I've gone Windows...

[turtlez]

i already built my MAC PC (iBoot + Unibeast = done), I'm a music producer so Case and Cooling chosen make it dead silent. Yes it makes me feel better to put my finger up to apple, NO I don't mind the extra hassle if any as I actually enjoy messing up with hardware and software and this wasn't a matter of patience, I could've waited, I can buy a Mac Pro but I wouldn't, they're just not offering what I want any longer. Btw it'd be fun watching you buy maxed out Macs for your starting software developing company, I'd probly lol a while at you before helping you put together your "clones".

Actually I already did put together my own company we have 8 maxed out 2010 iMacs and doing well... Don't kid yourself. When it comes to business you don't want to spend time tweaking around because time is money. See ya!!!!!!

 

[iClive]

After about a year of living a dual life (Windows at work, Mac at home), the only feature I can really say that Windows is "better" at is its file manager (or Windows Explorer as it's now called).

Maybe I have just not yet found out how to tweak Finder to give me the same experience, but the Windows offering just feels more intuitive and easier to use. Each to their own of course but that's my experience.

 

[roxxette]

Actually I already did put together my own company we have 8 maxed out 2010 iMacs and doing well... Don't kid yourself. When it comes to business you don't want to spend time tweaking around because time is money. See ya!!!!!!

What "tweaking" do you speak ?

 

[roxxette]

After about a year of living a dual life (Windows at work, Mac at home), the only feature I can really say that Windows is "better" at is its file manager (or Windows Explorer as it's now called).

Maybe I have just not yet found out how to tweak Finder to give me the same experience, but the Windows offering just feels more intuitive and easier to use. Each to their own of course but that's my experience.

Yeah i have to agree on file manager being better, other stuff it comes down to each person or "needs?"

 

[Dark Void]

I read a few posts in this thread, not sure if it has been said but I just wanted to say - why not just use both? You don't have to commit to either PC or Mac or Windows or OS X. Build yourself a Windows system, get a prebuilt if you don't feel comfortable, or what have you - and continue to dabble with Macs. You don't have to not use a PC when waiting for the new iMac.

Just my two cents.

 

[flopticalcube]

One of the reasons iMacs are quiet is they have opted for some lower power mobile parts like the graphics cards. These produce less heat than there more powerful desktop counterparts and therefore require less powerful fans for cooling. In many cases, Apple has integrated the CPU heatsink with the GPU and gets away with using a single fan to cool both. In modern gaming PCs, the GPU fans are the biggest noise producers.

All this is a pointless debate, however, as we have entered a "post PC" era according to Apple. One day we will be waiting for new machines that will never come. R.I.P. OS X.

 

[iClive]

I read a few posts in this thread, not sure if it has been said but I just wanted to say - why not just use both? You don't have to commit to either PC or Mac or Windows or OS X. Build yourself a Windows system, get a prebuilt if you don't feel comfortable, or what have you - and continue to dabble with Macs. You don't have to not use a PC when waiting for the new iMac.

Just my two cents.

I agree, I now have parallels running on one of the Mac minis as well as the MacBook Air for those rare occasions when only Windows will do the job (ie where there is no Mac OS equivalent).

 

[ithinqware]

Strangely stupid

Lots of people, perhaps even this guy, have some incomprehensible desire to smack the Mac world around.

It used to be something that Mac users would deal with on a fairly frequent basis. When Apple wasnt' the largest corporation on Earth, when it hadn't single handedly created then dominated categories like music and phones and entertainment. When Apple wasn't a major catalyst to the death of record stores (remember them?).

And when didn't have more cash on hand than the Federal Reserve.

Those days are now here, and what Mac users have known and said for decades is true. That without Apple to copy (Microsoft and Samsung and others), there wouldnt' BE an interface to steal, a design ethic to emulate, a business model to learn from, a retail store concept to duplicate.

Buy crap, stay stupid.

But first, realize that we, the informed, are laughing our asses off at your ignorance.

 

[Roller]

Lots of people, perhaps even this guy, have some incomprehensible desire to smack the Mac world around.

It used to be something that Mac users would deal with on a fairly frequent basis. When Apple wasnt' the largest corporation on Earth, when it hadn't single handedly created then dominated categories like music and phones and entertainment. When Apple wasn't a major catalyst to the death of record stores (remember them?).

And when didn't have more cash on hand than the Federal Reserve.

Those days are now here, and what Mac users have known and said for decades is true. That without Apple to copy (Microsoft and Samsung and others), there wouldnt' BE an interface to steal, a design ethic to emulate, a business model to learn from, a retail store concept to duplicate.

Buy crap, stay stupid.

But first, realize that we, the informed, are laughing our asses off at your ignorance.

