You Can Now Apply for Apple Card on the Web

[Rigby]

Thanks for the info but what I meant was, whatever the issues are I hope they work them out.

Be careful what you wish for. The higher credit card cashback rates in the US are a bit of a shell game, since at the end of the day it is of course us, the consumers, who pay for the higher transaction fees that make the cashback possible in the first place. The end result is that we pay slightly higher retail prices than we otherwise would, and get some of the difference back in the form of cashback rewards.

If the Apple Card comes to Europe, I bet it will have lower rewards. But even here in the US the card isn't really all that attractive compared to other cards IMO.

 

[0279317]

Be careful what you wish for. The higher credit card cashback rates in the US are a bit of a shell game, since at the end of the day it is of course us, the consumers, who pay for the higher transaction fees that make the cashback possible in the first place. The end result is that we pay slightly higher retail prices than we otherwise would, and get some of the difference back in the form of cashback rewards.

If the Apple Card comes to Europe, I bet it will have lower rewards. But even here in the US the card isn't really all that attractive compared to other cards IMO.

What about items I purchase directly from Apple? Prices not higher and subtract Apple discounts and promos. For example: Apple is offering new Apple Card holders a $50 Daily Cash bonus when they use the card for an Apple service, which includes renting a movie in the Apple TV app, subscribing to Apple Arcade or Apple Music, or making an App Storepurchase.

 

[Mimiron]

Why can't Apple Card work outside the US? I'd love using a Credit Card that actually gives me benefits and cash back. The current Visa is worth dog poop I literally have 50 EUR cashback on my birthday that's it. No miles nothing.

 

[orbital~debris]

Needs support for UK/EU.

And from the sounds of @PinkyMacGodess ' post, Family support as well.

That and a few more little tweaks would make a good short segment at the next Event, for an 'Apple Card 1.2' update…

 

[opcodegames]

Applied online and got one with my MBP M1 last week.

 

[MacAddict1978]

Still on the fence about this card. I almost applied but went with Citi's Double Cash as it earns 2% back with no category restrictions.

You get 2% as long as the merchant takes Apple Pay, and most do. The bonus categories suck though, and half the time they pay the wrong percentage and its a battle to get them to fix it.

It's also a pain to find bonus merchants as it required searching the web... you know, because why would it be featured in your wallet app?

 

[btrach144]

Still no authorized users, right?

Right 😑

Agreed. If I could add my spouse, we’d drop Amex in a heart beat. Until then, AppleCare appears immature.

 

[Rigby]

What about items I purchase directly from Apple? Prices not higher

I think you misunderstood what I meant. The high credit card transaction fees in the US raise retail prices across the board, since the retailers obviously pass the cost to the customers.

and subtract Apple discounts and promos. For example: Apple is offering new Apple Card holders a $50 Daily Cash bonus when they use the card for an Apple service, which includes renting a movie in the Apple TV app, subscribing to Apple Arcade or Apple Music, or making an App Storepurchase.

$50 isn't impressive. Other credit cards often offer hundreds of dollars worth of sign-up bonuses. Similarly, the cashback isn't all that great. For example, I have a combination of two Bank of America cards that give at least 2.62% on every purchase, 3.5% on groceries, and up to 5.25% on certain categories, one of which is online shopping (which includes online orders from the Apple store).

 

[TracesOfArsenic]

And people say Apple give us nothing!

 

[tmiw]

I think you misunderstood what I meant. The high credit card transaction fees in the US raise retail prices across the board, since the retailers obviously pass the cost to the customers.

It's not even just that. A lot of (mainly smaller) merchants in the US at least pre-pandemic really would rather you have paid cash/debit and thus weren't in a huge hurry to support anything other than the absolute minimum (insert these days, but even that's apparently challenging for some). Cards finally became the majority of under $10 transactions just before the pandemic hit, for example.

Anyway, I found that the last time I went to Europe, merchants (in the UK anyway) were far more okay with cards than ones here. And these were some pretty small places, too; I think only one place I went to tried to surcharge over the whole trip, whereas $5-10 minimums and extra fees were a lot more common here. Granted, those weren't the majority even pre-pandemic, but still.

