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Mac Mini: The new Mini refresh was well needed and the current parts that are available are all top notch. they're great quality. the compromise however is thermals aren't great (and should be better). Again, there's nothing grossly wrong with the Mini and it makes a great headless Mac Computer... except that the price again gets in the way. You can get smaller, more powerful computers now for $400-$500, several hundred less than the Mac Mini. So this is again where pricing gets in the way of a great product.

Do these computers come with four 40 Gbits/sec Thunderbolt-3 ports, two USB 3.1 ports, HDMI 2.0, and Bluetooth 5.0. All stock in the base unit. I suspect they do come with a large external brick power supply, rather than one that's built-in like the Mini.

How about the ability to add an optional built-in 10Gbit ethernet port?
 
Competition? Yeah... If you don't give two trucks about sound quality.

good job reading out of context and not the immediate next sentence which caveats the comment... talk about looking for something to be contrary about
 
I give AAPL a D- for what they introduced this year.

What was the Highlight of the year for AAPL ??? ... I have NO clue ! ... nothing stands out ... to me, 2018 will be remembered for Nov 1st, the day AAPL announced they will NO longer report iPhone Unit Sales at future earnings releases ... everything they do is tied to iPhone Unit Sales, so that announcement spelled Doom for them ! ... things won't rebound unless/until AAPL announces a change in leadership ...

I am still expecting that AAPL announces that Tim Cook has stepped down as CEO of AAPL late today !

The Board Chairman will take over on an interim basis.
 
good job reading out of context and not the immediate next sentence which caveats the comment... talk about looking for something to be contrary about

No. Not at all. And hardly a caveat. You may not understand the market Apple is addressing with HomePod.
 
That's right and I wish people would understand more, that for a company like Apple, where the #1 motivator seems to be profit and revenues. The only way for them to be told they're prices are too high is to not buy their products.

I think your premise, that people in general feel Apple's prices are too high, is faulty. Several hundred million repeat customers buy Apple products year after year after year.
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For a $700 you can build a decent 5.1 sound system with an AV receiver. AirPlay included.

Of course. But Apple is not trying to reach that group of people who want to do that.
 
Do these computers come with four 40 Gbits/sec Thunderbolt-3 ports, two USB 3.1 ports, HDMI 2.0, Bluetooth 5.0. I suspect they do come with a large external brick power supply, rather than one that's built-in like the Mini.

How about the ability to add an optional built-in 10Gbit ethernet port?


yes

I was using the Razer as an example. comes with Thunderbolt3 USB-C, 2x USB-A, a HDMI-2.0 port... though I Do not know which Bluetooth standard it's using.

as for NUCs that are cheaper? yes. they do. here's comparisons
Apple Mini Base: $799
CPU: i3-8100u
RAM: 8GB@2666
Storage: 128GB NVME (soldered)
GPU: Intel 620

Intel NUC: ($284) Total Price : $424
CPU: i3-8109u
RAM: customizable self installed: 8GB 2666mhz Memory ($60)
Storage: Customizable NVME: 256gb Samsung 970 EVO: ($80)
GPU: Intel Iris 655

To put it in comparison, if you went up to the 799 price point that the base model is going for you could get an Intel NUC that features
CPU: i7- 8559U
RAM: 16GB 2x8gb DDR4 2666
Storage: Samsung 970 EVO 500GB
GPU: intel Iris 655
This build still only comes to $709

As for "external power brick". this is going to be a matter of personal opinion. for performance and functionality, I would rather have the smaller overall device (NUC) with an external bric (easer to replace if breaks), that doesn't cause internal heat (the Mini already has a thermal problem, not helped by having the PSU next to the CPU/GPU)

all above does have Thunderbolt 3. they also include additional space for 2.5" SSD as well (easily user installable).

