^this
And don't forget repurposing the optical drive real estate for a second drive.
Thank you, Furry.
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13" MBP should have been phased out.
- Thread starter macguy360
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^this
And don't forget repurposing the optical drive real estate for a second drive.
Thank you, Furry.
By "customizable" are you referring to replacing the hard drive and ram. If so, that still doesn't negate the fact that your max resolution is 1280x800. Fact of the matter is that you won't need over 4gb of ram with such a low max resolution. You also won't be able to do anything more than the 13" mba can do because of the same graphics card in both.
The only benefit the MBP has is the optical drive which you can easily obtain a portable drive for $30 via newegg.
* and the war of the optical drive has already been won. You can already download any file you ever need online (just look down at the APP store icon as a testament to this). Optical disks are old news. Even Apple has already gotten rid of the need for a disc to reinstall mac osx if anything goes wrong with the computer.
So what if the resolution is 1280x800? For most applications, that resolution is quite acceptable and still HD resolution.
You can still upgrade the RAM on a 13" MBP...something you can't do on the Retina or Air unless you pay apple to do so. You can switch out hard drives as well...something you cannot do on a Retina or Air.
That alone tells me there is still a solid niche for the non-Retina MBP models.
Ummm, you are taking about a company who's biggest product still has a 3.5 inch phone with 3G tech. Old and outdated go hand in hand with Apple.
Did you even read my message that you quoted? I actually said in the post that the only customizable things were hard drive and ram. Then you went on to repeat what I said....
Ohhhhh... Low blow... Claws are coming out! lol... HAhahaha....
Overall the thread makes a good point, but the MBP 13" is marketed as a pro machine, while the air is a consumer... I know in college alot of people fall under this misconception and but the 13" pro thinking it will handle autocad better than the air - and the result is alot of hoping that autocads auto-recovery feature worked this time! haha
I recently bought an MBP 13 (didn't realize an updated model was on the immediate horizon). However, I'm very happy I did. I like the multiple ports, the optical drive, and, most of all -- THE SIZE!!
When I bought the MBP, I still had an excellent, fairly new 17-inch PC laptop. Much to my dismay, it was anything but portable. It weighed a ton, was incredibly cumbersome to take on the road, and was more a desktop than a laptop. A 17-inch screen is nice for the real estate, but 13 is perfect for a laptop! And, the MBP is lightweight with it's aluminum case, compact and powerful.
When I bought the MBP, I still had an excellent, fairly new 17-inch PC laptop. Much to my dismay, it was anything but portable. It weighed a ton, was incredibly cumbersome to take on the road, and was more a desktop than a laptop. A 17-inch screen is nice for the real estate, but 13 is perfect for a laptop! And, the MBP is lightweight with it's aluminum case, compact and powerful.
I realize that. However, my point remains that the 13" MBP is still a great machine to buy and own.
When compared to the macbook air 13" for 2012. There is absolutely no reason to buy the 13" MBP over the MBA. Resolution is worse, HDD speed is worse, portability is worse, ram upgrades won't be utilized due to the max 1280x800 resolution.
Why would you upgrade a 13" MBP if you wouldn't see any of the benefits from the upgrade? The only thing worth upgrading would be the HDD to a SSD and by the time you factor in the cost of an SSD you would still have been better off buying the higher end 13" MBA.
what are you on about thinking that ram is somehow directly tied to resolution? With the stuff I do, alot is CLI and I need as much ram as I can get
Imagine how much more awesome the 13" MBP would be if it had:
With proper 2.5" SSDs, and proper SODIMMs (that will likely get us to 32GB on Ivy), a little bit of attention from Apple could have turned the 13" into *the* non-retina to buy.
But they keep letting it stagnate - I don't understand why. It's their best form factor! 15" is just a bit too big, and the 13" air is just a bit too limiting!
- 1440x900 resolution (like the Air), with antiglare option
- A dedicated GPU. Doesn't have to be amazing, just better than the HD4000
- Apple-sanctioned optibay HDD/SSD option
- SSD as standard at the current price point
- 2x Thunderbolt like the new Retina Pro
- A quad core CPU. Don't tell me it isn't possible, Intel.
