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New eMacs

thatwendigo said:
*slaps his forehead*

Wow.

You know, if you at all paid attention to what I was saying, then it would be obvious that the premium factors would have to be dead for pricing to drop like that. Let me try this again... The reason, the big reason for macs to cost as much as they do, is that Apple is using multiple parts and designs that are not commodity-oriented and must be produced in short runs that cost more per-unit than a comparable-performing machine on the other side of the fence. This is because manufacturing is set up in a such a way that larger numbers mean cheaper per-unit overhead, along with bulk discounts on materials, and other factors. As long as there is a hardware standard that sets Apple apart from the x86 OEMs (PowerPC, related ASICs and support systems, and so on), there will be a price difference.
Click to expand...


Ok, and somehow over the past 3 years computer prices (and related components) have decreased by about 40%...while Apples pricing has remained much the same, except for in a few cases (powerbooks, ibooks, and emacs have dropped significantly like 20%).

So why is apple charging so much more?

So I am hoping for the next few revisions we see price drops or significant increases in specs and standard configurations.
 
jade said:
So why is apple charging so much more?
Click to expand...

very simple. because they can.

they charge more but still turn profit - so their business is not tanking.

if you think apple's too expensive and there are other equivalent alternatives that are cheaper, you should pursue those alternatives. but many people find those cheaper alternatives not to be equivalent... if those cheaper alternatives aren't equivalent, well, then there must be something of value in Macs that aren't in those equivalents.

if you see something as more valuable, then you shouldn't complain when those things are more expensive... no?
 
jade said:
So why is apple charging so much more?

So I am hoping for the next few revisions we see price drops or significant increases in specs and standard configurations.
Click to expand...

Here's a lovely example for those of you who like to harp about Apple's pricing. You want to complain, well here you go:

I give you the independent, commodity-built PowerPC tower:Pegasos II/PPC

Nexus Vivid Blue case w/ 330W psu (Screwless design for easy future modifications)
Pegasos II Mainboard and Motorola G4 Processor @ 1Ghz
ATI Radeon 9200 8x 128MB Graphics card
40GB Hard Disk Drive
256MB (DDR400) PC3200 RAM
Standard Keyboard and Mouse
Standard CDRW drive

Cost: $1,495

Apple overpriced? For about $300 more, you get a G5 at higher clock, more drive on SATA, a roughly equivalent graphics card, and all the benefits of Apple's components being integrated and not using Linux drivers.

Booya.
 
ThomasJefferson said:
I never would have guessed that a new eMac would generate over 500 posts. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

speaks volume about the lack of updates in other hardware, eh? ;)
 
jxyama said:
speaks volume about the lack of updates in other hardware, eh? ;)
Click to expand...

That probably accounts for about half the excitement. The other part of the excitement seems to be from people who own or have owned, or who work with or have worked with eMacs.

Then of course there are the people are offended that the new eMac has some better specs than most PowerBooks and all iMacs. Really the eMac and iMac should only be differentiated by their respective integrated monitors, and PowerBooks as portables aren't comparable (as has been noted by others). People who wish the eMac to be dumbed down compared to iMacs and PowerBooks are snobs. They are the kind of people who contribute the the stereotype of Mac users as elitist brats.
 
You Started It!

Griffindor73 said:
The thing that I want to know is this:

I work in education- I have looked at the eMac prices and I can get the basic eMac for £515.

Thats good price, thought I!

Then I looked at the US store ed price.

Then I converted it.

£419.

Why does the eMac cost an extra £96 here????

Or, why is everything so cheap in the US!- You lucky buggers! :)
Click to expand...

Simple. In 1812, British forces burned the White House. We don't forget such things. :)
 
iMacs

I think that the iMacs are starting to be a ripoff compared to the eMac..

The way I look at it, you can get a $1799 iMac or you can get a $999 eMac. The only difference: The eMac comes with a better video card. the iMacs have more vRam though but that doesn't matter.. If I ever get a desktop I'm going to think about getting an eMac unless iMacs become camparable in price & quality.
 
Picky

Rod Rod said:
I wish the new eMacs can help teachers instruct students about the difference between "to" and "too" so we don't have to read its misuse ten times from the same person in the same thread. This is almost as bad as all the people misusing the word "obsolete" when they really mean to say "superseded."

