Apple's Share of Worldwide Smartphone Market Slides as Samsung Continues to Surge

BC2009 said:

Negative comment about Apple is one thing. Trolling is another.

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There's trolling on both sides. Negative votes don't help or change that. Just ignore the trolls, you know, as in "Don't feed the trolls".

Negative votes feed them. There is no reason to bring back down votes except for people wanting to be passive agressive against things they don't understand or have the courage to either ignore or comment on.

iOS development is just too slow.
It still looks like 2007 and will continue to do that....well just because apple is milking the 3gs cow and still selling that old phone.
Means it has to be supported via software with the greatest and latest from Cupertino.

The Nrs are just a result of Apple being too greedy and selling that old crap (with the screen being pretty poor back then already...) and now that is limiting the development of iOS (which looks outdated....oh btw I own an Iphone 4 ). My next phone will be an android... I am sick of pressing that homebutton like mad. I have been waiting for iOS 6 but well guess what ....2007 again.

Otaviano said:

So people just don't get it.

There is a great Steve Jobs quote from when he first returned to Apple where he sad for Apple to succeed Windows did not have to lose. Not many people talk about that quote.

It's a shame because he were are and it's the same old misguided dynamic.

iPhone Vs. Android
Mac Vs. Windows

Apple makes a cellphone, that they choose to supply the software is irrelevant. Android is a software platform distributed to companies that make cell phone hardware.

Apple makes computers, that they choose to supply the software is again irrelevant. Windows is a software platform distributed to companies that make computers.

Do you see where I am going with this? How is comparing a company that makes one cell model to an entire software platform a fair comparison?

The reality is Apple sells more cellphones that nearly the entire cellular industry. The generate the majority of profits in the cellular industry. Doing this while maintaing excellent customer satisfaction levels and a high level of loyalty from their customers.

What exactly are they losing here? And what exactly is Google winning? You have companies like Amazon skinning Android, removing all Google services from it and using it in their products. Where is the win for Google or Android in that?

You want to look at general numbers, sure Android is winning. If you look deeper than that I think the fight is much much more even. I wouldn't even consider Samsungs current success to be a win for Google and Android. You don't think Samsung would like to pull a Kindle Fire on their Android products.

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Wow... did you even read what I was replying to?

I said "Yes... Android won"

But the key part was my next sentence that you must have missed. I said:

"So now what?"

I KNOW Apple is fine. Does it really matter who is in first place by unit sales? There are many other measures of success.

You should have used this rant on the guy I was replying to earlier.

Uh oh...

Huhn said:

iOS development is just too slow.

It still looks like 2007 and will continue to do that....

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To be fair... Android has "looked" the same for years too.

It's what's under the hood that counts!

It looks from those figures as if Samsung is cannibalising its own non-Smartphone sales. I wonder how much (if any) 'brand loyalty' there is with Samsung. Obviously, they have one of the best smartphones out there now too, which is being quite heavily promoted by carriers (here at least).

Otaviano said:

The reality is Apple sells more cellphones that nearly the entire cellular industry.

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Fact check:

• Apple sells ~ 7-9% of the cellphones in the world.
• Apple sells ~ 18-23% of the smartphones in the world.

Both are amazing numbers, but are not more than anyone else.

Perhaps you were trying to say that Apple sells more of a single model name? That's probably still true, since they only have a few models.

AlexJaye said:

Lol. Really?? Maybe to Apple execs, but not to the many iPhone users I know seriously considering switching to better Android phones.

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1. Better in YOUR opinion. Not everyone's opinion.
2. People to care about companies profit shares and the like. Every rumour site posts tons of rumours about companies financials and quarterly reports. This site is no different with Apple's financials. And a ton of people just like you and me reply to these articles.
3. People realise they want the tech company they bought products from to be in existence for a while. Never say never. People bought kodak cameras and palm stuff and both are down the toilet now. Long term support does matter to customers.

Offtopic but I will say the Android crowd can make some nice hardware in my opinion (or should I say clone ). But I think the Android OS is a piece of S***. That's why if I was to get a smart phone ever it would not be an android one.