With proper 2.5" SSDs, and proper SODIMMs (that will likely get us to 32GB on Ivy), a little bit of attention from Apple could have turned the 13" into *the* non-retina to buy.
But they keep letting it stagnate - I don't understand why. It's their best form factor! 15" is just a bit too big, and the 13" air is just a bit too limiting!
for the same reason that apple incramentally develops all of its products... and as a result, they have more money than many small nations... the 13 mbp makes them lots of money as long as they can keep from spending too much on it.
still, I wish they offered a higher res option on it.
1. I don't mind the resolution at all. For the applications I run, it suits me just fine.
2. The extra few seconds it takes a regular hard disk to work is not going to wreck my day.
3. I don't carry my laptop anywhere...when I do, that whole pound or so difference is not going to break my back.
4. Screen resolution has little (if any) bearing on how RAM is utilized.
Obviously I am not alone in these feelings since the 13" MBP is Apple's best-selling computer.
You sit here and spout absolutes as if you're somehow an authority on computers when in reality every person has their own needs and their own user experience. Some people like the Airs, some like the MBP and some like both. Who are you to say someone is wrong for purchasing the computer that best suits their needs?
Phased out?
If anything, Apple should have stopped marginalizing the brand and given people some real updates.
It's ridiculous that in 2012 they still have a laptop with 1280x800 resolution when I had a Dell in 2005 that had the same res.
But then again, that's what Apple is all about. Borderline incremental updates with one huge update every few years.
The fact that they couldn't be assed to improve the resolution, decrease the weight of the laptop or improve the heat dissipation is very telling.
If anything, Apple should have stopped marginalizing the brand and given people some real updates.
It's ridiculous that in 2012 they still have a laptop with 1280x800 resolution when I had a Dell in 2005 that had the same res.
But then again, that's what Apple is all about. Borderline incremental updates with one huge update every few years.
The fact that they couldn't be assed to improve the resolution, decrease the weight of the laptop or improve the heat dissipation is very telling.
Lol, you buy a laptop yet dont carry it anywhere...
Screen resolution is one of the main determinants of ram usage when your integrated graphics shares your ram... especially in video related tasks such as streaming hd content, editing video, playing games. If your only doing so at 720p then you dont need more than 4gb of ram.
You seem like the kind of person that would buy a crappier car on accident and then get all upset if someone told you that you could have gotten a much nicer car for the same price lol
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Watch out because Bubba 6pack will get all upset at you for offending them. They dont mind their almost 10 year old dated technology being sold to them at a premium price as long as people don't tell them their getting ripped off.
But will they keep it next go round? A 13" MBP with Retina display? Or will it just become 11" and 13" airs with a 15" Pro?
I personally am hoping for a similar redesign for the 13" MBP. Similar flat design, retina screen, dedicated graphics. Make is $1499 and then you have graduated pricing that makes sense again, rather than selling a relatively crippled 13" pro versus the Air.
I personally am hoping for a similar redesign for the 13" MBP. Similar flat design, retina screen, dedicated graphics. Make is $1499 and then you have graduated pricing that makes sense again, rather than selling a relatively crippled 13" pro versus the Air.
Nonsense. The 13" is Apples NUMBER 1 selling laptop. Why would you discontinue your NUMBER 1 SELLING LAPTOP.
So was the white Macbook at one point.
Also I haven't seen any recent sources for the "MBP 13" is #1 seller" claim. The 2010 and 2011 Macbook Air models must be eating into that at least somewhat.
I didn't say that I don't carry it anywhere. I just don't take it outside of the home as much as a lot of people.
Do you really like showing your ass or do you just play a jerk on the forums?
My point - that you obviously don't get - is that people should buy the computer that works best for them and their uses. Some people need Mac Pros...some need iMacs or Macbook Pros...some may need Macbook Airs. That is why we have choices in product.
Again, what gives you the right to berate people for buying what they choose to buy?
I said IS not WAS. You think because it's not as cool as the other laptops it should be discontinued?
