13.3 inch rMBP in September

[driftless]

My guess, and it is just a guess, is that the low end 13" rMBP will come in at price close, to the current high end 13" cMBP. The 15" high end rMBP, without options, starts at $2,199.00. The low end 15" rMBP, without options, starts at $2,199.00. I think that it is clear that Apple is pushing folks to retina MBP's. I agree with the posters who suggest that the cMBP series is likely to disappear when retina MBP production hits full stride. That should make the differences between the MBP and the MBA series more stark.

 

[crossi81]

Hi guys I repeat what I wrote in other tread some days ago....
This is my opinion (and hope!) about cpus of new rMBP 13":

I hope the last benchmark that came out some weeks ago is referred to the "base model" and the top model has got a quad-codre i7 3612QM (2.1ghz, 35 W)
If we remember the first benchmark posted some months ago, about the 15" rMBP, the result showed us i i7 2.3ghz w/ 8gb ram, which was just the base model too.....
Considering that Apple usually sells two models and considering that i7 3520M is the highest clocked dual-core cpu available at the moment on the market, if these benchmark are referred to the base model, the only chance for apple to have a "top" model is to build it with a 3612QM, imho.

Damn.. then look at the Sony Vaio on this article:

http://www.mobiletechreview.com/notebooks/Sony-Vaio-Z-2012.htm

...and look which CPU option it gives (section: Performance and Horsepower)!! If Sony does it, why not Apple too??

Bye

Andrea

Yes, as you said, they CAN actually put a 35W quad core inside a 13'' rMBP BUT I think it will be difficult.

First, dGPU is a must and make no mistake here: there's no reason in the whole world they will be using an hd 4000 for WQXGA resolution. And the bare minimum that makes sense both power wise and performance wise is, as I said, the 640m LE which is 20W. Unless they are going to shock us all using AMD solutions (both cpu and gpu).

Remember: 13'' battery < 15'' battery. They can surely have a 45W (if not more since it is overclocked) 650m and 35W quad core, but I find it hard to believe it, battery will last far less than current rMBP.

If even the 13'' has the combo 650m+quad core, my speculation is that it will give up something like thinness or weight. But my guess is still a 25W i7 Dual Core. Of course it's MY guess, nothing else.

 

[lockerc18]

Price, specs guesstimate

From

http://www.applebitch.com/2012/08/2...ions-of-a-13-inch-retina-display-macbook-pro/

Here's a spreadsheet guess about pricing for the 13" rMBP

The price of the new 13 inch Retina MacBook Pro will lie somewhere between $1499 and $1599 for the base model (likely the higher price point). The higher end of that estimation stems from the fact that there is a $400 supplement for the 15 inch Retina Display model over the standard 15 inch model and if the same were applied to the non-Retina Display 13 inch MacBook Pro ($1199 base) then $1599 is the high figure. That said, the 15 inch non-Retina MacBook Pro is 50% higher in cost compared to the 13 inch non-Retina version, so if that were applied to the price of the 15 inch model, then the figure ends up being around $1499.

Who knows how accurate this is. YMMV.

 

[Stetrain]

From

http://www.applebitch.com/2012/08/2...ions-of-a-13-inch-retina-display-macbook-pro/

Here's a spreadsheet guess about pricing for the 13" rMBP
...

Who knows how accurate this is. YMMV.

I think that it depends on what they put in the 13" RMBP. The 15" non-Retina and Retina MBPs have exactly the same processor and GPU. Many are guessing that the 13" Retina would have a bit of a boost over the current 13" MBP's specs. That would drive the cost up a bit more proportionately.