I remember well the days when I had to struggle to get any respect from Windows users - my Macs were "toys" and therefore not useful for any productive work. Those days are long gone. But with Apple's prominence, it's become a huge target for complaints, some unjustified and some justified.

Windows has caught up and even exceeded Mac OS in some respects. Although I still prefer Macs, if I were starting out again I might not make the same choice. And, if Apple were to abandon the desktop market completely - something I don't think they'll do - I'd move to Windows or perhaps Linux. Although I have a strong emotional attachment to Macs after using them since 1984 and owning many, ultimately I'm most interested in getting my work done.

 

[motrek]

I would like to hear a reason why some people came back to Mac from hackintosh. I'm toying with the idea lately and it just seems strange when someone puts a timeinto building and maintaining one, that he/she would just keep using it instead of buying Apple hardware. What are the reasons? Just curious.

At least for me, hackintoshing seemed like a fun and cool project at first, but after 4 years it just seems like a giant pain. You have to understand that none of your hardware has any official support from anybody. Even if you specifically selected your hardware because it was "supposed to be" hackintosh compatible, it might work, it might not work, it might work with some problems (large or small), and it might stop working if you update your OS. (Not necessarily the big updates like Mountain Lion; sometimes small updates will break stuff.)

Here's where my hackintosh is at and you can decide for yourself how great it is. I've never gotten sleep to work right, so 3 out of 4 times it will sleep and resume fine, but 1 out of 4 times it never wakes up and I lose whatever I was doing. So I keep it on all the time which is a waste of power. I have this weird problem lately where I wake up about once a week and my sound isn't working and the only way to fix it seems to be rebooting. Last month something weird was going on with my internet connection for a couple days and all my other computers could deal with it, but my hackintosh would drop its network connection every ~5 minutes and I had to unplug the Ethernet and plug it back in to get it working again. Of course there's no official tech support or support forum you can go to when these things go wrong. You're on your own. Maybe somebody on the hackintosh forums has seen the problem before and knows how to fix it, but that's 50-50 at best. Also, I haven't bothered to update to Mountain Lion yet because that's at least an all-day project where you have to make your own USB key installer, do a fresh install of the OS, and migrate all your stuff from your last install, assuming all of your hardware still works right (big assumption).

So if you have a lot of time on your hands and/or don't need the computer for anything mission-critical, then hackintoshing can be amusing. But I'm definitely getting a new iMac when they get refreshed.

 

[comatory]

At least for me, hackintoshing seemed like a fun and cool project at first, but after 4 years it just seems like a giant pain. You have to understand that none of your hardware has any official support from anybody. Even if you specifically selected your hardware because it was "supposed to be" hackintosh compatible, it might work, it might not work, it might work with some problems (large or small), and it might stop working if you update your OS. (Not necessarily the big updates like Mountain Lion; sometimes small updates will break stuff.)

Here's where my hackintosh is at and you can decide for yourself how great it is. I've never gotten sleep to work right, so 3 out of 4 times it will sleep and resume fine, but 1 out of 4 times it never wakes up and I lose whatever I was doing. So I keep it on all the time which is a waste of power. I have this weird problem lately where I wake up about once a week and my sound isn't working and the only way to fix it seems to be rebooting. Last month something weird was going on with my internet connection for a couple days and all my other computers could deal with it, but my hackintosh would drop its network connection every ~5 minutes and I had to unplug the Ethernet and plug it back in to get it working again. Of course there's no official tech support or support forum you can go to when these things go wrong. You're on your own. Maybe somebody on the hackintosh forums has seen the problem before and knows how to fix it, but that's 50-50 at best. Also, I haven't bothered to update to Mountain Lion yet because that's at least an all-day project where you have to make your own USB key installer, do a fresh install of the OS, and migrate all your stuff from your last install, assuming all of your hardware still works right (big assumption).

So if you have a lot of time on your hands and/or don't need the computer for anything mission-critical, then hackintoshing can be amusing. But I'm definitely getting a new iMac when they get refreshed.

I've been asking around on more than a one occassion, especially on hackintosh forums. I was told that if I choose "golden build" which are confirmed to work flawlessly, I shouldn't worry about stability.
So I see there are quirks here and there, the sleep function is a pain as I put my computer to sleep multiple times a day. I have a time to maintain a computer but I do not want to get to a point when I spend a lot of time fixing it.

My idea was to build confirmed hackintosh, it's Core i7 3770K, Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H and EVGA GeForce GT640 in R4 Fractal case. The plan is to get it running stable on 10.8.2 and don't touch unless it's critical. I know how to browse web safely and most of my applications run even in Snow Leopard, plus I don't have to have the latest features, so if I were to update OS, it'd be most likely to 10.9, probably 10.9.2 or something in a year.

