Would you buy another Mac Pro?

[dreamof3d]

My Mac Pro brings me joy every day. Sure I would like it faster for my 3d rendering. The fact is, Intel will most likely have an 8 core xeon for the new Mac Jan '09. Yes I would buy another one. I may just hold out till next year, and see what Intel does for those Macs. The way technology is going, we'll never be able to keep up anyway. I'm going to keep this one, and network it to my new machine, whether I get it next week or next year, I will buy one.
My ATI card does all it needs to except in my Linux tinkering.

Can't wait to do a network rendering..

 

[GotPro]

Now that I'm actually at a computer and not using my iPhone... I just want to touch on this a bit more.

I personally think that the Mac Pro is one HECK of an upgradeable machine.

Let's see... what can you upgrade out of the box from Apple (in a standard 2.8 Octo 2gb 320 config):

Want more hard drive space? Add any SATA hard drive type or size right out of the box. 4TB of upgradeability. Not too shabby.

Want external ESATA capabilities? Upgrade with a $22 part available online... plug it into the 2 spare SATA ports (on top of the stock 4) and now ESATA to your hearts content. Nice upgradeability / expandability. Not too shabby.

Want another CDRW/DVDRW/BLUERAY/WHATEVER DRIVE? Add one to the second optical port on the Mac Pro. Apple even has a nice little applet to allow you access to open / close the second drive (in addition to key combos). Nice upgradeability / expandability there.

Want faster CPUs? Apple doesn't control the cost of the CPUs... so too expensive isn't an argument. Go to newegg.com and buy 2 faster CPUs and plug them in. Nice upgradeability / expandability there.

Want more memory? Is 32 GB of upgrading / expanding not enough for you? I think it's pretty kick ass. Personally.

Want more than 2 gigabit ethernet ports? How about more firewire / usb ports? Well, one of the 3 PCI expansion slots are your friend! Use them! Order any card you want and upgrade / expand to your hearts content.

Want a faster / better video card? There are only 2 choices for the Mac right now... but that, too... isn't Apple's fault. ATI has a nice history of producing a few cards for Macs along the way. If you are running windows... then ANY 2.0 Card will run and run fine.

So... when talking about upgradeability... the ONLY area I see an issue with over any other PC in the world is in the area of Video Cards.

There is also a different mindset when users come from the PC world where they want to "upgrade" forever... the Mac side simply doesn't think that way because the resale of the existing machines are soooo great... that it kinda eliminates the need to upgrade in the traditional PC sense. I can get 70-80% of RETAIL when I go to sell my Mac in a year when the new ones come out... and probably spend LESS to get a brand new top of the line EVERYTHING than I would have to simply "upgrade" to the video card or CPUs themselves... NOT SO MUCH in the PC world. You have a 1-2 year old dell... and NOBODY is buying that thing for more than 30 cents on the dollar. Typically. I'm sure there are a few examples that PC people can point and say "See here... he sold it for more".

The bottom line is that the Mac Pro is:

1) a HELL of a machine.
2) a Price Bargain
3) Infinitely upgradeable / expandable (save the lone issue with video cards in OS X ONLY)
4) A machine that in a years time, you can sell for a ton of cash and get a brand new one for less than it would take you to upgrade a typical PC.

Thats my story and I'm stickin' to it ;-)

Flame on!

 

[pastrychef]

Well said, GotPro!

 

[dreamof3d]

Second that GotPro, I was bitching for a while too, but it all comes down to:

Technology is updated in leaps and bounds, with the re-sale value of our Mac Pro's, why would you want to rebuild anyway. I personally like the fact this machine is covered for 2 more years, why strip everything out for new, when for a few bones more......U know what I mean.....

 

[lampliter]

If graphics cards are so important to you, why didn't you get an X1900 or Quadro FX when you got your computer?

What is it that you do with your computer that you feel it's useless?

