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If they could replace the touch bar with proper function keys then this would be a decent entry pro machine.

Now for my hot take, I still love the butterfly keyboard.
The butterfly keyboard was a failure. An embarrassing one, at that.
 
Maybe you are also involved in business development and face to face stuff with clients, but personally I just need to be able to pull and push stuff off the company repository and obviously write/review code, I've never had to plug my laptop into a customers projector!

Apple is including ports that are useful to large customer segments, and not building a machine for one small segment such as developers. They have fast ports to push stuff out, and display options to meet teh needs of those who want them and don't want yet another dongle.

The majority of standups, meetings, etc we do are now Zoom based, and from what I've seen when we do interact with customers it's also using Zoom and screen sharing.

Not everyone does remote meetings or presentations.

I've used my MacBook with other people's projectors in a non-professional capacity and found that the HDMI dongle from Apple works just fine,

Amazingly, when Apple drops a port people scream about the need for a dongle.

so not really sure how you can assert that a developer isn't professional because they can't directly plug their laptop into a projector when its hardly the definitive requirement of a 'professional developer' and there is a dongle for it anyway.

I think it was more the OP's assertion that professionals don't need HDMI, etc.

The biggest problem with the Touch Bar is that it increased the BOM (bill of materials) substantially without contributing enough value to be worth the additional $200 price.

I guess that depends on the definition of value. Someone who customizes it with say, BTT, can have quick access to commonly used commands and options. Others want real function keys and the TB is not what they need.

I think that, if Apple had kept the physical function keys row, and added the TouchBar on top, the TouchBar could have had better adoption.

I agree - that would be the best of both worlds. The TB has potential, but needs more work to be useful. The return of a real escape key was a good start.

Anyways, I’m happy there’s still a MacBook for the TouchBar lovers.

Choice is good - some people act like Apple having a product they don't like is a personal affront.

'Okay stop'. A port on the side of the computer that serves a single function and most people will use very infrequently is an outdated concept.

Such as a MagSafe power cord? It's single use and USB-C can do its job nicely, meaning one less cable to keep around.

I'd much rather have multiple thunderbolt ports that can deliver 40Gb/s and be used to drive a display or do any number of other things including being daisy chained and connecting multiple devices at the same time.

But then you wind up with all sorts of dongles that have to be plugged in and pulled out. It's a tradeoff; and most people have no need for more TB ports anyway.
 
The reason the latest Macbooks "only" have three USB-C ports is that there is not enough bandwidth left for a 4th port. There is not a single laptop on the entire market that has four Thunderbolt 4 ports that can run at full speed simultaneously, and isn't also impaired by one of these ports being used for charging (whereas on the Macs the ports are actually free due to Magsafe).

Even with 4 port Intel Macbooks two ports share the bandwidth. The current Macbooks have a 50% higher combined throughput than the Intel ones before, the total is now 3x40Gbps instead of the previous 2x40Gbps.

I have a small bus-powered USB-C adapter that turns a single USB-C port into 4 ports, each limited to 10Gbps (USB 3.1 Gen2), I think it uses this chipset: https://www.via-labs.com/product_show.php?id=99

That gives me plenty additional ports for lower-bandwidth devices and still leaves two full speed ports free. If that isn't enough you can get yet another one of these adapters to turn 2 ports into 8 - still leaving you with two display outputs, and if you want you can get even more ports and yet another display output through a Thunderbolt dock.

The amount of I/O we have on the current Macbooks is honestly quite insane and on par with desktop workstations in similar price ranges. For example I found the expensive ASUS ProArt Z790 that offers a "massive" 2 Thunderbolt ports with no mention anywhere even in the full user manual that these aren't combined 40Gbps on a single controller. In fact, the website say "up to 40Gbps" so these two ports likely share the bandwidth.

There is a reason why the Mac Studio with the M1 Max has 2xTB and 2xUSB instead of 4xTB like the Ultra. The USB-C ports are there, but they are limited to 10Gbps on the M1 Max. Why? Not enough bandwidth.

Great points. It definitely felt like a retrograde step going from my Intel MacBook Pro with 4 ports to the M1 with only 2. Having said that, I don't think I've ever used more than 2 ports on the laptop at any one time, even when I had 4!! The time I have lots of devices plugged in is usually when my laptop is docked and I have 6 ports available.

