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First iPhone Review from Walt Mossberg

Why everyone thinks Apple is innocent in all of this...

Padriac said:
I think they're going to leave it to AT&T to rape us for ringtones and just wash their hands of it.
Click to expand...

...NEVER ceases to astound and amaze me :) They are IN it, part and parcel, knee deep, the whole thing.

At MWSF...the HUGE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM was that gigantic "Ringtones" tab in iTunes when El Jobso plugged the damned phone in...but like...not a peep about it.

"But Mr. Smarty-Pants," you say, "if you know so much, then how come it wasn't in the video they released today? Huh? HUH?"

Silly Rabbits...its simple. The same reason YouTube wasn't in the old videos and commercials. They haven't announced their "revolutionary" Ringtone strategy yet.

Apple...is the third largest music retailer in the US. Apple has deals with all the record companies. Apple has iTunes...and the iPhone...that connects to iTunes.

They have..."leverage" in this space.

Don't be surprised if between now and Tuesday Apple announces they are selling ringtones...and have managed to undercut Verizon @ 79¢ or 49¢.

This will also take the wind out of the new campaign Sprint is about to unleash as well.

*ssshhhh* :)
 
Twilight Zone

Lepton said:
I think AT&T's new improved EDGE is supposed to give us something like a max of 10K/sec real-world. That's about 2x dialup.
Click to expand...

WHAT?

Wow...what the hell are you talking about/ It has long since surpassed that speed in the "real world" by more than double...
 
did..did..you just...

korndog2003 said:
ewww you cant take videos and you cant use your music for ring tones, glad I dont have the money to wast on this. Lol the razr v3i can do the same stuff except for the screen, and the touch and the nice web browser the iphone has...
Click to expand...

Oh god...you did. You started a sentence with "ewww".

:)
 
RnSK said:
...NEVER ceases to astound and amaze me :) They are IN it, part and parcel, knee deep, the whole thing.

At MWSF...the HUGE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM was that gigantic "Ringtones" tab in iTunes when El Jobso plugged the damned phone in...but like...not a peep about it.

"But Mr. Smarty-Pants," you say, "if you know so much, then how come it wasn't in the video they released today? Huh? HUH?"

Silly Rabbits...its simple. The same reason YouTube wasn't in the old videos and commercials. They haven't announced their "revolutionary" Ringtone strategy yet.

Apple...is the third largest music retailer in the US. Apple has deals with all the record companies. Apple has iTunes...and the iPhone...that connects to iTunes.

They have..."leverage" in this space.

Don't be surprised if between now and Tuesday Apple announces they are selling ringtones...and have managed to undercut Verizon @ 79¢ or 49¢.

This will also take the wind out of the new campaign Sprint is about to unleash as well.

*ssshhhh* :)
Click to expand...

Apple are forbidden from allowing ITMS tracks to be used as ringtones as part of their deal with the record labels. I don't think Apple is "innocent", especially if they attempt to sell ringtones themselves and thus profit, but it is clear that their hand has been forced at least a wee bit.

While Apple may be a corporation like all the rest, nobody matches the record industry when it comes to flat-out evil.
 
roland.g said:
I would have to wait now for rev. B based on:

T-mobile SIM cards don't work
Call quality good, but not great
Songs can't be set as Ringtones

not a deal breaker, but the camera, and no video to boot.
Click to expand...

WILL PEOPLE STOP TALKING ABOUT THE RINGTONE ISSUE!!! You can't just set your songs as ringtones because that would be free, and ATT doesn't want that! They probably want you to pay for ringtones, WHAT!, NEVER! I could set my songs as ringtones on my other cell phone for free, oh wait, I COULDN'T!!!

I refuse to believe that it is hard for apple to make iTunes songs have the capability to be used as ringtones, the only thing holding it up is money. ATT would like to make money in this deal, or Apple would like to make more by adding ringtones to the iTunes Music Store for like $0.49 or $0.99, I don't know...

But whatever the price would be, people would buy them up like hot cakes. I personally don't care about ringtones, because I just use vibrate. And unfortunately to some people, the ringtone issue is not a deal breaker for me, sorry....
 
Ringtones

You know, the not being able to set as a ringtone is a crappy deal, but I'll still get the phone. My SLVR is currently set to ring like the phones from 24. Maybe we'll be able to browse the iPhone like I browse my SLVR and I'll be able to dump a rintone in whatever format the iPhone uses?
 
