2012 Macbook Pro Redesign

[Xcallibur]

Hey guys. I'm going to college next year and my iMac just crapped out on me. I'm thinking about picking up one of this generation's MBPs instead of waiting because i'm afraid that they will most likely drop the ODD. I would definitely want to load up Windows and some games on here, though, so the performance boost would be nice. Am I crazy for wanting to just get this model? I mean, it's already scoring 2.5 times my iMac on Geekbench.. (2.4 GHz, 1 GB Graphics)

I'm was very tempted to get the late 2011 model too, I still am, but I'm thinking the wait for USB3 and just to see what they decide to do is probably worth the wait. At least then I won't have bought the current model and then when the new model arrives, I won't feel as though I should have waited. I am in a bit of a dilemma though as I too want them to keep the ODD, but also want SSD as standard, but if they remove the ODD, I may opt for the 2011 model although I would lose the availability of a student discount on the older model.

 

[greygray]

Hey guys. I'm going to college next year and my iMac just crapped out on me. I'm thinking about picking up one of this generation's MBPs instead of waiting because i'm afraid that they will most likely drop the ODD. I would definitely want to load up Windows and some games on here, though, so the performance boost would be nice. Am I crazy for wanting to just get this model? I mean, it's already scoring 2.5 times my iMac on Geekbench.. (2.4 GHz, 1 GB Graphics)

Depends on your needs. Are you willing to wait for the next model? I suggest that you hold off for the next model first. If there's no ODD in the next-gen MBP and you really want to load up Windows and play some games or watch DVDs, you can pick up a refurbished 2.4GHz MBP for less cash and it comes with the ODD.

 

[floobie]

I somewhat doubt that it will look more pixelated if you keep the screen size the same and just double the resolution. I think there are two other effects that make the 480p content look like crap: One is that usually the HD TV will also have a larger screen size, and the other is that once you know how awesome 1080p content looks on that TV, the 480p content will look like crap.



Yes, at the end of the day, non-high-res content will look not so great. I checked a few websites with Safaris zoom yesterday: Text seems to scale very well, and remains incredibly sharp even with 200% zoom. Most images don't scale that well, e.g. here in the forums the buttons and smileys don't look particularly nice once zoomed in.

Now, since you brought up TVs... for about 30 years we were stuck with 480p TV programs and movies. HD content only was created after the devices became available.
A lot of web content for tablets and smartphones is already designed such that it looks decent when zoomed in - because you do that a lot on those devices. Honestly many news sites use more advanced technology for their mobile sites, e.g. properly scaling graphics and flash-free content, because devices like the iPhone and iPad created demand for it.

Indeed, anything vector based will scale without any problems. Any CSS elements will be fine. Text will generally scale fine with no loss in quality as well. But anything bitmapped (ie. jpegs, gifs) won't, unless a double resolution version of the graphic is put in place. They'll look pixelated.

Whether or not people care about this is a different story. I can only speak for myself, but pixelated images definitely look ugly to me. And, I mean, isn't that the whole point of a Retina display... to make the pixels less visible? It'll work fine with content designed for it, but bitmapped images that aren't designed for it will have the exact opposite effect. Time will sort it out eventually, of course. But, the transition definitely won't be instantaneous.

 

[shanshor]

Depends on your needs. Are you willing to wait for the next model? I suggest that you hold off for the next model first. If there's no ODD in the next-gen MBP and you really want to load up Windows and play some games or watch DVDs, you can pick up a refurbished 2.4GHz MBP for less cash and it comes with the ODD.

Well, also, I'd want to customize it with the anti glare screen and a faster HD. That's why I'm a little apprehensive about being able to find an older one.

 

[greygray]

Well, also, I'd want to customize it with the anti glare screen and a faster HD. That's why I'm a little apprehensive about being able to find an older one.

Well drop the cash for the current one then!