That said, making 0.2% caps the law here wouldn't necessarily trigger increased contactless acceptance or even less objection to card use overall. The dislike many merchants have towards Visa/MC goes back a while and thus may require additional regulation and/or time to fully resolve.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

And people say Apple give us nothing!

And, they did...

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

It's not even just that. A lot of (mainly smaller) merchants in the US at least pre-pandemic really would rather you have paid cash/debit and thus weren't in a huge hurry to support anything other than the absolute minimum (insert these days, but even that's apparently challenging for some). Cards finally became the majority of under $10 transactions just before the pandemic hit, for example.

Anyway, I found that the last time I went to Europe, merchants (in the UK anyway) were far more okay with cards than ones here. And these were some pretty small places, too; I think only one place I went to tried to surcharge over the whole trip, whereas $5-10 minimums and extra fees were a lot more common here. Granted, those weren't the majority even pre-pandemic, but still.

That said, making 0.2% caps the law here wouldn't necessarily trigger increased contactless acceptance or even less objection to card use overall. The dislike many merchants have towards Visa/MC goes back a while and thus may require additional regulation and/or time to fully resolve.

Canada was almost all chip-cards when the US was still wondering what the heck a 'chip card' was.

One thing that I experienced, owning a company that got a 'merchant account' for some of our clients: In the US (possibly other countries, I don't know), the laws are such that if you take a credit card, you pretty much hold the processor harmless for any loss. I mean, even if they have some idea that a card is stolen, and someone buys a couple of thousand dollars of merchandise, it's ALL ON YOU if the card turns out to be 'bad'. Shortly after we got our merchant account, our 'sales department' (me) got a request to quote on some specific equipment. Cisco routers, MS software, specific HP computers and a few servers, and accessories. I was 'assured' that the purchaser was 'legit', and that they wanted to pay by 'certified check'. I looked at the stuff they wanted, and responded that I would sell them ONE ITEM at a time. I never heard from them again. BUT apparently some idiot at a local 'hungry' reseller took their bait, hook, line, sinker, boat, dock, and probably lake too! They lost in the 'high 5 digits' and ended up going out of business because their merchant account holder said it was on them that they (their merchant account company) processed a 'known invalid' card. I was warned that I should be very careful whose card I accepted. That was some crazy stuff. THEY accept a card they know is suspect. And it's the merchant's fault? WTF?!?! What good is it to have a merchant account when they are looking for money from the companies they dupe. I think we only accepted a half dozen cards over several years. We dropped it, and everyone was fine with it. But whatever.

I'm sure larger businesses have to plan for those losses. I'm sure they can get pretty large too.

 

[0279317]

I think you misunderstood what I meant. The high credit card transaction fees in the US raise retail prices across the board, since the retailers obviously pass the cost to the customers.


$50 isn't impressive. Other credit cards often offer hundreds of dollars worth of sign-up bonuses. Similarly, the cashback isn't all that great. For example, I have a combination of two Bank of America cards that give at least 2.62% on every purchase, 3.5% on groceries, and up to 5.25% on certain categories, one of which is online shopping (which includes online orders from the Apple store).

My point was, I don't think that high transaction fees affect the prices that Apple charges for its goods and services. I'm incorrect?

I'm not in America but okay your point is taken.

 

[tmiw]

One thing that I experienced, owning a company that got a 'merchant account' for some of our clients: In the US (possibly other countries, I don't know), the laws are such that if you take a credit card, you pretty much hold the processor harmless for any loss. I mean, even if they have some idea that a card is stolen, and someone buys a couple of thousand dollars of merchandise, it's ALL ON YOU if the card turns out to be 'bad'.

Outside of online sales, that's not supposed to be the case as long as one follows all the acceptance guidelines.

That said, there are a lot of sketchy payment processors out there. I mean, I've heard people claim that Square was a lot cheaper than whatever they were using before, and Square isn't exactly the least expensive option.

My point was, I don't think that high transaction fees affect the prices that Apple charges for its goods and services. I'm incorrect?