 

[heisenberg123]

I think that it depends on what they put in the 13" RMBP. The 15" non-Retina and Retina MBPs have exactly the same processor and GPU. Many are guessing that the 13" Retina would have a bit of a boost over the current 13" MBP's specs. That would drive the cost up a bit more proportionately.

agreed a 13" rMBP with the same insides as the $2199 15" would cost about $1999, thats why I think it will have less power and be priced around $1799

 

[lockerc18]

agreed a 13" rMBP with the same insides as the $2199 15" would cost about $1999, thats why I think it will have less power and be priced around $1799

I don't know if the smaller form factor can support the same "insides". For instance, the battery would have to be smaller, but then again, it could be smaller because the screen is smaller, so a battery as large as the one in the 15" model isn't needed. That would reduce the manufacturing cost of the 13".

But, then again, manufacturing cost of a system isn't directly related to the sales price, either, since it's the marketeers who decide what the price point should be.

But... in thinking about this, if you ignore the actual piece part manufacturing cost of these systems (I know, this is factored into the sales price, but bear with me here), then ultimate sales prices for the systems are really dependent on where the consumer tolerance levels are from the marketing perspective.

Look at the 13 inch classic MBP. The base model is priced at $1199, and the high-end model is $1499. Oddly enough, these are the exact same prices as the same models of the 13 inch MBA.

But, when the 15 inch cMBP (at $1799 and $2199) is compared to the Retina MBP (at $2199 and $2799), that's an 18 percent and 21 percent difference respectively. If you assume the same proportionality here and apply those percentages to the 13 inch classic MBP pricing, to approximate what a 13 inch Retina MBP might be priced at, given the marketing perspectives, you get $1414 for the base package and $1813 for the high end package.

Or, when you factor in buying psychology being tuned to "99" levels, which Apple evidently subscribes to, you get $1399 and $1799. I bet that's where we come out when the 13" rMBP is finally announced.

That's a long way of saying that I agree with at least your high end pricing. But not entirely with the pricing in the AB article I linked to earlier. They used the absolute price differences between classic and Retina models to estimate the sales price of the 13 inch rMBP, but I used the relative price differences (percentage) instead.

Aren't spreadsheet exercises wonderful?

 

[heisenberg123]

I don't know if the smaller form factor can support the same "insides". For instance, the battery would have to be smaller, but then again, it could be smaller because the screen is smaller, so a battery as large as the one in the 15" model isn't needed. That would reduce the manufacturing cost of the 13".

But, then again, manufacturing cost of a system isn't directly related to the sales price, either, since it's the marketeers who decide what the price point should be.

But... in thinking about this, if you ignore the actual piece part manufacturing cost of these systems (I know, this is factored into the sales price, but bear with me here), then ultimate sales prices for the systems are really dependent on where the consumer tolerance levels are from the marketing perspective.

Look at the 13 inch classic MBP. The base model is priced at $1199, and the high-end model is $1499. Oddly enough, these are the exact same prices as the same models of the 13 inch MBA.

But, when the 15 inch cMBP (at $1799 and $2199) is compared to the Retina MBP (at $2199 and $2799), that's an 18 percent and 21 percent difference respectively. If you assume the same proportionality here and apply those percentages to the 13 inch classic MBP pricing, to approximate what a 13 inch Retina MBP might be priced at, given the marketing perspectives, you get $1414 for the base package and $1813 for the high end package.

Or, when you factor in buying psychology being tuned to "99" levels, which Apple evidently subscribes to, you get $1399 and $1799. I bet that's where we come out when the 13" rMBP is finally announced.

That's a long way of saying that I agree with at least your high end pricing. But not entirely with the pricing in the AB article I linked to earlier. They used the absolute price differences between classic and Retina models to estimate the sales price of the 13 inch rMBP, but I used the relative price differences (percentage) instead.

Aren't spreadsheet exercises wonderful?

Agreed with those prices but not with quad cores and the dual graphics, you cant make the 13" almost 1K cheaper if all your losing is 45 minutes of battery life and 2 inches of screen.

 

[lockerc18]

Agreed with those prices but not with quad cores and the dual graphics, you cant make the 13" almost 1K cheaper if all your losing is 45 minutes of battery life and 2 inches of screen.

