19" Widescreen LCDs are GREAT value!

JasonGough

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Original poster
Apr 25, 2005
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Manchester, UK
not being able to afford the £400 Dell 20", i suddenly noticed that for about £200 less, i can get a 19" widescreen LCD from some 'lesser' makes.

Not entirely sure of the quality of the screens, but the contrast ratios and response times look better that the dell/ACD on paper. Obviusly the quality of overall picture cannot be judged just by them figures.

Has anyone either got or tried/seen the:

Acer AL1916WS

or

ViewSonic 1912W

What advice might a more knowledgeable monitor guy be able to offer me?
 

sikkinixx

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Jul 10, 2005
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Rocketing through the sky!
I bought a Viewsonic VX924 with 4ms response time, 500:1 contrast. etc. and I love it. I would hardly consider Viewsonic to be lesser than a Dell, personally I don't like the Dell's at all. If you are at all into games then the VX924 is where it is at. But a buddy of mine does pro-graphics and says that nothing beats his Apple 23" Cinema for still graphics and range of colour. It got mine from $500 canadian a few months back so you should be able to find it for a good price back in the Old Country!
 

aswitcher

macrumors 603
Oct 8, 2003
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Canberra OZ
I did the same, bought a 19" with DVI and 8ms response, AG Neovo http://www.neovo-usa.com/ for $450 AUD - say 200 pounds. It's been great. zero pixel policy and long warranty. I was seriously looking at 20" and 24" Dells with discounts, but in the end couldn't justify the additional cost (double, triple) when I want to get a big LCD TV this year.
 

JasonGough

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Original poster
Apr 25, 2005
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Manchester, UK
The main difference between the 2 monitors i'm looking at is that the ViewSonic one has a DVI input, where as the Acer only has normal analogue input.

Is there going to be a big difference in picture quality based on just the digital conection?
 

MRU

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Aug 23, 2005
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The Acer for the price is a great monitor. I bought one from Amazon for my spare mac mini and it's lovely. There's hardly any screen size difference between a 19" & 20" widescreen when you put the two together....

Obviously resolution is less, but it's still very good and the quality of the signal htrough VGA surprised me. It was very good, not as good as a Dell 2005FPW through VGA but there's a big price difference there...

I don't know whether I'd use it as my main monitor, but as a spare monitor its' perfect...
 

Mord

macrumors G4
Aug 24, 2003
10,091
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UK
get an lcd with DVI, allot of people with not so great eyesight cant tell the difference, but their is shadowing pixels that leak into each other and colors are washed out, DVI is well worth the extra cost.
 

OldCorpse

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Dec 7, 2005
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Hector said:
get an lcd with DVI, allot of people with not so great eyesight cant tell the difference, but their is shadowing pixels that leak into each other and colors are washed out, DVI is well worth the extra cost.
You are assuming that he can do DVI. What if he has an iBook? That's my situation. So to me, it is very important to make sure the analog connection will be of good quality on a given monitor... sure I understand DVI is better, but I don't have the choice.
 

Mord

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Aug 24, 2003
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no i just know from prior knowledge that he has a powermac, the newest powermac that did not support dvi was the B&W G3, and seeing as he plays ut2k4 on it it's defiantly news than a B&W, thus he has dvi.
 

mdavey

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Nov 1, 2005
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JasonGough said:
not being able to afford the £400 Dell 20", i suddenly noticed that for about £200 less, i can get a 19" widescreen LCD from some 'lesser' makes.
Hey, well spotted! I am in the same position and was planning to wait until Dell or Apple did a firesale to get rid of old models or wait for them to come down in price (I was particularly gutted to note that the US store has 45% discount on refurbished 20" and 24" monitors).

I even considered buying two unbranded 17" but no-one does a USB video card for Mac yet (I have a mini).

After some research inspired by your post, I also found the Fujitsu-Siemens W19-1. I like the look of this better than the ViewSonic and it has DVI. Anyone had good/bad experiences with the W19-1?

I assume that Acer doesn't do a 19" widescreen with DVI. I couldn't find such a model.
 

howardnow

macrumors member
Mar 29, 2004
55
1
I just got a FANTASTIC Gateway 21" HD ready ($520US)

If you can afford this, it is a great value.

It has DVI, VGA and all types of video inputs for SD and HDTV.

I work with Avid, FCP and photoshop for major studios. It is a fantastic monitor for all computer work and well worth the money.
 

