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2018 Formula 1 Season Thread
- Thread starter Apple fanboy
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https://www.mclaren.com/formula1/team/mclaren-returns-indy-500-fernando-alonso-2019/
Alonso to race Indy 500 in McLaren car. I presume a Chevrolet engine?
Alonso to race Indy 500 in McLaren car. I presume a Chevrolet engine?
Enjoyed the race today. I was surprised that Mercedes went for such an early tyre change and was concerned they might not last to the end of the race. Lewis did a great job of managing his tyres. Interesting that Bottas went for the second tyre change was wondering if that was just a "belt and braces" approach to make sure they got points on the board for constructors title in case Lewis tyres did not last.
What a great, and exciting, race!
Whatever F1 has gotten wrong over the past few seasons, it certainly wasn't on display today. A truly thrilling race. Up until the last few seconds, we didn't know if Hamilton was going to be able to hold on. With 31 laps to go - I was pretty sure Verstappen was going to romp home to victory. And there always seemed to be the possibility of rain.
I'm sure Verstappen feels as if he had his victory stolen from him. And while that is true, there is also the fact that Verstappen didn't have to pass Ocon quite as aggressively as he did. If Lewis Hamilton had been in that position, I think he'd have given a back marker some more clearance, or waited till he could pass him in the open part of the circuit. I also give Hamilton, and Mercedes, great credit for nursing those tires through more than fifty laps.
Ferrari, despite a podium finish, didn't seem to be much of a factor today. I thought that their tire strategy, which the analysts made a big deal out of during qualifying, just didn't seem to work. Verstappen seemed to have pretty much no problem at all blasting by both Raikkonen and Vettel in the early laps. And subsequently passing Lewis Hamilton. It was great to see so much legitimate overtaking.
Red Bull got everything right in Brazil, except for one thing. Their headline driver made the sort of mistake a very aggressive, supremely talented 20-something racer would do.
All in all: Congrats to Hamilton and the Mercedes team.
Whatever F1 has gotten wrong over the past few seasons, it certainly wasn't on display today. A truly thrilling race. Up until the last few seconds, we didn't know if Hamilton was going to be able to hold on. With 31 laps to go - I was pretty sure Verstappen was going to romp home to victory. And there always seemed to be the possibility of rain.
I'm sure Verstappen feels as if he had his victory stolen from him. And while that is true, there is also the fact that Verstappen didn't have to pass Ocon quite as aggressively as he did. If Lewis Hamilton had been in that position, I think he'd have given a back marker some more clearance, or waited till he could pass him in the open part of the circuit. I also give Hamilton, and Mercedes, great credit for nursing those tires through more than fifty laps.
Ferrari, despite a podium finish, didn't seem to be much of a factor today. I thought that their tire strategy, which the analysts made a big deal out of during qualifying, just didn't seem to work. Verstappen seemed to have pretty much no problem at all blasting by both Raikkonen and Vettel in the early laps. And subsequently passing Lewis Hamilton. It was great to see so much legitimate overtaking.
Red Bull got everything right in Brazil, except for one thing. Their headline driver made the sort of mistake a very aggressive, supremely talented 20-something racer would do.
All in all: Congrats to Hamilton and the Mercedes team.
Watching it now, apparently Ocon was allowed to ‘unlap himself’.... well if that’s the rule what the feck feckity feck is the point in the blue flags then huh????? You can lap them but those you lap are allowed to unlap themselves even if they ran you and ruin your race... pathetic contradictory rules!
And I have to say this race has had some of the worst camera work I’ve seen all year, really poor and amateur IMO.
No I’m sorry, if you are lapped by the frigging race leader you do NOT do anything you can to overtake the leader again! It makes an utter mockery of racing otherwise!!!!
Not happy.... we will ignore the fact Ocon is a Mercedes driver....
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And if it was Max’s fault the stewardess would NOT have given Ocon a 10 second stop and to penalty for causing the collision!!!! Ocon needs to either stop cheating or go and read the rule book again....
And I have to say this race has had some of the worst camera work I’ve seen all year, really poor and amateur IMO.
No I’m sorry, if you are lapped by the frigging race leader you do NOT do anything you can to overtake the leader again! It makes an utter mockery of racing otherwise!!!!
Not happy.... we will ignore the fact Ocon is a Mercedes driver....