True, but don't forget the materials costs involved. A smaller form factor means less materials used for the case and a bunch of other things as you shrink the footprint. Of course, that means space is that much tighter inside, too, so something has to give.

Apple has to decide what profit margin they can live with, and also how much of a price they can wring out of consumers. You know they're going to maximize their profit here.

The reports have been saying that the screens are being manufactured in quantities which are an order of magnitude more than for the 15" rMBP (1 to 2 million versus a few hundred thousand). So, maybe Apple can live with a smaller margin, which they'd make up through a higher sales volume. Or, they could think that price will be somewhat irrelevant for this system because it will be such a hot seller anyway, so they can charge a premium price for it because of all the buyers who will camp out at their stores for the week ahead of the 12th just to get the first ones. They're anticipating a high demand, and I certainly agree with that.

Who knows? We'll just have to wait to find out. I think they'll sell every one of these puppies they can build, price be damned.

 

[SurferMan]

It'll be interesting to see what combo's they offer for the 13". I wanted to upgrade my 13" last go around hoping they would offering anti glare etc for it, but they pretty much left it as is. Already have a 15" high res antiglare. But I love using the 13" for traveling. So a thinner 13" with a nicer screen w/ reduced glaring and better battery life (and cpu/ram etc setup) than the Air was what I was hoping for.

 

[macuserx86]

Can you post screens of this in Activity Monitor?

I can't imagine using 4GB of RAM in Photoshop.

It's not all about the RAM usage of a single app. For example, I often use PS, Lightroom, Premeire and various other apps at the same time. An SSD makes opening and closing Apps like this faster, but nothing is as fast as being able to just leave everything open and switch between the programs that you need.
I'm on my iPad so no activity monitor shots from me, but hopefully you get the point. More RAM helps with multitasking and general system stability which is very important for content creation.

 

[driftless]

Yes, the SSD mikes a nice scratch disk. However, I think that the best option would be a 16GB BTO option on the 13" rMBP like there is on the 15" rMBP along with SSD. Now that would be killer. I know that a lot of the MBA fans use PS with 4 GB RAM but I think that heavy users of CS would prefer something more robust.

 

[DVD9]

I wish Apple would just go and put 16GB of RAM as standard. Less than twelve hours after the announcement this forum would see posts popping up in every thread screaming that Apple needs to make available a 32GB RAM option.

99.9% of laptop users will never be able to max out 4GB of RAM. Not even ten years from now.

What do you think the motives of the RAM spammers is?

 

[evilpaddy]

As I've posted above, if all they do is offer a CPU bump and nicer screen, then it will replace the MBA. There has to be more to differentiate the models... after all the top spec 13" MBA is a much better buy that the current MBP... I appreciate a dedicated GPU would be difficult, but we've seen how the rMBP sutters with the dedicated GPU, imagine what it will be like with *only* the intel HD400...

 

[imladris]

A fun day for us 13 inch rMBP believers!

Kuo predicts (again) that the 13 inch rMBP will be released in mid September (if the scale in the graph means anything) and that it will start at under $1300.

Also, Samsung apparently showed a 13" laptop with a "retina-dpi" screen at IFA, so they also seem to be thinking about building a similar machine.

 

[heisenberg123]

A fun day for us 13 inch rMBP believers!

Kuo predicts (again) that the 13 inch rMBP will be released in mid September (if the scale in the graph means anything) and that it will start at under $1300.

Also, Samsung apparently showed a 13" laptop with a "retina-dpi" screen at IFA, so they also seem to be thinking about building a similar machine.

that price makes me think it wont have much of an upgrade to CPU or graphics

 

[DVD9]

that price makes me think it wont have much of an upgrade to CPU or graphics

There's a better chance of an asteroid pulverizing this planet than a 13"Retina being sold for $1,300.