1) The headline is rather sensational. Yes, iPhones sales are down, Samsung up. Samsung has a slick new phone out; Apple's won't be out for another month or so. iPhone sales traditionally dip in the months before a new release. But the headline makes it sound like the iPhone's best days are behind it. Clearly that isn't the case, they is just better competition now. That's not necessarily a bad thing for Apple.

2) The fixation on marketshare is way overwrought. Yes, it's an important metric, but it's not the be-all & end-all. Honda sells approx 100K cars each month in the U.S. and it's fleet ranges from $15K to $35K. BMW sells only 25K cars each month in the U.S. but it's fleet ranges from $31K to $140K. The 3 series, which accounts for half it's sales avgs at $45K.

Honda has two cars in the U.S. top 20, the Civic and the Accord. BMW has none. A fully loaded top of the line Accord coupe costs about $30K. A stripped BMW 3 series 4 door is $36K.

Despite Honda selling more cars than BMW and having two in the top 20 sales category, overwhelming public and professional opinion is that BMWs are better cars, but not everyone can afford one or has a practical use for one.

Honda profits for the March quarter were $1.9b EBIDA. BMW's for the same period were $2.7b.

Marketshare is a useful metric but isn't everything folks. What's important is a company has a product, not a commodity, people want. That's where profits come from. There are many econo-boxes like Honda, but few cars match the way a BMW drives which is why they are rarely deeply discounted.

Good. Don't get cocky apple.

the8thark said:

]
Offtopic but I will say the Android crowd can make some nice hardware in my opinion (or should I say clone ). But I think the Android OS is a piece of S***. That's why if I was to get a smart phone ever it would not be an android one.

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Based on what? Please explain to us why Jelly Bean on a Galaxy Nexus is a piece of ****. What are you basing that on? Oh that's right -- nothing.

Chupa Chupa said:

1) The headline is rather sensational. Yes, iPhones sales are down, Samsung up. Samsung has a slick new phone out; Apple's won't be out for another month or so. iPhone sales traditionally dip in the months before a new release. But the headline makes it sound like the iPhone's best days are behind it. Clearly that isn't the case, they is just better competition now. That's not necessarily a bad thing for Apple.

2) The fixation on marketshare is way overwrought. Yes, it's an important metric, but it's not the be-all & end-all. Honda sells approx 100K cars each month in the U.S. and it's fleet ranges from $15K to $35K. BMW sells only 25K cars each month in the U.S. but it's fleet ranges from $31K to $140K. The 3 series, which accounts for half it's sales avgs at $45K.

Honda has two cars in the U.S. top 20, the Civic and the Accord. BMW has none. A fully loaded top of the line Accord coupe costs about $30K. A stripped BMW 3 series 4 door is $36K.

Yes, despite Honda selling more cars than BMW and having two in the top 20 sales category, overwhelming public and professional opinion is that BMWs are better cars, but not everyone can afford one or desires one. Also Honda profits for the March quarter were $1.9b EBIDA. BMWs for the same period were $2.7b.

Marketshare is nice but isn't everything folks. What's important is a company has a product, not a commodity people want. That's where profits come from.

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1) in recent history when has apple benefitted from increased competition and in the end brought out a better product? btw that is a genuine question. as i see them they mostly go their own way whether its the "right" or "wrong" one

2) so apple is "losing" sales because its too expensive? i go to apples website and i can get a 3gs for $0 and a 4 for $99. it may help you feel better to use this analogy but i dont find it that relevant where the price difference at most is a few hundred dollars.

numlock said:

1) in recent history when has apple benefitted from increased competition and in the end brought out a better product? btw that is a genuine question. as i see them they mostly go their own way whether its the "right" or "wrong" one

2) so apple is "losing" sales because its too expensive? i go to apples website and i can get a 3gs for $0 and a 4 for $99. it may help you feel better to use this analogy but i dont find it that relevant where the price difference at most is a few hundred dollars.

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Either you misread what I wrote or I don't understand what you wrote. Your comments do not in any way mesh with my point that marketshare isn't everything, i.e., Samsung might be selling more Android phones than Apple is selling iPhones right now, but so what? Honda sells as many cars in one month as BMW does in an entire quarter. But which car is more respected by the public and professional drivers and car reviewers? Which company had higher profits last Q.