 

[ermir4444]

I think people want a thinner and lighter 15" MacBook Pro. It doesn't need to be as thin or as light as the MacBook Air. If Apple can make a notebook with quad core i7 ivy bridge and dedicated graphics (AMD 7xxx) that is 0.7-0.8" thick and weights less than 4.5 lbs than they have a winner. To achieve this target weight and thickness apple must remove the optical drive as well as use flash storage SSD instead of traditional hard drive. Here is my prediction:

2012 15" MacBook Pro
2.6GHz Intel Core i7 Ivy Bridge
4GB 1600MHz
256GB flash storage
AMD Radeon HD 7750M with 1 GB GDDR5
Built in battery (10 hours)
Height: 0.7"
Weight 4.5 lbs

Make it happen Apple and you got my 2000 dollars

 

[that1guyy]

I think people want a thinner and lighter 15" MacBook Pro. It doesn't need to be as thin or as light as the MacBook Air. If Apple can make a notebook with quad core i7 ivy bridge and dedicated graphics (AMD 7xxx) that is 0.7-0.8" thick and weights less than 4.5 lbs than they have a winner. To achieve this target weight and thickness apple must remove the optical drive as well as use flash storage SSD instead of traditional hard drive. Here is my prediction:

2012 15" MacBook Pro
2.6GHz Intel Core i7 Ivy Bridge
4GB 1600MHz
256GB flash storage
AMD Radeon HD 7750M with 1 GB GDDR5
Built in battery (10 hours)
Height: 0.7"
Weight 4.5 lbs

Make it happen Apple and you got my 2000 dollars

That would be great as long as there is a retina display and the cost upgrade to 512GB SSD isn't outrageous like $1,000. Maybe if it was closer to $300 for upgrading.

 

[Naimfan]

@ermir -

256 GB isn't nearly enough - I have almost that much music. And having to use an external drive to hold it defeats the purpose of having a "portable" laptop.

It's already thin enough - there's no need to make it thinner for the sake of it. And to make it thinner, I think they'd have to lose the ethernet and FW ports. That's something that would make me not buy a new one.

 

[SurferMan]

@ermir -

256 GB isn't nearly enough - I have almost that much music. And having to use an external drive to hold it defeats the purpose of having a "portable" laptop.

I gotta agree, I don't see Apple going to flash drive only, no way, not right now... prices still haven't and won't be down at a price point that makes it justifiable since majority of orderers option for for upgraded drives for more storage. It'll be awhile before larger SSDs come down to a decent $ range.

I'll bet money they'll either stick with normal HD or more likely a combo SSD/HD with the SSD for the OS and everything else on the HD which is best all around as you get the speed of the SSD for the OS and programs.

 

[ermir4444]

@ermir -

256 GB isn't nearly enough - I have almost that much music. And having to use an external drive to hold it defeats the purpose of having a "portable" laptop.

It's already thin enough - there's no need to make it thinner for the sake of it. And to make it thinner, I think they'd have to lose the ethernet and FW ports. That's something that would make me not buy a new one.

Im am 90% sure Apple will offer an upgrade to 512 SSD. The upgrade price will depend on the market price of the SSD when the new MacBook Pro will get introduced. I am assuming it will be quite steep but then again you are getting 512 GB SSD

As for the ethernet port it is not really necessary on a mobile device in 2012 considering the advancements in wifi. If you really need it there is plenty of cheap adaptors. And there is no point on including a firewire on a mac anymore considering that thunderbolt is much faster and more versatile.

 

[Naimfan]

Im am 90% sure Apple will offer an upgrade to 512 SSD. The upgrade price will depend on the market price of the SSD when the new MacBook Pro will get introduced. I am assuming it will be quite steep but then again you are getting 512 GB SSD

As for the ethernet port it is not really necessary on a mobile device in 2012 considering the advancements in wifi. If you really need it there is plenty of cheap adaptors. And there is no point on including a firewire on a mac anymore considering that thunderbolt is much faster and more versatile.

512 isn't enough either, especially for the price premium it would command. I have a 750 GB drive and am looking at moving to a 1 TB. SSD doesn't offer enough yet at a reasonable cost for it to be worth it.

Ethernet is required for many applications - just because you don't need it (and an adapter is not a serious alternative) doesn't mean others do. Wifi? Security is a sick joke, and some of us can't use it in a work environment. As for Firewire, I'm sure many other people would disagree.

If someone wants a toy, or a laptop you have to replace in a year or two because the RAM can't be upgraded, they can already go buy an Air.

For the MBP, a longer battery life, faster and cooler processing, and improved graphics would all be good, and seem likely with Ivy Bridge. But the MBP should remain flexible, expandable, and adaptable - all things that seem to have gone out the window as Apple has tried to make things thinner just for the sake of it.

 

[Ddyracer]

Make it happen Apple and you got my 2000 dollars:

Dedicated graphics (AMD 7xxx)
2012 15" MacBook Pro
AMD Radeon HD 7750M with 1 GB GDDR5

Dedicated graphics in a macbook ain't gonna happen. Anytime soon. Even the iMac doesn't have full graphics. Btw, the graphic card you listed is mobile you might want to change that.