I guess it would be nice to have the additional ports, but hardly top of my bucket list. M2 with 24Gb of RAM and 2Tb SSD is already a very compelling machine, especially as I can use it all day without plugging into power.
 
What amazes me is that 14” no Touch Bar, pro legacy ports supporters are realizing that they are not the only voice in the the world. There is plenty of professionals that value good design and they also value that apple has always been one step ahead, not 20 backwards.
 
If you bought a 13” MBP in 2017 and you wanted to replace it today, you are faced with some tricky choices… Especially if you’re work load hasn’t changed massively or the type of work you do and files you handle and software you run hasn’t changed… The natural replacement is not necessarily a macbook pro of any kind… given the leaps that M series computers have made to laptops… 6 years ago an entry level MBP was the only option if you wanted an apple lapto -for business and wanted it to last, the MBA on the day just didn’t cut it…. today the M2 MBA and 13” MBP offer serious laptop grunt without having to go to a Proper Pro machine… agree however that the 13” MBP should become a Macbook and be done with it less confusing….
 
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The choice is yours - either you like the notch or you like thick bezels. It's one or the other with today's technology.
Exactly. I find the notch incredibly ugly yet I don't have to look at it: Set the menu bar to black and it's gone:
Screen Shot 2023-04-17 at 09.53.01.png

This is actually what it looks like when using it, the notch is as black as the background and cannot be distinguished even when you try to look for it. The space is still unusable for menu bar items of course, but visually it isn't ugly anymore.
 
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Exactly. I find the notch incredibly ugly yet I don't have to look at it: Set the menu bar to black and it's gone:
View attachment 2189762
This is actually what it looks like when using it, the notch is as black as the background and cannot be distinguished even when you try to look for it. The space is still unusable for menu bar items of course, but visually it isn't ugly anymore.
Yep. If there's an OS whose manufacturer can get away with this notch thing, that's macOS and its 39-year-old (40-year-old, if you count the Macintosh XL, née Lisa) top menu bar. If any other PC maker attempted a notch like Apple's, everyone would be crying bloody murder.
 
If there's an OS whose manufacturer can get away
That space remains unused 100% for many users, and is only used some of the time in certain applications such as the Adobe ones. And these applications skip the unusable space and continue the menu bar items on the other side. For me personally that is acceptable, the alternative would be less usable space for applications 100% of the time. I rather have the bigger screen.
 
That space remains unused 100% for many users, and is only used some of the time in certain applications such as the Adobe ones. And these applications skip the unusable space and continue the menu bar items on the other side. For me personally that is acceptable, the alternative would be less usable space for applications 100% of the time. I rather have the bigger screen.

Il ike that I can move the menubar around the notch as well, giving me slightly more screen space. Bartender handles nicely the 20 or so Menu Bar icons I use, and a black strip on my desktop background hides the notch so I don't even notice it is there.
 
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Responding to some of the comments here: Macbook Pro 13" M2, even M1, is supposed to be entry-level—but it's not. I'm a C-level exec, and a software engineer and a digital artist. So the high-end M2 Pro (or Pro Max) 14" would be better suited for me, right? Well, I did try the 14" 19 core 4Tb 32Gb RAM one for a few weeks. The 14" was certainly faster, but there were some major deal breakers, so I returned to my 13". First, no Touchbar. I use Touchbar with BetterTouchtool. In the normal configuration, Touchbar is useless. Most people don't know what to do with it. It also can get in the way - in that sense, it can be extremely annoying. But, I've written such complex Applescripts, shell, and Python code, and man oh man, does this greatly speed up and automate my work. Compare to the $35k panels for Da Vinci Resolve - panels are a very good thing if you know how to use them. I tried to make the 14" work, but the 2x to 3x CPU/GPU speed boost was overshadowed by the 10x reduction in overall work speed. Next, THAT notch. To repeat because you can never get used to it: THAT NOTCH! It's beyond bad. Apple is not being Apple. I tried using Bartender 4 to see all the menu items - otherwise, they would disappear under the notched-out area. Wasn't Jony Ive criticized for focusing on form over function? Seriously, then what is this? I'll take bigger bezels over this nonsense. Third, the design - it's just bulky and, shall I say it, Windows-like! What I will miss about the 14" is the better quality screen, better tactile feel keyboard, and those speakers (wow). But I can't do serious work on that thing. So this working pro will go back to his 13" and hoping that model gets an M2 Pro or M3 Pro and better quality screen, and speakers.
 
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