11.6-Inch 'MacBook' Headed to Manufacturing?

[iMacmatician]

It will be interesting to see what processor Apple uses. If Apple were to produce an 11.6" notebook/netbook, they could use the new Zacate APU from AMD. The Zacate APU is designed for netbooks and its performance compares favorably with the Intel i5-520M, even performing better than the latter in some cases, and only draws around 18W.

It'll also most likely be significantly cheaper than Core ix's, especially the LV/ULV ones.

The CPU performance of Zacate is surprisingly decent but as the article shows, the big thing in Zacate is the GPU. Llano goes down to (I think) 20 W, so that's always another option but if Apple is targeting low prices with this 11.6" MacBook, it might make more sense to use Zacate.

 

[Matrixfan]

The concept of the Air is great: full featured keyboard and display with reduced weight. When speaking of portability weight and thickness matter the most. I don't see any benefit in reducing the screen size lower than A4 paper sheet. My eyesight is perfect, but 11.6 is the minimum for me to do some actual work on. Even a 15" Air would be just as portable. Thickness saves space in a case but size is almost indifferent.

 

[iMacmatician]

I would definitely be interested, but the question is: will it support 4+ GB of RAM so I can still run Win 7 and MS Office under VMware Fusion? This will be the deciding factor.

I'm not sure…the current MacBook only has 2 GB. The cheaper it is, the less likely it will have 4 GB but that also depends on the pricing of the other components.

I think the RAM may be non-removable, like with the MBA.

 

[TSE]

I really really really want Apple to keep the same MacBook Air build quality, but perhaps stick in one of the new AMD ultramobile APUs that is expected to come out in Q1 2011... They are supposedly REALLY well rounded.

 

[deconstruct60]

I really really really want Apple to keep the same MacBook Air build quality, but perhaps stick in one of the new AMD ultramobile APUs that is expected to come out in Q1 2011... They are supposedly REALLY well rounded.

Go back to post 81. The Zacate chips are suppose to come out in Q4 2010. Not bleeding edge app crunching units, but sufficient for a ultramobile notebook. Also cheaper so Apple could perhaps standardize on Flash storage ( skip 2.5" drives and go with flat SSD sticks. ) without dramatically increasing the price.

The more mainstream AMD CPU+GPU combo aren't due till later Q1-Q2 2011. If going to wait that long, then perhaps can wait for Intel's update with some flavor of Sandy Bridge. That gets more murky. If these models to going to launch before 2011 then neight of those two options is a good fit.

 

[deconstruct60]

The concept of the Air is great: full featured keyboard and display with reduced weight. When speaking of portability weight and thickness matter the most.

it isn't thickness; it is volume that is the problem. It isn't one or two dimensions that come into play when carrying something. All three + weight play a factor.

Even a 15" Air would be just as portable. Thickness saves space in a case but size is almost indifferent.

A 15" Air would not likely pass the " airline tray table with seat partially reclined" test.

The 13" MBA/MBP screens aren't that much taller than the old 12" screens because the aspect ratio is wider for the new 16:9 screens than was for 4:3 ones. Going to 15" would make a significant difference.

 

[deconstruct60]

I would definitely be interested, but the question is: will it support 4+ GB of RAM .

If Apple sticks with some design approach then doubtful. The mounted the RAM directly onto the motherboard in previous versions to save height. With no angle so save horizontal space the RAM consumes a relatively large chunk of the motherboard. More than 4GB means more surface area then covered before ( or radically increasing the prices..... which Apple is unlikely to do).

It should be possible to double the capacity of the same size chips Apple used in pervious versions at the old cost. So MBA would move from 2GB to 4GB. Going over that is probably a no-go though. Not sure what trying to put into Window VM but do not necessarily need more than 2GB for an "average" windows machine. That leaves 2GB for the Mac side. It is an ultramobile oriented laptop .... what do you want? If primarily looking for horsepower get a MBP.