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Utter total rubbish! The rules state Ocon should have MOVED out of the race leaders way. He should not have had to of made an overtaking move in the first place, let alone Ocon attack back and ran him!!!
And if it was Max’s fault the stewardess would NOT have given Ocon a 10 second stop and to penalty for causing the collision!!!! Ocon needs to either stop cheating or go and read the rule book again....
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Ocon is 100% at fault, but Max showed his lack of race craft. Just because you're right, doesn't mean you should have the accident anyway. When a backmarker pulls alongside you, tries to go around the outside, and hangs there afterwards, you know he's not going to back out. So why turn in? Even if you're right, you're going to have an accident. What's the point in being right whilst you're sitting backwards on the run off?
Ocon is at fault, but Max didn't read the situation at all. I feel bad for Max, but he could've avoided that. Ocon had signalled he was going to be a moron, so just give him a wide berth and you'll live for another day.
Backmarkers are allowed to unlap themselves. The blue flags are for slower cars being lapped. If Ocon had unlapped himself and then pulled away then it'd have been fine. And Max would've still been leading.
Ocon is at fault, but Max didn't read the situation at all. I feel bad for Max, but he could've avoided that. Ocon had signalled he was going to be a moron, so just give him a wide berth and you'll live for another day.
Backmarkers are allowed to unlap themselves. The blue flags are for slower cars being lapped. If Ocon had unlapped himself and then pulled away then it'd have been fine. And Max would've still been leading.
That is exactly what Hamilton told him the cool down room. Max seemed to be very attentive. It was surprising to hear Lewis say that. Must be feeling his age.
Wrong, Max had the racing line and was the race leader, hence Ocon was penalised for causing the collision, fact, it was nothing to do with Max, you’ve only picked on him because it’s Max, it could have been any of them, if your a race leader and your in the racing line and lapped someone, you do not expect the person you just lapped to come back and attack you at the next corner!
Go and look at it again, Ocon clearly attacked Max! Max was ahead around the corner and even under normal overtaking rules Ocon MUST pull back because he lost position, anyway you spin it Max was NOT at fault!
Theirs a big reason Ocon has been dropped by all teams for next season... he was hoping for a Mercedes drive in 2020 let’s hope not with his crash record... Ocon has had a LOT of crashes this year and if I remember last year too.
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That is exactly what Hamilton told him the cool down room. Max seemed to be very attentive. It was surprising to hear Lewis say that. Must be feeling his age.
You’ll be telling us next he’ll be losing his nose and earnings and floppy hair style next![doublepost=1541969528][/doublepost]Aside from Ocons mess, this was the best race all year! How I wish they’d do this every race.... hoping they will for next year.
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I’m a Max fan. I think he’s the best thing to happen to F1 since Lewis and Vettel. But that doesn’t mean I think he is perfect.
Ocon was 100% in the wrong. Max was 100% in the right. But Max has the opportunity to avoid that accident and keep the lead and he didn’t take it. Ocon was a moron but he sign posted his stupidity extremely early and Max didn’t read he sign.
Max was 100% right to do what he did. He did absolutely nothing “wrong”. But it’s no use being wrong when you’re backwards with a damaged car. Let the idiot who was actually in the wrong make the stupid move and deal with him later. Your priority is keeping the car in the lead of the race, undamaged. That’s called race craft.
Lewis saying it is a perfect example because he used to be like Max back in the day. He had an incident with Maldonado at Valencia which was similar. Lewis was 100% right but Pastor took him out anyway. Lewis learned from that and now let’s people make stupid moves and he doesn’t get mixed up in it.
Being a racing driver isn’t about doing something because you’re right. It’s about getting the car to the end of the race. If this attitude of “I’m right, I’ll do what I want” happened in sportscar racing then nobody would ever finish Le Mans. Be smart, let idiots be idiots and don’t get caught up in stupidity. Watch the Nürburgring 24 and tell me how many accidents were avoided by the driver in the right.
Still think Max is awesome. He’s just young. He’s learnt that lesson the same way Lewis did. He’s got plenty more wins in his future and he’ll survive future moves learning from this.
Ocon was 100% in the wrong. Max was 100% in the right. But Max has the opportunity to avoid that accident and keep the lead and he didn’t take it. Ocon was a moron but he sign posted his stupidity extremely early and Max didn’t read he sign.
