With how well the M1 is performing, are Intel Macs just DOA at this point?

[FilmIndustryGuy]

the M1 is good but im returning it and keeping the 16" because it serves my use currently and I prefer the larger screen. There is always new tech coming out. I dont like the impulsive chase for a smaller old design screen. Its not like you are dragging the 16 everywhere and using it on battery all day. in 7 months these forms will be about new comparisons and quick dumping of the M1 Air because the 16 is coming out. Rosetta worked well for me but everything on the 16 works just as well. there is the fear that your intel will drop value and that may be so. if you aren't making money with it now than sure get rid of it and bet on the future but you may win that bet in 2022. im actually thinking of keeping my 16 and getting a discounted M16 a year from now. the price difference will be fair. sell mine at a deeper loss but buy another at a discount instead fo buying yet another small MacBook and then trying to get rid of that too while paying list price and tax on the new thing. we see these items like we see socks. I would definitely buy and keep an M1 right now if I was doing a bunch of moving around traveling as the battery is worth the hype. The 16 isnt portable now and won't be portable in 2022. just try to plop It down on the airplane food tray. the screen wont open to a comfort angle. Enjoy your M1 Air. I'll buy one in 7 months or buy yours slightly used at a nice discount when you are all dumping them for a 16 inch.

 

[PatrycjaKozdra]

I'm wondering how fast Adobe programs like Photoshop and Illustrator will run on the M1 compared to Intel chips. Also, how fast Adobe will launch native apps for M1...

 

[deeddawg]

I'm wondering how fast Adobe programs like Photoshop and Illustrator will run on the M1 compared to Intel chips. Also, how fast Adobe will launch native apps for M1...

Per Adobe "native support for Lightroom next month and Photoshop in early 2021" - though note they also mention Lirghtroom Classic will be "next year" ...

See https://petapixel.com/2020/11/13/ad...supported-on-apple-silicon-running-rosetta-2/

Also see https://petapixel.com/2020/11/17/photoshop-for-apple-silicon-is-here-adobe-releases-beta/

 

[dizmonk]

I just spent $4k in September, on a 16" MBP, i9 with 32GB and 5600m and I'm concerned that this device will just tank in value when the M1 or M2 take fully over. I'm debating if I should ask Apple to return or sell this machine before they become obsolete. I thought it was good idea to max out the last intel MBP given that it might retain it's value since it can run Bootcamp etc... but I just feel like maybe I overspent on a machine that will easily be decimated in stats by a cheaper computer in a years time.

Also, yes, I know I can use this computer and it'll be a great machine and I'm not that worried about the value, but I am wondering if maybe I should wait and pick up the M1 / M2 16" when it comes out and will decimate this machine.

Just wondering if people think the Intel Mac's wont have a market later on.

How do you plan on returning a Mac to Apple 3 months after you bought it?

 

[mdgm]

I always laugh at the people saying they hate Windows/Microsoft machines but live in boot camp on the Mac.

For some industries there simply isn't enough competition for developers to bother making Mac server/client software so there's no choice but to use Windows. If I could I'd work in Mac OS all day, but that's not an option.

As more software moves to cloud web based versions that should become less of an issue but we're not there yet.

 

[richinaus]

For some industries there simply isn't enough competition for developers to bother making Mac server/client software so there's no choice but to use Windows. If I could I'd work in Mac OS all day, but that's not an option.

As more software moves to cloud web based versions that should become less of an issue but we're not there yet.

Same here - sat on windows all day long at present. Its fine for pro work though, and I actually enjoy the productivity.

Some mac users dont seem to appreciate this fact, that many apps are not available on MacOS or if they are they are very inferior [I am looking at you Rhino......]
Also CUDA based apps are vastly better in windows than MacOS [Twinmotion, unreal, Vray etc].

 

[AnthonyHarris]

Same here - sat on windows all day long at present. Its fine for pro work though, and I actually enjoy the productivity.

Some mac users dont seem to appreciate this fact, that many apps are not available on MacOS or if they are they are very inferior [I am looking at you Rhino......]
Also CUDA based apps are vastly better in windows than MacOS [Twinmotion, unreal, Vray etc].

