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The most commonly discounted machines are the base models. Thus if 16 GB becomes the base, it will be easier to find a good deal on a 16 GB machine.
Yes, discounts typically happens on models that are the most price sensitive. Update to base spec will matter most to people who buy base spec.

On the other hand, those people SHOULD be the ones least concerned about it, because if you need a high spec computer, why are you buying the base version?
 
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Anyone else want a iMac with the M4 Pro chip?
Probably not.

The cuisine iMac logic board fits in the chin with a minuscule heat and 2 really really small fans, in very thin iMac. Based on tear down of MacBook Pro, the M1Pro chip, the M2Pro chip and the M3Pro chip all required a heat sink and a fan that would not fit within the iMac chin.

The Mac mini (and probably the new Mac mini) has enough height the fit the necessary Mpro chip heat sink and fan/air flow.

Unless the new M4pro chip requires significant less cooling.
 
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I hear what you're saying, but if you look a bit deeper you will see there actually is a logic to this, even if Apple does increase the price by an amount equal to the RAM upgrade price:

The most commonly discounted machines are the base models. Thus if 16 GB becomes the base, it will be easier to find a good deal on a 16 GB machine.

Also, there's a decent chance Apple won't increase the price by the full $200, especially on the more mass-market devices, like the Air, since those are the machines that students buy (or students' parents buy for them), and it's essential for Apple's future growth that they continue to bring those users into the Mac ecosystem
Base SKUs are also sold by third party retailers who are allowed to discount whereas apple can’t, and if you want a higher spec you have to go to optional extras which only apple generally sell army their retail price. You find this sometimes when the bigger retailers get stocks of pre upgraded SKUs.
 
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you don't know if 16GB will work well either. people who buy the minimum specced version understand there's less chances of being future proof
Again, you don’t know that. Some of them understand the service life could be shorter, but others don’t.
 
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Umm, isn’t this what computer manufacturers are supposed to do? PC vendors, and not just Apple, cater to needs of their customers, not their wants.
You throughly misunderstood what I wrote, or chose to find new meaning in it.

I also disagree with what you're saying, fundamentally. It's ludicrous to separate customer needs and wants. Honestly, think about what you typed- customers don't "NEED" the laptop to be beautiful, they vastly don't "NEED" the high resolution, the don't "NEED" it to be aluminium, etc etc. Also, what makes you think customers all "NEED" the world's faster single core processor while they merely "WANT" storage and RAM. A preposterous argument. 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

Additionally, your argument that Apple merely make the laptop just about fast enough 'not to lag' and work 'fine' is REALLY silly. Did you forget that you can buy laptops for a quarter of the price that fulfil those criteria? Apple's stuff is priced to be better than 'fine' and their entire brand image is about providing superior products that are premium.
 
Probably not.

The cuisine iMac logic board fits in the chin with a minuscule heat and 2 really really small fans, in very thin iMac. Based on tear down of MacBook Pro, the M1Pro chip, the M2Pro chip and the M3Pro chip all required a heat sink and a fan that would not fit within the iMac chin.

The Mac mini (and probably the new Mac mini) has enough height the fit the necessary Mpro chip heat sink and fan/air flow.

Unless the new M4pro chip requires significant less cooling.
You're right. That iMac is not designed to cool a chip to any significant degree. Personally I think it's a lousy design- thinness at the expense of cooling, connectivity, speakers, etc- but it has its fans here.
 
For how long? It’s shameless on apple’s side to charge as much as they do for machines with 8 gigs of RAM.
Agreed. Too many people think it's fine for Apple to provide the same amount of RAM on a £1700 MacBook Pro as on budget £250 laptop. "World's fastest single core consumer CPU" hampered by low RAM and pitiful storage. Are the people that only need 8GB really utilising all that CPU power?
 
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You throughly misunderstood what I wrote, or chose to find new meaning in it.