Pastry chef I do understand your question,and at least this time it is a fair question coming from what seems a mind that is still intact.However I know even when I answer it there will still be replies that my case is very unusual and some how exaggerated.So here it is,first off all I have always had a mac,longer than most here and deserve the right to be not put off as a nut.OK,when I bought my pro I didnt buy the 1900 because it is a terrible card for the price,I don`t mean bad performance but there were hundreds of posts saying the card was nothing but trouble,and any serch on any form will tell you that.I didnt buy the 8 million dollar FX because it is not even close to being worth it not to say it is`nt a half desend one.So the problem is here once again I have answered and now I will be told that I have no right to turn down choices given to me by apple(such as the 400 dollar fire ball 1900).Also most people here can not for a second sympathize with this situation,and somehow it is the fault of the buyer for paying out all that money on a pro.I know I should be held responsible for buying this pro and thinking apple would support it for more than a year.Maybe I am crazy thinking that the 7300 gt is out dated,because most here take offense to saying anything about it. We can make fun of windows for every little thing we can come up with , but don`t dare say anything wrong with mac because it will fall on deaf ears.You people are actually beginning to break me also.Praise Steve, he is my savior and can do nothing wrong.And I hope he is spending my money wisely.

 

[Wild-Bill]

Interesting how many people saying this have early '08 Mac Pros with 8800s.

Just for the record, I have a 2008 MP with an 8800GT and I have nothing but sympathy for those of you stuck with the 1900xt in your pre-2008 Mac Pros. I'd be pretty pissed. But I'll just reserve my anger for later this year or next year when it happens to me.

Apple is not going to do anything to get the 8800GT working in the older Mac Pros, as I'm sure they'll do nothing for early 2008 Mac Pro owners who want whatever comes in the "late 2008 / 2009" Mac Pro.

 

[pastrychef]

Pastry chef I do understand your question,and at least this time it is a fair question coming from what seems a mind that is still intact.However I know even when I answer it there will still be replies that my case is very unusual and some how exaggerated.So here it is,first off all I have always had a mac,longer than most here and deserve the right to be not put off as a nut.OK,when I bought my pro I didnt buy the 1900 because it is a terrible card for the price,I don`t mean bad performance but there were hundreds of posts saying the card was nothing but trouble,and any serch on any form will tell you that.I didnt buy the 8 million dollar FX because it is not even close to being worth it not to say it is`nt a half desend one.So the problem is here once again I have answered and now I will be told that I have no right to turn down choices given to me by apple(such as the 400 dollar fire ball 1900).Also most people here can not for a second sympathize with this situation,and somehow it is the fault of the buyer for paying out all that money on a pro.I know I should be held responsible for buying this pro and thinking apple would support it for more than a year.Maybe I am crazy thinking that the 7300 gt is out dated,because most here take offense to saying anything about it. We can make fun of windows for every little thing we can come up with , but don`t dare say anything wrong with mac because it will fall on deaf ears.You people are actually beginning to break me also.Praise Steve, he is my savior and can do nothing wrong.And I hope he is spending my money wisely.

Yes, some people had problems with X1900s. But, I believe later revisions corrected whatever issues plagued it.

I could be wrong, but, from what I remember, the X1900 was the top of the line card from ATI when it made its appearance on the 1st gen Mac Pros.

You keep on claiming that we're Jobs worshippers and Apple apologists. I really don't see any of that in this thread. Please stop insulting me and everyone else here.

Just for the record, I have a 2008 MP with an 8800GT and I have nothing but sympathy for those of you stuck with the 1900xt in your pre-2008 Mac Pros. I'd be pretty pissed. But I'll just reserve my anger for later this year or next year when it happens to me.

Apple is not going to do anything to get the 8800GT working in the older Mac Pros, as I'm sure they'll do nothing for early 2008 Mac Pro owners who want whatever comes in the "late 2008 / 2009" Mac Pro.