Rhino is getting better, but I imagine Apples transition away from Intel isn’t going to speed up development.

 

[richinaus]

Rhino is getting better, but I imagine Apples transition away from Intel isn’t going to speed up development.

They already said possibly v8 for M chips. V7 just come out. So I give it 12-18 months if we are lucky.

 

[GrumpyCoder]

Also CUDA based apps are vastly better in windows than MacOS [Twinmotion, unreal, Vray etc].

I would assume so, because there's no Nvidia support in current macOS and has not been for a while. No Nvidia, no CUDA.

 

[AnthonyHarris]

They already said possibly v8 for M chips. V7 just come out. So I give it 12-18 months if we are lucky.

It's good to know they are working/going to be working on it.

I did check the Rhino forum to see if anyone had managed to get it running, but I'll be fine sticking with what I have until there is at least Rosetta compatibility. They say that Rhino v7 will be updated for that so I'm going to upgrade to v7 in the new year in preparation.

 

[aid]

Good in cold weather though, to heat up you lap

What intrigues me with the M1 is what are the architectural trade-offs? There's always a trade-off, as there is with software architectures (I used to manage a team of architects who I put through this program, so I know a little about it - https://resources.sei.cmu.edu/library/asset-view.cfm?assetid=5177).

If you think of trade-offs being mostly constraints (e.g. words that end in "ity") then if it's greater velocity (aka speed) what are we getting less of? Upgradability and maintainability seem like options. Anything else that as a user I would care about?

I think the trade-offs are more on Intel's side; they've sacrificed performance and power to support decades-old instruction sets in the name of backwards compatibility. They're burdened with the same chain as Microsoft Windows.

In contrast; Apple Silicon is able to achieve far greater efficiency by including no legacy support (e.g. ARM 32bit).

 

[edubfromktown]

If I had to hazard a guess, I would say that the Intel Macs are going to still be relevant about the same amount of time that the PPC Macs were during the switch to Intel in the first place. Maybe even a little less time, because I just read the benchmarks and the numbers are pretty convincing. 😨
You're maxed out with your MBP now but in 4 or 5 years you might start having trouble finding apps that run on x86 at all.
I wouldn't upgrade out of Intel until probably the M3 or whatever they end up calling it.
Have there been comparisons between the M1 and i9 or even i7 Macs?
Until we get one with a dedicated GPU though I don't know how compelling these ARM Macs are going to be.

Totally agree. Some of us are hanging back for other reasons related to software compatibility. I'm happy that I can use Catalina and just about everything that ran on the past few OS versions still works with relatively good stability.

I don't really care about iPhone/iPad look-a-like/cross platform functionality, ... so Big Sur is not a priority. Some of my friends who are longtime Mac users are having legit issues with the new OS which is yet another reason for waiting a while.

The M1 is souped-up in certain ways and lacking in others. It really won't make most of what I do any faster/more efficient so there is no hurry to jump on the bleeding edge hardware bandwagon.

 

[gearlobe]

x86 is just so old now. Maybe it's time to use an architecture designed for modern times? x86 is from the late 70s and we've really come a long way from there. There's so many extensions on x86 now that it's hardly recognizable.

 

[dinobear]

I bought a 16" 64GB, 2TB SSD, 5600M in September as well.

I love it! I freelance and it's my only machine. Having upgraded from a 16gb 13" machine (integrated graphics), this 16" blows it away.

I'm so happy with this 16"mbp that I have no feeling of regret or "what if apple releases something better in 12 months?" questions. AT THE SAME TIME, I'm also really looking forward to seeing Apple's GPU solution to their chips. I'm happy with my current machine and also looking forward to Apple continuing to innovate.

Having spent $4200 on this machine (edu discount, zero taxes in NH), I feel I got a decent deal. And I hope to use it for at least 3 years, hopefully 4 (depends on how fast things advance by then). Well worth it to me if that's the case. I'm not worried what I'll be able to sell it for, as this machine helps me make money and I'm using it now. There isn't even a 16" ARM option. There isn't even an ARM computer with better graphics. There isn't even an ARM computer with as much memory.

