15" rMBP temps are too high?

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by Moshe1010, Apr 19, 2013.

  1. Moshe1010 macrumors 6502a

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    #1
    Hi,

    I'm wondering if the temperature of my 15" rMBP base is too high since the keyboard feels really warm (left mid-top side). I don't run any applications except for Chrome & Adium.

    Here are my temps:

    HD: 42
    GPU: 70
    GPU Diode: 80
    Heatsink B: 49
    Enclosure Bottom: 39
    Airport Card: 49
    Mem Bank A1: 58

    All in Celsius.

    Thanks.
     
  2. simsaladimbamba

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    #2
  3. Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #3
    CPU A Proximity: 62
    CPU Core 1: 82
    CPU Core 3: 81
    CPU Core 4: 92

    For some reason it doesn't want to read Core 2.
     
  4. snaky69, Apr 19, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 19, 2013

    snaky69 macrumors 603

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    #4
    Those temps are normal under high stress, are you rendering anything, doing large calculations or gaming?

    Either way, your temps are normal.
     
  5. Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #5
    As I said, nothing. Only Chrome & Adium are open right now (and Babylon and Dropbox on the background).
     
  6. simsaladimbamba

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    #6
    Open Activity Monitor and select All Processes and then sort by CPU to show you the process(es) slowing down your Mac or speeding up your fan(s) or causing more heat.


    And that link in post #2 might hold valuable information too.
     
  7. Moshe1010, Apr 19, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2013

    Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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  8. simsaladimbamba

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    #8
    Again, those temperatures are perfectly within the limits of the CPU. If the CPU would be TOO HOT, it would shut down to prevent further damage, but then again, that has already been said in that post I linked to.

    And you might not have selected All Processes as advised.

    Just out of curiosity, and hopefully not too off topic to get moderated, but have you looked at post #2 and the resulting link, and read the information in that small tale?
     
  9. Moshe1010, Apr 19, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2013

    Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #9
    Yes, I read everything, but I can't see how this is relevant to whatever I'm asking. I asked if the temperatures are normal, which they are, but they aren't normal for the amount of processes I'm currently running (vs. the highest load). In addition, I don't think the computer should be warm/hot to touch on the mid-top area of the keyboard.
    Moreover, I selected all the processes, and the highest is Chrome with ~11%, and now it's even less with 5%.
     
  10. Asuriyan macrumors 6502a

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    #10
    By the standards of the engineered design of the MBP, those are within specification.

    Judging by what you are doing, however, those seem a bit high. Mine runs so cool under normal use that it's impossible to distinguish whether or not the computer is being used just by touching the chassis. 50-60C seems to be normal for idle temperatures-- I don't see the temps that you're hitting except under heavy load, i.e. gaming or video transcoding.

    Are the fans kicking in at all?

    What is the ambient temperature in the room you are using it in?
     
  11. Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #11
    The room right now is about 23-24C (74-75F).

    The fans are at 2000rpm which is normal. However, when I watch a youtube video (sometimes) or opening multiple flash videos, the fans are going on very loud (which I think is quite normal for OSX laptops since they hate flash).
    I have Speck Clear Hard-Shell case, but I removed it now, and it hasn't made any difference.
    I think a trip to the Apple store would have more benefit for me than wondering why it's so hot under light use, but that would leave me without a laptop for a while, which I can't afford right now.
     
  12. simsaladimbamba

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    #12
    Then post a screenshot of your Activity Monitor window.
     
  13. Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #13
  14. Queen6 macrumors 603

    Queen6

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    #14
    No, it`s common for Mac`s to run hotter than PC`s. Chrome is switching on the discrete GPU which in turn elevates the temperature further. If you want the system to run cooler surfing the web use Safari, as it will use the integrated Intel GPU.
     
  15. Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #15
    I used Safari all day yesterday, and my avg. CPU temp was 83 degrees, which is too high. On 83 degrees my fans are still at 2000RPM. Only when it gets to 90 they start to spin like crazy. Something is clearly wrong, I would try to make an appointment since I have no choice.
     
  16. Queen6 macrumors 603

    Queen6

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    #16
    The fans spooling up at 90C + is normal for a 15" Retina (I have a 2.3 15"), the bigger question is what is driving up the temperature. Take a snapshot of Activity Monitor sorted by %CPU, it may be nothing more than a runaway process. If you have Flash installed and are on heavy Flash orientated Flash sites that can also drive up temps on a Mac fast.