 

[ermir4444]

That would be great as long as there is a retina display and the cost upgrade to 512GB SSD isn't outrageous like $1,000. Maybe if it was closer to $300 for upgrading.

I would love to have a retina display on a 15". I hope Apple really brings it just like with the iPhone and iPad 3.
Unfortunately 512 GB flash is a rare thing in a notebook nowadays so start saving

I gotta agree, I don't see Apple going to flash drive only, no way, not right now... prices still haven't and won't be down at a price point that makes it justifiable since majority of orderers option for for upgraded drives for more storage. It'll be awhile before larger SSDs come down to a decent $ range.

I'll bet money they'll either stick with normal HD or more likely a combo SSD/HD with the SSD for the OS and everything else on the HD which is best all around as you get the speed of the SSD for the OS and programs.

I dont agree with you on a SSD + HDD combo. While it may work very well in an iMac it wont work in a MacBook Pro for 2 simple reasons:

1-Space inside the Macbook Pro. Apple notebooks have been getting slimmer with every redesign and putting 2 drives would be a waste of space. Apple can use flash storage and fill the rest of the space with more battery. I think that is a compromise Apple will make any day.

2- Spinning hard drives are not the best choice on a notebook. They are loud, unreliable, consume more power and are very bulky. Considering that flash prices are falling quickly and considering Apple"s purchase of Anobit it is clear that flash storage is the future of any apple mobile device.

And yes i will take your bet

 

[psykick5]

2- Spinning hard drives are not the best choice on a notebook. They are loud, unreliable, consume more power and are very bulky. Considering that flash prices are falling quickly and considering Apple"s purchase of Anobit it is clear that flash storage is the future of any apple mobile device.

Oh, by the way spinning hard drives can hold more than 128GB for a reasonable price. Don't be stupid. This isn't a MBA just yet.

 

[ermir4444]

512 isn't enough either, especially for the price premium it would command. I have a 750 GB drive and am looking at moving to a 1 TB. SSD doesn't offer enough yet at a reasonable cost for it to be worth it.

Ethernet is required for many applications - just because you don't need it (and an adapter is not a serious alternative) doesn't mean others do. Wifi? Security is a sick joke, and some of us can't use it in a work environment. As for Firewire, I'm sure many other people would disagree.

If someone wants a toy, or a laptop you have to replace in a year or two because the RAM can't be upgraded, they can already go buy an Air.

For the MBP, a longer battery life, faster and cooler processing, and improved graphics would all be good, and seem likely with Ivy Bridge. But the MBP should remain flexible, expandable, and adaptable - all things that seem to have gone out the window as Apple has tried to make things thinner just for the sake of it.

I agree with your point about ethernet and the security issues of wifi. Unfortunately people who use the Macbook pro with ethernet in a work environment are a minority. You seem to forget that most of the people buy the MacBook "Pro" as a toy and Apple recognized that. Same goes for firewire. I used to live in a school residence and most of the students had a MBP. I have never seen anyone use a firewire device. There is really one port you need and thats a thunderbolt port.
http://www.theverge.com/2011/09/13/...ess-dock-pc-expansion-seagate-goflex-adapter/

I never said that the next MBP wont have upgradable Ram. I believe it will and you will be able to upgrade the flash sticks as well. OWC already offers 480 blade ssd. So you will ave a laptop thats just as upgradable as the previous one but in a much m ore thinner and lighter package

----------

Oh, by the way spinning hard drives can hold more than 128GB for a reasonable price. Don't be stupid. This isn't a MBA just yet.

But they are whack. They are slow and loud and consume a lot more battery life than flash storage. Not to mention how unreliable they are. They are great on a desktop as they offer more storage for the buck but they should not be in a moving portable computer.

 

[Naimfan]

They are slow and loud and consume a lot more battery life than flash storage. Not to mention how unreliable they are. They are great on a desktop as they offer more storage for the buck but they should not be in a moving portable computer.

Ahem . . .

Reliability numbers that are available show platter drives to be as reliable as SSD. Go figure. Platter drives also don't consume any more power than do SSD.

SSD are great if you reboot a lot, open applications frequently, etc. But they remain a terrible value proposition for mass storage - which is, after all, the point of mass storage in a laptop.

 

[klover]

Dedicated graphics in a macbook ain't gonna happen. Anytime soon. Even the iMac doesn't have full graphics. Btw, the graphic card you listed is mobile you might want to change that.

