2011 Chevrolet Volt to start at $41,000

quagmire

macrumors 603
Original poster
Apr 19, 2004
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This is why I do not see "electric cars" gaining mainstream popularity any time soon.
Me neither. Anyone hoping the volt would be priced below $30k was on something, IMHO. I was personally hoping for $35-37K due that $7500 tax credit would make the volt a bit more appealing. That lease offering doesn't look bad though. I wonder what are the terms of the lease.
 

iShater

macrumors 604
Aug 13, 2002
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It has a lot of standard features, and seems to be more on the premium targeted market vs. regular sedans.

Did the Preius start out on the expensive side as well?
 

CasaRed

macrumors newbie
Jun 15, 2010
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St. Louis, MO
I agree that as priced that the majority of people getting this car would lease it. Keep in mind though that if you have a daily commute of less than 40 miles, you'll seldom need to purchase gasoline, so compared to a regular car or even a Prius, those savings will add up faster.

Either way, at this point this car seems to be at an early-adopter stage where you would expect to be paying a premium until it becomes more of a commodity or there's more competitors in the space. Kinda like how a 5gb iPod used to cost $400. ;)
 

quagmire

macrumors 603
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Apr 19, 2004
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That's after the tax credit. The MSRP is $32,780.
And only has a range of 100 miles. Making it not a good primary vehicle for people. I know for trips to my aunts I would be screwed.
 

rhett7660

macrumors G5
Jan 9, 2008
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Sunny, Southern California
Well,
If you look at the $34,000 for a hybrid then it isn't a bad deal. Most Hybrids run around $30,000 (Ford and Toyoda's); more for the Lincoln and Lexus; less for the Honda's. So you get the super range extending gas motor, in an all electric vehicle.
 

dmr727

macrumors G3
Dec 29, 2007
8,639
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NYC
^^^ that's what I was thinking too. This is a pretty full featured vehicle - once I start looking at all the goodies, a mid 30's price doesn't seem so out of the ballpark. I still have my prejudices against GM - but I'm really trying to give them the benefit of the doubt here.

I'm on Honda's list for their Clarity, but I'm not holding my breath that my name will be drawn anytime soon - I meet all their 'ideal candidate' guidelines, but they seem more interested in giving the first models to celebrities. So it's nice to see some other options out there for me to mull over.
 

quagmire

macrumors 603
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Apr 19, 2004
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The Volt should sell for no more than $20,000. What a ripoff!!!!
Name one vehicle that has the electric motors and lithium ion battery the volt and leaf has that goes for less then $20,000.
 

Lord Blackadder

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May 7, 2004
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Sod off
I think the Volt is a success in terms of meeting its intended design parameters. However, I think the whole notion of the all-electric car and plug-in hybrids are flawed due to our current infrastructure.

As long as we burn fossil fuels to get the electricity, the electric car is just sweeping the fossil fuel/pollution problem under the rug by putting the "dirty" side of power consumption out of sight (back at the power plant). Also, there's no way our current power generation infrastructure could support even a fraction of the population switching to electric cars. California already has rolling blackouts - if people stopped burning gas and switched to electrics, the problem would get drastically worse.

I think electric cars are a dead end for the present...At least until our entire power grid makes large-scale switches to alternative energy, and there is no timeline for that currently. Also, there is currently no guarantee that practical fuel-cell systems will ever be truly affordable or mass-producable. The current offerings are all extremely expensive, proof-of-concept vehicles with short useful lives.

We'd be better off with diesels or diesel hybrids. People don't want to admit it, but those are currently our best options IMO.

I really wish I didn't sound so cynical, but that's the picture as I understand it.
 

Mousse

macrumors 68020
Apr 7, 2008
2,154
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Flea Bottom, King's Landing
The Volt should sell for no more than $20,000. What a ripoff!!!!
:confused::confused::confused:

How do you figure? A comparable gas powered car is in the $30,000+ range. Hybrids have always been higher priced than equivalent gas powered cars. Electric even higher priced than hybrids. Besides, a early adopters are paying for the development cost in addition to the production cost.

Anyhow, I'll only be interested once it hits the road. I've been hearing a production model is coming next year for a few years now.:rolleyes:
 

iShater

macrumors 604
Aug 13, 2002
6,993
409
Chicagoland
I think the Volt is a success in terms of meeting it's intended design parameters. However, I think the whole notion of the all-electric car and plug-in hybrids are flawed due to our current infrastructure.

As long as we burn fossil fuels to get the electricity, the electric car is just sweeping the fossil fuel/pollution problem under the rug by putting the "dirty" side of power consumption out of sight (back at the power plant). Also, there's no way our current power generation infrastructure could support even a fraction of the population switching to electric cars. California already has rolling blackouts - if people stopped burning gas and switched to electrics, the problem would get drastically worse.

I think electric cars are a dead end for the present...At least until our entire power grid makes large-scale switches to alternative energy, and there is no timeline for that currently. Also, there is currently no guarantee that practical fuel-cell systems will ever be truly affordable or mass-producable. The current offerings are all extremely expensive, proof-of-concept vehicles with short useful lives.

