Would you accept a delay to Nov 11 for IGZO in the rMBP? (+Dell XPS 15 Compare)

[skaertus]

Reliability. Is it worth it?

Look at Dell's design. They merely copied Apple, up to the power button (cMBP). It may look like a solid laptop, but designs does not mean performance and quality. I owned a Dell XPS 15 and quickly sold it and got a cMBP (rMBP now).

Dell's keyboard feels plastic and lightweight. It has a weird spring to it. The motherboard crapped out due to heating issues, as well as the power adapter. The battery life was not as advertised.

Check reviews on XPS15 heating issues. If they couldn't resolve it on a huge laptop, what makes you think they resolved it on an extremely thin one? Will the battery last as long through many cycles? It's like comparing a fully loaded Kia with advertised super spec features vs a Benz.

Remember that Dell is a PC manufacturer and Apple focuses on various other things. It surprises me it took Dell this long.

Apple has the tendency to buy out the supplies of everything. They invested tons of money into Sharp themselves. I wouldn't be surprised that Apple owns a majority of the IGZO displays, which is why Dell has a shortage.

I've never owned a Dell XPS, so I just can't say.

As for the keyboard, I can say that I didn't like the feel of the keys in the XPS models. I preferred the keyboard of the Dell Vostro and Inspiron models over the XPS (although I prefer the Vostro over the Inspiron and XPS keyboards). I may just be a strange person, as the XPS is supposed to be the high-end model, but that's it.

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Well, let's wait for when the machine is actually released. We still have no idea what the actuall specs are. They still might have some crappy GPU (Dell simply says 'nvidia graphics', which can be anything) or downclocked CPUs in there.

It's available at Dell's website. It's a GeForce 750M with 2 GB RAM.

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Spec wise Apple has always been beaten. I've yet to see anything trump the complete overall package that they have consistently been able to provide though. The upcoming Dell does look very nice indeed and you have to hand it to them for being so proficient at copying the blueprint Apple provided. Until proven otherwise I'm still highly skeptical of the overall build quality/durability of Dell, trackpad, carbon fiber, and battery life claims.

There's a lot of unknowns in how the new IGZO technology will work and whether the transition will be seamless. The combination of touchscreen and Windows aren't for me but I don't count that against them. I do hope that both of the new XPS models succeed and force Apple to up their game even more and at a faster rate than they would otherwise prefer. Competition has always been healthy for innovation.

Well said.

And this Dell model is providing a lot of competition for Apple.

The top-end model has a Core i7-4702HQ processor at 2.2 GHz, 16 GB RAM, a 512 GB SSD, and sells for US$ 2,299.00. And, of course, the 3200x1800 IGZO display, and a body slightly lighter than the retina MacBook Pro. Spec-wise, it looks a better deal than the retina MacBook Pro.

As for the battery life, it should be better than the battery life of the current retina MacBook Pro, as it makes use of two technologies that are expected to boost battery life: Haswell processors and IGZO displays. Should Apple put these two beasts inside the Mac, however, then the game may change. We'll see in a few days.

 

[Xerotech]

Spec wise Apple has always been beaten. I've yet to see anything trump the complete overall package that they have consistently been able to provide though. The upcoming Dell does look very nice indeed and you have to hand it to them for being so proficient at copying the blueprint Apple provided. Until proven otherwise I'm still highly skeptical of the overall build quality/durability of Dell, trackpad, carbon fiber, and battery life claims.

There's a lot of unknowns in how the new IGZO technology will work and whether the transition will be seamless. The combination of touchscreen and Windows aren't for me but I don't count that against them. I do hope that both of the new XPS models succeed and force Apple to up their game even more and at a faster rate than they would otherwise prefer. Competition has always been healthy for innovation.

True, Apple has always been beaten spec-wise, but not in lightweight, thin and battery life.