Let me just quote you David Pogue from the NY Times Review:

"But even in version 1.0, the iPhone is still the most sophisticated, outlook-changing piece of electronics to come along in years. It does so many things so well, and so pleasurably, that you tend to forgive its foibles."

And remember, a LOT of fixes can be executed via software updates.
 
nuckinfutz said:
Well then enjoy your non-iphone :)

Expecting AT&T to give you free ringtones when the rest of the market charges is foolish.
Click to expand...

He didn't say free rigntones.. he said he is bummed about not being able to use the songs he possibly BOUGHT as ringtone... hmm, reading is indeed fundamental.
 
Padriac said:
You'll notice in the iTunes Store Terms of Service, it specifically forbids songs being used as ringtones. I think there is just some legal problem here. I'm sure they will be happy to sell you separate ringtones, but then everyone will bitch about having to rebuy the songs. I think the record labels might be most to blame for this and Apple just said "screw it, it's all messed up. Just forget it." I think they're going to leave it to AT&T to rape us for ringtones and just wash their hands of it. I'm hoping there will be some clever workaround in the future that won't piss of the labels (like you can add any uprotected AAC file as a ringtone, and if that file just happens to be a song...)
Click to expand...

Yep, that was my first thought. It's the record companies holding Apple back, not Apple itself.

Aren't ringtones a huge portion of the downloadable music biz? Nobody, but nobody wants to lose revenue .
 
unfortunately i expect ring tones will be added to itunes in the very near future. the record companies have wanted "variable" or at least increased pricing for years now. apple has been staunchly against it -- except when there's a value add like itunes plus.

so expect to see itunes ringtones for $2 or $1.50 -- you get the song and the ring tone.
 
Ugg said:
Yep, that was my first thought. It's the record companies holding Apple back, not Apple itself.

Aren't ringtones a huge portion of the downloadable music biz? Nobody, but nobody wants to lose revenue .
Click to expand...

I wonder how the iPhone shows up under disk mode. Maybe we can just add ringtones to a directory of sorts and the iPhone will just add them to the list.
 
chrisgeleven said:
I don't get the need for MMS messaging. A simple e-mail solves that. And if AT&T were smart, it would just fowarded all incoming MMS messages to your e-mail address.

I am sure Apple thought of this.

Problem solved.
Click to expand...

I see, the whole world will be using iphones huh?. How about someone else who can view video messages but does not have a smartphone?.
 
Digital Skunk said:
...That doesn't mean the iPhone is perfect or that Apple's method of distribution of the iPhone is the best method.
Click to expand...

I think you are putting out a straw man argument that people are saying this phone is perfect for *everybody*. It's just perfect for what they want (or close enough to it, as is the case with me).

You bring up many valid features that the iPhone indeed does not have. BUT, all features are not of equal value. Imagine a scale from 1-10 where 1 means that the feature virtually useless or non-important, and 10 means that the omission is a really big deal: a total dealbreaker. Now, let's look at the iPhone negatives and try to put numbers on them. This will represent *my* opinion to show you how I came to the conclusion that an iPhone is a solid choice for me.

No removable battery = 1. iPhone has great battery life and the dock connector allows battery packs (rechargable or AA) that work just like an extra battery would (same hassle of carrying it around everywhere). The only *real* issue is having to send it in when the battery gets old, but that's a one-time hassle that may not even happen before you switch out the phone for a new one.

No 3G = 5. If you live in a 3G heavy area but have little Wi-fi access at the places you go you'll be majorly annoyed (a "10" for you). If you don't get 3G anyway but have tons of Wi-fi access you won't even notice the lack of Wi-fi (a "0" for you). It's going to depend on the user so I split it down the middle. For me personally, it's still a 5 (I am in a 3G zone but I'm also attached to a Wi-fi network almost everywhere I go except my car).

No video recording = 3 for me. I can think of a few occasions where I'd use it, but mostly it would sit there unused. For others, it's different. It would have to do really high quality video for me to be interested, but at that point the cost would not make it worth it (to me).

2 MP Camera = 2 for me. I'm a wannabe photographer, so I'd only use the phone camera when I don't care about quality too much anyway (informal things or unexpected things, for the rest it's a DSLR). I'd say the camera is perfectly adequate, nothing more, nothing less.