 

[MrWillie]

I'm praying this is already a new MacBook (not Air). I know it's unlikely, but it'd be awesome if it were true. My ex just bought a MB and I would love for it to be "old technology" already

Do like I did, make her old technology. I replaced mine with a thinner, sexier, classier model.

I am due a laptop upgrade at the office. I need two USB ports, I would love an Air with two USBs.

 

[TSE]

Go back to post 81. The Zacate chips are suppose to come out in Q4 2010. Not bleeding edge app crunching units, but sufficient for a ultramobile notebook. Also cheaper so Apple could perhaps standardize on Flash storage ( skip 2.5" drives and go with flat SSD sticks. ) without dramatically increasing the price.

The more mainstream AMD CPU+GPU combo aren't due till later Q1-Q2 2011. If going to wait that long, then perhaps can wait for Intel's update with some flavor of Sandy Bridge. That gets more murky. If these models to going to launch before 2011 then neight of those two options is a good fit.

I personally think, from what I've researched, is the Q4 2010 AMD chips coming out aren't entirely worth it for being a premium notebook, but the Q1 2011 ones coming out from AMD are the ones worth waiting for.

If the specs are something like:

-AMD APU
-4 GBs of RAM
-128 GB SSD (256 GB SSD option)
-11" 1280x800 screen
-Full-sized, backlit keyboard
-1 USB, 1 Headphone/Mic combo, Mini Display port, SD card slot
-6+ hours realistic battery life
-$1299-$1499

 

[Eidorian]

I personally think, from what I've researched, is the Q4 2010 AMD chips coming out aren't entirely worth it for being a premium notebook, but the Q1 2011 ones coming out from AMD are the ones worth waiting for.

If the specs are something like:

-AMD APU
-4 GBs of RAM
-128 GB SSD (256 GB SSD option)
-11" 1280x800 screen
-Full-sized, backlit keyboard
-1 USB, 1 Headphone/Mic combo, Mini Display port, SD card slot
-6+ hours realistic battery life
-$1299-$1499

Only Apple would be able to sell a Zacate based machine at that price.

The waters are still murky for the remaining AMD Fusion line up. Zacate is aiming for thin and light but you're talking about a sub-$600 market.

The IGP performance is impressive for such a part but even Llano doesn't look that impressive with a shrunk Athlon II core. AMD has to have something else out besides a die shrink and an Atom competitor.

 

[MinorBidoh]

Just not in poly white, please apple. That's all I ask for.

 

[deconstruct60]

11" seems like a nice little niche for MBA to occupy.

Yes. Definitely, it needs a bigger differentiation from the MBP 13" .

4GB of RAM isn't bad, especially if they consolidate it as one 4GB module, for space consideration.

To save vertical space Apple has mounted the RAM directly the board. This is a tradeoff in increased horizontal space. ( depth and width). I suspect they will make same trade-off this time. It has been a couple of years so it is possible to put 4GB in at same cost of 2GB from 2-3 years ago now.

SSD also makes sense, for space considerations.

A SSD drive in the generic sense. If really trying to conseve space/volume though should dump the 2.5" drive case. Just go with Flash memory sticks. They are smaller in volume. All the "crack the case and stick in a faster drive" folks will moan, but that's one way to pack just as much into a smaller case.

Battery capacity depends on available volume, but the more complex, the more expensive.

As pointed out above. Throw out the standard 2.5" drive case. There is no need to scrafice battery volume. They can get rid of the cheesey point at the end of the MBA too. Make the whole thing uniform height.

i7 is likely far too hot and power hungry for such a thin, compactly packaged machine.

There are 18W i7's that exist now. However, if going to make SSD standard then need to shave cost out of the component costs so don't have price creep. The AMD option would be cheaper and come in performance around a regular i5 ( not the underclocked ones). That isn't bad. The notion that folks put out that MBA is suppose to be some sort of speed deamon in an even smaller containter than the MBP is strange.