That remains to be seen. I read from a link from another thread on here to look for a 1st gen compatible version of the 8800GT in April. I don't know if it's real or fake, but I think people should wait and see a little before jumping to conclusions.

Found the link:
https://forums.macrumors.com/posts/5212031/

 

[lampliter]

Yes, some people had problems with X1900s. But, I believe later revisions corrected whatever issues plagued it.

I could be wrong, but, from what I remember, the X1900 was the top of the line card from ATI when it made its appearance on the 1st gen Mac Pros.

You keep on claiming that we're Jobs worshippers and Apple apologists. I really don't see any of that in this thread. Please stop insulting me and everyone else here.

Why is it such a bad thing that we ask for a reasonable graphics card.The only reasaon I can come to is that it hurts peoples feeling to say apple is not perfect.Telling me that the 1900 is top of the line doesn`t help me,it helps you feel better about apple.The 1900 is a flop, sorry to make you hurt once again with the facts.Looking forward to another post saying every thing is peaches and cream at apple land.All we are saying is , it is not right what apple is doing.Stop insulting me by trying to tell me I have no right to expect something even reasonably from a 3000 dollar machine.

 

[pastrychef]

Why is it such a bad thing that we ask for a reasonable graphics card.The only reasaon I can come to is that it hurts peoples feeling to say apple is not perfect.Telling me that the 1900 is top of the line doesn`t help me,it helps you feel better about apple.The 1900 is a flop, sorry to make you hurt once again with the facts.Looking forward to another post saying every thing is peaches and cream at apple land.All we are saying is , it is not right what apple is doing.Stop insulting me by trying to tell me I have no right to expect something even reasonably from a 3000 dollar machine.

Are you saying it wasn't the top of the line ATI card at the time of the Mac Pro introduction?

It doesn't make me feel any better or worse if the X1900 is a flop or not. I sold it along with my old Mac Pro.

What is "reasonable" to you?

I never told you to expect or not to expect anything. I was asking you to stop insulting me.

 

[lampliter]

Are you saying it wasn't the top of the line ATI card at the time of the Mac Pro introduction?

It doesn't make me feel any better or worse if the X1900 is a flop or not. I sold it along with my old Mac Pro.

What is "reasonable" to you?

I never told you to expect or not to expect anything. I was asking you to stop insulting me.

Pastry chef I can see this form is a place for you to argue and try to twist peoples posts to comply with your personal way of thinking.You will no more hear from me you are always off topic on every post you submit.I will now go and buy a brand new mac pro,just so you can sleep.YES I will buy another mac pro.I am very sorry for expressing my frustration with apple and my mac.You are right ,I am wrong.A 1900 is the best card on the market and has never had problems.I should be happy with my 7300,and it is wrong of me to think other wise.

 

[syth]

I stand by what I said, if I do not get to buy an 8800 for my machine that is still less than a year old, this is my last Mac Pro. I I _am_ able to buy an 8800, then certainly I would consider another Mac Pro.

Right now I am still holding out hope Apple will come through and that his was NVIDIA's screw-up.

 

[Mackilroy]

Pastry chef I can see this form is a place for you to argue and try to twist peoples posts to comply with your personal way of thinking.You will no more hear from me you are always off topic on every post you submit.I will now go and buy a brand new mac pro,just so you can sleep.YES I will buy another mac pro.I am very sorry for expressing my frustration with apple and my mac.You are right ,I am wrong.A 1900 is the best card on the market and has never had problems.I should be happy with my 7300,and it is wrong of me to think other wise.

Having read your and his interchange, it seems like you're overreacting a bit here. He's not saying that you should be happy with the 7300, he's simply saying that when the 2006 Mac Pro was released, the x1900 was top of the line. Nowhere does he state that it still is, or that you have to be satisfied with it being the most powerful card currently available to run in the 2006 Mac Pros under OS X.