I apologize if this sounds less than polite, but I only mean this comment to be useful. All the concern about the "education market" brought to my mind the irony in the posts concerning basic education.
Click to expand...



If you were to judge literacy levels based on forum posts, you would get a pretty grim picture. Nevertheless, you should remember that for many people posting here, English is NOT their first language (as is my case).

Anyway, while diverging from the thread to the topic of basic education, I would point out that your own post contains a basic grammatical error.

Back on the emac track, I have to agree with those who think that the emac is underpowered in the vram department. For it's intended education market it is probably enough in the short term, but many schools aren't loaded with spare cash to upgrade every couple of years.In my experience schools often have to hang on to their machines for a loooooong time.

Secondly I believe Apple is missing out a whole market of people who love OSX but can't afford premium prices. I'm a "prosumer" but also like to game from time to time. When I do, I want to be able to play games that have been released at around the same time my mac was bought. The flimsy 32 meg doesn't really cut the mustard. The rest of the new emac's specs are all more than enough for my needs. Shame.
 
eMac drive & availability

I got a confident-sounding answer that the new eMac has a 7200rpm disk drive when I called the Apple Store here a few minutes ago. And they don't have the SuperDrive model yet.
 
emac

i have a new emac its pretty nice and i have 10.3.3 its all good but at 1ghz its not fast enough for me i also have 640mb ram but its to damn slow. i need a $28 000 g5 now tha would be nice :mad: but hey its a mac still beetter then any pc **** that is out there. agree?
 
I love it!

This is great!
Great for people that want to save money and great for schools!
Great because this is the kind of unit that APPLE needs more of, to go up against the low cost DELLS etc.

I also love it, when this kind of upgrade pisses off the wannabes that have bought PB's so recently.
That is one of the best parts of the whole upgrade.
Imagine the guy that is so angry at APPLE for releasing a new eMac.
What a completely slow witted, self indulgent person.

Why di I call this person so uhh S L O W?
Here is why:
A: He knows about this site and can read, yet knows nothing about the soon to come upgrades. LOL
B: He feels cheated because he was allowed to use his freedom of choice to buy early, as if he was forced to decide to buy now. Everyone here knows that when you decide to buy a MAC, you hold back the sour grapes and enjoy your MAC. <snicker>
C: The insanely funny comparison between a eMac and a PowerBook! LOL
E: Imagine the EGO of the person that becomes so offended by a update that benefits SO many people and our favorite company, itself.

This is the kind of EGO that can only slow and retard a person till the blood rushes to the next part of their body that is equally intelligent.

Oh was that too much?

But best of all, it means MORE updates coming up to our other favorites including PowerBooks.
Which in turn will render all the older PowerBooks, so last year.,

Making these people even MORE pissed.
Its a cycle thats filled with laughs. :D
 
Griffindor73 said:
The thing that I want to know is this:

I work in education- I have looked at the eMac prices and I can get the basic eMac for £515.

Thats good price, thought I!

Then I looked at the US store ed price.

Then I converted it.

£419.

Why does the eMac cost an extra £96 here????

Or, why is everything so cheap in the US!- You lucky buggers! :)
Click to expand...


Why Apple prices are different around the world

1. Exchange rates

Prices on Apple stores (generally) take a fixed RATE over a qtr or pricing period.
OK normally customer looses, but on occasions Apple loses.
Note - the Euro helps France and germany have the same pricing (Not the case in the past)
Can be extreme when prices are not updated for a long period as in OZ over the last year

2. Shipping Costs
Sea normally
But some times by air to meet launch dates etc

** Any import duty (Items not from the EU
UK
(Items not from the EU - not from Cork)
Import Duty is usually percentage based. It averages at between about 5% and 9% - but with extremes in some cases between nil and 85%.

3. Terms and conditions

In the US

Once you complete your order - sales TAX is added
Apple Store purchases will include sales tax based on the ship-to location and the sales tax rate in effect at the time of shipping.