    You can also if you wish install gfxCardStatus this will indicate which GPU is activated and more importantly the dependencies forcing the Nvidia on. Bresink`s Temperature Monitor is one of the more concise and invaluable apps when troubleshooting temperature issues, you may want to look it over.

    ----------

    If you are concerned about temperature and want to reduce it elevation of the rear of the machine helps, as sitting flat on the desk only reflects the heat back to the base of the Mac. You can buy passive aluminium coolers like Rain Designs Mstand or iLap. Most powered coolers are designed for PC notebooks and don't work overly well with Mac`s if at all. One cooler that does work efficiently is the Moshi Zefyr 2, as it`s principle of cooling is specifically designed for Apple portables, by blowing the air horizontally across the base of the computer, however don't expect miracles.
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Link: Moshi Zefyr 2
    A cheap USB fan can achieve the same if strategically placed, not as elegant mind, nor as easy to put in your notebooks case :p but they do help to reduce case temperatures.

    You can use software to override Apple`s own cooling algorithm by manually taking control of fan RPM and setting up power profile presets with SMC Fan Control 2.4, or here with UltraFan which allows you stipulate a preset temperature and the software will automatically raise and lower fan RPM`s to keep the system at the predefined temp, which i personally feel is a far more elegant solution. At the end of the day you want to control your system temperature, not your fan rpm`s. For me SMC is now pretty much redundant with the latest release of UltraFan having manual control of the fans RPM, and subsequently i am starting to uninstall it from my own Mac`s. SMC FC is a great app, however although it`s recently updated, functionality is limited compared to some newer apps, equally SMC Fan Control is rock steady stable and a finished product.

    Strictly speaking Apple`s own cooling algorithm works, albeit at sacrifice of increased temps for quieter operation. This has always been the Apple way and is really nothing detrimental to the system, i have one MBP from 2008 all original barring a recent fan change that has an uptime of over 30K hours. The latest MBP`s need less assistance in remaining cool; for some it`s simply disconcerting the heat generated and transferred to the case, although it`s perfectly normal as the aluminium acts as a heat-sync. i have to deal with elevated ambient temperature so at times a software solution is useful. Apart from the passive cooling the Mstands bring they also offer a very sound ergonomic solution. A passive cooler and UltraFan will maximise the cooling, there is little else you can do short of reducing the ambient temperature or the system load. If I know i am going to push a system i will close all apps that are not essential as this can and does make an impact to system temperature.

    High temperatures in general is not overly harmful to your systems, unless you push to the extremes. What is far more detrimental is thermal stress, where temperatures rapidly cycle by significant margins over a short period of time. Anyone striving for great longevity should look to minimise rapid temperature changes, here UltraFan is your best friend.

    Using a RainDesign Mstand, a Moshi Zefyr 2 and latest version of UltraFan I can reduce temperature by over 20C when transcoding an MKV video file, and that is something worth thinking about;

    • Apple default cooling algorithm 99C - 103C (still on Mstand) fans 4K and escalating :eek:
    • Mstand, Zefyr & UltraFan 79C - 82C fans at 5.8K :cool:

    Recently i have been experimenting with a CoolerMaster Notrepal E1 cooling pad, it has a single very large fan 23CM (9") running at 800 rpm, and most importantly moving a significant 91.25 CFM, this is far more than most other powered coolers i have tried.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    The fan by far takes up the majority of the coolers body, runs slow and quiet. As it`s designed for a PC portable i didn't have any high expectations; the cooler runs quiet as in silent, perfect size for a 15" MBP, has USB expansion, single speed with on/off button and lifts the machine a good couple of inch`s of the desk. I chose my Late 2011 2.4 i7 15" MBP, it`s connected to an external display, runs 24/7 and is generally north of 70C (158F) on any given day. Any software solution only results in the MBP doing a fair impression of a "Turbojet" which we all love to loath, as workloads rise and temperatures increase.

    The important part cooling; well as ever with a Mac a mixed bag, the elevation definitely helps versus being flat on the desk. I have little expectation of any cooler reducing a Mac`s internal temperature significantly, what the Notepal E1 was able to do was systematically reduce fan rpm by a good 1K without any increase in internal temperatures, which is a big step forward. With this cooler and a software solution (UltraFan/SMC Fan Control) it`s possible to have a moderate load and a relatively quiet system, and that counts for a lot. The major downside to the Notepal E1 is the size, it`s clearly designed to be "planted" on the desk. when using the 10 degree angle i use a piece of that rubber you can buy for car dashboards, just to ensure the MBP doesn't slip and slide about, just seems prudent with such an expensive notebook perched on the edge of the desk. The Notepal E1 also unusually blows a stream of cool air out of the front to cool the hands which is well unusual, nevertheless not unpleasant on a hot day.