JasonGough

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Original poster
Apr 25, 2005
183
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Manchester, UK
Hector said:
no i just know from prior knowledge that he has a powermac, the newest powermac that did not support dvi was the B&W G3, and seeing as he plays ut2k4 on it it's defiantly news than a B&W, thus he has dvi.
man, you know a scary amount about me :eek:

pretty good memory on you tho, and i apreaciate the help, so thanks :)

I think it'd b silly not to get a screen that supports DVI in, and thanx alot to MDavey for bringing that Fujitsu-Siemens W19-1 to my attention. Not a screen i'd seen before, but at only £220, it now head to head with the ViewSonic. (it looks well nicer tho)

All 3 of the monitors mentioned in this thread have the same specs: 8ms video response, 300 cd/m² of brightness, 500:1 contrast ratio.

Does anyone else think that cos the prices are so similar, all 3 of them have the same pannel in them?
 

DISCOMUNICATION

macrumors 6502a
Jul 7, 2004
831
2
Cambridge, MA USA
Hdcp

howardnow said:
If you can afford this, it is a great value.

It has DVI, VGA and all types of video inputs for SD and HDTV.

I work with Avid, FCP and photoshop for major studios. It is a fantastic monitor for all computer work and well worth the money.
Not to mention that yours is one of the few computer monitors on the market
that is HDCP compliant and ready for the future. I don't expect Apple to become HDCP compliant anytime soon, but what is taking Dell so long to replace the 2405wfp or at least anounce that they will be replacing it sometime this year with an HDCP version of it? Yeah, I know the 3007wfp is HDCP, but it is also Dual-Link, too expensive, and has no video inputs(can only be used as monitor).
 

mdavey

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Nov 1, 2005
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JasonGough said:
Does anyone else think that 'cos the prices are so similar, all 3 of them have the same panel in them?
No, there appears to be at least two different panels.

The Acer supports 8bit per channel colour (giving 16,7M colours) but doesn't have a DVI input. I'm guessing this is the Samsung LTM190M2 panel.

Fujitsu-Siemens W19-1, Westinghouse LCM-19w4, Hannstar HU191 and Polyview V398 are all 6bit per channel colour (giving 16,2M colours after dithering). I'm guessing that they all use the Chi Mei Optoelectronics M190A1 (Wide).

The AG-Neovo CW-19 could be using either panel. Some sites say that the CW-19 is 6bit, while others say it is 8bit. Either way, the CW-19 does not have DVI.
 

mdavey

macrumors 6502a
Nov 1, 2005
507
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cube said:
900 lines. Ugh. I prefer a 17".
If 14% more horizontal make that much of a difference to you ;)

I was also considering replacing my 17" iiyama CRT with another 17" CRT. 1600x1200 resolution for under $100.
 

JasonGough

macrumors regular
Original poster
Apr 25, 2005
183
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Manchester, UK
mdavey said:
No, there appears to be at least two different panels.

The Acer supports 8bit per channel colour (giving 16,7M colours) but doesn't have a DVI input. I'm guessing this is the Samsung LTM190M2 panel.

Fujitsu-Siemens W19-1, Westinghouse LCM-19w4, Hannstar HU191 and Polyview V398 are all 6bit per channel colour (giving 16,2M colours after dithering). I'm guessing that they all use the Chi Mei Optoelectronics M190A1 (Wide).

The AG-Neovo CW-19 could be using either panel. Some sites say that the CW-19 is 6bit, while others say it is 8bit. Either way, the CW-19 does not have DVI.
Interesting.

From a 'dummies' point of view, instinct would tell me that Samsung are better at making panels that some other brand i ain't heard of.

Its weird that there are 2 different formats for the color, especially when it is such a small and un-noticable difference.

I'm hoping that there might be a few more 19" Wide-boys come out in the next month or so, hopefully all with DVI and DSub inputs, so i can switch between my Mac & PC with the 1 screen.
 

mdavey

macrumors 6502a
Nov 1, 2005
507
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JasonGough said:
Interesting.

From a 'dummies' point of view, instinct would tell me that Samsung are better at making panels that some other brand i ain't heard of.
From the tiny amount of research I've done, I'd say that specifically for these two panels, the Samsung is the better one. Samsung monitors always look nice and you often notice them on designers desks (those companies that refuse to buy their employees Sony or Apple monitors ;)).

