How is it expensive, time consuming, and difficult to transition to Windows OS? I use both interchangeably and have for years - what's the big deal?
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2018 MBP - Am I screwed?
- Thread starter jkehaniii
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How is it expensive, time consuming, and difficult to transition to Windows OS? I use both interchangeably and have for years - what's the big deal?
I think your thread title may be a little dramatic for the situation you are in. I have the 2017 13 inch model with the 256gb drive and it has been working fine for me, no keyboard issues yet.
I would go for a walk and shake the nerves out and then just write down your requirements including when you need the laptop by and make a simple rational decision. You can either wait until some date or you cannot wait and need a laptop immediately. When the time comes pick the laptop you want that meets your requirements, fits your budget, and you like it. Simple as that.
Fear of what may or may not come or happen to you is not how you make decisions. If you would like to purchase insurance then buy the apple care. It is your money, your life, you are in full control just don't get whipped up in an emotional storm and start fretting as it leads to nothing at best and bad decision making at worst.
I would go for a walk and shake the nerves out and then just write down your requirements including when you need the laptop by and make a simple rational decision. You can either wait until some date or you cannot wait and need a laptop immediately. When the time comes pick the laptop you want that meets your requirements, fits your budget, and you like it. Simple as that.
Fear of what may or may not come or happen to you is not how you make decisions. If you would like to purchase insurance then buy the apple care. It is your money, your life, you are in full control just don't get whipped up in an emotional storm and start fretting as it leads to nothing at best and bad decision making at worst.
While your point is valid, there is definitely a bigger problem than existed in previous years.... My company's "Desktop" team gets a *lot* more keyboard issues with the 2016/17 MBP15's than they ever saw with the 2015 and earlier units. Wouldn't be that huge a deal if it wasn't *also* coupled with a design that forces a stupidly excessive repair bill when a key fails.
The trouble then is what do you do in three years? System out of warranty, can't extend AC+, *and* you could be facing a depressed resale value if the problem continues to mount as the 16/17 units age.
At this point, I'd buy either a used 2015 from a place like MacofAllTrades with a degree of warranty, or I would buy a refurb 2015 from Apple, even as galling as it is to pay those prices for a 2015 model. Still, if a 2012 unit was serving the person's needs today in 2018, then a 2015 unit ought to serve that person's needs into 2020/2021 at which point perhaps the scene will be different.
That's like saying: the Ford Pinto is fine since mine hasn't blown up yet.
It depends on whether you need to purchase new software (cost) and how to integrate Mac into a Windows platform. I have found it fairly easy to support Windows on Mac, but supporting Macs and iOS devices when Windows is the primary platform is much more difficult.
E.g., I use my Mac Server to back up all devices locally. Time Machine is a big help and critical Windows files can be backed up automatically with TM through folder sharing. However, without using the cloud for file storage--I won't for security reasons--Windows lacks a similar robust backup solution that will accommodate Macs and iOS devices. NAS devices claim TM compatibility, but there are often glitches and bugs with the backup process.
Excellent point. Platform switching becomes much more complex if you're deep into the ecosystem and your workflows depend on platform commonality. It's much easier if you just have one single computer and very minimally utilize apple based services/applications.
That Apple isn’t willing to stand behind their expensive high-end laptops for at least 2 years is telling. EU customers already get minimum 2-year warranties. If Apple had the courage to stand behind their products they should make it a minimum 2-year warranty globally!
It’s not just that there’s a lot of evidence showing that these keyboards have significantly (at least twice) the rate of failure, it’s that if you’re unlucky enough to get a failure after the first year (if you don’t live in the EU and possibly some other places) and you don’t have extended warranty they’ll turn around and say it’ll cost you $700 to get it fixed. If I spend $3-4K on a laptop I shouldn’t have to worry about the keyboard breaking after the third year either! This is pure madness and it’s for this and other reasons that many people are saying “Don’t buy the current MacBook Pros!”.
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I don't think it has anything to do with couage but costs. It's not as if they are breaking any laws, so why not profit from repairs 1 year ealier? Pure business decision... not to mention that extending it to 2 years globally would have quite a negative impact on Apple Care. I doubt many people in Europe get AppleCare for that additional 1 year coverage, but for virtually anyone else outside of EU, it makes quite some sense to buy AppleCare and have 2 additional years of coverage. It's not in their interest to now also extend AppleCare to 4 years so that people are still motivated to pay for it. Yes they could do it, but there's really no reason to...
You’re saying this as though what’s good for Apple (maximising profits) is good for the customer. Frankly, I think it’s the reverse, something Apple seems to have forgotten in the Cook era. I don’t trust Apple products without AppleCare anymore (and since they control the repair market repair costs are exorbitant), so it ends up inflating the price of the computer anyway. It’s ridiculous that a $4,000 laptop or $5,000 desktop is only covered for one year! I support the EU’s moves to promote quality and minimise e-waste and the throwaway society. If Apple cares about the environment and the quality of their products they should agree and support it (2-year warranties) out of their own free-will, not be forced to by consumer law. Though Apple won’t admit it, I’m pretty sure they prefer the former, as you yourself seem to imply; the only thing that matters to them is profit.
I won’t buy another computer unless it comes with a 2-year warranty minimum, which fortunately in Australia I believe we’re entitled to as in the EU, but I’d prefer Apple confirm this or I’ll look elsewhere. Why does it matter? Because that sends a signal to the customer that it’s a device of quality and they’re prepared to stand behind it. If such a large proportion of their products are failing within 2 years that they can’t easily roll the cost of a 2-year warranty without adding anything more than a marginal increase to the device cost, then I argue they’re (knowingly) selling flawed or defective products that either have planned obsolescence (designed to break) or aren’t fit for purpose.