As he said in his previous post (which it seems you missed) he just wants you to stop insulting him, not stop being dissatisfied with Apple's upgradeability or lack thereof regarding the Mac Pro.

 

[peschybear]

Experiences with my Mac Pro

The Mac Pro is a nice and powerful machine. At the time I bought it (9 months ago) it was the best you could get for that price even compared to PCs (video card excluded). I am a gamer and normally I buy a new PC every 2 years, but I got fet up with the video card race on PC and the idea of an optimal system that changes every month. Also I was looking for a silent machine.
At the Apple reseller I was able to get some hands-on experience with the Mac Pro and I wanted one badly.
But there was a catch: the Mac Pro with the X1900XT isn't silent at all (in the store it had a 7300) and this card didn't work with boot camp. After 2 weeks my Mac Pro stopped altogether and they needed to replace the Logic board, the processors and the video card. After these problems the machine worked fine.
So now I got a machine which isn't silent and I can't upgrade the video card (yet).
If I run boot camp windows only detects 2GB RAM in stead of the max of 4GB.
If I want to run Windows 64 bit on my 64-bit machine I need a new Mac Pro. The old one is 64 bit according to Apple, but not for boot camp.
It says a lot of Mac OS X, that I am still a fan despite all the problems and setbacks.
Apple fans don't like criticism but this is the truth. Apple is selling nice machines and has an awesome operating system, but they can still improve a lot of things.
The idea of a Mac Mini or iMac combined with a Macbook in stead of a Mac Pro isn't so bad.
To the question if I would buy another Mac Pro I'll say maybe.

 

[OZMP]

my next tower will be a pc tower, thinking of returning my macbook due to **** build quality, and the screens on MBP's are meant to be duds. My MP will be on ebay soon most likely

 

[jjahshik32]

I would definitely buy again, I'm going to try to wait out 4-5 years before buying another one... but.. I doubt it and I'll only hold out 2 more years realistically!!

 

[Infrared]

Why is it such a bad thing that we ask for a reasonable graphics card.The only reasaon I can come to is that it hurts peoples feeling to say apple is not perfect.Telling me that the 1900 is top of the line doesn`t help me,it helps you feel better about apple.The 1900 is a flop, sorry to make you hurt once again with the facts.

I think Apple would have done better to have waited a little
then offered the x1950, which had a better cooling solution.

That card came out pretty much the same time as the 2006
MPs (or just a little after) if I recall correctly.

 

[Infrared]

If I want to run Windows 64 bit on my 64-bit machine I need a new Mac Pro.

Really?

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/231901/

 

[pastrychef]

The Mac Pro is a nice and powerful machine. At the time I bought it (9 months ago) it was the best you could get for that price even compared to PCs (video card excluded). I am a gamer and normally I buy a new PC every 2 years, but I got fet up with the video card race on PC and the idea of an optimal system that changes every month. Also I was looking for a silent machine.
At the Apple reseller I was able to get some hands-on experience with the Mac Pro and I wanted one badly.
But there was a catch: the Mac Pro with the X1900XT isn't silent at all (in the store it had a 7300) and this card didn't work with boot camp. After 2 weeks my Mac Pro stopped altogether and they needed to replace the Logic board, the processors and the video card. After these problems the machine worked fine.
So now I got a machine which isn't silent and I can't upgrade the video card (yet).
If I run boot camp windows only detects 2GB RAM in stead of the max of 4GB.
If I want to run Windows 64 bit on my 64-bit machine I need a new Mac Pro. The old one is 64 bit according to Apple, but not for boot camp.
It says a lot of Mac OS X, that I am still a fan despite all the problems and setbacks.
Apple fans don't like criticism but this is the truth. Apple is selling nice machines and has an awesome operating system, but they can still improve a lot of things.
The idea of a Mac Mini or iMac combined with a Macbook in stead of a Mac Pro isn't so bad.
To the question if I would buy another Mac Pro I'll say maybe.

