Apple Dock Connector to Support DisplayPort, USB 3.0, Thunderbolt?

[RWA MC]

confused as to how this signifies thunderbolt?

I might just be missing something here but how does this imply that Apple is putting thunderbolt in here?

I can see where they made the minidisplay port (which is the same form factor as thunderbolt) a dual channel now instead of just a one way channel but wouldn't it say thunderbolt instead of minidisplay port? or is a dual channel minidisplay port just a thunderbolt port? and if minidisplay is on the current 30-pin how is it currently used--do you need an adapter for USB to minidisplay?

i guess i am kind of answering my own question here but does that mean in the future if apple were to say make its own TV one could use the 30-pin connector to plug right into the back of a TV (into a minidisplay port) and play movies/music like that without the need for an HDMI cable?

thx for any help or clarification!

 

[toddybody]

Awesome Awesome move Apple...so glad they included USB 3.0 support as well. +1

 

[iansilv]

I wish people would actually think before they post sometimes.

YES this connector has USB3, it also has USB2, Thunderbolt and a pretty white cable too.

What people fail to realise is that if you own a current gen/future Mac you can use the thunderbolt part of the connection, if you own an older version then it will use the USB2 part. OR if you are using a USB3 compatible PC then you can use their USB3 connection.

Its actually a quite clever design and means that the iProducts 30pin connector can be relevant for many more years to come.

Thank you- i was sitting here wondering why the hell anyone would think this was a negative development... and about to post something like what you did.

 

[CWallace]

Apple should've held out on the refresh to include USB 3 and even HDMI. Thunderbolt is currently useless.

DisplayPort to HDMI cables that support both audio and video are quite inexpensive from many online sources. I use one from my iMac to my 40" LCD TV and the DP port takes up a good bit less space than an HDMI port would (which can be important for a portable device).

 

[Elijahg]

No, it doesn't. The line-in port does not supply power for a microphone.

The combined line-in/out jack on the newest Macs certainly DOES supply a small amount of power for the mic built into the iPhone headphones. The separate line in port on older Macs doesn't, but the headphone port does supply power (on my 2009 MBP at least). It's not the same amount of power as the mic port on PCs, but it's similar. The mic on an analogue headset designed for a PC has never worked on a Mac. The old Plaintalk mics back in the beige Mac days used to have a really long connector, so the tip would touch the power part of the socket in the Mac.

Some people seem to want a new Dock Connector, but I think the current one is here to stay for quite a while yet. It's thin, tough, and has plenty of pins for analogue and digital data. Plus there are thousands of devices that use the Dock Connector. If Apple were to change the design, it'd likely prevent future devices from connecting to the thousands of accessories.

The only problem I've ever had with the connector is the quality of the cable. It's awful. It's made from a kind of eco-friendly rubberised plastic, which tends to tear easily. I've had two or three cables split at the connector end; the cable plastic is much too soft.

 

[Mr. Retrofire]

I might just be missing something here but how does this imply that Apple is putting thunderbolt in here?

Only TB-compatible (mini-) DP-connectors have two lanes.

 

[madhatter61]

It will be interesting to see if Apple develops its own controller chip for ARM processors. Currently the Intel controller is designed for Intel processors that incorporate PCI express architecture. ARM architecture is quite different. Thunderbolt is currently designed for the standard Mac line of products using Intel Processors. All the mobile products are Arm based processors.

The idea of having a common connector like minidisplay port is quite awesome, and the utilization is all in the software control approach. Dual channel, full bidirectional, with the possibility of multiple protocols running simultaneously with very high data rates. Apple is just covering their future bases, and doing it very nicely.

I saw posts asking about backward compatibility possibilities. The answer is a definite no. But the future arrangements will be most interesting.

One post wanted everything to go thru a standard phone jack. Not at all likely or even possible.

 

[Elijahg]

It will be interesting to see if Apple develops its own controller chip for ARM processors.

I agree! They'll have to deal with flipping the endian-ness of the different architectures, the complete lack of a extensible interface like PCI-E on ARM too may pose a challenge.

The idea of having a common connector like minidisplay port is quite awesome, and the utilization is all in the software control approach. Dual channel, full bidirectional, with the possibility of up to 4 protocols running simultaneously with very high data rates. Apple is just covering their future bases, and doing it very nicely.