Max was 100% right to do what he did. He did absolutely nothing “wrong”. But it’s no use being wrong when you’re backwards with a damaged car. Let the idiot who was actually in the wrong make the stupid move and deal with him later. Your priority is keeping the car in the lead of the race, undamaged. That’s called race craft.
Lewis saying it is a perfect example because he used to be like Max back in the day. He had an incident with Maldonado at Valencia which was similar. Lewis was 100% right but Pastor took him out anyway. Lewis learned from that and now let’s people make stupid moves and he doesn’t get mixed up in it.
Being a racing driver isn’t about doing something because you’re right. It’s about getting the car to the end of the race. If this attitude of “I’m right, I’ll do what I want” happened in sportscar racing then nobody would ever finish Le Mans. Be smart, let idiots be idiots and don’t get caught up in stupidity. Watch the Nürburgring 24 and tell me how many accidents were avoided by the driver in the right.
Still think Max is awesome. He’s just young. He’s learnt that lesson the same way Lewis did. He’s got plenty more wins in his future and he’ll survive future moves learning from this.
Great little win off the back of Verstappen’s bad luck or Lewis, what was Ocon doing? Should have given him a wide berth until the corner was finished though so Max judged poorly there I think. He should also have a talking to for acting like a dick in the weigh room too. Entertaining for us though lol. I always say Max is a great talent and if he lands the eighth drive at the right time he’ll be a WDC. However he’s not getting rid of this immaturity any time soon and he needs to realise it needs to go.
But that’s like saying Max should ignore the racing rules and presume the other driver will always ignore them!
Let’s not forget, Ocon doing what he did gave Mercedes the Constructors Championship, Ocons car was powered by Mercedes, Ocon apparently wants a Mercedes seat in 2020 even though he has none for next year.. and arrogant Lewis was stood there proclaiming he’d ‘be in a different mindset’ after being given the constructors championship by Ocon....
As someone who’s son works in F1 once told me, it’s one dirty political game, and Mercedes like to bend the rules..
You won’t hear that much unless you are in the sport, they’ll win anyway they can, anyway... I cannot wait for the new complete rewrite of rules in 2020, if that means Mercedes and Ferrari quit so be it, don’t let the door hit you on the way out, and I’d extend that to Red Bull too if they behaved the same.
[doublepost=1541972665][/doublepost]FYI I just read when Ocon rammed Max he was actually a lap down!!! So he was two laps behind yet apparently felt the need to ‘unlap himself’.... by ramming the race leader.
And others have already started calling Ocon a cheat because he wants a Mercedes seat in 2020, that was reported on Sky F1!
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In F1 racing, as in many other situations in life, it is possible to be 100% legally right, and still end up losing.
The stewards could have given Ocon a 1-minute penalty. They could have black-flagged him or given him a race suspension. But they simply could not move Max Verstappen ahead of Lewis Hamilton by so much as a second.
Verstappen made a mistake. That's what maturity and experience teach drivers like Hamilton. That when passing back-markers you need to be extra careful. You need to keep your eye on the big picture. That sometimes you don't need to be a "hero", that nobody really would have cared if Verstappen beat Hamilton by 5 seconds or 55 seconds. Verstappen should have been patient. Hamilton wasn't catching up to him. With Hamilton's tire situation that simply wasn't going to happen.
Compare Verstappen's action passing Ocon with the way Hamilton dealt with back-markers when he had regained the lead, and Verstappen actually was catching up to him. Super, super careful.
Imagine Verstappen really did catch and pass Hamilton on lap 67. Hamilton would be disappointed not to have won the race. But still better for his record, and his team's Constructors Championship, to finish the race high in the points, rather than spin out trying to rush your way past a lapped back marker.
I think it was Nicki Lauda who said it: The best way to win an F1 race is to do it as slowly as possible.
Christian Horner has some work to do over the off-season. Verstappen is an incredible talent and likely the future of F1. But he's still got some growing up to do.
And yet again you’ve blamed Max stereotyping him because it’s Max, despite the fact he did NOTHING WRONG WHAT SO EVER!!
But you keep on stereotyping him and making excuses for Ocon, despite as every, single, ex F1 driver and F1 champion including Damon Hill on Sky sports has ONLY blamed Ocon and not blamed Max ONE BIT!
I’ll take what they say over anyone else’s opinions, as all these F1 drivers and champions stared you do NOT expect a back market to lunge at you!