 

[sushi]

Ugh, I really hope they don't though, for the sake of us devs. Testing a 4-way universal binary would be a major pain (not like it's not a pain already).

Wow. Never thought of it that way.

I remember the days of simply transitioning to 32 bit clean apps (System 7 era) and maintaining two versions.

I think the RAM may be non-removable, like with the MBA.

I think that this will become more the norm in the future as laptops shrink in size.

If the specs are something like:

-AMD APU

AMD. That's almost blasphemous. Ha ha!

But you might be on to something there.

A SSD drive in the generic sense. If really trying to conseve space/volume though should dump the 2.5" drive case. Just go with Flash memory sticks. They are smaller in volume. All the "crack the case and stick in a faster drive" folks will moan, but that's one way to pack just as much into a smaller case.

The issue with this, is how do you interface with the HD space. USB is slow. Current PATA and SATA interface are the norm. So until a new standard is developed, I don't see this happening.

 

[deconstruct60]

a premium notebook,

Don't see why because the article referenced says they are as fast as current i5's which are in premium notebooks now. It would still be competitive and if going to put SSD/Flash storage in by default you are going to have something with premium pricing. Flash storage is 2x-3x more expensive than disk storage. If going to put a much more expensive component into the standard system then going to need some other components to drop in price. The CPU ( along with display) is a major price component have some flexibility one. If go with Intel (would puts a price premium on their utra low i-series offerings) then price would have to go up.

If the Zacate part turns in better numbers than the old MBA SL9400/SL9600 parts that is all it has to do. The new MBA will be faster than the old MBA. Alot of hand-wringing in this forum is about the 'woulda coulda shoulda' MBA being faster than the 'woulda-coulda-shoulda' old MBA. That is twisted. It just should be incrementally faster than the old one.

If the specs are something like:

-AMD APU
-4 GBs of RAM
-128 GB SSD (256 GB SSD option)

At the price points quoted below probably closer to 60-90Gb Flash storage at low end and 128GB on the higher end.

-11" 1280x800 screen

11.6" inch. 11" screen is too small for full sized keyboard to match up with. Given that they also need to cover an huge trackpad with the "top half" lid, that is all the more true.

-Full-sized, backlit keyboard
-1 USB, 1 Headphone/Mic combo, Mini Display port, SD card slot

Not so sure about SD card slot. Again internal volume at premium if chopping down on internal space. However, if get rid of the gimmick taper toward the front and go back to 3D rectangle the design can probably squeeze it in.

-6+ hours realistic battery life

if go with the Zacate option then this likely would be 10+ hours of battery life. If this is a ultramobile device how come it can't last as long on battery as a MBP 13". That's kind of goofy. The MBA should be able to last at least a long. Otherwise you have to carry a power cord and where is your wieght savings then ???? If working an 8-9 hour day the laptop should last at least that long. Smaller screen and a endurance oriented CPU will do that.

There wil be $500-600 Zacate systems but how many with SSD , non low end screens ( 11.6" IPS panels ... not likely ), and other higher end components. The total price of all of the components drive the system cost.

-$1299-$1499

Close to MBP 13" entry point only makes sense if they are differentiated on more that one or two points. CPU is another option. The other AMD options don't make as much sense once start saying that higher end CPU horsepower is "necessary". At that point, the Intel options start to looking better if willing to wait till later into next year to get next generation parts.

The problem is that the MBA is overdue now. If the new MBA comes in at $1299 that is a $200 price drop from where it is now. Apple is not going to release something closer in cost to the entry MBP 13" that is way faster than it. That doesn't make sense. The MBA needs a way to move down in cost but stay out of the cannibalizing the MBP 13".

 

[deconstruct60]

The issue with this, is how do you interface with the HD space. USB is slow. Current PATA and SATA interface are the norm. So until a new standard is developed, I don't see this happening.

