$4,800 iPhone bill

[TXCraig]

After two weeks in Europe I found myself at the Dublin airport struggling to use up my 20 megs which cost less than $25 total. .

The going data rate is $20.00 per MB. So if you used 20 that would be 400.00 plus tax. Now- if you have international data plan, that is 25.00 per month with a min of 12 months. People that travel outside the US once of twice a year are not going to get the yearly plan.

 

[artalliance]

Now- if you have international data plan, that is 25.00 per month with a min of 12 months. People that travel outside the US once of twice a year are not going to get the yearly plan.

I concur. I usually visit my family 2x a year in Germany but still would not get the international plan for that.

 

[mojohanna]

I agree that this is a huge problem for Apple and AT&T, because it impacts business customers who would otherwise choose the iphone over other smartphones. This happened to me when I traveled to Italy and China and had data roaming charges of over $1000. One email download alone cost me $126.

The problem here is that there’s no way to control these costs. You can’t turn data off on the iphone (although you can call AT&T and have them disable data when you travel outside the US) without loosing the telephone functions. I know if I talk to America for one hour from China on my iphone that I will run up a big bill, but that’s much different than turning your phone on in the morning, throwing into the briefcase, and having your bill run up like a meter on a taxi cab. People just don’t expect that a service that costs $20 a month for all you can use could possibly cost $1000-$3000.

For all of you who criticize people like me for not knowing that the iphone would run up such a big bill just imagine yourself sitting down at a bar and ordering a beer, only to find that it costs $100 after you’ve finished it. Or park your car at the mall for a few hours to find that the bill comes to $500.

Was the information about international roaming charges buried in the AT&T contract? Sure it was. But I would ask you to also look at the cover page for the iphone on Apple’s website. You will find the following under the AT&T logo…

• Rate Plans for iPhone
All rate plans include Visual Voicemail and unlimited data

Let's get one thing straight. This is NOT Apple's problem. It is AT&T's. Just the same as it would not be Motorola's problem. It is not an issue with the phone or the hardware, it is an issue with the carrier, their network and their terms of service. Apple has nothing to do with AT&T's terms of service or network operation. Leave Apple out of this mess that AT&T has created and to the people who don't bother to ask questions before they go on international trips. People who assume things are just plain stoooopid and deserve what they get.

 

[ErikCLDR]

I feel bad for these people.

Yes, technically they should receive a $5000 bill, but it's too bad they weren't aware that their phones automatically used data minutes.

 

[rayward]

Let's get one thing straight. This is NOT Apple's problem. It is AT&T's. Just the same as it would not be Motorola's problem. It is not an issue with the phone or the hardware, it is an issue with the carrier, their network and their terms of service. Apple has nothing to do with AT&T's terms of service or network operation. Leave Apple out of this mess that AT&T has created and to the people who don't bother to ask questions before they go on international trips. People who assume things are just plain stoooopid and deserve what they get.

It's actually a combination of the two, but more AT&T than Apple. When AT&T were setting up the plans for the iPhone, they - being the experienced wireless provider - should've said "Whoa there! If this thing is going to be pinging the network for data every minute of every day then it's going to be hell for anyone taking outside of the data plan area. We should sell a decent international plan with this or give them a way to shut down the data connection."

Apple didn't think of it, which is poor but they aren't wireless providers.

AT&T didn't think of it or didn't care. If they had half a brain, they would've called up all their existing customers who have an international calling plan (like me) and who'd just switched to the iPhone, and sold them the crappy international plan they currently offer. But it's hard to criticise them for not selling it correctly at the point of sale, because it was all activated online. Though iTunes...

 

[103734]

Agreed! They need to FIX THE PHONE! Apple needs to address basic operation of the phone before they spend time making Starbucks buttons on the phone.

they do have that feature, its called Airplane Mode

 

[TXCraig]

Let's get one thing straight. This is NOT Apple's problem. .

I disagree! Apple is the one that needs to put a switch in the phone settings turning off the data on phone when the phone is on a non AT&T network.

If you have ever owned a different smartphone like a blackberry, Palm, or even a SideKick they all have this ability.

AT&T does not have to give you a reasonable roaming data plan- but Apple does need to fix this on the phone.

I think APPLE should have insisted AT&T provide a international plan like is available on a blackberry from ANY providor including AT&T.

 

[TXCraig]

they do have that feature, its called Airplane Mode

How do you get calls and SMS messages in airplane mode? They need to add a switch JUST for roaming data that will still allow the device to be used as a phone.

 

[LanikaiGirl]

Not to mention that wifi does not work in airplane mode either.

 

[method525]

It's actually a combination of the two, but more AT&T than Apple. When AT&T were setting up the plans for the iPhone, they - being the experienced wireless provider - should've said "Whoa there! If this thing is going to be pinging the network for data every minute of every day then it's going to be hell for anyone taking outside of the data plan area. We should sell a decent international plan with this or give them a way to shut down the data connection."

Apple didn't think of it, which is poor but they aren't wireless providers.