Be careful not to get too caught up in Apple's marketing (Apple is really good at it). Although if the battery life is important for your workflow that's a solid reason to get it.

If you're trying to stay ahead on depreciation... honestly those 13" M1 machines are going to look old and lose just as much exponential value when the newly designed form factors come out. The average consumer doesn't know what intel i9s or M1s are. But the shiny new design is what will make the "old" laptops depreciate.

Unless you are in the market for a new laptop now, wait until the new designs come out. But I wouldnt sell what you currently have just because of M1 envy or trying to stay ahead of intel values dropping.

That's my take on it.

 

[FilmIndustryGuy]

I bought a 16" 64GB, 2TB SSD, 5600M in September as well.

I love it! I freelance and it's my only machine. Having upgraded from a 16gb 13" machine (integrated graphics), this 16" blows it away.

I'm so happy with this 16"mbp that I have no feeling of regret or "what if apple releases something better in 12 months?" questions. AT THE SAME TIME, I'm also really looking forward to seeing Apple's GPU solution to their chips. I'm happy with my current machine and also looking forward to Apple continuing to innovate.

Having spent $4200 on this machine (edu discount, zero taxes in NH), I feel I got a decent deal. And I hope to use it for at least 3 years, hopefully 4 (depends on how fast things advance by then). Well worth it to me if that's the case. I'm not worried what I'll be able to sell it for, as this machine helps me make money and I'm using it now. There isn't even a 16" ARM option. There isn't even an ARM computer with better graphics. There isn't even an ARM computer with as much memory.

Be careful not to get too caught up in Apple's marketing (Apple is really good at it). Although if the battery life is important for your workflow that's a solid reason to get it.

If you're trying to stay ahead on depreciation... honestly those 13" M1 machines are going to look old and lose just as much exponential value when the newly designed form factors come out. The average consumer doesn't know what intel i9s or M1s are. But the shiny new design is what will make the "old" laptops depreciate.

Unless you are in the market for a new laptop now, wait until the new designs come out. But I wouldnt sell what you currently have just because of M1 envy or trying to stay ahead of intel values dropping.

That's my take on it.

I feel the same way. Maybe I’ll buy the M1 air again when everyone is unloading them for the bee 16. 16 is too heavy to go mobile anyways

 

[kilihn]

I bought a 16" 64GB, 2TB SSD, 5600M in September as well.

I love it! I freelance and it's my only machine. Having upgraded from a 16gb 13" machine (integrated graphics), this 16" blows it away.

I'm so happy with this 16"mbp that I have no feeling of regret or "what if apple releases something better in 12 months?" questions. AT THE SAME TIME, I'm also really looking forward to seeing Apple's GPU solution to their chips. I'm happy with my current machine and also looking forward to Apple continuing to innovate.

Having spent $4200 on this machine (edu discount, zero taxes in NH), I feel I got a decent deal. And I hope to use it for at least 3 years, hopefully 4 (depends on how fast things advance by then). Well worth it to me if that's the case. I'm not worried what I'll be able to sell it for, as this machine helps me make money and I'm using it now. There isn't even a 16" ARM option. There isn't even an ARM computer with better graphics. There isn't even an ARM computer with as much memory.

Be careful not to get too caught up in Apple's marketing (Apple is really good at it). Although if the battery life is important for your workflow that's a solid reason to get it.

If you're trying to stay ahead on depreciation... honestly those 13" M1 machines are going to look old and lose just as much exponential value when the newly designed form factors come out. The average consumer doesn't know what intel i9s or M1s are. But the shiny new design is what will make the "old" laptops depreciate.

Unless you are in the market for a new laptop now, wait until the new designs come out. But I wouldnt sell what you currently have just because of M1 envy or trying to stay ahead of intel values dropping.

That's my take on it.

Honestly your post is making me want to buy a refurbished 5600m, I have been waiting for months for an intel refresh(not silicon) to see if they fixed the heating/fan problems. I feel like at a point with my work that I should just get one because who knows if there will be a refresh in march or they will completely ditch intel in the next iteration.