Don't tell Sony because some of their utltramobiles have already done this. (http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/05/sony-vaio-z-with-quad-ssd-stripped-down-and-explained-by-its-pro/)

It is the box itself that is the volume problem. SSD components inside of those boxes don't need all of that space. In one solution you just remove the box and keep the same guts. It is similar to the solution apple had for taking the battery out of the plastic box it was in.

Besides there already are standards.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI_Express#Mini_PCIe_SSD_connector

http://www.stec-inc.com/product/umssd.php

And those that use standard interfaces (DIMM ).

http://sun.systemnews.com/articles/133/4/FOSS/21536
http://www.oracle.com/us/products/servers-storage/storage/disk-storage/043963.html

 

[firewood]

The concept of the Air is great: full featured keyboard and display with reduced weight. When speaking of portability weight and thickness matter the most. I don't see any benefit in reducing the screen size lower than A4 paper sheet.

Screen size matters quite a bit if you are trying to fit something inside a typical size woman's purse or handbag.

 

[TSE]

Don't see why because the article referenced says they are as fast as current i5's which are in premium notebooks now. It would still be competitive and if going to put SSD/Flash storage in by default you are going to have something with premium pricing. Flash storage is 2x-3x more expensive than disk storage. If going to put a much more expensive component into the standard system then going to need some other components to drop in price. The CPU ( along with display) is a major price component have some flexibility one. If go with Intel (would puts a price premium on their utra low i-series offerings) then price would have to go up.

If the Zacate part turns in better numbers than the old MBA SL9400/SL9600 parts that is all it has to do. The new MBA will be faster than the old MBA. Alot of hand-wringing in this forum is about the 'woulda coulda shoulda' MBA being faster than the 'woulda-coulda-shoulda' old MBA. That is twisted. It just should be incrementally faster than the old one.



11.6" inch. 11" screen is too small for full sized keyboard to match up with. Given that they also need to cover an huge trackpad with the "top half" lid, that is all the more true.




Not so sure about SD card slot. Again internal volume at premium if chopping down on internal space. However, if get rid of the gimmick taper toward the front and go back to 3D rectangle the design can probably squeeze it in.






if go with the Zacate option then this likely would be 10+ hours of battery life. If this is a ultramobile device how come it can't last as long on battery as a MBP 13". That's kind of goofy. The MBA should be able to last at least a long. Otherwise you have to carry a power cord and where is your wieght savings then ???? If working an 8-9 hour day the laptop should last at least that long. Smaller screen and a endurance oriented CPU will do that.

There wil be $500-600 Zacate systems but how many with SSD , non low end screens ( 11.6" IPS panels ... not likely ), and other higher end components. The total price of all of the components drive the system cost.








Close to MBP 13" entry point only makes sense if they are differentiated on more that one or two points. CPU is another option. The other AMD options don't make as much sense once start saying that higher end CPU horsepower is "necessary". At that point, the Intel options start to looking better if willing to wait till later into next year to get next generation parts.

The problem is that the MBA is overdue now. If the new MBA comes in at $1299 that is a $200 price drop from where it is now. Apple is not going to release something closer in cost to the entry MBP 13" that is way faster than it. That doesn't make sense. The MBA needs a way to move down in cost but stay out of the cannibalizing the MBP 13".

The Zacate is not and I repeat this, NOT as fast as a Core 2 Duo or Core i5 MacBook Pro.

It is FASTER as it in some processes that benefit from the GPU + CPU combo, but in a pure CPU sense, the Zacate will most likely fall behind...

One of the features of the new Zacate APU is that it will be able to really really really underclock both the GPU and CPU to increase battery life depending on how demanding you are using it... Intel has done this with it's ULV processors but I think that AMD is trying to do it to a maximum degree with this processor, similar to the old AMD Geode processor that ran from 366mhz to 1800mhz or something like that.

This is educated speculation/research on my part.

 

[0186279]

If this is cheaper than the current MacBook then I will be very interested. I'm looking into getting a new computer soon and this may be exactly what I need.