Searchable contacts = 1. It makes sense to add, but I don't have nearly enough contacts (100?) that scrolling will be all that hassle. Seems like an easily upgradable thing to me, anyway.

No Adobe Flash = 3 for me. Some sites I frequent do have flash and it will be a pain to not be able to quickly check out that content. It's really the only downside I see to the Browser which otherwise looks amazing. The YouTube client mitigates a lot of the pain.

No Custom Ringtones = 2 for me. I more just want to be able to put my own "beepy" ringtones than I do songs, but I see how a younger crowd will be sad they can't let the world know how much they love Kelly Clarkson every time somebody calls them. I think this is some legal thing and some custom ringtone solution will show up in software eventually

My point being that a few issues are somewhat big (3G, mostly), dealbreakers even for some out there, but most are way overblown as being things of any importance for many people. When you contrast with the indisputable positives:

- the "iPod" portion. The media portion of this thing just looks insane. Great interface.
- full email with pictures. Even exchange support (which I absolutely don't need, but others do)
- wonderful UI (this is so key it should get listed twice),
- visual voicemail. People complain about ringtones, but ignore this long-need feature? This has been a long time coming.
- really smart wi-fi management
- really great browser (arguably the best on a mobile device)
- awesome google maps implementation (even without GPS)
- Large, beautiful screen with a higher resolution than the competition
- Great conference call management.
- etc.

The picture painted is a phone that does what it is designed to do really well but with a couple of big caveats (3G...) and a few niggling software update issues (search, no IM). In total, much as the reviews seem to say, the iPhone mostly delivers but there are a few drawbacks. Decide how much those drawbacks matter to you and choose accordingly, If they don't apply (they don't apply that much to me and I have faith that most software gripes will get ironed out) and I don't see how you can say my decision to get an iPhone is wrong or that I'm falling for the hype or whatever it is. Trust me, I'm well aware of where this thing shines and where it doesn't, but it's mostly shine as far as my personal use is concerned. I'll be happy to see this thing get updated with time and probably get the REV C when it hits in 2 years (assuming my experience is positive).

There are very few phones with the "full" internet with 3G, but I *could* get one of those, sure. But what I'd gain in speed every now and then while I'm out and about I'd lose in other places (UI, screen, visual voicemail, prettiness, cost (N95), etc.)
 
Nobody?!?!

Padriac said:
While Apple may be a corporation like all the rest, nobody matches the record industry when it comes to flat-out evil.
Click to expand...

I think Apple is in that club my man.

The difference is...they do it with *style* :)
 
Padriac said:
I …snip…There are very few phones with the "full" internet with 3G, but I *could* get one of those, sure. But what I'd gain in speed every now and then while I'm out and about I'd lose in other places (UI, screen, visual voicemail, prettiness, cost (N95), etc.)
Click to expand...

Don't forget to add the small issue of possible incompatibility with a lot of the hundreds of add-ons currently available for the iPods. That is kinda scary if you think about it, like will the iPod hi-fi work?
 
EDGE Speed tests, As promised.

Sorry..a bit late on this as i had some Real Life stuff to tend to.

Anyway...here we go.

First, the test environment:

These tests were done from a fixed location within 50 Miles of Washington, DC, over ATT's EDGE Data Network, via a tethered Samsung Blackjack locked to the 850 Mhz GSM Band.

All web tests were done from cache cleaned cold single run and loads of Safari 3 beta on 10.4.9. When i say cache cleaned. I mean it. There was no Safari cache on the disk; safari had to create the cache folders for every site. After each site was loaded, I quit safari, erased the safari caches via the finder, and emptied the trash.

Nothing was "turned off"; these are fully loaded sites...all the crap flash, the ads, javascripts etc.

So with all that out of the way...some numbers:

Apple.com 17 seconds
Apple.com 19 seconds <- so nice, i had to do it again. They do great HTML!
yahoo.com 20 seconds
nytimes.com 47 seconds <--full of ads and flash crap. what is going on there?!
digg.com/apple 27 seconds

Additionally, I ran the Speakeasy Speedtests:

http://www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/

Washington DC
Download Speed: 238 kbps (29.8 KB/sec transfer rate)
Upload Speed: 81 kbps (10.1 KB/sec transfer rate)

NY, NY
Download Speed: 169 kbps (21.1 KB/sec transfer rate)
Upload Speed: 77 kbps (9.6 KB/sec transfer rate)