It might be a wash in that cash users help subsidize prices too. Most places don't charge separate cash vs. card prices, so if they can encourage people to use cash at least some of the time, they may be able to keep down the amount they have to raise their prices (if any).

BTW, while it's allowed to surcharge and/or require minimums now, those have yet to become "standard" outside of maybe gas stations. That's pretty telling in itself, IMO.

 

[SurferPup]

Every time I see an article on Apple Card, I become a little excited especially when the first line is, "Last week, Apple rolled out the ability to apply for the Apple Card..." 💳. I'm so jelly of Americans as all the cool Apple services are released in USA first. I can't wait to have my own titanium  Card and this how my name will read on it:

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

Outside of online sales, that's not supposed to be the case as long as one follows all the acceptance guidelines.

That said, there are a lot of sketchy payment processors out there. I mean, I've heard people claim that Square was a lot cheaper than whatever they were using before, and Square isn't exactly the least expensive option.

The agreement we signed did not distinguish from 'card present' and 'card not present' sales. As I remember, there was a higher charge for 'not present' sales, but it didn't matter. If someone here accepted the card, and the merchant processor processed it, and it turned up they knew, or it was subsequently reported to be stolen, WE covered ALL the costs. Even if they screwed it up. Granted, the risk is small, but in the case I mentioned upstream, the cost of bad cards has real consequences, and if the processor had a reasonable chance of determining that the card was 'bad', and processed it anyway, THEY should carry the majority of the cost, if not ALL of the cost. I wonder how many cards they KNEW are suspect are processed because it's easier to just accept them, than actually investigate each and every charge.

 

[Rigby]

My point was, I don't think that high transaction fees affect the prices that Apple charges for its goods and services. I'm incorrect?

Of course they do. In the US most Apple customers use credit cards to pay for items from the Apple store or services. The average transaction fee in the US is nearly 2%, and can be as high as 3%. Apple does not just eat that cost, they pass it on to us.

If you don't use a cashback card in the US, you get robbed to pad the banks' profits and finance the cashback for those that do ...

In most countries in Europe the average transaction fee is below 1%, primarily due to bank regulations.

 

[tmiw]

The agreement we signed did not distinguish from 'card present' and 'card not present' sales. As I remember, there was a higher charge for 'not present' sales, but it didn't matter. If someone here accepted the card, and the merchant processor processed it, and it turned up they knew, or it was subsequently reported to be stolen, WE covered ALL the costs. Even if they screwed it up. Granted, the risk is small, but in the case I mentioned upstream, the cost of bad cards has real consequences, and if the processor had a reasonable chance of determining that the card was 'bad', and processed it anyway, THEY should carry the majority of the cost, if not ALL of the cost. I wonder how many cards they KNEW are suspect are processed because it's easier to just accept them, than actually investigate each and every charge.

Yeah, totally a bad processing agreement. Unfortunately those aren't uncommon as previously mentioned.

As for card validity, there aren't too many ways of checking on the merchant end that won't run afoul of the card network rules. ID checks were one common example of something that technically is against the rules, but customers were (mostly) okay with. Those have diminished with the advent of chip, though. Signature checks were something that was allowed, though, despite those being fairly ineffective.

Of course they do. In the US most Apple customers use credit cards to pay for items from the Apple store or services. The average transaction fee in the US is nearly 2%, and can be as high as 3%. Apple does not just eat that cost, they pass it on to us.

If you don't use a cashback card in the US, you get robbed to pad the banks' profits and finance the cashback for those that do ...

In most countries in Europe the average transaction fee is below 1%, primarily due to bank regulations.

I'd say most cards do have some sort of rewards system these days. It might not necessarily be an awesome one, mind you, but it does exist. The main exceptions I can think of off the top of my head are the "balance transfer" cards (e.g. Chase Slate) which exist for people to transfer higher interest balances in order to make paying them off easier (typically by offering a period of time with no interest).

As for whether the existence of credit in general (or credit cards in particular) is a good idea, that's a discussion that's stretched for thousands of pages on multiple forums and probably won't ever be resolved.