    I still rate the Moshi Zefyr 2 as the best powered cooler for a Mac portable simply due to it`s continuous horizontal air flow, however the pricing and availability make it a tough choice. 1K reduction in fan speed may not sound that big a deal, however if that keeps the Mac below the "Turbojet' threshold then it`s a worthwhile investment for anyone seeking the quieter life :p

    What i have observed over the years is the best solution for a Mac portable is a combination of software, and powered cooler, on my Late 2011 15" MBP (2.4 i7) running both internal & external display`s i run; Ultrafan set to 66C, AdBlock and it sits on a CoolerMaster NotePal E1 this results in a reasonably cool and quiet system. My Retina is better behaved thermally and i just run UltraFan, AdBlock and it sits on a Rain Design Mstand.

    Note: the CoolerMaster Notepal E1 moves a very considerable volume of air, over 90 cubic feet per minute (CFM) a regular PC cooler moving say 40CFM will have little to no effect on an Apple portable, my recent observations are undertaken in an ambient temperature of 25C to 28C, so you may not need to go all the way to achieve a cool, quiet Mac

    The old adage still applies; it`s easier to keep a system cool, than cool-down an already hot machine. This being said it`s not strictly necessary, equally it`s nice to know that there are options for reducing temperature out there.
     
  17. Moshe1010, Apr 20, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2013

    Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #17
    I already posted my activity monitor, and I'm using the program you've mentioned to monitor my temps (Which sucks big time. I bought a better app on Appstore).
    About the accessories, I see no sense buying multiple accessories to keep my KEYBOARD cool enough to be able to type on. It's the most minimal factor that I expect from a laptop, especially from a $2200 laptop. I don't care for the numbers, if it's 30 degrees or 80 degrees when it's idle/light activity - makes no difference for me; but when my keyboard feels like a BBQ grill, it makes things uncomfortable. As I mentioned, I'm doing nothing except for surfing the web. Currently when typing this, I'm on 80 degrees avg with 2200RPM.
    I made an appointment with my local Apple store, I will update here what happened.
     
  18. Mechinyun macrumors 6502

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    #18
    Great info Queen (didn't want to quote the whole thing)
     
  19. Queen6 macrumors 603

    Queen6

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    #19
    Welcome to workstation class performance, thin & light, clad in aluminium, if you want something that remains cool to the touch don't push the power button or buy a ThinkPad W530 just bear in mind it`s close to an inch and a half thick, weighing near 6lb...
     
  20. Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #20
    As I mentioned, I get the same temps while surfing with Safari.
    Safari average is 70 degrees, Chrome average is 80 degrees. Surfing with one tab, this thread, with Safari at 70 degrees is normal in your opinion?
     
  21. Queen6 macrumors 603

    Queen6

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    #21
    I would say no, what is the site? is it Flash intensive. I can try the same on my Retina later today. Right now on my Late 2011 2.4 17 15" MBP I have 30-40 tabs open in Safari, App Store, Preview x2 , TextEdit, Excel, Finder folders X2, Activity Monitor, Intel Power Monitor right now CPU temp is at 63C with fans running at 3440 RPM under UltraFan`s control, target temp 66C. After 15 minutes under Apple`s cooling algorithm temp is 79C fans at 2600 RPM, and the system is noticeably hotter to the touch.

    The Late 2011 MBP is far less efficient thermally than Retina, so you may want to review the process`s running on the system. With the same load my own Retina would be a good deal cooler...
     
  22. Moshe1010 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #22
    I did another test right now. I closed every single application I have (background + login apps + normal apps). I waited 20-25 min for the system to cool down, and guess what? It didn't go below 60 without anything (except the temp app) open. Something is wrong, and I know they would ask to leave the laptop for 3-5 days, which would be a huge deal for me; but I can't type on a hot keyboard anymore, it drives me crazy.
     
  23. jNSK macrumors newbie

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    #23
    If you are absolutely sure that nothing is running under a high load to cause those temperatures, I would definitely say something is wrong there.

    At the moment, I have Safari, Sublime Text, MAMP Pro, Preview, Mail open (pretty light workload for me) in a 22 degree room and my CPU Die temperature is 42 degrees celcius.

    When I compile in Xcode it can get pretty high but rarely over 80.

    I would call Apple and see what they think about it.
     
  24. bill-p macrumors 65816

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  25. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

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    #25
    That will help if fans are spinning up without increased heat, but resetting the SMC will not affect temps.
     

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