Atlanta
Download Speed: 134 kbps (16.8 KB/sec transfer rate)
Upload Speed: 68 kbps (8.5 KB/sec transfer rate)

Chicago
Download Speed: 216 kbps (27 KB/sec transfer rate)
Upload Speed: 74 kbps (9.3 KB/sec transfer rate)

Dallas
Download Speed: 185 kbps (23.1 KB/sec transfer rate)
Upload Speed: 22 kbps (2.8 KB/sec transfer rate)

LA
Download Speed: 224 kbps (28 KB/sec transfer rate)
Upload Speed: 74 kbps (9.3 KB/sec transfer rate)

San Fran
Download Speed: 213 kbps (26.6 KB/sec transfer rate)
Upload Speed: 78 kbps (9.8 KB/sec transfer rate)

Seattle
Download Speed: 166 kbps (20.8 KB/sec transfer rate)
Upload Speed: 75 kbps (9.4 KB/sec transfer rate)


Latency is a factor often in speeds...so lets look at some numbers there. people like...numbers:

Ping latency to apple.com
PING apple.com (17.254.3.183): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 17.254.3.183: icmp_seq=0 ttl=241 time=693.804 ms
64 bytes from 17.254.3.183: icmp_seq=1 ttl=241 time=414.703 ms
64 bytes from 17.254.3.183: icmp_seq=2 ttl=241 time=332.706 ms
64 bytes from 17.254.3.183: icmp_seq=3 ttl=241 time=315.609 ms
64 bytes from 17.254.3.183: icmp_seq=4 ttl=241 time=312.536 ms
64 bytes from 17.254.3.183: icmp_seq=5 ttl=241 time=374.499 ms
64 bytes from 17.254.3.183: icmp_seq=6 ttl=241 time=315.511 ms
64 bytes from 17.254.3.183: icmp_seq=7 ttl=241 time=312.466 ms
^C
--- apple.com ping statistics ---
8 packets transmitted, 8 packets received, 0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 312.466/383.979/693.804/122.083 ms

google.com
PING google.com (64.233.167.99): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 64.233.167.99: icmp_seq=0 ttl=243 time=359.067 ms
64 bytes from 64.233.167.99: icmp_seq=1 ttl=243 time=300.974 ms
64 bytes from 64.233.167.99: icmp_seq=2 ttl=243 time=319.822 ms
64 bytes from 64.233.167.99: icmp_seq=4 ttl=243 time=258.598 ms
64 bytes from 64.233.167.99: icmp_seq=5 ttl=243 time=278.440 ms
64 bytes from 64.233.167.99: icmp_seq=6 ttl=243 time=298.387 ms
64 bytes from 64.233.167.99: icmp_seq=7 ttl=243 time=359.281 ms
64 bytes from 64.233.167.99: icmp_seq=8 ttl=243 time=319.170 ms
64 bytes from 64.233.167.99: icmp_seq=9 ttl=243 time=298.159 ms
^C
--- google.com ping statistics ---
11 packets transmitted, 9 packets received, 18% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 258.598/310.211/359.281/31.642 ms

yahoo.com
PING yahoo.com (66.94.234.13): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 66.94.234.13: icmp_seq=0 ttl=46 time=378.373 ms
64 bytes from 66.94.234.13: icmp_seq=1 ttl=46 time=356.381 ms
64 bytes from 66.94.234.13: icmp_seq=2 ttl=46 time=376.343 ms
64 bytes from 66.94.234.13: icmp_seq=3 ttl=46 time=359.245 ms
64 bytes from 66.94.234.13: icmp_seq=4 ttl=46 time=336.109 ms
64 bytes from 66.94.234.13: icmp_seq=5 ttl=46 time=357.052 ms
64 bytes from 66.94.234.13: icmp_seq=6 ttl=46 time=357.953 ms
64 bytes from 66.94.234.13: icmp_seq=7 ttl=46 time=377.831 ms
64 bytes from 66.94.234.13: icmp_seq=8 ttl=46 time=356.776 ms
^C
--- yahoo.com ping statistics ---
9 packets transmitted, 9 packets received, 0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 336.109/361.785/378.373/12.917 ms