My comment was not to say Apple is losing sales b/c of price. In fact, the point of my entire post was that price isn't all that relevant if you have a good product. Honda's are cheaper than BMWs. They sell better than BMWs. BMWs profits were significantly higher than Honda's last Q though on far fewer unit sales because Hondas are a commodity car, BMWs are a prized possession, a symbol of one's success, and, most importantly, fun to drive.

BTW there are several features Apple "borrowed" from Android that who knows if they would have been implemented in iPhones but for Android. Competition helps improve product.

Chupa Chupa said:

Either you misread what I wrote or I don't understand what you wrote. Your comments do not in any way mesh with my point that marketshare isn't everything, i.e., Samsung might be selling more Android phones than Apple is selling iPhones right now, but so what? Honda sells as many cars in one month as BMW does in an entire quarter. But which car is more respected by the public and professional drivers and car reviewers? Which company had higher profits last Q.

My comment was not to say Apple is losing sales b/c of price. In fact, the point of my entire post was that price isn't all that relevant if you have a good product. Honda's are cheaper than BMWs. They sell more of them. BMWs profits were significantly higher than Honda's last Q though on far fewer unit sales.

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i just dont see the point for this car analogy. it might fit for apple the compuer company (rip) but not the phone company imo.

apple is not going to maintain these profits if they lose sales to samsung.

no you didnt say apple was losing sales because of the price but considering what thread we are in and your analogy i somehow understood that.

numlock said:

i just dont see the point for this car analogy. it might fit for apple the compuer company (rip) but not the phone company imo.

apple is not going to maintain these profits if they lose sales to samsung.

no you didnt say apple was losing sales because of the price but considering what thread we are in and your analogy i somehow understood that.

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Maybe you are looking at it too concretely. If the product category "cars," and brands "Honda," and "BMW" get in your way, then think of it as Widgets and "BudgetWidgs," and "LuxoWidgs."

The point, again, has to do with the concept of marketshare, which is the headline of this thread, i.e., Samsung up, Apple down. My point is that marketshare, regardless of product category, is only one metric of many. Too many people look at marketshare as the sine qua non of product/company success.

I used Honda and BMW because they are two popular brands. Both companies make good products. Honda is on the lower to mid end of the spectrum, BMW, on the mid to high end. Honda's marketshare whips BMW any day, any hour. But BMW makes an even better & desired product and therefore can charge a higher price with better margins.

Specifically, a lot of consumers don't want to spend $150 or more on a phone. It's not the 1000s of $ difference b/t a Honda and BMW, no, but to many the upfront cost of a phone is a barrier to entry. The majority of Samsung's Android phones are under $100. They are the Honda of smartphones. On the other end of the spectrum is Apple, whose product line up is the oppose of Samsungs - two sub $100 phones (all previous years models) and 3 phones $199 and higher.

So Samsung sells more phones than Apple, sure. They are mostly less expensive. But Apple's EBITA profits are not hurting because they don't need to go toe-to-toe on pricing with it's newest model as Android phones are a commodity where as the iPhone is, like the BMW, something people desire. You never see masses of people eagerly anticipating the newest Android phone, either by pre-ordering or lining up day of release.

Chupa Chupa said:

Maybe you are looking at it too concretely. If the product category "cars," and brands "Honda," and "BMW" get in your way, then think of it as Widgets and "BudgetWidgs," and "LuxoWidgs."

The point, again, has to do with the concept of marketshare, which is the headline of this thread, i.e., Samsung up, Apple down. My point is that marketshare, regardless of product category, is only one metric of many. Too many people look at marketshare as the sine qua non of product/company success. My point is that marketshare isn't as important as people think.

I used Honda and BMW because they are two popular brand. Both companies make good products. Honda is on the lower to mid end of the spectrum, BMW, on the mid to high end. Honda's marketshare whips BMW any day, any hour. But BMW makes an ever better product and therefore can charge a higher price with better margins. Same is true with Samsung and Honda.

