Your favorite new thunderbolt device?

Discussion in 'Mac Accessories' started by thundersteele, Jan 11, 2012.

  1. thundersteele macrumors 68030

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    #1
    At CES finally a few more thunderbolt devices were announced - some of them even appear to be ready and might be available soon.

    My current favorite is the seagate GoFlex adapter:
    http://www.anandtech.com/show/5345/seagates-goflex-thunderbolt-adapters

    At $100 + $50 for the thunderbolt cable it's still expensive for essentially not doing anything, but at least it allows you to upgrade existing GoFlex external HDDs to new speed levels.
    Finally, it will be available in a few weeks, which is nice. At least there will be some choice.


    Then, a few Thunderbolt more SSDs are announced. OCZ claims transfer rates up to 750 MB/s, which would be faster than internal SATA 3 SSDs.
     
  2. mulo macrumors 68020

    mulo

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    #2
    impossible, thunderbolt will use SATA III to connect the drives to your mac, and will thus still abide by the SATA III speed limits.
     
  3. theSeb macrumors 604

    theSeb

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    #3
    750 MB/s is still below the SATA III limits.

    6 gigabits per second = 768 MB/s

    But what you said about abiding by SATA III speed limits is not correct

    Promise Pegasus R6 as tested by Anandtech

    Sequential Read in RAID 0 (using 7200 RPM HDD x 6): 782.2 MB/s

    They then achieved 1002 MB/s using 4xSSDs in RAID 0

    TB connects directly to the PCIe bus and is not limited in any way by SATA. The connection circumvents SATA.
     
  4. reebzor macrumors 6502a

    reebzor

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    #4
    You are saying the harddrive* does not have SATA, but a direct thunderbolt port? Source?

    *I mean the harddrive, not the enclosure
     
  5. theSeb macrumors 604

    theSeb

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    #5
    Sorry, not clear - no. The hard drive still connects via a SATA port in the enclosure, but the transmission of data between the enclosure and your computer is not limited to SATA III speeds. The thunderbolt connection in the pegasus is between the RAID controller and the PCIe bus.
     
  6. kas23, Jan 11, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2012

    kas23 macrumors 603

    kas23

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    #6
    TB still seems way too expensive. To really get any benefit, don't you have to pair it with a SSD? The best HDDs out there read/write at about 160 MB/s, which is going to be the limiting factor here. I guess you can get much higher transfer rates with a RAID array, but the average consumer won't be buying them. So, to get the true benefit of a TB-attached drive, you'll have to pay out for the cable, hub and an SSD. Am I right? I suppose using TB for other peripherals, like a display may be useful. But, in everyday use, connecting a display via traditional ports is good enough for most.
     
  7. calderone macrumors 68040

    calderone

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    #7
    Well....

    Sort of. If you have a single drive enclosure, running a single SATA III disk the maximum speed you can achieve is the theoretical maximum of SATA III.

    It doesn't matter if TB is capable of more. The Pegasus is capable of higher than SATA speeds for the same reason RAID configurations can also outperform SATA. Combining multiple disks generally increases speed.

    The Pegasus isn't performing magic, it is just doing what people have been doing with RAID for years with the advantage of an interconnect that can handle the amount of data it is capable of pushing.
     
  8. theSeb macrumors 604

    theSeb

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    #8
    Yes that's the point. However, the other point is that 750 MB/s is possible with SATA III.
     
  9. nickos94 macrumors newbie

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    #9
    I'm really looking forward for Belkin's thunderbolt hub! It's kind of disappointing I'll have to wait until September though.
     
  10. thundersteele thread starter macrumors 68030

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    #10
    Thanks for filling in the details. Current SATA III SSDs seem to max out around 500-600 MB/s. There is usually a small difference between the theoretical maximal speed and the actual sustained transfer rates.

    I'm not sure if the SSD has to connect to the thunderbolt controller via SATA. After all, there are also PCIe SSDs on the (server) market - and thunderbolt connects directly to the PCIe bus. Still it is likely that the OCZ SSD connects through a single SATA III port, and the 750 MB/s might just be a marketing number... if it does 600 MB/s, it would still be awesome.
     
  11. calderone macrumors 68040

    calderone

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    #11
    *Theoretically.
     
  12. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

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    #12
    Not necessarily. OCZ Lightfoot uses OCZ/Marvell PCIe SSD controller so there is no SATA bottlenecking it. Hence it can achieve speeds of up to 750MB/s.

    No, it's not.

    6Gbit/s = 750MB/s (8 bits per byte)

    However, SATA uses 8b/10b encoding so there is 20% overhead:

    750MB/s * (8b/10b) = 750MB/s * 0.80 = 600MB/s

    Plus there are additional overheads such as latency so we are most likely looking at a maximum of 570MB/s.
     
  13. theSeb macrumors 604

    theSeb

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    #13
    Of course.

    ----------

    I just felt like being pedantic and silly this morning. If this thing reaches anywhere near 650, then I'll eat my hat.
     
  14. maril1111 macrumors 68000

    maril1111

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    #14
    same but i will most likely wait til christmas when the prices tend to get reduced a bit.
     
  15. bdodds1985 macrumors 6502a

    bdodds1985

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    #15
    thats all well and good, and i own two seagte 1.5tb externals, but arent they only 5400rpm drives? and is there a way to connect an external display through hdmi and have my goflex connected as well... like a splitter.
     
  16. convergent macrumors 68000

    convergent

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    #16
    Getting back on topic... these companies are I think full of crap regarding their prices being tied to the controller price. Case in point, my favorite device that I really want to get is this new Black Magic Design's intensity Thunderbolt. Its price is only $40 more than the USB version at $239... very reasonable.

    http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/intensity/models/

    They also have the Intensity Extreme for recording HDMI directly, also Thunderbolt.

    The video production market is embracing Thunderbolt big time because they need the throughput, and its a heavy Mac environment.
     
  17. theSeb macrumors 604

    theSeb

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    #17
    I was reading that the controller costs about $30 right now. Prices should drop a we see more adoption across the pc world in 2012.
     
  18. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

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    #18
    $20-$30 according to AnandTech. However, there's more than just the controller costs, as said in the article. Cactus Ridge should bring down the overall cost of Thunderbolt, but it will still cost a good premium over USB 3.0.
     
  19. thundersteele thread starter macrumors 68030

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    #19
    It only has one thunderbolt port though, so it kills daisy chaining...

    If the controller really costs around $30, then it's understandable why even simple thunderbolt to SATA connectors start at $99. A $50 premium over a comparable USB 3.0 device sounds realistic for other devices.

    Now, the other problem of course is that the stupid cable adds another $50 to the price tag.
     

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