I also disagree with what you're saying, fundamentally. It's ludicrous to separate customer needs and wants. Honestly, think about what you typed- customers don't "NEED" the laptop to be beautiful, they vastly don't "NEED" the high resolution, the don't "NEED" it to be aluminium, etc etc. Also, what makes you think customers all "NEED" the world's faster single core processor while they merely "WANT" storage and RAM. A preposterous argument. 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

Additionally, your argument that Apple merely make the laptop just about fast enough 'not to lag' and work 'fine' is REALLY silly. Did you forget that you can buy laptops for a quarter of the price that fulfil those criteria? Apple's stuff is priced to be better than 'fine' and their entire brand image is about providing superior products that are premium.
Every computer manufacturer has competitive advantages. Apple’s competitive advantage is that they have the fastest processors available for each class of computers and are energy efficient. There is no lag with 8GB of RAM unless you’re doing something ridiculous that should be run on a M3 Pro or Max. Apple has its own performance standards that makes them the best. You cannot provide a single reason why they should provide more than 8GB outside of “I want it.” You don’t need it unless you’re a high end professional running all sorts of things that shouldn’t be running on an entry level computer. Because you can’t provide a single reason, that’s why Apple doesn’t do it and neither does any other computer vendor on the planet. These companies know what people buy and what they need.

Even on the base M3 MBP, those professionals don’t need more than 8GB because they’re basically running Word, Excel, and Powerpoint or Sales Force, which is why businesses buy these 8GB machines in droves for their professionals. Those machines run great. If they had 16GB, it wouldn’t have made a bit of difference because it didn’t lag in anything they were doing. Most professionals do not need an M3 Pro machine because they don’t do anything that needs it. Once again, companies buy AND sell for need, not for want. Just as Apple doesn’t sell for want, businesses don’t buy for want either. They buy the minimum configuration that works for them. You seem to think companies are charities to give away features without any reason or buy things they don’t need.

You’ll say why don’t those people buy MacBook Airs instead? Sometimes they do because that’s all they need, but those who do a lot of presentations in conference rooms, you can bet their companies are buying that base MBP with an HDMI port and SD card slot, something you can’t get with a MBA. When Apple didn’t provide things companies needed with the 2016-2019 MBP’s, their sales and reputation suffered. Notice that with their 8GB AS Macs, their reputation is pretty darned good except with YouTubers and niche users who buy machines with far more stats than they need, not just in RAM and drive space, but in classes of machines.

Despite 8GB of RAM, Apple’s computer still run rings around the competition, both in performance and battery life with Windows machines only starting to close the gap with a processor that works just like Apple Silicon. What would 16GB do for those who don’t need more? Nothing. Things will run only so fast before you don’t even notice it’s running faster. That’s what I mean when I say that the computer doesn’t lag. It performs as well as they need it to, which is still better than anyone else.
 
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Agreed. Too many people think it's fine for Apple to provide the same amount of RAM on a £1700 MacBook Pro as on budget £250 laptop. "World's fastest single core consumer CPU" hampered by low RAM and pitiful storage. Are the people that only need 8GB really utilising all that CPU power?
Honestly, I don’t know, because I never look at activity monitor. All I know is that it feels faster than my 16GB Lenovo, which was bought around the same time, for around the same price (by my employer). Whichever hardware balance Apple chose to make it work that way, I’m a fan. Because on top of that I get at least twice the battery life, and a much better screen. Why should I NOT be fine with that?

Are the people who only need a crappy low-end Intel CPU actually utilising all that RAM?
 
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You're right. That iMac is not designed to cool a chip to any significant degree. Personally I think it's a lousy design- thinness at the expense of cooling, connectivity, speakers, etc- but it has its fans here.
Because it’s designed for a specific purpose, which it does nicely. Why would I want a larger cade to fit a Pro chip I don’t need?

iMac is the desktop version of Macbook Air. The issue is they don’t make an iMac Pro. Not that there is anything wrong with the iMac.
 