AT&T didn't think of it or didn't care. If they had half a brain, they would've called up all their existing customers who have an international calling plan (like me) and who'd just switched to the iPhone, and sold them the crappy international plan they currently offer. But it's hard to criticise them for not selling it correctly at the point of sale, because it was all activated online. Though iTunes...

Calling up all there existing customers would be a monumental task and would be a waste of time for most customers. They could take the time to call up CS and find out what additional charges they may incur if they go out of the country. People are not surprised that they will see additional charges if they use voice while out the country, so why should someone be surprised that data incurs an extra charge

 

[notjustjay]

Actually, I don't recall saying that was a bad idea. I think it would be a great idea, but I also don't think you should whine about a big bill just because there isn't one.

True. But it would be nice for someone like me to have, when I'm going out of country and want to be DARNED SURE that I won't have accidentally left something on. Being hit with a big bill is a bad way to find out that I forgot a setting somewhere.

(And by "big bill" in this case I don't mean $4800 for "Oops, I guess all that Google Maps and Facebook wasn't free after all! Nyuk!" but, say, forgetting that Mail checked in and downloaded a big attachment, or something like that.)

 

[atszyman]

True. But it would be nice for someone like me to have, when I'm going out of country and want to be DARNED SURE that I won't have accidentally left something on. Being hit with a big bill is a bad way to find out that I forgot a setting somewhere.

(And by "big bill" in this case I don't mean $4800 for "Oops, I guess all that Google Maps and Facebook wasn't free after all! Nyuk!" but, say, forgetting that Mail checked in and downloaded a big attachment, or something like that.)

Well you can turn off automatic checking of you're email accounts and try to make sure that your friends/family/work know you're traveling, so don't send large attachments.

With the only data usage being voicemail and whatever updating the phone does you should get off fairly cheap, and possibly free if you call and complain to at&t that there is no way to turn it off (they did offer a $1500 credit to this family which should be more than enough to take care of accesses they had no control over). Alternatively you can call at&t and have them turn off your data plan and only used WiFi hotspots to do email and surfing.

Yes there should be a simple switch to turn off non-WiFi network access, but there are some alternatives to avoid large bills at your finger tips, just not quite as easy as a single button.

For this family the lack of a switch was not their problem. Even if they could turn off the network access, a $4800 bill is from them doing active surfing/emailing which is all their fault for not figuring out how much non-domestic internet would cost them on the phones. They obviously know how to search the web. Since multi-thousand dollar iPhone bills being sent to people while traveling internationally have been out since weeks after the iPhone launch, it almost makes them look like either idiots, or they did this intentionally for the publicity/chance to sue.

 

[dangleheart]

Since multi-thousand dollar iPhone bills being sent to people while traveling internationally have been out since weeks after the iPhone launch, it almost makes them look like either idiots

Sure, YOU can call them idiots but I sure hope AT&T and Apple do not take that attitude. They want to sell to millions and millions of such 'idiots' and not just to the 50 thousand or so who spend a lot of time on internet forums keeping upto date on the news. For most people, people have busy lives and the last item in their mind is to keep track of news about their silly phone.

 

[CWallace]

I agree ATT and Apple could possibly make a bit more effort, but how far does it need to go?

Will it be like many car navigation systems, and every time we activate a data service (mail, maps, weather, safari, etc.) our iPhone outside the US a screen pops up that requires we acknowledge there will be fees? Wouldn't that get aggravating after about the third time, much less the thousand and third time?

 

[atszyman]

Sure, YOU can call them idiots but I sure hope AT&T and Apple do not take that attitude. They want to sell to millions and millions of such 'idiots' and not just to the 50 thousand or so who spend a lot of time on internet forums keeping upto date on the news. For most people, people have busy lives and the last item in their mind is to keep track of news about their silly phone.

I don't expect at&t or Apple to call them idiots. But why is it not big news when someone took their freebie world phone to Europe and racked up an extra $200 in phone charges? Does at&t offer rebates for these people? My guess is that they don't. When they call up they are probably politely pointed to where the international rates are published, and the iPhone's international rates were published. It's not at&t's, nor Apple's fault that people don't check on how much their behavior is going to cost, but for some odd reason it's big news when someone has to take consequences for actions they took that could have easily been avoided with about 5 minutes of research.

 

[whistler72]

i say they aren't telling the truth.

 

[TXCraig]

I don't expect at&t or Apple to call them idiots. But why is it not big news when someone took their freebie world phone to Europe and racked up an extra $200 in phone charges? Does at&t offer rebates for these people? My guess is that they don't. .

Your missing the point. If you take a world phone to euope on holiday for 2 weeks and don't use it at all to make calls or send sms messages... how much would the bill be? Nothing. Some people like to have a phone with them in case someone needs to reach them or its a emergency.

Take you iPhone to Euorpe for 2 weeks... and do nothing with it but listen to music and what is your bill when you get home? Who knows? It will be something im sure. At 20.00 a meg you might be looking at 100.00 to 200.00 in roaming data as the iPhone is all the time chatting away over its wireless data conneciton updating things on the phone. If someone calls you and you don't take the call... your still going to pay as the voice mail file is going to be sent to the phone... like it or not!