Specifically, a lot of consumers don't want to spend $150 or more on a phone. It's not the 1000s of $ difference b/t a Honda and BMW, no, but to many the upfront cost of a phone is a barrier to entry. The majority of Samsung's Android phones are under $100. They are the Honda of smartphones. On the other end of the spectrum is Apple, whose product line up is the oppose of Samsungs - two sub $100 phones (all previous years models) and 3 phones $199 and higher.

So Samsung sells more phones, sure. They are mostly less expensive. But Apple's EBITA profits are not hurting because they don't need to go toe-to-toe on pricing with it's newest model because most Android phones are commodities where as the iPhone is, like the BMW, something people desire. You never see masses of people eagerly anticipating the newest Android phone, either by pre-ordering or lining up day of release.

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maybe i am. samsung may be honda but then apple is definitely not bmw. i think you overly romanticize apple as a brand here and most peoples view of it.

but you know who has been guilty of pushing out marketshare %? thats right apple.

isnt the new galaxy doing pretty darn well? samsung seems to be going from strength to strength. who knows how their launch weeks will be in a few years. how do the sub $100 iphones compare with samsungs in specs and features?

but the point is that if apple keeps on losing shares then their profit margin and EBITA (which to me is not something a fanboy should consider) will suffer.

Chupa Chupa said:

1) The headline is rather sensational. Yes, iPhones sales are down, Samsung up. Samsung has a slick new phone out; Apple's won't be out for another month or so. iPhone sales traditionally dip in the months before a new release.

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iPhone sales, Q2 to Q3 "traditonal" dip :

'09 Q2 : 3.79M Q3 : 5.2M Growth: 37%
'10 Q2 : 8.75M Q3 : 8.4M Dip: 4%
'11 Q2 : 18.65M Q3 : 20.34M Growth: 9%
'12 Q2 : 35.1M Q3: 26M Dip: 26%

(Growth/Dip percentages calculated as 100 - Q3/Q2 for simplicity).

Seems there's no tradition there. The numbers are still quite good, probably nothing to worry about. But this is a first time dip as far as the sheer gap of units sold between Q2 and Q3 go, which is what is causing all the "unrest".

numlock said:

maybe i am. samsung may be honda but then apple is definitely not bmw. i think you overly romanticize apple as a brand here and most peoples view of it.

but you know who has been guilty of pushing out marketshare %? thats right apple.

isnt the new galaxy doing pretty darn well? samsung seems to be going from strength to strength. who knows how their launch weeks will be in a few years. how do the sub $100 iphones compare with samsungs in specs and features?

but the point is that if apple keeps on losing shares then their profit margin and EBITA (which to me is not something a fanboy should consider) will suffer.

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1) If people "over romanticized" the Apple brand you wouldn't see so many people on the street, in airports, malls, etc. heads down, eyes on their iPhone. It also wouldn't have the highest brand reputation quotient (link loads PDF) of any company in this history of the Harris survey. Then there are other surveys Apple tops out at, and lets not forget the always packed Apple Stores even when the rest of the mall stores are dead. People desire Apple products or they would have such astounding growth the past decade. Consumers are fickle and tough to impress. Most Apple buyers are not Apple loyalists like here. They just like Apple products as they are today. If Apple screws up they'll leave in an instant.

2) Apple pushes a lot of stats out for public consumption when its to their advantage just like every other company. It doesn't make them any better or worse. It's still "big picture," not one statistic. Again, Honda sells a heck of a lot of cars but it's profits are lower than BMW. Which company do you want to own stock in?

3) The Galaxy is an impressive phone that in many ways is better than the iPhone 4S. It's doing great. I never said it wasn't. I think I mentioned its a cool phone in my original post. Will it be better than the next iPhone? We'll have to see. Consumers will let us know very quickly. It's selling well. Is it Samsung's best selling Android phone? No. Why? Because Android buyers are mostly a price sensitive with a smattering of "open source or bust" people mixed in.

4) Again (see my original post) it's yet to be determined if the iPhone sales decline is permanent or seasonal. History suggests its seasonal, and sales growth will continue when the next iPhone is release in the coming months.

5) If you are going to accuse anyone of being a fan boy you should look in the mirror. Why throw out pejoratives? I think I know why. Anyway, good day.