Yup, it'll be great if we manage to cut down the reams of connectors we have now to just a few TB and maybe USB ports. One port for all is a great idea, which has been tried in the past (i.e. USB's original intention), but USB was never designed well enough to become one-for-all. Just imagine having a Mac Mini attached to a 4TB disk array with an iTunes library on, daisy-chained to a HDTV. All through one thin cable, no messing about with X number of different cables all over the place. If you needed more storage, just add an extra disk into the daisy-chain.

One post wanted everything to go thru a standard phone jack. Not at all likely or even possible.

I saw that too, but forgot to reply in my previous post... @ the headphone jack poster: A standard headphone jack works with USB as it's got 4 wires, just one more than a normal set of headphones. Apple have an extra ring around the USB to jack cable, enabling USB transfer. It wouldn't be possible to add more than a few extra sleeves to the headphone jack without getting problems with interference and alignment. Displayport/Thunderbolt uses 20 pins, which would be quite a challenge to fit onto a jack plug. Though if Thunderbolt supports optical transmission, that could be used in a headphone jack, with the rings used for power only. Similar to the Toslink to headphone jack adapters. I'm not sure if TB does support future optical connections though.

 

[-hh]

Am I the only one that's happy about adapters?

I feel they give the maximum flexibility for the minimum port interference; I'd rather have 4 of these good-for-any-use ports on my computer than a set number of fixed use ports, some of which never get used.

I guess it's just me?

Sorry, you're not alone

What a 'flexible' interface such as this does when coupled with adaptors is allow the basic mobile device to become smaller/thinner/etc. Overall, more desirable in its "mobile" modality.

Consider if the 1st generation iPad came with a row of legacy video ports: VGI, DVI ... and for good measure, let's include Composite & Component too, since IIRC adaptors currently exist for all of these. Even though each one of them adds "only a little bit" to the form factor of the iPad, the net result of just these is that the iPad is going to have a figurative "1.5 inch binder" now running down its side to provide the real estate. And its now going to be pushing 2lbs. Does this still sound like an awesome & compelling new mobile product? Probably not.

Now repeat the exercise and put just a DVI or VGI connector on a cellphone

The pragmatic reality is that the dongle adaptor can live at home, next to the non-mobile display that we would use with the mobile device. Since we don't have to carry it around for that use case, why should we care that it exists or how big it is? We shouldn't.


-hh

 

[mmomega]

Sounds like a great idea and who's not all for faster sync times.

I just don't get what people are doing to break connectors. I know the one I use for my phone now is the same cable from my iPod video I bought in '05 and I have large clumsy gorilla fingers.

 

[aiqw9182]

The combined line-in/out jack on the newest Macs certainly DOES supply a small amount of power for the mic built into the iPhone headphones. The separate line in port on older Macs doesn't, but the headphone port does supply power (on my 2009 MBP at least). It's not the same amount of power as the mic port on PCs, but it's similar. The mic on an analogue headset designed for a PC has never worked on a Mac. The old Plaintalk mics back in the beige Mac days used to have a really long connector, so the tip would touch the power part of the socket in the Mac.

Once again, I was never talking about the audio out port that also has mic capabilities for iPhone headsets that there are very few of. I was talking about the line-in jack that is useless and does not support power for a typical headset.

http://blogs.computerworld.com/mac_microphone_line_in_only_port_is_a_real_drag

 

[Elijahg]

Once again, I was never talking about the audio out port that also has mic capabilities for iPhone headsets that there are very few of. I was talking about the line-in jack that is useless and does not support power for a typical headset.

http://blogs.computerworld.com/mac_microphone_line_in_only_port_is_a_real_drag

It certainly isn't useless, it's designed so you can get high-quality stereo audio through it. You can't do that with a mic socket, the power in the socket for the mic can affect the sound quality, it causes a buzz. If you want high quality audio get a USB headset or a USB/FW microphone preamp. For the majority the iPhone headphones/mic or the built-in mic work just fine. Why do you need support for PC-style headsets?

 

[aiqw9182]

It certainly isn't useless, it's designed so you can get high-quality stereo audio through it. You can't do that with a mic socket, the power in the socket for the mic can affect the sound quality, it causes a buzz. If you want high quality audio get a USB headset or a USB/FW microphone preamp. For the majority the iPhone headphones/mic or the built-in mic work just fine. Why do you need support for PC-style headsets?