digg.com
PING digg.com (64.191.203.30): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 64.191.203.30: icmp_seq=0 ttl=237 time=378.475 ms
64 bytes from 64.191.203.30: icmp_seq=1 ttl=237 time=320.362 ms
64 bytes from 64.191.203.30: icmp_seq=2 ttl=237 time=316.230 ms
64 bytes from 64.191.203.30: icmp_seq=3 ttl=237 time=360.066 ms
64 bytes from 64.191.203.30: icmp_seq=4 ttl=237 time=355.990 ms
64 bytes from 64.191.203.30: icmp_seq=5 ttl=237 time=357.879 ms
64 bytes from 64.191.203.30: icmp_seq=6 ttl=237 time=357.027 ms
64 bytes from 64.191.203.30: icmp_seq=7 ttl=237 time=334.989 ms
^C
--- digg.com ping statistics ---
8 packets transmitted, 8 packets received, 0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 316.230/347.627/378.475/20.182 ms


Wow.

So really, there is a lot of hyperbole...a lot of exaggeration.

I suppose next to your fancy cablemodem speeds, this might seem "like dialup"...but dialup is in fact MUCH slower than this. Its been so long since most tech saavy people have USED dialup that i think they forget how slow it *really* is :)

Hopefully this is helps
 
Well, my main issue I see with the iPhone is the lack of video recording capabilities. It is gay!! I personally enjoy taking video of events on a daily basis that I find funny or interesting. That is a standard feature that look when selecting a cellphone. I was excited about iPhone, but this a HUGE deal-breaker for me.

Another problem is the lack of a built-in GPS system. You might not think it is vital, but I have enjoyed this feature tremendously with my LG enV. My contract with Verizon is about to expire, and I really want to change my company because I do not like the service.

I loved the idea of having the iPhone, but I am seriousy thinking about backing out because of the lack of these VERY IMPORTANT features for me. I will have to look into other smart phones with the rest of the companies before making up my mind

Good luck to everyone who is getting it!
 
northwesternmac said:
WILL PEOPLE STOP TALKING ABOUT THE RINGTONE ISSUE!!! You can't just set your songs as ringtones because that would be free, and ATT doesn't want that!
Click to expand...


Thats a weak answer. Its probably an Apple decision too - wait for the ring tones on iTMS. Its a revenue generator. Squeeze the very last $ out of the consumer.

Fortunately, not all phones are as locked up as the iPhone.
 
Stella said:
Thats a weak answer. Its probably an Apple decision too - wait for the ring tones on iTMS. Its a revenue generator. Squeeze the very last $ out of the consumer.

Fortunately, not all phones are as locked up as the iPhone.
Click to expand...

I think it was in this thread that I asked for someone to point out a smartphone that didn't have user addable ringtones. I never got a response. All I know is it isn't AT&T (the Treo can have ringtones added to it).
 
My Bad.

Hopstretch said:
Dude! Stop screwing up everybody's uninformed opinions with your actual data. Please. ;)
Click to expand...

Mea Culpa.

Um...yeah...3G is like SUPER UBER MEGA FAST*...ATTs slow ass dial-up network is a RIPOFF!! It will take like 4 minutes just to pull up a webpage!!!!

Apple really dropped the ball here going on Crapular's slow, ancient network!!:mad:

I think everyone should just wait for the Rev3 iPhone on Verizon the 200GB of flash, OC3 Wireless and built in Orgasmatronic Resonator for $200 and no contract.




*actually, it is faster, no doubt. the averages are about 65Kbytes/second...73ish in bursts and peaks. Contrast this with GPRS and dialup...there you get about 4KBytes/sec...with data compression ;)
 
RnSK said:
Mea Culpa.

Um...yeah...3G is like SUPER UBER MEGA FAST*...ATTs slow ass dial-up network is a RIPOFF!! It will take like 4 minutes just to pull up a webpage!!!!

Apple really dropped the ball here going on Crapular's slow, ancient network!!:mad:

I think everyone should just wait for the Rev3 iPhone on Verizon the 200GB of flash, OC3 Wireless and built in Orgasmatronic Resonator for $200 and no contract.




*actually, it is faster, no doubt. the averages are about 65Kbytes/second...73ish in bursts and peaks. Contrast this with GPRS and dialup...there you get about 4KBytes/sec...with data compression ;)
Click to expand...


Excellent post! For those whom aren't smart enough to understand---he was being sarcastic. Yeah the iPhone isn't perfect, but it is a revolution of today. Do you want to be part of it or not? It's up to you. I sure do!
 
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