Theres no way. It'll be cheaper than the Pro's but more costly than the MB's. The Air's right now are as much as the Pro's.

i would consider getting one of these if:
1. 10+ battery
2. decent CPU (NO ARM PLEASE - i dont want iOS)
3. +4GB RAM supported.
4. <$1500 price tag.

i think thats reasonable to ask.

Likewise, sounds perfect to me.

 

[Wild-Bill]

I'd love to replace my Rev. C Macbook Air with an updated one, provided it's got the "rumored" backlit IPS display, and the price is reasonable.

If Apple meets those two requirements I'm in like Flynn.

 

[finnns2000]

This would be a great replacement for my aging MB, if it comes with a little power packed in.

 

[bigpics]

If this is cheaper than the current MacBook then I will be very interested. I'm looking into getting a new computer soon and this may be exactly what I need.

If a MacBook and not an MBA or MBP, I think the base config would have to be $799 to really fly off shelves (and have the same memory and close to the same processor speeds of the 13"). $899 would leave most potential customers opting for the 13, and it'd serve a devoted niche, but not really be a mass market item.

Also, Apple's historically slow to increase the number of SKU's in any of their lines - and part of their consumer success lies, I believe, in a) that their product line is (while adding new device categories) clear and coherent within each device category, and b) the prices are close to the same thru all channels. While other companies flail about and release confusing new slight variations on products with names like "5710D" every few months, and different configs thru different retail channels, i.e., it's almost impossible to compare prices because each chain has slightly differently specced products.

An 11.6" MacBook would therefore be a significant introduction. So my guess would be that any such Mac portable is more likely to a be new MBAir.

But whadda I know? I'm typing this on my beloved six year old 12" iBook (which, alas is finally aging a bit).

 

[The.316]

As long as its not C2D, I would seriously consider this.

 

[DoFoT9]

I would find this product extremely interesting if it ran an A4 and had a keyboard. But I mean if they are calling it a Macbook, it is unlikely to be an A4 or any ARM processor.

you'd think so, right? just the same way as apple went from PPC (powerbook) to intel (mac book/pro) - i would like to see the same thing with an ARM based mobile/desktop CPU computer.

You should realise that ARM doesn't mean iOS. Apple would have no problem at all to recompile MacOS X for ARM and ship an ARM based MacOS X with full MacOS X on it. The apps that I create run on PowerPC, Intel x86 and Intel x86-64; adding ARM to it would be no problem at all (and ARM is more compatible with Intel than with PowerPC anyway). And with ARM the ten hours with a small (light weight) battery wouldn't be a problem either. ARM would also help Apple keep the price down and stop it from cannibalising Intel MacBook sales.

sorry, i worded it wrong. at this point in time, i dont want an ARM based CPU OR a computer based iOS. the MBA needs to come out NOW. i dont believe the ARM to be developed far enough to be a powerful enough desktop machine.

And it will be iOS based.

dont break my heart

Likewise, sounds perfect to me.

yes specs of CPU etc dont matter to me, i just want enough RAM to multitask quite heavily (even VM use) - and a good batter life. thats it.

 

[Azathoth]

You should realise that ARM doesn't mean iOS. Apple would have no problem at all to recompile MacOS X for ARM and ship an ARM based MacOS X with full MacOS X on it.

I don't buy a computer to run an OS X - I buy it to run applications and they are not all going to be recompiled + tested. And then there is the gfx issue - Apple is having enough problems making the 330M work smoothly - unless you suggest they use the iPad gfx chip..?

 

[KnightWRX]

As long as its not C2D, I would seriously consider this.

If it's C2D to retain the nVidia IGP I would seriously consider this. If it has Core i3 with an Intel IGP count me out. The thing is, contrary to above poster, I understand that C2D and Core i3 aren't much different in terms of performance, only in marketing push and material, but nVidia IGPs and much better than Intel IGPs giving me way more bang for the buck.