The only thing the Mac Mini has above those listed is the 10gb ethernet port, which Intel haven't added to the NIC lineup yet. Which would be nice. And amazingly the Mini's price to upgrade to the 10gb port is actually incredibly reasonable.
 
yes

I was using the Razer as an example. comes with Thunderbolt3 USB-C, 2x USB-A, a HDMI-2.0 port... though I Do not know which Bluetooth standard it's using.

as for NUCs that are cheaper? yes. they do. here's comparisons
Apple Mini Base: $799
CPU: i3-8100u
RAM: 8GB@2666
Storage: 128GB NVME (soldered)
GPU: Intel 620

Intel NUC: ($284) Total Price : $424
CPU: i3-8109u
RAM: customizable self installed: 8GB 2666mhz Memory ($60)
Storage: Customizable NVME: 256gb Samsung 970 EVO: ($80)
GPU: Intel Iris 655

To put it in comparison, if you went up to the 799 price point that the base model is going for you could get an Intel NUC that features
CPU: i7- 8559U
RAM: 16GB 2x8gb DDR4 2666
Storage: Samsung 970 EVO 500GB
GPU: intel Iris 655
This build still only comes to $709

As for "external power brick". this is going to be a matter of personal opinion. for performance and functionality, I would rather have the smaller overall device (NUC) with an external bric (easer to replace if breaks), that doesn't cause internal heat (the Mini already has a thermal problem, not helped by having the PSU next to the CPU/GPU)

all above does have Thunderbolt 3. they also include additional space for 2.5" SSD as well (easily user installable).

The only thing the Mac Mini has above those listed is the 10gb ethernet port, which Intel haven't added to the NIC lineup yet. Which would be nice. And amazingly the Mini's price to upgrade to the 10gb port is actually incredibly reasonable.

All of the above come with four TB-3 ports?

And...Not trying to be obvious/limiting/etc, but if a small form-factor computer (being used headless in my case) does not come with macOS, then there's little chance I would be interested.

Having an extra one that can drive two 5K/4K displays is intriguing as well.
 
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I think your premise, that people in general feel Apple's prices are too high, is faulty. Several hundred million repeat customers buy Apple products year after year after year.

youre need to defend is palpable.

Apple's prices were always premium and that's always been considered OK. even I regularly paid that premium. however it was 2018 that saw sweeping price increases across the board. that sort of change doesn't impact numbers within a few short quarters. already in 2018 though we saw Apple mac sales the lowest since 2010.

Apple's iPhone sales, while revenues went up, volume numbers didn't grow as they sold similar amount to the previous year, possibly indicating a slowdown in the market and impact of higher prices. 2019 numbers will be interesting to see, especially since they will no longer report how many devices they sold.

but you are right in your ascertian even if you didn't say it outright. this is all speculative. None of us predicts the future. but we can only analyze based on the stats / figures and commentary we see/hear.
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All of the above come with four TB-3 ports?

if you absolutely require 4 TB3 ports for your device, and having 1 or 2 will not suffice, than yes, your best option is the Mac Mini.

if on the other hand, 4TB3 ports is not a requirement? Than you'd be paying a massive premium for the auxillary ports you may not use.

your mileage will vary in this matter. I would argue however that the bulk of the worlds users aren't going to be set back by having 1 or 2 tB3 vs 4. But if that's the goalpost you require, than the price premium of the Mini is what you have to pay.

as for everything else in those builds, you get significantly far FAR more performance and specs per dollar out of the NUC option than Mac Mini. Which I also heard (haven't tested myself yet), the NUC is extremely hackintosh capable.

And...Not trying to be obvious/limiting/etc, but if a small form-factor computer (being used headless in my case) does not come with macOS, then there's little chance I would be interested.

And that's understandable. if the price premium for hardware is acceptible to you based on MacOS, than you are going to have to pay that premium and might find that the $400 or so difference in hardware is worth the MacOS.
 
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youre need to defend is palpable.

Apple's prices were always premium and that's always been considered OK. even I regularly paid that premium. however it was 2018 that saw sweeping price increases across the board. that sort of change doesn't impact numbers within a few short quarters. already in 2018 though we saw Apple mac sales the lowest since 2010.