Ground Shipping: This option is available on all orders over $50.00 for no additional charge
Two-Day Delivery: For an additional charge
Overnight Delivery: For an additional charge

UK
Prices are inclusive of 17.5% VAT (TAX) but exclusive of delivery charges


OZ
Prices are inclusive of delivery and 10% GST (TAX)

Fr.
Les prix indiqués s'entendent toutes taxes comprises (19,6%) et hors frais de port

Sw.
Priset inkluderar 25 % moms men är exklusive leveranskostnader

4. Localization - software, keyboards etc


5. Other factors - cost of local sales force, distributer cost, storage cost, reseller margins, cost of advertising etc
All depend on the country.


:(
 
BlueMountain said:
Why Apple prices are different around the world

1. Exchange rates

Prices on Apple stores (generally) take a fixed RATE over a qtr or pricing period.
OK normally customer looses, but on occasions Apple loses.
Note - the Euro helps France and germany have the same pricing (Not the case in the past)
Can be extreme when prices are not updated for a long period as in OZ over the last year

2. Shipping Costs
Sea normally
But some times by air to meet launch dates etc

** Any import duty (Items not from the EU
UK
(Items not from the EU - not from Cork)
Import Duty is usually percentage based. It averages at between about 5% and 9% - but with extremes in some cases between nil and 85%.

3. Terms and conditions

In the US

Once you complete your order - sales TAX is added
Apple Store purchases will include sales tax based on the ship-to location and the sales tax rate in effect at the time of shipping.

Ground Shipping: This option is available on all orders over $50.00 for no additional charge
Two-Day Delivery: For an additional charge
Overnight Delivery: For an additional charge

UK
Prices are inclusive of 17.5% VAT (TAX) but exclusive of delivery charges


OZ
Prices are inclusive of delivery and 10% GST (TAX)

Fr.
Les prix indiqués s'entendent toutes taxes comprises (19,6%) et hors frais de port

Sw.
Priset inkluderar 25 % moms men är exklusive leveranskostnader

4. Localization - software, keyboards etc


5. Other factors - cost of local sales force, distributer cost, storage cost, reseller margins, cost of advertising etc
All depend on the country.


:(
Click to expand...

Thanks for the great explanation.

I understand the frustration from people in other countries. In this age of the internet it all too easy to see what everyone is paying. Some of it makes no sense.

In the end no manufacture i believe truly wants to limit their sales by artificially high prices in one country than another. Unless of course there is a need to stretch limited inventory to other countries where the demand is stronger.
 
BlueMountain said:
** Any import duty (Items not from the EU
UK
(Items not from the EU - not from Cork)
Import Duty is usually percentage based. It averages at between about 5% and 9% - but with extremes in some cases between nil and 85%.
Click to expand...

there is _no_ EU import tax/duty/customs tarif for desktops,laptops or server ..

yes the import tax is between 3%-9% for some products if there is a import tarif tax at all.... sure some have higher ones but those are sometimes anti-price-dumping tarifs... and those apply to listed companies

i just wanted to add that for the price discussion... you know the myth of a EU-computer-import tarif just won't die....
 
takao said:
there is _no_ EU import tax/duty/customs tarif for desktops,laptops or server ..

yes the import tax is between 3%-9% for some products if there is a import tarif tax at all.... sure some have higher ones but those are sometimes anti-price-dumping tarifs... and those apply to listed companies

i just wanted to add that for the price discussion... you know the myth of a EU-computer-import tarif just won't die....
Click to expand...



Yes, 0% EU-computer-import tarif. I think I'm a few years out of date. I left the UK for Australia over 5 years ago.

So computers are cheeper in Euro.

:)
 
thatwendigo said:
Here's a lovely example for those of you who like to harp about Apple's pricing. You want to complain, well here you go:

I give you the independent, commodity-built PowerPC tower:Pegasos II/PPC

Nexus Vivid Blue case w/ 330W psu (Screwless design for easy future modifications)
Pegasos II Mainboard and Motorola G4 Processor @ 1Ghz
ATI Radeon 9200 8x 128MB Graphics card
40GB Hard Disk Drive
256MB (DDR400) PC3200 RAM
Standard Keyboard and Mouse
Standard CDRW drive

Cost: $1,495

Apple overpriced? For about $300 more, you get a G5 at higher clock, more drive on SATA, a roughly equivalent graphics card, and all the benefits of Apple's components being integrated and not using Linux drivers.

Booya.
Click to expand...

