Sidebar Sidebar
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

'Znaps' Adds MagSafe-Style Connectivity to Your Lightning Cables

An abstract is only a summary - its not the actual claim. Just because the abstract of the patent is similar does not mean it rules out anything that matches it as shown by the posts above around cookers etc.

Having read through the whole patent I think it may well have a chance - there are lots of words and descriptions that will be open to interpretation so it will be up to the lawyers as to whether this adapter is really a device etc. I think this has a lot more wiggle room that other attempts due to it being an adapter.
 
togglemedia said:
That's not how licensing fees work. If you are trying to make money off a plug that is both size and pin-compatible with their port, then a licensing fee applies.
Click to expand...

I love to watch a Kickstarter end in disaster and impotent rage as much as the next person, but kneejerk negativity needs to be challenged. You said they had to be compatible with the protocol, but that was too hasty. There's a lot of hasty dismissal goes on in these forums.

Interesting to look here... http://magnector.com

Do they have a workaround for the magsafe patent?
 
I would venture to guess that Apple could challenge a number of other manufacturers who are using this patent in their products (Sony X3, Pebble) but they are not. Of course there is more to the patent than just magnets. But the magnets are inseparable from the patent. Contrary to the suggestion that it's "not the magnet...that matters".

But yes, the Apple patent also includes the use of pins on springs, and is orientation agnostic / reversible, among other things. I wonder if this is how Pebble gets around it, by not being reversible. Not sure how Sony or others would wiggle out.

It's the combination of magnets, pins on springs, and reversible nature that really make the Znaps product a standout infringement. But of course, the courts will decide.
 
mw360 said:
You said they had to be compatible with the protocol
Click to expand...

Compatible in the sense that the plug fits the port. :) Any business that wants to make money selling a plug that fits the Lightning port is subject to Apple's licensing fees. There's really no way around that.

Apple outlines what type of accessories fall under the MFI program, and the Znaps clearly would need to be licensed:

https://mfi.apple.com/MFiWeb/getFAQ.action#1-1

I think this may prove to be the biggest clue that the Znaps team have no intention of bringing this to market. They don't include licensing fees in their cost structure. If they did, they would be selling the Znaps adapter for 3x the price.

That's really my main discussion point. There are too many red flags indicating that this is indeed a "crockstarter", and they are willfully taking your money, with the full knowledge that this product will never see the light of day.
 
Last edited:
nj-morris said:
Now this is ingenious. Wonder how strong the magnet is though.
Click to expand...
If they are really hoping to allow it to release if you trip over a cord instead of pulling the phone down it can't be very strong. The magsafe connector on my 11" air will sometimes pull the computer instead of releasing, so I'd imagine it would be much worse with an iPhone that is a lot lighter.
 
I inquired about Apples licensing on the mag connector, this is their response.

Our patent lawyer did a patent search before we started the project. This is one of the reasons why we didn’t develop ZNAPS into a whole charging cable. We haven’t infringed on Apple's patent.
Best,
Znaps​
 
  • Like
Reactions: AlliFlowers
powaking said:
I inquired about Apples licensing on the mag connector, this is their response.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's the same text as on their FAQ. It's incredibly dismissive considering the ramifications of being wrong on this matter. At a bare minimum the product allows standard Lightning cables to be converted to "patent infringing" cables. This would be a case of indirect infringement, and because Znaps is aware of the Apple patent, they are in fact liable for the role their product plays in resulting infringements.
 
togglemedia said:
Yeah, that's the same text as on their FAQ. It's incredibly dismissive considering the ramifications of being wrong on this matter. At a bare minimum the product allows standard Lightning cables to be converted to "patent infringing" cables. This would be a case of indirect infringement, and because Znaps is aware of the Apple patent, they are in fact liable for the role their product plays in resulting infringements.
Click to expand...

If that's the case wouldn't it be okay if they don't sell lightning cables with the connector? The fact that this could be used by the customer to convert a cable into patent infringing products shouldn't apply since that would mean that apple would be able to go after a company if I bought some magnets and wires from them and made a magnetic connector myself.

I'm not familiar with patent laws, so if I'm wrong, please enlighten me.
 
szw-mapple fan said:
If that's the case wouldn't it be okay if they don't sell lightning cables with the connector? The fact that this could be used by the customer to convert a cable into patent infringing products shouldn't apply since that would mean that apple would be able to go after a company if I bought some magnets and wires from them and made a magnetic connector myself.
Click to expand...

If you tried to sell the magnetic connector you made yourself, you could be pursued for patent infringement. Technically hand making a product that infringes, is an infringement, but I don't think any organization would take you to court over it. :p It's really only after the revenue that your infringement undercuts the patent holder's profits, that you'll see it in court.