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Of course not. I’m curious, what made you think I even remotely implied that?
I am of course exaggerating to make a point. My point is, it doesn’t make sense to over-spec the low end, just because some people won’t know which specs they need. Low end is low end, if you don’t like it, get a bigger one. If you have no clue how much RAM you need, you are likely exactly the type of user for whom 8GB is plenty.

Just look at the amount of posts here from people still using 8+ year old Intel Macs with 8GB of RAM. Clearly that works for them, even though it is MUCH slower than my 3 (almost 4) year old M1 Air. Stop saying 8GB computers are useless. There’s no reason to think that my M1 Air will be any slower in three years, than a 6 year old Intel MBA with ANY amount of RAM is today.
 
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Generally, because they're company laptops, you don't send out systems with potentially confidential information on them. So warranty repairs aren't much of an option.
They very much are with Dell. You have onsite techs who come to repair systems, and also have them install a new SSD and you keep the SSD that was in it if there is a need to reimage/replace. There is zero concern about confidential information being on the computer as it never leaves the facility.
 
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Not all professionals have the same requirements. My spouse runs a small business and 8 GB is plenty. I have many colleagues in academia who are professionals (scientists, professors, and researchers) who also have no issues with 8 GB of RAM.
That's not what pro means in this context. If the professor drives a car, that won't make them a pro driver, same with a computer.
 
I don't understand why people are happy the minimum is 16GB. The system needs resources over time. Which means the 8GB slow performance you all know, is now carried over to 16GB. In other words 16GB is the 8GB you know now.

It should have been 24 GB, not to forget the AI needing 8GB.
I'll just turn off anything AI related, avoiding any subscription costs and enjoying my extra ram :D
 
I don't understand why people are happy the minimum is 16GB. The system needs resources over time. Which means the 8GB slow performance you all know, is now carried over to 16GB. In other words 16GB is the 8GB you know now.

It should have been 24 GB, not to forget the AI needing 8GB.
This BS is getting repeated all over the place. Apple Intelligence DOES NOT take up 8GB of RAM. It requires a device that has 8GB of RAM TOTAL, including for all the normal stuff. So, it’s very likely that AI takes up maybe 2GB on average, and surely it is distributed dynamically so when you aren’t using AI, you just have some extra RAM. I’m sure if you are using AI and your device isn’t jogges by other processes, it takes more, hence “average”. Guess “typical” may be a more appropriate term.
 
Here's a random observation I've noticed - in terms of pricing and specs Apple has long aligned with Microsoft and their Surface line. The Surface was one of the last premium laptops on the Windows side to start at 8GB of RAM (and have similarly onerous upgrade charges). When Microsoft unveiled their new CoPilot+ PC lineup earlier this year the base amount of RAM became 16GB to support the new AI features.

I'm sure better supporting Apple Intelligence is a strong motivator to upgrade the base, but being the last premium PC manufacturer still having 8GB at the low end is also a distinction Apple likely doesn't want.
 
I think there'll be a bunch of upgrades on most hardware specs leading to a significant price increase, more than $200.

So it's not necessarily like Apple is just going to add $200 to all new Macs for the extra RAM and call it a day.

Although, about $200 actually might be around the price increase we'll see for the entry-level configurations of the low-end Macs with the non-Pro M4 chips, like the next MacBooks Air and Macs mini.

I think it all comes down to whether Apple is still shaky on AI or not, and exactly what M4 Macs are going to be able to do with AI that M3 and older don't get to do.
Adding the upgrade cost of the ram to the base price won't fly. Apple already missed a huge opportunity since M1 to gain market share to secure long term service revenues with opting instead for short-term hardware sale profits (and bigger bonuses for Tim) instead.
 
I’m on board with that too. I hope it will really work that way!
If it doesn't, then no new Mac purchase from me, I'll use what I have until the current MacOS version gets security updates, then goodbye.
 
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