We'd be better off with diesels or diesel hybrids. People don't want to admit it, but those are currently our best options IMO.

I really wish I didn't sound so cynical, but that's the picture as I understand it.
All very valid points. However, keep in mind that even how we get our power varies from state to state. Switching to electric vehicles does need to come hand in hand with a change on not only how we generate electricity, but also how we consume it.
 

quagmire

macrumors 603
Original poster
Apr 19, 2004
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:confused::confused::confused:

How do you figure? A comparable gas powered car is in the $30,000+ range. Hybrids have always been higher priced than equivalent gas powered cars. Electric even higher priced than hybrids. Besides, a early adopters are paying for the development cost in addition to the production cost.

Anyhow, I'll only be interested once it hits the road. I've been hearing a production model is coming next year for a few years now.:rolleyes:
They have always stated the Volt would be coming by the end of 2010 ever since the program started back in 2007.

Also remember, the areas the Volt will be sold in first( DC, New York, etc) are affluent areas where people can afford the Volt.

And even at $41,000, GM is still taking a loss with the vehicle.
 

Lord Blackadder

macrumors G5
May 7, 2004
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Sod off
Personally, I think those of us trying to by a more efficient vehicle would be better served by buying smaller cars and switching to diesel power. People like to believe that by switching to a hybrid drivetrain they can have their cake (own a monstrously large SUV) and eat it too (drive guilt-free because it's a hybrid). But that is fantasy. Hybrid SUVs get better gas mileage than their non-hybrid counterparts - but are still not very economical. Lifestyle changes (buying smaller vehicles) will make a much bigger impact compared with buying huge, gas-guzzling hybrid trucks and SUVs.

Switching from a Tahoe to a Tahoe hybrid is just window dressing. Switching from, say, a Ford Explorer to a diesel Golf - now that will make a difference.
 

patrick0brien

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Oct 24, 2002
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Lets also not forget this is essentially the first Series-Hybrid on the major markets, all have been Parallel-Hybrids, e.g. Prius, et.al. Meaning complex transmissions to allow both the motor and engine to drive the wheels.

Series-Hybrids have no need for transmissions at all, the wheels are driven by electric motors only.

This is a new type, therefore high price until economies of scale kick in.
 

Lord Blackadder

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May 7, 2004
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Sod off
Series-Hybrids have no need for transmissions at all, the wheels are driven by electric motors only.

This is a new type, therefore high price until economies of scale kick in.
True on the economies of scale bit - although the batteries are always going to be pricey.

I keep hammering the same point here, but the Volt would see a quite significant fuel economy boost by switching to a diesel engine to charge the batteries and run the motors. Sort it out, US car companies...it's not like we don't sell diesel here.
 

iShater

macrumors 604
Aug 13, 2002
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Chicagoland
True on the economies of scale bit - although the batteries are always going to be pricey.

I keep hammering the same point here, but the Volt would see a quite significant fuel economy boost by switching to a diesel engine to charge the batteries and run the motors. Sort it out, US car companies...it's not like we don't sell diesel here.
That is true. I'm surprised nobody has brought even diesel based hybrids here yet. I recall hearing VW was planning on it, but I don't remember where I read that.
 

patrick0brien

macrumors 68040
Oct 24, 2002
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The West Loop
Lord Blackadder said:
True on the economies of scale bit - although the batteries are always going to be pricey.
Well, they should research capacitors then, never wear out, and charge veeeeewy quick. Like EEstor

Lord Blackadder said:
keep hammering the same point here, but the Volt would see a quite significant fuel economy boost by switching to a diesel engine to charge the batteries and run the motors. Sort it out, US car companies...it's not like we don't sell diesel here.
Very good point. And not without a bit of irony as Rudolf Diesel patented his engine in the U.S. (608,845), and we don't use it - though that's because of the Oil companies, not the car companies.

I agree we should use the diesel. After the apocalypse, you could make your own fuel from zombie bodies!
 

Lord Blackadder

macrumors G5
May 7, 2004
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Sod off
The Audi A3 clean diesel TDI
That's a diesel though, not a hybrid. Not that there's anything wrong with that, of course.

I have a few major problems with the A3 though - it's considerably more money than its Golf platform-mate, and most models are FWD-only, which is stupid IMO. And you can't get a manual transmission with Quattro on the diesel? That would be like Subaru selling FWD cars again...it's not what the brand is about.

Even if I had the money for an A3 I'd buy a Golf instead. A diesel Golf is cheaper than comparable hybrids, gets competitive fuel economy, is cheaper to maintain, and its simpler drivetrain (with the tried-and-tested-for-over-a-century diesel engine) is more reliable. People just need to collectively pull their heads out of their butts and admit that the stinky, clattering diesel is a thing of the past when it comes to consumer automobiles.

I wish VW offered a limited slip as an option though...that's one thing I miss when it's not there.
 
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