Which is why I could see Apple ignoring the patent infringement. I'm not so sure I could see Apple ignoring the failure to license the Lightning though.

But yeah, Znaps is liable for indirect infringement if they knowingly sell a product that converts non infringing products to infringing products.

It would be like if you owned the patent for those kids shoes with wheels in the heels. And then a company came along and started selling straps that convert regular shoes to your patented shoes. An indirect infringement, which your patent protects you against. This is because the common part (ie. the shoes) is not essential to the patented innovation.

In Znaps case, the common part (ie. the cable) is not essential to Apple's patented innovation, it's merely an example of how the patent can be applied.
 
JohnApples said:
Wow, this is so clever and neat. Would also keep the dust (and water, according to the website) out as well. The best part is that it's at a reasonable price too.

This may be the first project I back on Kickstarter.
Click to expand...
This was exactly what I thought as well. The tough part now is just waiting until November :)
 
One comment I haven't seen is that Apple recommends that the user keep magnets away from the iPhone in https://support.apple.com/en-is/HT203040. Magnets and electronic equipment don't always play nice together. Even if Apple's warning is slightly different than this product, you never know.
 
They just posted a kickstarter update with a little bit more detail about the patent infringement everyones bitching about.
 
I really like the idea of ZNAPS. But I am doubting that it all will work out for various reasons:

1. They say their lawyer thinks it does not violate apples magsafe patent. Check it yourself if you want: http://tinyurl.com/ou2svcz
Not all descriptions clearly refer to a cable.

2. What about the Apple "MagSafe to MagSafe 2 Converter"?
That is exactly the same. I don't know if it is covered by the patent above or if their might be another patent.

3. Znaps states they are located in Toronto, Canada.
There is no company registered with that name (znaps / snaps). Even the FB page does not mention the type of entity, nor does their web-page (www.znaps.net).

4. There are no information who registered the web address www.znaps.net as it is hidden behind => godaddy.com => domainsbyproxy.com

5. Is there any information about the founder Phiona Pui Woon Leung or the team?
I could not find any.

6. Design aspects like the pins for power not connecting before the pins for data (like in every USB plug).

7. MFI is never going to happen + impossible within the time frame.

8. Very short videos, no close ups and no video about a data transfer with lightning connector and iTunes (so far).

And there some other things which I at least consider a bit weird. Why do they show in the pictures that the part sticking out of the iphone is 1.5mm wide/long when it is actually wider/longer because of the part where the magnet attaches.

EDIT:

@RobQuads

Well, the reason might be that your link from Pleson shows a magnetic micro USB connector. But Znaps has an Apple Lightning Connector with that feature.
 
Last edited:
Well thanks ma rumors.... Still have received nothing and it was looking serious project as you made an article about it but this is a pure scam. Go on their kick-starter page.... Everyone is upset... Personally i my sad that macrumors made advertisement for such fraud..... I thought it was serious....
 
33man said:
Well thanks ma rumors.... Still have received nothing and it was looking serious project as you made an article about it but this is a pure scam. Go on their kick-starter page.... Everyone is upset... Personally i my sad that macrumors made advertisement for such fraud..... I thought it was serious....
Click to expand...

My post from one year ago.

Anyone thinking of backing this, please remember, Kickstarter is not a store and you are not placing an 'order' by backing a project!!
Click to expand...
 
It seems now official that Znaps is / was a fraud from the beginning.
I am so glad I did not back it, but feel bad for other backers.

Here is a quote from the znaps kickstarter comment page


Michael Long vor rund 3 Stunden
i have found this on the hk news website, apparently this is a hong kong company, to be more precise this is a Hong Kong family specialise in frauds for the mass funding community, the "Znaps" is own by the wife, another kickstarter campaign "Arist" the so called smartphone control coffee machine, they use our money to buy multi millions luxury apartment in Hong Kong! **** you Znaps! http://hk.apple.nextmedia.com/realtime/news/20160629/55290025
Click to expand...

And if you check for arist, you will find another kickstarter project with no product and no responses anymore.

Furthermore, on the arist kickstarter page, you will find this comment:


Martin Bouchard
Superbacker
am Juli 19
What do u think about this?

http://www.ejinsight.com/20160630-mobile-device-charger-maker-denies-crowdfunding-fraud/

Nelson Chiu's wife now operates Znaps

Nothing from Arist and nothing from Znaps...
Znaps send empty envelop at random Backers with no device only spot glue...

WEIRD
Click to expand...
 
You should follow up on this. They’ve taken in over $3 million and are putting up shops all over the place to sell the product, but aren’t fulfilling their Kickstarter pledge. It’s beginning to look like a con.
 
  • Like
Reactions: d3bruts1d and raydragon
You must log in or register to reply here.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.
Top Bottom
Back