 

[weasel79]

i am a MPB user and i am not sure why everybody seems to put apples build quality overy anybody elses.
apple always had these "error by design" logicboard/trackpad problems; i've seen plenty people who lost key tops off their keyboard; my usb ports are really loose after 2 years; my power button is kind of sticking... also a week ago the SSD of a 2 months old rMBP just died in the middle of a very important project, out of the blue. didnt boot up at all anymore, all the apple store guys could do is make it show a big "FAILED" screen and tell me to send it in.
and of course it is really kinda of hard to replace/repair anything.

granted, the aluminum feels god, but if dell or anybody else just uses a similar feeling material for the body/case, i wouldnt put apple over anything else by default, talking build quality.

sure, the low-end dells some of you have been working with might feel like plastic, because they are. at a price less than half the same apple though.

as my main work software (cubase) runs more stable & efficient on windows, i am tempted to stray from apple this time around.

 

[TechZeke]

i am a MPB user and i am not sure why everybody seems to put apples build quality overy anybody elses.
apple always had these "error by design" logicboard/trackpad problems; i've seen plenty people who lost key tops off their keyboard; my usb ports are really loose after 2 years; my power button is kind of sticking... also a week ago the SSD of a 2 months old rMBP just died in the middle of a very important project, out of the blue. didnt boot up at all anymore, all the apple store guys could do is make it show a big "FAILED" screen and tell me to send it in.
and of course it is really kinda of hard to replace/repair anything.

granted, the aluminum feels god, but if dell or anybody else just uses a similar feeling material for the body/case, i wouldnt put apple over anything else by default, talking build quality.

sure, the low-end dells some of you have been working with might feel like plastic, because they are. at a price less than half the same apple though.

as my main work software (cubase) runs more stable & efficient on windows, i am tempted to stray from apple this time around.

It's not that Apple's build quality is automatically better than everyone else's, it's just a simply fact of you get what you pay for. I have a $2500 2006/2007 17" Sony VAIO that still runs perfectly fine. The $500 Dell had keys falling off and a failed motherboard after just a year of use.

If other similarly priced laptops weren't having any of the issues the MacBooks have, then fine. But from my experience Apple computers are simply one of the best built computers out there.

With that said, no machine is perfect. There are going to be oddities and failures no matter what the machine it is.

PS. Of the 4 or 5 MacBooks my family has had, I've NEVER seen a logic board spontaneously fail, or keyboard key fall off.

Also, a friend in the dorm last year, had his ASUS Zenbook come in the mail brand new with sticky keys and a "B" key falling off. At $1400, it's just as expensive as any Macbook. The Zenbook is still an excellent windows alternative, it's called a manufacturing fluke.

 

[hellboyz]

I feel if IGZO screens are better than retina in terms of display quality, we should have the iMBP(igzoMBP) on 22nd... coz if Dell can have it on 11/11, Apple can definately have it before that

 

[akdj]

while i respect your right to post a poll in general, the premise of this poll is terrible. not only are dell and apple two different OS, people don't just choose one or the other on a whim.

but we're talking about a dell. a freaking dell. give me a break. it disgusts me that people think dells are built great. i've used dells at work for the past 10 years and none of them are good.

So have I (use Dell @ work)---I edit and produce audio on a pair of (cheap) Dells, one that's probably four or five years old now. They're desktops but they're fine (Win 7). Dell makes phenomenal laptops if you look at their Precision line, Alienware....as well as some of the upper tier XPS, et al. Build a Dell with similar specs as a MBP and the prices aren't all that different. That said, Apple truly DOES trump Dell with build quality, materials choice, trackpad...and of course the lack of Windows/Dell bloat ware (that you don't have to have with a Precision or high end config)...Apple build both their hard and software and are able to optimize the experience (end user experience and support) to their specific and 'small' selection of portables. I've been using Windows for 25 years. Consistently at the studio and up until 'Vista' personally. That is when I bought our first Macs. My wife a white MacBook and myself an MBP in 2006. I'll never buy another Windows machine myself....but most Windows OEMs, including MS itself are starting to figure out Apple's dirty little secret. Build. Quality! People love it....but it does cost. If you're willing to put some money into your laptop....most manufacturers will sell you a killer piece of gear. What I like about Apple is their forward thinking. SSDs...now PCIe SSDs, thunderbolt, retina...high resolution displays and their 'clout' with both Intel and nVidia. They're working with both constantly and with the Air, they transformed the laptop market. Intel recognized it and dropped $300mil to market, compel the other OEMs, and distribute a well built, powerful, small package based on solid state storage and portability. Not sure it's paid off yet....but really, the last 18 months have been a new landscape for these manufacturers. Sony has always kinda done their own thing. But ASUS, Dell, Toshiba, and Samsung to name a few have released better products each year that ARE giving Apple's engineering a 'run' for the money.