Its weird that there are 2 different formats for the color, especially when it is such a small and un-noticable difference.
Notice that the 16,2M is only after dithering. I'm not sure why, but the 6bit sampler is quite a bit cheaper than the 8 bit. Most people can't tell the difference between 6bit dithered and 8bit, but some say that near-blacks aren't distinctive (so watching, say, The X-Files isn't so enjoyable as shadows look like a solid block of black) and reds and blues lack definition. Others say that they notice the dithering and it looks like an analog video signal rather than digital when using DVI.

I'm hoping that there might be a few more 19" Wide-boys come out in the next month or so, hopefully all with DVI and DSub inputs, so i can switch between my Mac & PC with the 1 screen.
CES 2006 announcements included:

The Westinghouse LCM 19w4 is already out, I think. It is a 6bit display.

Norcent has announced and will introduce its LM-965W 19" widescreen with DVI and 8ms response (unknown #bits) for $349 (somewhere between £230 and £349 UK I guess) within the next two months. The case is all black.

Asus have announced the PW191 19" widescreen (6bit display) with DVI.

Videoseven have announced their L19WA 19" widescreen (6bit display, no DVI).

AOC/Envision have announced a 19" widescreen, model number expected to be 193FW (DVI, 8ms response, unknown #bits - some Chinese pages seem to suggest 6bit), suggested retail price <$300.

I doubt that (beyond those announced at CES 2006) there will be any other new 19" on their way in the next few months but perhaps some manufacturers will tweak their models. Maybe Acer will choose to fit DVI on its entire value range (that would be nice).

I just want a 19" widescreen with 8ms or better response, DVI, 8bit per channel, no built-in speakers and a thin frame for under $400.

Edit: Clarity, more AOC & Norcent details.
 

ScottB

macrumors regular
Jul 13, 2005
176
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Britain
I was looking for monitors a few months ago, but seeing as I didn't know much about them I was browsing mostly well known brands. I was mostly just skipping brands I hadn't heard of, I'll have to pay more attention next time. :rolleyes:
 

JasonGough

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Original poster
Apr 25, 2005
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Manchester, UK
mdavey said:
I just want a 19" widescreen with 8ms or better response, DVI, 8bit per channel, no built-in speakers and a thin frame for under $400.

yeah thats exactly what i want. give me somthing like that for £200 and i'll buy it. If the Acer had DVI, i'd buy that. Got no idea why they chose not to add it to their display.

Hopefuly they will update their display with a DVI in soon, that'd be sweet.
 

clykins90

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Feb 9, 2005
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Isn't the reason the 19" is cheaper is because it isn't widescreen? 1280x1024 is not widescreen.
 

mdavey

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Nov 1, 2005
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clykins90 said:
Isn't the reason the 19" is cheaper is because it isn't widescreen? 1280x1024 is not widescreen.
Which 19" are you looking at? I'm pretty sure that all the ones in this thread are 1440x900, which is 16:10 ratio widescreen @ 1.3M pixels.

I think that the reason they are cheaper is because they are "only" 1.3M pixels compared to 1.7M for the 20" (1680x1050) and 2.3M pixels for the 23"/24" displays (1920x1200).
 

dp351

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Jul 29, 2003
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The Westinghouse LCM-19W4 is available at Best Buy in the states for $299. I plan to get one next week so I'll post back how it works out. The one on display seemed well built and looked nice. I tend to pick stuff up and flip it around and over when I'm in big consumer electronics stores. I definitely twist and turn stuff to its limits to see how well it's put together and this monitor was much sturdier than the Dells. Has VGA and DVI but no peripheral ports like the USB ports on the Dells and new Gateway widescreen or USB and FW like on the Apple displays.
 

briangig

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May 16, 2005
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I'm going for the 19" westinghouse (mainly because of 180 bucks in GCs to BB), either the widescreen or the normal, havent decided.

Question though, how do I know if my video card (Radeon 9600 pro) supports the widescreen resolution?
 

JasonGough

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Original poster
Apr 25, 2005
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Manchester, UK
i don't think you can buy the Westinghouse LCM-19W4 in the UK yet :( typing it into Google.co.uk brings no results atall, so looks like its not here yet.

Doesn't look like i'm gonna be able to buy a new screen for a few months now anyway, so maybe there will be a load more new 19" wideboys come out in the near future :)
 

mdavey

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Nov 1, 2005
507
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JasonGough said:
i don't think you can buy the Westinghouse LCM-19W4 in the UK yet
I couldn't find it either. The AOC 193FW sounds promising, but European consumers might have similar problems locating the model when it is released. AOC do seem to be slightly better stocked in Europe than non-existent Westinghouse, though.

Edit: The 193FW appears to be 6bit :(