 

[dinobear]

Honestly your post is making me want to buy a refurbished 5600m, I have been waiting for months for an intel refresh(not silicon) to see if they fixed the heating/fan problems. I feel like at a point with my work that I should just get one because who knows if there will be a refresh in march or they will completely ditch intel in the next iteration.

I was tempted to wait for an intel refresh too. It did feel like a lot to buy a nearly maxed out 16" that was released in Nov 2019. But the 5600M, released in the summer, was my main necessity for upgrading so I was able to justify to myself I was getting a "2020" version. I had to pull the trigger in September when I was visiting my sister who is a teacher and she was able to get me the EDU deal (along with being in New Hampshire at the same time=tax free). So that locked in the timeframe I was buying. And just went with it.

Rumors at this point are looking at mid-2021 for the new 16"s. As it goes, wait if you can, buy when you need.

 

[ght56]

Honestly your post is making me want to buy a refurbished 5600m, I have been waiting for months for an intel refresh(not silicon) to see if they fixed the heating/fan problems. I feel like at a point with my work that I should just get one because who knows if there will be a refresh in march or they will completely ditch intel in the next iteration.

The 5600M 16-inch doesn't have the power draw/heating/fan/throttling problem that affects the 5300M/5500M models with respect to external displays. The 5600M 16-inch MacBook Pro delivers an outstanding user experience.

 

[Maxwells_Equations]

To add there is a lot of uncertainty whether or not the 16" silicon MBP's will be able to supersede the 5600M the first time around.

 

[JosepPont]

I'm in the market and am thinking to purchase a refurbished 16" 32GB 5600 for 4300€ because I'll need some apps that only run in Windows like TIA Portal and factory io (Then I'll post a question to the M1 owners relating that). What is worryng me is the leak a weeks ago that says that the new MBP with new form factor will come with both processors, Intel and AS. If that models will arrive in march I can wait but no more. The problem is that if I wait till march and apple do not release that models I will be in the same case because we will be at3 months to WWDC. I'm so tired to think about what to do because is not little money

 

[Jaekae]

resale value go down alot but its still same performance as when you bought it. If want sell it its maby best sell it directly before all regular consumers start to know what these arm computers performance actually is..

 

[JosepPont]

resale value go down alot but its still same performance as when you bought it. If want sell it its maby best sell it directly before all regular consumers start to know what these arm computers performance actually is..

Totally agree. The fact is that I selled at a good price my 16" with 5500 a few months ago because the heat and poor performance with a external monitor (among other things like scratches that I don't didn't like to see) and with hope of a 16 AS or a spec bump in november event. Now if you see some secong hand stores you will see more 16" models that are depreciating while more people want to drop it tu take a new model. I'm happy to selled mine at a good time. The fact is that the model with 5600 is not present in that stores and that is a signal of better price te resell in a few months (before the release of the new models) so IDK what to do.

 

[ruka.snow]

x86 is just so old now. Maybe it's time to use an architecture designed for modern times? x86 is from the late 70s and we've really come a long way from there. There's so many extensions on x86 now that it's hardly recognizable.

ARM isn't all that new itself.

 

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

ARM isn't all that new itself.

No, but less riddled with backwards compatibility issues, and (complex) instruction sets.

 

[yurc]

x86 is just so old now. Maybe it's time to use an architecture designed for modern times? x86 is from the late 70s and we've really come a long way from there. There's so many extensions on x86 now that it's hardly recognizable.

Literally asking trouble for folks working with bunch of gear. I am use Mac connected with myriad of gears, Tangent panels, Wacom pen display / tablet, audio interface, etc. Those driver are still x86 instruction.

The problem is not all manufactures keen for rewriting drivers for their products. As user, why replacing my fully working hardware because of favor of Apple ARM is silly. Prime example : eGPU isn't supported on any M1 system because driver was inexistent.

As for me, x86 is still offer great expandability. ARM might caught someday, but not yet now, especially due SoC nature. To add insult to injury driver support is play vital role.