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It is a "free market" you know. It's not like anyone is forcing people to pay 4-5k on a laptop if they don't want to. This is how Apple rolls and many seem to be fine with it and they clearly don't seem to be bothered much about not everyone agreeing to their ways. Why would they be any different than virtually any other luxury brand out there? You don't buy a Ferrari because of the amazing quality of the car, heck they tend to break down like crazy... yet people keep on buying them and Ferrari doesn't seem to be worried much. They target a special kind of customer, so does Apple... if you're not that kind of customer, no problem, you have plenty other alternatives. A bigger price tag does not and has never guaranteed higher quality...
While I agree with you that the world should, ideally be a much better place where the customer matters the most and quality is paramount, etc. etc. etc. unfortunately that's not the world we live in. I'm not saying one should just accept things the way they are, it's your right to fight for what you believe in and send whatever signals you think should be sent... Their decision of not extending waranty to 2 years globally, objectively speaking has nothing to do with courage, that's all I'm saying.
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As per the original question. Given AppleCare on the current generation is a must, I’d say it’s absurd to spend that much money for soon-to-be deprecated hardware. Once upon a time it was possible to complete a uni degree without a laptop! I know I did!
Edit: Some quick searching suggests Apple definitely covers all MacBooks in Australia for 2 years regardless of AppleCare status and may do for 3 depending on the model. I’ll ask them myself in person soon. I assume OP is not in AU or EU however.
Edit: Some quick searching suggests Apple definitely covers all MacBooks in Australia for 2 years regardless of AppleCare status and may do for 3 depending on the model. I’ll ask them myself in person soon. I assume OP is not in AU or EU however.
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Yeah, the 2015 is likely on the chopping block for the next Mac OS version after Mojave.
Why do you say that?
Currently the 2012 model is the oldest supported model for Mojave, so I would assume if any model misses the cut it will be the 2013 MBP
Recently bought an Asus notebook; 3 years national & 2 years international cover included. Apple I'm paying more for less hardware, it's staff will blatantly lie that no issue exists and AppleCare pretty much mandatory. Apple was so very confident of the quality of it's product AppleCare would be gratis...
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They did went from 2009/2010 to 2012 with Mojave but I agree that it's unlikely that they would do that again with the next version.
Yeah, I kind of noticed that, people are saying that was due to the higher requirements for Metal. I'm not really following mojave enough to confirm or deny that.
Well if you want a new Apple MBP, then yes you are forced to spend 3-4 thousand dollars on one. There is a perception (and it's always been there) that expensive equates with quality. Apple markets their devices as premium and they charge a heck of a lot of money for them. I disagree that a premium quality device should not have the expectation of higher quality. I do believe that when you spend between 3 and 4 thousand dollars for a MBP, there should be a longer warranty period without having to purchase Apple Care, which inflates the already high price of the computer. My only solution is to purchase these high priced computers with my American Express charge card (Gold or Platinum). Amex doubles the mfg warranty. And I have used it many times on Apple products that have failed after their warranty expired. Amex refunded my purchase price in full. The only Apple computer I have ever bought that has remained trouble-free is the one I am using now - an 8 year old 17" MBP.
Guys, it's not simple as that. I live in the EU, and still, I always purchase Apple Care. Even my own company does.
I'm gonna try to be as simple as I can here... Indeed, it is true. You get 2 years of warranty in EU. Sort of.
If you buy directly from Apple, yes, those two years are (almost) great. But even then, if something breaks after one year, Apple store is gonna try to deny you the second year. Only after you mention EU laws and 2 years of warranty they will reluctantly fix your device.
But if you purchase from anywhere else, Apple will still give you warranty. But for just the first year. For 2nd year they won't, since they don't have to. That task is now for the seller of the device (be it iPhone or MBP). And that 2nd year then becomes a joke. Most sellers will try to avoid this, and it will work out for them. You have to go to court and win your case in order to get that warranty. And no, I'm not joking.
Also, EU has 28 countries. And as far as I know, Apple Store is available in just 9 countries. My own country doesn't have an Apple Store, all we got is Apple resellers. And that's it. And it's like that in most of EU countries.
So that 2nd year is almost worthless for most of EU citizens.
So what do we do? Well, we purchase Apple Care. Mostly via ebay, since Apple won't deliver it to any country where they don't have their own stores. And because it's ebay, and most sellers know this, we have to overpay for the Apple Care. We pay more then it sells for in Apple Stores.
You have narrowed down you choices. After three returns I gave up and went to Windows for now as having a computer was more important.
I'm currently using a 2009 MBP 13" C2D.
I tried the 2017 MBP but didn't like the keyboard. Don't need the TB. Have no thunderbolt accessories whatsoever. Price is high... ugh.
I keep thinking the 2015 MBP 15" is the best choice for me. Good enough for audio work. Don't need a dGPU. Then I look at the price for old tech... ugh.
Maybe I can get by with a MacBook Air until 6-core MBPs are released. Then I look at the dated screen... ugh again.
I've also narrowed down my choices and none of them are appealing enough to fork over the cash. I can adapt to using Thunderbolt 3 (literally), but regardless of any failure issues the 2017 keyboards have I just don't like them for Logic key commands. 2017 MBA with dated screen or 2015 MBP here I come!