Chupa Chupa said:

I used Honda and BMW because they are two popular brands. Both companies make good products. Honda is on the lower to mid end of the spectrum, BMW, on the mid to high end. Honda's marketshare whips BMW any day, any hour. But BMW makes an even better & desired product and therefore can charge a higher price with better margins.

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Honda and BMW is a bad thing to compare here, BMWs are nicer. But as far as how reliable they are, Hondas are actually better ( I've owned BMWs, no thanks. 870 dollars for a water pump, that failed at 81,000? No thanks ). Kind of like, well if your just looking for a A-B car, and you want it to " just work ", for a good price. Go with the Honda. Which lots of consumers do.

What you should do, is compare Honda and well....Acura ( nicer hondas! ). They both do the same thing, the cost difference isn't very much. But in essence, an Acura is a more desirable car than a honda, even tho its just a shineyer honda.

The car analogy just doesn't work with phones, because we are not talking about large amounts of money here, a typical android phone, assuming your not going for a freebee, which is fine for lots of people.

Typical Android phone goes for anywhere from like 50-150 dollars, and the 4S goes for what? 200 if you sign a new contract? And the vast majority of people only upgrade every time they get a free upgrade, or sign a new contract. So, we are talking well under 100 dollars of difference.

I don't understand why people on this fourm seem to think thats a large amount of money, because its not. Hell, when I was still in college working at a BBQ place running a smoker for 7 bucks an hour ( hey now, back in the early 00's, that was pretty good for a part time summer gig ) Assuming the iPhone even existed back then, and the price point was as small as it is, that wouldn't have stopped me from buying one, even with horribly tiny 500 dollar 2 week paychecks.

Luxary Car vs Ecobox car is a terrible analogy. Because Apple isn't viewed by the vast majority of people as a " luxury " product. Because they aren't. If everyone thought Macs were da bomb, surely they would line up outside Apple stores to buy the cheaper mac minis? But they dont.

You never see masses of people eagerly anticipating the newest Android phone, either by pre-ordering or lining up day of release.

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Anyone who takes time out of their day to wait in line for a PHONE, is CRAZY. Sorry if that personally offends you, its not intended to. But seriously who does that? Does your old phone stop working the day Apple brings out the next iPhone? Waiting in line for something like a phone is something like waiting for the next WoW release. ( GF is HUGE into WoW...stood....in the snow....for 3 hours....cold....cold....cold ....cold....couldve just waitied for the downloader ). It makes zero sense.

As far as these Sub 100 dollar phones go, when I first signed up with sprint, my workphone was a Palm something running Windows mobile 5, which did pretty much everything I wanted it to, and had a great time using it.

So I picked up a Samsung Replenish, low end-mid end Android phone, was like 50 bucks with 2 year contract, as well as a discount on your plan for being " green " ( probably made out of recycled Galaxy S1s lol ).

And I can see why people buy them, it does pretty much everything you need it to, tons of games, lots of Apps run on it, decent amount of memory when you put a bigass SD card in it. Real keyboard. Battery life was great for me, esp with the solar cover.



Cheap? You bet it is! Feels cheap? Yeppers! Not very good Specs wise? Yep!

I do like the fact that its almost 100% recycled materials, that is a cool thing, even the ink on the box is made of soy lol.

Back to the point, a phone like that, while cheap. Is what tons of consumers are looking for, it does everything they need it to. And its data plan is much cheaper than an iPhone data plan.

So, to the average Joe, who just wants a basic data plan, and a basic smartphone, why should he get an iPhone over that? I think thats why Android is getting so popular, because it has a " low end " market. And at the same time, it has high end phones, and Android Phones weather high or low end, tend to have options, like keyboards, kickstands, bigger or smaller screens, candybar form factor, or something more like a Blackberry or Palm form factor. Choice is a GOOD THING

Though I'll admit. I upgraded to the S3, and its epic. We did upgrade to iPhones at work, and while these aren't my personal phones.



Step it up Apple.

Michael Scrip said:

To be fair... Android has "looked" the same for years too.

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Actually, I think that's what people are asking Apple to do that Android has done and your screenshots show. Just refresh the "theme" of iOS. The only updates we've had are the dock background and wallpapers. Otherwise, UI widgets have not really changed from the original look.