 

[heisenberg123]

There's a better chance of an asteroid pulverizing this planet than a 13"Retina being sold for $1,300.

ya, also wonder if the 13" rentina screen is the for the Air lineup hows to say there will be two 13 inch lines

 

[leecbaker]

ya, also wonder if the 13" rentina screen is the for the Air lineup hows to say there will be two 13 inch lines

This is an interesting thought. I wonder how many modifications would have to be made to the existing MBA13 design to fit in a retina screen?

Can anyone comment on the thickness of the rMBP15 screen/lid versus the MBA13? It is unlikely, but, is it possible they could wring enough graphics performance from the existing CPU in the top of the line MBA13 to drive the screen (via driver optimizations, higher clocks, etc)?

Since we know most people find it okay running a non-pixel-doubled resolution on the rMBP, maybe they could get away with not pixel doubling on a MBA add-on. Perhaps they could go with 1.5x the resolution in each dimension, instead of pixel doubling (1440 x 900 -> 2160x1350), saving some work for the GPU.

At the rMBP announcement, they would have known what they planned on releasing for a 13" model. Does their marketing line up with a non-pixel-doubled strategy?

I am imagining (dreaming!) about a retina screen as an $250 option to be added on to the current top of the line MBA13?

 

[driftless]

The lid of the rMBP is remarkably thin. It is a little hard to compare to the MBA but I would think that a retina display can fit into the MBA form factor. Every time that I think the MBA won't have the "guts" run retina I remember that iPad is retina. Maybe in '13 for the MBA fans?

 

[truelies]

I believe 13" retina with 256ssd will be $1800, they need a gpu for retina. I will stick with 2012 13" mbp, for laptop retina is not so important since distant is longer than iPhone iPad. The upgrade ability is critical.

 

[evilpaddy]

ive never understood why upgrading is critical? Buy what you need now. When you want to replace it there will be bigger and better things available in 3yrs time. Everytime ive upgraded a cpu, ive needed to change the ram and motherboard.... yeah it's cheaper than buying a new computer, but people dont buy Apple because they are cheap...

 

[driftless]

I think that the issue is many folks are or have been at the end of their 2 - 3 buy cycles. While they should and want to upgrade, it makes little or no sense to upgrade NOW when new and better are just weeks away. I suppose the buy whatever is available works for folks who don't have a computer. For the rest of us, waiting for an anticipated upgrade not only makes sense but it is financially prudent.

 

[HishamAkhtar]

I think that the issue is many folks are or have been at the end of their 2 - 3 buy cycles. While they should and want to upgrade, it makes little or no sense to upgrade NOW when new and better are just weeks away. I suppose the buy whatever is available works for folks who don't have a computer. For the rest of us, waiting for an anticipated upgrade not only makes sense but it is financially prudent.

Agreed.

I think the price-point for the 13 inch MBPr depends on the comparisons one makes compared to the regular MBP and the 15 inch MBPr.

I think it'll be between 1699 and 1799 considering it'll have no competitors and will be a brand new product. Then as time goes by it'll come down to 1499. Considering it'll end up being their volume seller, they can price it aggressively and still make a mint on them seeing as they sell a lot more 13 inch laptops compared to 15 inch.

 

[watchthisspace]

I hope the Retina comes out this month. It means I will be given a 2010 MBP. Couldn't be more excited!

Come on Apple, shock the world!

 

[yanksrock100]

No way it will be $1300....more like $1500 or $1600. I think with the retina screen, and better specs, it will be enough to differentiate the Pro from Air.

A 13 inch Retina really is the perfect size for me, as I am not willing to lug around a 15 inch laptop around. Also, its a little too pricey for me. Apple would really pull ahead in the laptop game with having these super high res screens on all their "pro" laptops. I haven't seen anything higher than 1920x1080 on any Windows machines, so a 2560x1600 (227 ppi) and 2880x1800 (220 ppi) is really a huge step above the pack.

I can't wait!