Apple's iPhone sales, while revenues went up, volume numbers didn't grow as they sold similar amount to the previous year, possibly indicating a slowdown in the market and impact of higher prices. 2019 numbers will be interesting to see, especially since they will no longer report how many devices they sold.

but you are right in your ascertian even if you didn't say it outright. this is all speculative. None of us predicts the future. but we can only analyze based on the stats / figures and commentary we see/hear.
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if you absolutely require 4 TB3 ports for your device, and having 1 or 2 will not suffice, than yes, your best option is the Mac Mini.

if on the other hand, 4TB3 ports is not a requirement? Than you'd be paying a massive premium for the auxillary ports you may not use.

your mileage will vary in this matter. I would argue however that the bulk of the worlds users aren't going to be set back by having 1 or 2 tB3 vs 4. But if that's the goalpost you require, than the price premium of the Mini is what you have to pay.

as for everything else in those builds, you get significantly far FAR more performance and specs per dollar out of the NUC option than Mac Mini. Which I also heard (haven't tested myself yet), the NUC is extremely hackintosh capable.



And that's understandable. if the price premium for hardware is acceptible to you based on MacOS, than you are going to have to pay that premium and might find that the $400 or so difference in hardware is worth the MacOS.

Need to defend? That's a hoot. I have no problem criticizing Apple when appropriate.

I don't see the price "premium" as an issue. The four TB-3 ports are flexible, and can be used as USB-C ports, or display ports as well. The point is there's lots of built-in flexibility, at the base price, right out of the box. And I do require them.

Small NVMe M.2-based external drives, interfaced by TB-3, will be coming down in price over the year. 2+ GBytes/sec transfer rates will be (and are) killer. I'm very much looking forward to that. And...the overall package will play nice with the 10Gb NIC.
 
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unfortunately though tech doesn't work that way with inflation. as technologies mature, the cost of production generally goes down as efficiencies from scale are found.

So while everything else being equal, the pricing should have a general decline over time. Not a dramatic increase.

PLEASE LISTEN ALL ... YES its not a price hike mathematically BUT it is, because tech gets way cheaper over the last decade!
Therefore the prices of apple stuff but also m$ and google etc are INSANE high ... they have started something nearly impossible making tech products close to double the price in a decade, when tech products in general are falling.

THEREFORE all this discussion about price is kind of annoying because its crystal clear that this companies hiking prices like crazy / JUST look at the iphone production price if You are still not sure . It may have doubled which it hasnt I gues but thats not a justification to double the consumer price!

from my point of view there is no more discussion about price needed / prices are unhealthy high and I hope the bubble bursts sooner than later!

I agree that something strange is going on. There are two possible explanations: (1) illegal price collusion, or (2) the discount was already priced in when the tech first launched.

With other consumer technology (computers, laptops, televisions, cameras, etc.), the price falls significantly as the technology matures. Accounting for inflation actually makes the fall in price even more dramatic. But with smartphones and tablets, as the technology matures, the prices seem be staying steady with inflation at best or even rising at worst.

This could be the result of illegal price fixing or collusion. I doubt Apple and Samsung and Google are directly colluding to fix prices, but they all source from generally the same suppliers, of which there are not so many. I wouldn't be surprised if suppliers of the priciest components (screens, SoCs, SSDs, RAM, battery, modem) are in fact doing some anti-competitive stuff to keep prices high.

The other theory is that the long-term technological advancements discount was priced in from the beginning. In other words, when smartphones first came out with a take-home price of ~$650, that was the actual cost of building and designing a smartphone with no profit. The profit came from the cost-reduction that would occur over time. Now they're just keeping it steady with inflation. The hugely competitive smartphone market of the 2010s supports this theory. It was a race to the bottom to wean out the weakest competitors, and now that the market has gelled around 3 or 4 competitors that have a collective 95% market share, there is no more downward pressure on prices.