But for $620 (the cost of the motherboard) you could take an old PC and make it into a G4. That would be a decent deal if you have an old ATX form factor PC laying around.
Also, according to what I have read about Mac on Linux the Apple OS runs native on the Pegasos board.
I had actually thought about assembling a Pegasos based G4 (I had some of the parts so I could have done it for under $800. But the new faster eMac makes it pointless IMHO. Also, it started a whole arguement about the Apple EULA which uses the term "Apple labeled", but I want do not want to go into that again.
 
pjkelnhofer said:
But for $620 (the cost of the motherboard) you could take an old PC and make it into a G4. That would be a decent deal if you have an old ATX form factor PC laying around.
Click to expand...

Actually, it's $775, according to ultraspec, which sells them here in the US.

For $775, I can buy all of the following (by flavor):

AMD-fans get...
ASUS SK8V
-PC3200 RAM (4 slots)
-3 UltraDMA (6 devices)
-AGP 8x
-PCI (5 slots)
-1 "Wi-Fi"
-2x PS 2, 1x LPT, 1x COM, SPDIF out, 8x USB2.0, 2x FireWire
-10/100/1000 Ethernet
-2x SATA RAID 0/1 and 2x
AMD Athlon 64 3000+
-2ghz core clock
-Hypertransport as "FSB"
-512k L2
ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB 8x
Crucial 512MB PC3200

Cost: $756

Intel-fans get...
ASUS P4C800-E Deluxe
-PC3200 RAM (4 slots)
-2x UltraDMA 100, 1x UltraDMA 133 (6 devices)
-AGP 8x
-PCI (5 slots)
-1 "Wi-Fi"
-2x PS 2, 1x LPT, 1x COM, SPDIF out, 8x USB2.0, 2x FireWire
-10/100/1000 Ethernet
-2x SATA RAID 0/1 and 2x SATA 0/1/0+1/"Multiple RAID"
Intel Pentium4 3.0ghz
-3ghz core clock
-800mhz FSB
-512k L2
ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB 8x
Crucial 512MB PC3200

Cost: $754

Unless you REALLY want to run OS X on some old ATX case, it's not worth it.

Also, according to what I have read about Mac on Linux the Apple OS runs native on the Pegasos board..
Click to expand...

From the MoL FAQ:
Q: Does MOL run on non-Apple hardware?
A: It does. MOL runs for instance on the Pegasos board, the Teron board and on AmigaOne hardware. In short, MOL should run on any PowerPC hardware (with the except of 601-based systems). However, the EULA of MacOS prohibits its usage on non-Apple hardware (it is of course perfectly legal to use MOL to boot a second Linux though).
 
thatwendigo said:
Actually, it's $775, according to ultraspec, which sells them here in the US.

...

Unless you REALLY want to run OS X on some old ATX case, it's not worth it.
Click to expand...

This is interesting. It is only listed at $620 on the Pegasos website. It was worth it when the eMac was only 800 MHz with a combo-drive and I had everything else I need already (case, HD, DVD+/-RW, monitor). I agree though. Now it is not worth it.

The fact that many people miss is PPC chips just cost more because there are fewer of them being used. An ATX style motherboard with 1 GHz G4 on it costs more than one with the fastest Intel and AMD chips would. The high cost of Macs is not solely Apple trying to screw us ;)
 
pjkelnhofer said:
This is interesting. It is only listed at $620 on the Pegasos website. It was worth it when the eMac was only 800 MHz with a combo-drive and I had everything else I need already (case, HD, DVD+/-RW, monitor). I agree though. Now it is not worth it.
Click to expand...

That's probably what Pegasos charges their distibutors, who then markup to cover their own margins. Now, because of Apple's revisions in the eMacs, I have to agree... There just isn't any reason to buy a Pegasos board, not even if you're using Linux on PPC. A G5 doens't cost much more, which I've pointed out on certain threads around here.

The fact that many people miss is PPC chips just cost more because there are fewer of them being used. An ATX style motherboard with 1 GHz G4 on it costs more than one with the fastest Intel and AMD chips would. The high cost of Macs is not solely Apple trying to screw us ;)
Click to expand...

Oh believe me, you're preaching to the choir. I've been trying to convey that particular point for some time now.
 
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