Foolish.
Not everyone wants a $2000 computer. For some 1300 is a stretch, but it's good business for Apple to offer entry level in order to acquire customers early on in the hopes of keeping them for a lifetime.
Just because something isn't the latest and greatest doesn't make it a bad business strategy. Bring in entry level buyers with a solid product at a fair price, and keep them with cutting edge advancements and solid marketing, i.e. don't ask them what they want, tell them what they need.
Source?
PS: No need to yell and call me foolish. I'm not completely against your position. I replied to this post on the previous page, saying:
"I agree that the 13" MBP isn't really a smart buy right now, but I do understand why Apple hasn't killed it yet."
swingerofbirch
macrumors 68040
Here's a little interesting history: back in 2003, Apple introduced 12" and 17" aluminum PowerBooks (remember the ads with Verne Troyer and Yao Ming?). The 15" model retained its titanium housing until later that year when it was updated to the aluminum design.
When I heard the rumors about the third notebook coming out at WWDC, I assumed something like that would happen again. Instead, as we know, Apple added its new 15" notebook alongside its current 15" notebook (the distinctions doesn't make sense: they're both new and they're both current). Anyhow, I think it makes less sense for Apple to have kept its current 15" MacBook Pro alongside the new model than it would make sense to axe the 13". While you can purchase a less expensive current than new 15" MBP, if you configure them with the same specs, the current is far more expensive than the new.
Back in 2003, it was clear that Apple would eventually get around to transitioning the 15" PowerBook G4. And now it seems clear that they will eventually transition to only "new" 15" MacBook Pros. I would also like to hope it's clear that they will transition the 13" MBP line, as well. Perhaps if you look spec for spec, you could say that the 13" MBP isn' t valuable compared to the MacBook Air, but as the hopeful next heir to the Retina display, it has great importance as a placeholder for what I hope will come. There are also some people like myself who prefer the glass display along with the MBP 13"'s display quality over the Air.
But again, I think the curiosity is that Apple kept the 15" MBP current. Apple often will force new technology onto the market even if it is prohibitively expensive for a while. Why they couldn't come up with a 13" "new" model simultaneously may be a matter of lack of resources to devote to two projects.
The other difference between now and 2003 is that then Apple expanded from one screen size to three, and now they are contracting from 3 to 2. I'm not sure if that made a difference in their decision to retain the current 15" MBP.
FYI: In the above any mention of current MBP refers to a non-Retina MBP and new MBP refers to an actual or potential future Retina MBP.
When I heard the rumors about the third notebook coming out at WWDC, I assumed something like that would happen again. Instead, as we know, Apple added its new 15" notebook alongside its current 15" notebook (the distinctions doesn't make sense: they're both new and they're both current). Anyhow, I think it makes less sense for Apple to have kept its current 15" MacBook Pro alongside the new model than it would make sense to axe the 13". While you can purchase a less expensive current than new 15" MBP, if you configure them with the same specs, the current is far more expensive than the new.
Back in 2003, it was clear that Apple would eventually get around to transitioning the 15" PowerBook G4. And now it seems clear that they will eventually transition to only "new" 15" MacBook Pros. I would also like to hope it's clear that they will transition the 13" MBP line, as well. Perhaps if you look spec for spec, you could say that the 13" MBP isn' t valuable compared to the MacBook Air, but as the hopeful next heir to the Retina display, it has great importance as a placeholder for what I hope will come. There are also some people like myself who prefer the glass display along with the MBP 13"'s display quality over the Air.
But again, I think the curiosity is that Apple kept the 15" MBP current. Apple often will force new technology onto the market even if it is prohibitively expensive for a while. Why they couldn't come up with a 13" "new" model simultaneously may be a matter of lack of resources to devote to two projects.
The other difference between now and 2003 is that then Apple expanded from one screen size to three, and now they are contracting from 3 to 2. I'm not sure if that made a difference in their decision to retain the current 15" MBP.
FYI: In the above any mention of current MBP refers to a non-Retina MBP and new MBP refers to an actual or potential future Retina MBP.