Max and Red Bull we’re racing as per the rules, yet somehow it’s their fault a back marker chose to ignore those rules and rammed them off the track...
While Ocon has been oportioned blame universally, Martin Brundle definitely talked about Max not needing to be involved to have an incident. Ocon was clearly on a mission and certainly should’ve been more careful, but Max should also have seen what was going on.
On this note I’m not sure Max’s attitude will change anytime soon. The Red Bull attitude or Helmut Marko, Christian Horner and Jos all fuel Max’s entitled mood and I can’t see this changing anytime soon. An interesting thing, for example, from Mexico was that the hydraulics failure from Ricciardo was a Red Bull part, and it is clear that the packaging of the Red Bull contributes to their reliability issues, but this is rarely acknowledged.
What do you want me to say?
The best possible reading is that Verstappen was very unlucky to have made contact with Ocon. If that's the case, then I'd say that pretty much every F1 driver sometimes gets unlucky. Lewis Hamilton has had power units fails on him. So has Sebastian Vettel, Ricciardo, etc etc. Bad luck happens.
Was Lewis Hamilton lucky that today Verstappen collided with Ocon? Absolutely. But its also true that Hamilton took that good luck and made the most of it. But was it also bad luck that put Hamilton on a tire set that wasn't ideal for the race down at Interlagos? I mean, all things being equal, Hamilton qualified faster than Verstappen and Ricciardo, Vettel and Raikkonen.
I wouldn't have been mad if Max Verstappen had won in Brazil. By all reasonable standards, he deserved the win. But he didn't. IMHO Verstappen screwed up by being too aggressive passing backmarkers.
It's quite acceptable to disagree with that opinion. But it's not going to change the outcome. If Verstappen were smart he'd learn something from this. But if he decides to simply blame his failure 100% on somebody else - then it's (long term) going to impact his ability to be an F1 Champion.
Indeed. Video of Max and Esteban getting into quite a shoving match in the garage on reddit/formula1. The conspiracy fans are already asking what Estaban is receiving from Mercedes for turning into Max.
How about you stop ignoring the rules of F1, stop stereotyping and blaming Max. But you won’t so no point in saying it.
Max did absolutely nothing wrong, yet because it’s him everybody just blames him and ignores the F1 rules on overtaking.
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I never heard Brindle say that, he totally blamed Ocon, even more so after seeing the video again. He said Ocon had no right to charge at Max like that.
I don’t think Max did anything wrong but he did go wheel to wheel with a back marker and we’ve seen Hamilton in similar situations just back off and live to fight another day. Max just needs to learn every point counts and sometimes you lose a battle to win the war. I think when he watches it tomorrow and sees how stupid he looks shoving Ocon he’ll mature a bit. He probably wins the race next time he’s in a similar situation. All that aside I enjoyed Max’s performance today. He deserved the win but raced well and I loved seeing his passion come through in the defeat.
Ocon was in the wrong, but I did feel sorry for Max. He looked like a clear winner.
Given his comments on the radio, I think RBR could have met him straight after the race as it was clear he was going to lose it when he caught Ocon at the weight in.
Still it wasn’t a Schumacher verses Cultard was it? Just a bit of nothing!
But overall a good exciting race.
Given his comments on the radio, I think RBR could have met him straight after the race as it was clear he was going to lose it when he caught Ocon at the weight in.
Still it wasn’t a Schumacher verses Cultard was it? Just a bit of nothing!
But overall a good exciting race.
It's not like saying that at all.
Ok, extreme example here but you'll understand my point. You are approaching a junction. Your traffic light is green. As you enter the junction you spot a red light runner. You're going to make contact with him. Do you continue on, because you are legally in the right, and that's all that matters? Or do you take avoiding action and let the idiot through?
Max should've let Ocon go. He had nothing to gain by combatting him. Again, Ocon is 100% in the wrong for what he did - he's a moron and should be penalised accordingly. However, Max had the opportunity to avoid the incident and didn't. And it wasn't like Ocon dived from 10m behind. He was properly alongside - he signposted his stupidity really early and Max didn't read the sign.
Knowledge is knowing the street is one way. Wisdom is checking both directions anyway.
Brundle did say that but he also agreed with Lewis’s post race sentiment about avoiding that position. Max was pissed because he didn’t realise lapped cars could unlap themselves. I seem to recall Senna and Barrichello having a similar incident without the crash.