As mentioned, 25 years of computing and I couldn't be happier with Apple right now. Our business is built around Apple with a Mac Pro, several iMacs, a pair of 15" rMBPs are my wife and I's every day machines and we've both got a MBA. 11" for travel and 'on the couch' work when the iPad won't cut it. To me, the rMBP was damn near as big a difference in laptop technology as the iPhone's disruption to the phone market. It's an absolute pleasure to use and puts a smile on my face every time I boot up in ten seconds. Open a Word .doc in a half second, or watch a 340mb 'Office' critical update install in 20 or 30 seconds. The display is second to none. The package is incredibly portable and it doesn't lack power even in comparison to our 2010 MP! Ten years ago...this type of speed would only by achieved by super computers. These days, even Dell will build you one
Thing is....you can't judge Dell, HP, etc by the offerings at Best Buy. Check their website and build a good rig. It might open your eyes

I voted yes... I figure even is the new rMBPs with a conventional IPS display will hit the 10-12 hour range, they will still pull down below 6-7 if using a heavy workload. An extra few hours might still be necessary for a full day without charger experience. Also if possible a res bump to 3360 x 2100 (a native 'desktop space' of 1680x1050) would be most welcome, as that would be my default work mode 80% of the time and it would be nice to not have to scale.

Interesting aside, I don't keep up with PCs and one of my interns got a 13" variant of this Dell. I was surprised at how solid the machine is and love the soft-touch rubberized thing going on. That said doing without OSX is murder for a new Rails dev when that industry/toolchain is primarily using OSX.

I run in 'scaled' mode on my rMBP (1920/1200) all the time. No performance degradation at all noticeable. Lot of overblown 'crappola' about the rMBP and 'lag' associated with them. The only situation I'll see any type of lag is poorly coded sites....and most have improved a LOT over the past year (or Safari's updates have fixed it). I came to the 15" rMBP from six years of 17" only MBPs. The lack of real estate bugged me for all of about two minutes adder turning it on the first time.
Not that I'm against a 4k 17" pro model workstation offering. Just not sure Apple is interested in that small of a population. We'll get a better idea with what they do with the new Mac Pro I think

i am a MPB user and i am not sure why everybody seems to put apples build quality overy anybody elses.
apple always had these "error by design" logicboard/trackpad problems; i've seen plenty people who lost key tops off their keyboard; my usb ports are really loose after 2 years; my power button is kind of sticking... also a week ago the SSD of a 2 months old rMBP just died in the middle of a very important project, out of the blue. didnt boot up at all anymore, all the apple store guys could do is make it show a big "FAILED" screen and tell me to send it in.
and of course it is really kinda of hard to replace/repair anything.

granted, the aluminum feels god, but if dell or anybody else just uses a similar feeling material for the body/case, i wouldnt put apple over anything else by default, talking build quality.

sure, the low-end dells some of you have been working with might feel like plastic, because they are. at a price less than half the same apple though.

as my main work software (cubase) runs more stable & efficient on windows, i am tempted to stray from apple this time around.

Interesting. We own 11 Macs all together...including the original MacBook I bought my wife in 2006. My 8 year old son uses it now. Never an issue. Certainly not to the extent you're claiming. That said...in the world of electronics, failures happen. Take care of your gear and you keys won't fall off. Their trackpad is the best and most responsive in the business....and your rMBP should be covered under warranty. Their support is also second to none.
Hard to argue Apple's build quality isn't top notch. I noticed you just registered. You sure you're not embellishing these issues?

J

 

[Xerotech]

No IGZO display unfortunately. Apple led and is now behind.