile workstations.

If Apple wants to give the rMBP a standing chance against the cMBP, give an official mobile dock like IBM/Lenovo offered with the X-series--the dock snapped onto the bottom, gave "extra ports & legacy ports" and an ultrabay(CD/DVD or HDD).

rMBP is just an ultrabook on steroids, when the hype dries up like the Netbook era you'll see Apple scramble in panic of what next. While the retina screen is great, offer it on the cMBP and avoid the backlash of lost features or adapter overload.
Click to expand...

You mention adapter overload, and that's a valid point.

Apple want to downsize everything to be as clean and visually appealing as possible, but by trashing ports most use on a daily basis (I max out my usb ports on my late 2011 MBP and on my Asus monitor with a built-in hub, and use my Thunderbolt port as a glorified Mini Displayport, and have a separate microphone and headphones/speakers), they're alienating all but the most diehard and richest of Apple users who can afford to run with the rapid change.

If I had been forced by Apple to have the Retina model, I would have needed to buy a £200+ dock from Matrox to use what I use on an almost daily basis, not to mention £40+ for the cable to connect it with (which still wouldn't do all I need it to)...and have everything look equally messy. One adapter, but it's one adapter too many for basic function that should come with the machine, and a hell of a premium to pay for a prettier screen and complete lack of customisable internals.

I know they're not budgeted to casual consumers in the first place but the route they've gone is ridiculous.
 
Clearly yes, this has aways been Apple`s way, they have never wanted the end user to play with the internals. Apple`s expectation is that they design and manufacture systems that provide a great user experience for the duration of the usable life. If you want to have an upgrade path for a Notebook, best look to the portable Workstations offered by the likes of Lenovo`s ThinkPad`s, or just want to tinker buy a desktop PC and install OS X.

Apple have firmly taken the consumer route, they produce fantastic portables that offer extreme performance for the form factor, equally some suffer from heavy throttling, they can be noisy, you do have to take greater care as even a small drop or bump can result in physical damage. additional ports, upping RAM & SSD/HDD or anything else for that matter is simply not on Apples agenda for their portables. The choices are very simple accept and continue, or do something different...
 
Personally, I don't see any use in updating the RAM (there is already a sufficient amount of RAM there and it is as fast as it gets, actually faster), an user-replaceable SSD would be useful though. The only thing I am disappointed about is that rMBP does not use the mSATA standard. One reason I can guess (besides all that proprietary crap) is that mSATA seems to be smaller physically and fit less flash chips than Apple's card.
 
leman said:
Personally, I don't see any use in updating the RAM (there is already a sufficient amount of RAM there and it is as fast as it gets, actually faster), an user-replaceable SSD would be useful though. The only thing I am disappointed about is that rMBP does not use the mSATA standard. One reason I can guess (besides all that proprietary crap) is that mSATA seems to be smaller physically and fit less flash chips than Apple's card.
Click to expand...

The only reason I updated my mid12 cMbps ram from 8 to 16 gig was I use multiple VMWare OS's at a time and run a lot of open apps. If i didn't then I would have stuck with the 8 that came with it.
 
My answer is I have no idea yet. I just got a new system in December, so I'm at least 3 or 4 years away from needing a new one. That is, unless my wife's Early-2008 MBP suffers from the infamous nVidia GPU issue before then, or it just isn't fast enough anymore for what she needs.

When the time comes that I need a new one, I will see what's available at that time, research the crap out of each option that I consider, and get the one that I view is the best one at that time which also meets requirements at that time.

Unfortunately, my crystal ball is a cheap knock-off, so that's the best I can do.
 
I'm not the type to use it until all the keys fall out before buying a new machine. I use my rMBP everyday. It is a critical part of my personal, professional, and financial life so it doesn't owe me anything when upgrade time is near. I still marvel at the retina display. It will provide me with thousands of hours of entertainment and productivity so it's worth it to me. I don't feel the need to squeeze every last drop of use from it before letting it go.
 
sc25893 said:
...
I find it depressing reading that the future of Macbook is soldered in RAM (!!), stuck in battery (?!?!) and no way to upgrade anything.
...
Click to expand...
The stuck in battery isn't that big of a deal the way Apple has battery service set up. As for the soldered RAM, I'd probably just max the ram when buying and by the time that isn't enough I'd probably need a new system anyway.
 
I got a 2012 13" cMBP and upgraded it myself, and should receive my 2012 15" cMBP tomorrow. I'll upgrade it myself as well.

By the time they need replacing, perhaps there won't be laptops... we'll have computers installed under our skin. :p
 
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