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Chupa Chupa said:

1) If people "over romanticized" the Apple brand you wouldn't see so many people on the street, in airports, malls, etc. heads down, eyes on their iPhone.

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That has nothing to do with comparing Apple to BMW. Apple is not a "luxury" brand or "high-end" brand. They're a commodity brand, same as Sony, Motorola, HTC, Samsung, etc...

And frankly, your reason (heads down, eyes on their iPhone) can easily be applied to about every god damn phone out there. People everywhere these days are heads down, eyes on their cellphone, be it an Android, Windows Phone, iPhone, dumb feature phone running Bada or a Symbian stack or J2ME or whatever else. People these days just can't seem to let go.

unlinked said:

Are you from a universe where there is only one iPhone on sale? Here they sell a variety of iPhones which a variable amount of storage.

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They sell 3 different types of iPhones in 2 different colors with 3 different storage capacities. Hardly called a variety. I'm pretty sure once the 5 comes out they will drop the 3GS.

Variety I would like to see it different screen sizes. Maybe I want my iPhone with a slide out keyboard. Maybe a notification light. More colors not just black or white. Stuff like that. But we follow apple like they are god and their rein at the top is coming to an end. Can't stay on top forever


James

numlock said:

2) so apple is "losing" sales because its too expensive? i go to apples website and i can get a 3gs for $0 and a 4 for $99. it may help you feel better to use this analogy but i dont find it that relevant where the price difference at most is a few hundred dollars.

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What you've cited the prices on USA carrier post paid contract sales where Apple utterly destroys the competition as we all know. A quick Google search tells me, the average selling prices for the smartphones worldwide somewhere the $200-$300, which means there are a ton of smartphones sold worldwide that cost only $100-200. Even 3GS is (or at least has been) too expensive for that.

It's been said before but the majority of Android smartphone sales are not Galaxy S, HTC One X, etc. Even HTC, probably the Android vendor with the highest average selling price, averaged a selling price that's below the 3GS' $400 off contract priced. The phone market world wide is massive and most of them aren't as lucrative as the USA's in terms of unit price, with few possible exceptions such as Japan and Korea.

matrix07 said:

That's where I think you're confused. This specific version doesn't outsell iPhone. It might be outsell iPhone 4S at specific time but it doesn't outsell iPhone 4S. People should read the news more carefully.

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Obviously by outsell I mean number of units sold right now, not total. I never meant to say it sold more in one month than the 4S in almost one year. That would be downright insane.

The achievement is still big since I don't recall any Android phone being the top selling smartphone and surpassing the iPhone (in sales rate, not total number).

It's also worth noting that it had 9 million preorders, while the iPhone 4S had 4 million preorders at the time of its launch.

pgiguere1 said:

It's also worth noting that it had 9 million preorders, while the iPhone 4S had 4 million preorders at the time of its launch.

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No, the 4 million figure of iPhone 4S was a direct sales number to the consumers. The 9 million "preorder" of Galaxy S3 were the orders by the carriers and retailers worldwide prior to the launch of the phone, which is actually very clear in the original Korean articles.

ChazUK said:

Consumers must be buying these handsets or retailers wouldn't be buying them in increasing quantities from Samsung.

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Indeed.

Moreover, Apple is not immune to the situation where a company ships more than is bought by end users during a certain time period.

A prime example was brought up by Tim Cook in the last earnings call. There was a question about why sales were so down this quarter, and he admitted that in the first quarter of the year, they had sold so many iPhones to world retailers that "it increased sell in over sell through by 2.6 million units."

In other words, an extra 2.6 million iPhones were sold to retailers that didn't sell through to end users until this quarter. They sat on shelves for a while.

So, no they did not sell 35 million iPhones in the first quarter to end users... they sold about 32 million. And while they only sold 26 million to stores this quarter, about ~30 million got sold to end users.

Thus the quarter-to-quarter drop was not nearly as bad as it first seemed. On the flipside, the first quarter's end user sales weren't as big as people thought, either.

So whenever people talk about "millions of phones sitting on shelves", they should also keep Apple's history in mind.