Anyone doing serious recording through a 1/8 jack needs their head examined. The jack is useless in its current state. Why do I need support for 'PC style' headsets? Well for one there are a ton of new high quality headsets I could choose from and for two I could have a free USB port. The headphones that support the audio out microphone capability are either expensive as hell or not good for long periods of time.

 

[CaoCao]

w00t, blazing fast backup times anyone? (20s/16GB w/TB)

 

[joaoferro99]

in general, how long does it take to apply a patent from US Patent and Trademark Office? I am just wondering why apple got the approval within such short period of time? paid premium fee?

 

[Popeye206]

The thread here is funny. So many off topic rambles.

But... this seems like a great thing! Fast I/O between the iOS device and the Mac. It will make for amazingly fast throughput and it standardizes on one port. Yes, another change, but in the long run, it should be awesome. Let's hope this happens.

 

[Hattig]

Headset jack was removed, so had to buy a USB headset for example.

He just needed to buy a 3.5mm combo-jack to dual-jack adaptor. Probably under a dollar.

 

[Thunderhawks]

Thank you- i was sitting here wondering why the hell anyone would think this was a negative development... and about to post something like what you did.

Same here. How can somebody rate this negative?

It's a development for the future and will make many other dongles obsolete over time.

 

[Lesser Evets]

With all the advancements in Apple hardware ready to appear in the next couple years, I'd be hard pressed to buy any new hardware until the next rung of technology is incorporated in their products.

 

[aliensporebomb]

Ah!

I think you're misinformed. The current models simply combined the 1/8" in and out jacks into one port (TRRS), just like the port on the iPhone. For example, you can plug your iPhone headphones into your Mac for use as a headset.

It also supports optical via mini-TOSlink: http://www.amazon.com/6ft-Toslink-Mini-Cable/dp/B000FMXKC8/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1302041837&sr=8-2

Thanks for the link since I've wanted one of these for my iMac for a while now since the audio inputs/outputs are hybrid now from what I understand.

The iMacs have (according to the Apple website):

"Headphone/optical digital audio output (minijack)
Audio line in/optical digital audio input (minijack)"

 

[paulold]

Been wanting to get a new iPod Classic for the larger capacity. This report makes me want to hold off, if they are going to improve its dock connector to be faster...

 

[kycophpd]

I might just be missing something here but how does this imply that Apple is putting thunderbolt in here?

I can see where they made the minidisplay port (which is the same form factor as thunderbolt) a dual channel now instead of just a one way channel but wouldn't it say thunderbolt instead of minidisplay port? or is a dual channel minidisplay port just a thunderbolt port? and if minidisplay is on the current 30-pin how is it currently used--do you need an adapter for USB to minidisplay?

i guess i am kind of answering my own question here but does that mean in the future if apple were to say make its own TV one could use the 30-pin connector to plug right into the back of a TV (into a minidisplay port) and play movies/music like that without the need for an HDMI cable?

thx for any help or clarification!

My opinion is that Thunderbolt was not publicly announced when this was originally submitted so call it a dual channel display port so that it does not get leaked out before they announce it. It will probably be corrected/resubmitted as Thunderbolt when and if it comes to be.

 

[ten-oak-druid]

Need to wait a year at least to see how thunderbolt pans out. The only thunderbolt drive I know of is Lacie's and its announced as coming soon. But how much will it cost?

 

[aegisdesign]

Wireless syncing is a lot easier and a lot less hassle. Charging the battery with an electrical outlet is the only time you need to plug your iPhone in anything, IMHO. I find syncing my iPhone to my computer to be a chore and I rarely do so because of this.

Thank you Cinch. I was wondering when someone would point out the pointlessness of cables.

I've just hit 'Sync Now' in iSync (remember that) in my menu bar and it's wirelessly updated the two Nokias on my desk with fresh contacts, calendar and todos.

Nokia Media Transfer also wirelessly syncs my photos and music too.

Come on Apple, even Nokia do wireless syncing.

 

[Bubba Satori]

I am starting to think why do i have a mac, as i need so many dam adapters.

100 billion in the bank.