I can afford to wait for new iMac, I'm just tired of it and want something powerful. I've given myself a deadline - middle of March 2013. If nothing is out, I'll just build it and get on with my life.

 

[motrek]

I've been asking around on more than a one occassion, especially on hackintosh forums. I was told that if I choose "golden build" which are confirmed to work flawlessly, I shouldn't worry about stability.
So I see there are quirks here and there, the sleep function is a pain as I put my computer to sleep multiple times a day. I have a time to maintain a computer but I do not want to get to a point when I spend a lot of time fixing it.

My idea was to build confirmed hackintosh, it's Core i7 3770K, Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H and EVGA GeForce GT640 in R4 Fractal case. The plan is to get it running stable on 10.8.2 and don't touch unless it's critical. I know how to browse web safely and most of my applications run even in Snow Leopard, plus I don't have to have the latest features, so if I were to update OS, it'd be most likely to 10.9, probably 10.9.2 or something in a year.

I can afford to wait for new iMac, I'm just tired of it and want something powerful. I've given myself a deadline - middle of March 2013. If nothing is out, I'll just build it and get on with my life.

Yes, *definitely* get a processor/motherboard/graphics card combination that's confirmed to work well. (Drives and cases don't really matter.) Realize that one person's idea of "running flawlessly" might differ from your own ideas and there may be quirks like not sleeping reliably.

If you don't have to update the OS more than once every year or two then that's your best route. For reasons I won't go into, my OS has to be pretty current and that just multiplies the headaches.

I don't know what you're using now or what you do with it, but if you want a good interim upgrade, you can get an SSD.

 

[george-brooks]

Let's be clear, the only reason I use Apple hardware is for Apple software.

 

[435713]

deleted, no flamesuit

 

[Mike in Kansas]

It wont last cause of the limited vision the company has, but for now you will get gimped on specs which shouldn't happen

I've heard this since the iMac came out 15 years ago.... how long will it not last?

 

[435713]

I've heard this since the iMac came out 15 years ago.... how long will it not last?

From the looks of it a few years till they eliminate desktops more than likely. The behavior of 15 months and 2-3 years on the Mac pro is bizarre.

The iMac didn't sell as well as it did currently back in those days. Macs got a lot more mainstream over the past few years. But people spending the prices they ask are not likely to want to pull the trigger on those purchases every 2-3 years like they seem to want by making the OS obsolete as fast as possible.

I would not be shocked at all if that is the line of thinking that went/goes on there. Big reason why Gates had no trouble slaughtering them in the 90's without breaking a sweat.

PS: I hope you are correct and I am wrong. And I respect Jobs, but the dude did some bad acid a few times obviously.

 

[Medic311]

i have found this combination of devices to be optimal for me:

1) Windows Home Server, custom built, 5 x 2TB drives - for centralized storage of all media, files, backups, etc
2) Acer laptop running Windows 7 - my main computer and what i use for engineering grad school
3) iPad 3, 32GB, LTE-Verizon - my quick mobile solution, or my "zone-out" entertainment device, also use Log Me In for remote access
4) iPhone 4S 32GB Verizon
5) WD TV Live - for watching my movies on my 50" Plasma, directly from the WHS


i have always thought about getting a Macbook Pro. in all honesty, i was on the verge of doing so. however i have found Windows 7 to be a great robust operating system. the Acer laptop was on a fire sale for $377. maybe when that breaks i will get a Macbook Pro.

 

[Mike in Kansas]

But people spending the prices they ask are not likely to want to pull the trigger on those purchases every 2-3 years like they seem to want by making the OS obsolete as fast as possible.

Why do you say that? I'm on a 4-1/2 year old iMac, and it runs ML perfect. Ditto for anyone on a 2007 Intel iMac. That's over 5 years on one machine. Who needs to update their Mac desktop every 2-3 years? Windows machine yes, but Mac no.

 

[roxxette]

Why do you say that? I'm on a 4-1/2 year old iMac, and it runs ML perfect. Ditto for anyone on a 2007 Intel iMac. That's over 5 years on one machine. Who needs to update their Mac desktop every 2-3 years? Windows machine yes, but Mac no.

Yeah thats why i have a windows desktop with over 5 years dont understand why people keep saying macs last longer lol

Apple is what it is now because of the iphone and ipad mate, other products are not getting a lot of love because people are not interested in going to Mac; they been trying to make people that buy a iphone to get a macbook pro etc you can tell with that ads of "retina" macbook pro lol wtf

 

[HurryKayne]

For me its easy,
Windows/XBox for gaming,Mac for work but..looking how Apple is doing with Final Cut,Imac etc..i'm starting to look for some windows alternatives such as
Sonar instead of Logic..and so on.