I'm not saying that you should have to do this, but there are quite a few after market coolers for the X1900 that dramatically reduced the amount of noise.

If you are running the 32 bit version of Windows XP in Bootcamp, it should be detecting 3GB. This is a limitation of 32 bit Windows XP, not the Mac Pro.

As Infrared has shown you, it is indeed possible to run the 64 bit version of Windows.

I don't mind hearing criticism if it's true.

 

[krye]

I'd buy another Mac Pro is a heart beat. It's the most amazing, most powerful computer I've ever owned. The thing is, if you're about to spend $4000 on a Mac, it's your responsibility as an Apple consumer to check the blogs. Find out if a new machine in the works. And if it is, then wait. If you don't, then you have to live with your decision.

"We" the Apple community knew for months that the new 8 core standard Mac Pros were coming in January. We all suspected a MacWorld release. Much to our surprise, it was released the week before. You have to be an educated consumer where it comes to Apple. I can't stand listening to people complain about the machine they just bought and they're all upset because a new one just come out a week later. It's like when people buy iPods in August and then are all upset when Apple releases new iPods in the fall. New iPhones are coming in June. People will buy the old one in May and then bitch that they missed the boat in June. You need to educate yourself the next time you decide to drop $4000 on Apple.

 

[Gonk42]

Apple is a bit of a tease

I am waiting to buy a MacPro (until the point when I really need it) but I do now own a Macbook. I've read this thread with interest.

It seems to me that hardware wise the base model Mac Pro is a very good price for an 8 core machine (especially if you're a student). In the pc world prices sky-rocket as soon as you go to dual Xeon processors.

Additionally the Mac OS is very nice.

But what seems to frustrate many people on the forums is that you are constantly faced with unpleasant choices-

i) you can fit a powerful graphics card and use it under Windows but then you have to give up Mac OS because of such issues as the fans going full-tilt even if there is a second graphics card present.

ii) you can fit an (expensive) RAID card and have SAS drives but then can't use bootcamp and Windows.

iii) if you want anything more powerful than the base model Apple charges outrageous upgrade prices. Memory and hard-drives you can get around by buying 3rd party but this sometimes means the Apple support is more limited. With processors you really have no choice. For example, Apple charges £500 to upgrade to 3.0GHz processors and you not even guaranteed to get the lower power 'E5472' ones. The difference in price from somewhere like scan is only £280 and you do get the 'E' versions. Similarly, with graphics cards you have a very limited and in some cases expensive choice if you want to use Mac OSX.

iv) third party support for hardware (such as nvidia's CUDA and Tesla) will always go first to Windows then Linux and probably never be quite complete for Mac OSX. (This, of course, is not Apple's fault but a reflection of user-base size.)

v.) for obvious commercial reasons, new goodies (like the 8800) go to the new machines first but there does seem to be a lack of support for existing owners - not everyone likes to go through the hassle of selling a machine and buying again just to upgrade one component.

So Apple seduces you with good base prices, a nice OS, good design, but then frustrates by not being flexible, by forcing you to work at getting the machine you really want and by always giving the best goodies to new customers rather than rewarding loyalty.

On one level it makes commercial sense for Apple but I wonder if there is a hidden commercial cost in lost and delayed sales where people like me put off buying or worse still opt for a drab, perhaps expensive, but flexible Unix box instead.

I should add that there is a big upside to Apple's restrictive hardware policy - things should work better because there are far less varients to worry about - perhaps you just can't have things both ways.

 

[jrnewhouse]

Maybe I have been lucky, but I have owned Macs since 1994 and each one has been great. I have had a couple of minor problems over the years. My PowerMac 7300 had a bad hard drive, and my PowerMac G5 had a bad optical drive, but Apple sent me new ones via overnight delivery and the replacements worked fine. Regarding my current Mac, being able to run OS X and Windows Vista on the same machine gives me the best of both worlds for getting my work done and gaming. So far, I have not had a problem with my X1900XT for any game I have thrown at it (knock wood). Like many who contribute to this thread, I would like to have a graphics card upgrade for my machine and the recent post on Blizzard's forum seems to intimate that it will happen. But I am not willing to throw away 14 years of great experiences with Macs just because I can't buy an 8800GT for my 2007 Mac Pro today. So, yes I will buy another Mac Pro (if that is what they call it when the time comes ).