Personally, I think both theories are true. I think low-tier suppliers like TSMC, UMC, and Samsung Semiconductor are colluding to fix prices or are otherwise engaged in anti-competitive practices. We know Qualcomm has been doing shady stuff too. I don't think there is much shady stuff going on with display suppliers just because there are so many of them. But advanced process node chips and modems, where there are very few competitors, I bet there's some illegal stuff going on. At the same time, I do think the discount was priced in early by the OEMs. Put another way, the OEMs learned from the 90s and early 2000s about pricing, and realized that if they delay profits for a year or so, adoption happens much quicker. So with smartphones/tablets, they priced in discount early and counted on future adoption and component cost-reduction to become their profits.
 
Define “truly updated”, as that term is based solely on your own perspective.

From an internals standpoint the iMac is a generation behind. Not the most egregious "out of date" devies Apple has ever had and at this point not terribly noticable except for mainly in multi-threaded workloads that the 8xxx series CPU's from intel bring.

the CPU's that are in the imac have had their replacements available on the open market from Intel since Q2 2018. So at this point, the iMac's internals should be due for a spec bump
 
Revamping a pretty bad designed original product it is still a bad product. The Revamping was just about the internal components not the actual Computer design. It was the same original Trashcan as 2006. It is impressive that took Apple 12 years to update the Mac Pro design. I guess the iMac is quite close it is already in its 10 year and counting.
Dood, the trashcan came out in 2013. It is a second gen Mac Pro. The design is nothing like the older "giant aluminum box" design. So I'm confused where you are getting the 2006 for the "trashcan"?
 
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Sorry, my bad. Still 5 years to upgrade a failed design is a long time.
True that, I recall being very tempted to get a Mac Pro in 2010 but sadly got an HP instead (though I liked Windows 7). Very happy with my iMac now but I am still hoping Apple pull out the stops and give us the Mac Pro we wanted and even more so what we weren't expecting...let's see.
 
I don't see the price "premium" as an issue. The four TB-3 ports are flexible, and can be used as USB-C ports, or display ports as well. The point is there's lots of built-in flexibility, at the base price, right out of the box. And I do require them.

I think flexibility is debatable here. I would rather it have 2 USB-C with 2 USB-A than 4 USB-C. And yeah I do still require USB-A for the time being because I only have 1 adapter.

I personally find USB-C still a hassle at work and at home because it requires having the dongle hub. Until USB-C is completely ubiquitous, I don’t find it as flexible as what I proposed.
 
The Mac Pro was release in 2006, but that model is what some people refer to as the cheese grader, not the trash can. The trash can came out in 2013.

EDIT: deebinem beat me to it.
 
I think your premise, that people in general feel Apple's prices are too high, is faulty. Several hundred million repeat customers buy Apple products year after year after year.

I can afford Apple products easily, but I feel the prices are pretty high. It does not mean I won’t buy. There are many more like me out there who will buy even if the price is expensive.
 
It's probably about time they start retiring new iOS support for 5S and 6S as well, new iPhone sales have slowed and getting people off those phones will probably be the next step. The iOS 12 performance bump is of course already appreciated.
Ouch! This year we bought a 2018 13 inch MacBook Pro Touch Bar, two HomePods and an AW4 -- no regrets. But I think my favorite purchase was the $29 battery for my bombproof iPhone 6s. I typically get a new iPhone every two years, but the 6s does everything I need: Lots of storage, good camera, touch ID, etc. My wife also got a new iPhone SE a month before it was discontinued, and enjoys the smaller form factor with most of the benefits of the 6s. I hope/expect another 2 years for my 6s (now 3 years old).
 
The Mac Pro was release in 2006, but that model is what some people refer to as the cheese grader, not the trash can. The trash can came out in 2013.
I would give the Stilton a grade of B+ for its pungency.
The Beecher's Flagship gets a grade of A for its consistent flavor.
The Humboldt Fog receives an A- for the gorgeous vein of ash.

That's how I grade cheese...

EDIT: Don't mind the snark, iAssimilated, I'm just bored...
 
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