And yes.. you can diable your mail accounts, stop your calls from going to voice mail... call AT&T and cancel your data plan... take the SIM out so you can't get any calls... even if someone needs to reach you... turn it on airplane mode so you can't even use WiFi.... stand on your head and click your heels together.... or... WAIT... add a switch to turn off the roaming data... like every other smart phone on the market.... naw, that's too easy...

That is the difference.

 

[atszyman]

Your missing the point. If you take a world phone to euope on holiday for 2 weeks and don't use it at all to make calls or send sms messages... how much would the bill be? Nothing. Some people like to have a phone with them in case someone needs to reach them or its a emergency.

Take you iPhone to Euorpe for 2 weeks... and do nothing with it but listen to music and what is your bill when you get home? Who knows? It will be something im sure. At 20.00 a meg you might be looking at 100.00 to 200.00 in roaming data as the iPhone is all the time chatting away over its wireless data conneciton updating things on the phone.

That is the difference.

And at&t offered to take $1500 off the bill. If they could prove that their phone did more than that without any input from them (not counting auto checking of email which they could have turned off) then at&t should be refunding that amount. My guess is that the charges they have no control over amount to far less than the $1500 they were offered. The rest of the bill is their responsibility and their fault. Just because you didn't bother to look up the consequences does not mean you are exempt from them.

I also know that you can call at&t and shut off data access via GPRS/edge and have it turned back on upon your return, thus getting rid of the charges that would have accrued. A simple phone call to at&t before they went on their trip could have solved their issues as well.

 

[TXCraig]

A simple phone call to at&t before they went on their trip could have solved their issues as well.

So now we need to call AT&T and clear it every time we go on vacation? What if they tell me I'm not allowed to go?

 

[KSpider]

So now we need to call AT&T and clear it every time we go on vacation? What if they tell me I'm not allowed to go?

Wrong - a call to find out how your phone works while out of the country is a smart thing to do. Especially if you don't know what the heck is going on and complain about a $4000 bill. A simple call would have fixed their problem.

 

[atszyman]

So now we need to call AT&T and clear it every time we go on vacation? What if they tell me I'm not allowed to go?

Let me say this one more time.

A switch to shut off EDGE/GPRS data access is a really good idea. However, the terms for international data usage are on at&t's site and there is a warning in your terms of service that travel abroad could result in large fees even if the phone is not used to check email/websites.

You can call at&t and have your data access turned off if you really need to take your phone with you. They will not keep you from your vacation. For most people who have run up these bills and called to complain have had at&t offer some sort of rebate usually amounting to far more than the automatic data accesses could have accrued. If you can prove that the automatic data accesses were more than this, I agree that at&t should offer to refund that amount. However every time I've seen these stories posted the iPhone user seems to want a full refund taking no responsibility for the internet access that they had complete control over. I think at&t has the right idea in refunding an amount that should more than cover the automatic accesses, but their responsibility goes no further than that.

 

[megfilmworks]

The going data rate is $20.00 per MB. So if you used 20 that would be 400.00 plus tax. Now- if you have international data plan, that is 25.00 per month with a min of 12 months. People that travel outside the US once of twice a year are not going to get the yearly plan.

12x25 = $300 Still $100 cheaper if you only go over once. They will if they can do simple math.

 

[megfilmworks]

Let me say this one more time.

A switch to shut off EDGE/GPRS data access is a really good idea.

I agree it is a good idea, but there are about 100 better and more useful things that most everyone would like to see first. After all how many iPhones are we talking about traveling abroad with owners who can't afford data and are clueless? Less than 1%?? Let's concentrate on the really important features we all want.

 

[Rodimus Prime]

I agree it is a good idea, but there are about 100 better and more useful things that most everyone would like to see first. After all how many iPhones are we talking about traveling abroad with owners who can't afford data and are clueless? Less than 1%?? Let's concentrate on the really important features we all want.

question 2 how long would it take to do this feature. Ummm next to none. a lot less time that to add the others. It would be added one little thing to the menu and then very little in coding it to turn it off.

I honestly think it was rather stupid of apple NOT to include that feature.

 

[julric01]

This is crazy - there should be no discussion about alternatives...

This is a no brainer - there shouldn't even be discussions about any other alternatives - they just need to add a GPRS/Data on/off option.

I've owned other GSM phones and they've all had that option - it's basic - we're not talking some fancy new "beta" feature that needs a bunch of programming.

Even if you turn off your e-mail, and don't surf on EDGE - the problem I find is that there are lots of times when my iPhone shows I'm connected to WiFi, you start to load some page and all of the sudden it shows the E in the corner - bang - you've been switched to EDGE - there's no way to control it. I should be able to use WiFi and also be able to take calls - period - without having to call AT&T or jumping through hoops.

This is an Apple issue the way I see it.