 

[lampliter]

Having read your and his interchange, it seems like you're overreacting a bit here. He's not saying that you should be happy with the 7300, he's simply saying that when the 2006 Mac Pro was released, the x1900 was top of the line. Nowhere does he state that it still is, or that you have to be satisfied with it being the most powerful card currently available to run in the 2006 Mac Pros under OS X.

As he said in his previous post (which it seems you missed) he just wants you to stop insulting him, not stop being dissatisfied with Apple's upgradeability or lack thereof regarding the Mac Pro.

Im sick of repeating myself and sick of you putting words in my mouth and sick of replies from mac freaks who can`t agree with any thing that may hurt mac.Look,I have a 3000 dollar mac with a 7300 and there is no,absolutely no upgrade path for this machine.That is the bottom line,twist it how you like,come up with some crazy answer to make yourselves feel better about your own mac.There is no upgrade path for this machine.But there is in your opinion because you refuse to see it that way.The 7300 is the only very reliable card for this mac.end of story.Hundreds of others are in the same boat.Why do you think these threads even exist.How do you make yourselves believe there is no problem.I do not own shares in apple so I can tell it how it is.There is no other card for a 1 year old mac other than the 7300.

 

[peschybear]

I'm not saying that you should have to do this, but there are quite a few after market coolers for the X1900 that dramatically reduced the amount of noise.

If you are running the 32 bit version of Windows XP in Bootcamp, it should be detecting 3GB. This is a limitation of 32 bit Windows XP, not the Mac Pro.

As Infrared has shown you, it is indeed possible to run the 64 bit version of Windows.

I don't mind hearing criticism if it's true.

I know, but then there is the warranty issue and the X1900XT is not the most stable video card, so I'm not taking the risk with a €500 card.

You'll find on this page the table with the memory limit for Windows XP (4GB!):
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa366778.aspx
Windows XP in boot camp sees actually 5GB, but only 2GB are used. The same problem occurs with Vista in boot camp

There is a difference between something that runs smoothly out of the box and something that needs a lot of tweaking and praying. Check the forums: some people succeed other have issues with hardware.
But, OK, it is "possible".

 

[greenmeanie]

I did the same thing.
For your money you are doing good getting two quad cores.

Not just yes but HELL yes.

Even if I wanted a PC and not a Mac I'd STILL buy a Mac Pro and ONLY run XP/VISTA on it.

Why?

1 PRICE. Its truly a steal. Price out the parts on building a PC just as bad-a$$ed as the Mac Pro and its almost 2x as much... Heck... Just 2 2.8 Quad Cpus and a dual CPU mb for said CPUS costs near $2300ish... And the whole system from Apple with Education discount is only $2500!!!

2 Want a windows only gaming system? Its STILL a steal... Buy it... ONLY run Windows in it... And buy any damn Video Card you want for it!

Not sure why people get so upset... Kinda like being pissed at Ford because they didnt drop a Chevy LS7 motor in a mustang.

If you want a Chevy LS7 motor so freaking bad go buy the car that the motor you want comes in... Don't go whining to the other car companies fan forums that you are upset with their companies because their cars don't have the motor YOU want.

Go buy the thing that makes YOU happy and just let us do the same ;-)

No offense intended, btw!

 

[Infrared]

iv) third party support for hardware (such as nvidia's CUDA and Tesla) will always go first to Windows then Linux and probably never be quite complete for Mac OSX. (This, of course, is not Apple's fault but a reflection of user-base size.)

OS X has a larger user-base than Linux.