What?

Plenty of Macbooks have dedicated graphics; in fact, every 15" and 17" model has a discrete card.
And why wouldn't you put a mobile gpu in a laptop?

 

[Ddyracer]

What?

Plenty of Macbooks have dedicated graphics; in fact, every 15" and 17" model has a discrete card.
And why wouldn't you put a mobile gpu in a laptop?

True, but they are mobile. Well, I thought that the OP when he said dedicated graphics he meant the full desktop version. Reading comprehension error.

 

[jamezr]

Ahem . . .

Reliability numbers that are available show platter drives to be as reliable as SSD. Go figure. Platter drives also don't consume any more power than do SSD.

SSD are great if you reboot a lot, open applications frequently, etc. But they remain a terrible value proposition for mass storage - which is, after all, the point of mass storage in a laptop.

You have numbers and links to back those 2 statements up? I have been thinking of springing for a Samsung M830 256 but if there are legitimate data to prove a conventional hard drive can produce the same speed and power consumption then it might save me close to $400....

 

[Naimfan]

You have numbers and links to back those 2 statements up? I have been thinking of springing for a Samsung M830 256 but if there are legitimate data to prove a conventional hard drive can produce the same speed and power consumption then it might save me close to $400....

Search is your friend. There have been several studies linked here that evaluate the reliability and power consumption of SSD vs. platter drives.

Also, I did not say you can get the same speed.

 

[jamezr]

Search is your friend. There have been several studies linked here that evaluate the reliability and power consumption of SSD vs. platter drives.

Also, I did not say you can get the same speed.

I know how to search and I have done a lot of research myself.....thats why I was asking where you got your info from. I have not seen anything that says regular hard drives are just as reliable as SSDs. I have not seen anything that also states there is no power savings between a SSD and a spinning hard drive. So can you post you info please??????

 

[Naimfan]

You haven't looked very hard.

And given that you wrongly ascribed me as saying you could get the same speed with a platter drive as a SSD, you'll benefit from doing the research and actually reading the studies that are out there. Hint: They require access to a real library.

Finally, the cost per GB for a SSD is roughly 500% compared to HDD. Since most people don't reboot often, and generally leave apps open, the value of the speed benefit of an SSD is overstated.

 

[jamezr]

You haven't looked very hard.

And given that you wrongly ascribed me as saying you could get the same speed with a platter drive as a SSD, you'll benefit from doing the research and actually reading the studies that are out there. Hint: They require access to a real library.

Thats what I thought you were just stating your opinion without any real data to back it up......
Since you didn't know the facts I will post some articles for you to read. SSDs don't save on power consumption:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ssd-hdd-battery,1955.html
http://www.engadget.com/2008/07/01/ssds-save-battery-power-right-wrong/
http://www.ehow.com/info_12184254_ssd-save-power.html

 

[Naimfan]

That what I thought you were just stating your opinion without any real data to back it up......

Heh. There are none so blind . . . as those unwilling to research. And nothing so sad as people looking for handouts. To say nothing of your inability to write.

Like I said, given that you read something into what I wrote that was not there, namely, trying to claim that I said you could get the same speed with a HDD vs. a SSD, the research exercise should be stimulating for you. Then again, you won't bother, as it would require effort beyond a few lazy google searches. The data is out there, you just have to find it. But do be careful, because it may reduce your self-esteem when you realize you spent a lot of money to get less storage and a speed advantage you'll rarely use or need. But hey, its your money.

 

[ermir4444]

You haven't looked very hard.

And given that you wrongly ascribed me as saying you could get the same speed with a platter drive as a SSD, you'll benefit from doing the research and actually reading the studies that are out there. Hint: They require access to a real library.

Finally, the cost per GB for a SSD is roughly 500% compared to HDD. Since most people don't reboot often, and generally leave apps open, the value of the speed benefit of an SSD is overstated.

Do you still use floppy drives? I hear their price/GB is roughly 0.01% compared to HDD. Since most people dont need anything that can actually speed up your system dramatically then HDD are overrated... /s

Jokes aside the only thing that HDD have over SSD is price/ GB. The SSD is superior in any other aspect.
Everybody knows that the bottleneck for nowadays computers are the slow platter-based HDD and the biggest upgrade you can do to a computer is to put in an SSD. You are trying to claw behind an argument that doesn't hold much water. Just admit that SSD are much better than HDD and they are the future of storage in computing. Then we can actually discuss the 2012 MBP