 

[IGregory]

Yeah thats why i have a windows desktop with over 5 years dont understand why people keep saying macs last longer lol

Apple is what it is now because of the iphone and ipad mate, other products are not getting a lot of love because people are not interested in going to Mac; they been trying to make people that buy a iphone to get a macbook pro etc you can tell with that ads of "retina" macbook pro lol wtf

Yeah, I agree. I don't understand why some Mac (hardware) users think Macs are better and last longer than PCs. PC makers get their hardware components from the same sources that Apple does. The difference is in the software. One either likes Windows or Apple's OS and other software. That's the difference. I switched to Mac because my PC needed replacing and I wanted to experience the challenge of learning a new OS. I am finding that OS X is not that dissimilar for Windows. Its all about process. Where Apple travels one path, Windows travels another, but both arrive at the same place.

If one considers the history between Apple and Microsoft one will find they both cross license each others operating system. Some Mac users say Windows OS is more buggy than Mac OS. Based on the complaints that I have found reading Macrumors forums, I don't believe that complaint is accurate.

The only other significant difference between the two systems is Apple allows the consumer to configure his or her system (primarily laptops) with higher performing components (ram/ssd/gpu). Professionals and professional wannabes like Macs for that reason. PCs with Windows are designed primarily with the average consumer in mind. It is very difficult to find a PC laptop with more than 8 gigs of ram or 256 gig SSD. To sum it up simply, you either like one system or you don't. The quality of one system over the other is a non-factor except those PC makers who make dirt cheap machines. Yes, one can buy a Mac with an aluminum case and complain about scratches, or buy a PC and not worry about scratches. Or, buy a retina and complain about the associated problems, or buy a PC without retina and not have those problems. I am not favoring one system over another. I just refuse to say PCs are inferior.

P.S. - There is one down side to a MAC. Because of its expense, at least the Macbook Pro with retina, I find myself obsessing over security and handling it with TLC. I didn't do that with any of the PCs I've owned through the years.

 

[talmy]

I feel that except for environments with a single computer, Macs effectively don't last as long as PCs. The reasons are the close coupling of OS versions with the computers.

Last year my 4 year old (at the time) work computer was replaced with a new one. But both systems run Windows XP. With a Mac, a new computer forces an OS upgrade. What do you do when you have lots of computer systems?

I replaced my server computer (a PC running XP for 8 years) with a Mac Mini with Snow Leopard server two years ago. Luckily it continues to function fine with Mountain Lion clients, but Mountain Lion's server is missing features I use so replacing the system would hurt (newer mini's don't run Snow Leopard, of course). What happens if a new system I buy, say next year with the Mountain Lion successor, doesn't work properly with the server?

Basically, Microsoft protects you from obsolescence. Apple encourages it. Of course if you have only one computer and upgrade it every year or two, you won't have any problems.

 

[Bendrix]

I got a dell xps 8500 and it's a quiet machine. I don't know if its iMac level but it's very very quiet. it is easy to open up and add ram or an ssd, which I did. and only the front of the tower is plastic, but material is not a huge deal for me. I just wanted a workhorse to run a daw. I would be using a 2011 iMac right now if I hadn't ended up with a lemon of a refurb back in may. that and the rude apple care guy on the phone sent me in this direction. there's always the possibility of owning a future iMac. time is precious, guys, and in the end it's just a tool to get stuff done.

 

[comatory]

I hink the longetivity issuE is tied nOt to individiual internal componente but to the build quality. Mac laptops usually dont get broken hinges and similar issues. Also the cooling is sometimes better whih can increase the life of internal components.
Of course, PC manufacturers have been catching up in those areas, especially cheaper brands like Asus. But for example the Z and T line of IBM
Thinkpad laptops has always been high end and carried the same price tag as Macs.


Also nobody forces you to update OSes,know a few people who work
Still comfortably on Leopard. Even today if you have 10.6.8 you pretty much have all the features,that is unless you need everythhing supertied to iToys.

 

[iClive]

Basically, Microsoft protects you from obsolescence. Apple encourages it. Of course if you have only one computer and upgrade it every year or two, you won't have any problems.

Not really, try using Office 97 with documents created with later versions or running Office 97 across an SBS2011 network, or anything earlier than Outlook 2007 with SBS2011; there are serious "compatibility" issues.

I know that Office 97 is now some 15 years old but it is perfectly adequate for most of our work needs but part of Microsoft's marketing strategy is to force paid upgrades to their latest Office suite which has a very significant cost attached to it, even with a volume licensing program.