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5K light bleed (and lag)
- Thread starter BJB Productions
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I agree that obsession is bad, no matter how it manifests. I don't see my light bleed most of the time under normal uses. However, if I'm watching a movie I can certainly notice it around the edges of the screen. This is a normal use case, no?
I'm not exchanging my RiMac or anything, but I think many of us have certain tolerances of things like this, and it's a shame that a product this expensive exhibits an issue with its centerpiece feature.
THAT said, black levels in general are FAR superior to the 2012/2013 iMacs. The off-axis IPS glow is basically non-existent now, which is a big surprise to me.
I didn't realize how little off-axis IPS glow the Retina iMac has until I looked at my 27'' 2010
I didn't realize how little off-axis IPS glow the Retina iMac has until I looked at my 27'' 2010
Yes, it's a huge difference, even from the newer form factor of the 2012/2013 models. Night/day difference.
Fair enough, thanks.
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Yeah sort of a agree. If you get a good IPS panel tho it is quite a sight to behold. The newer Apple retina screens are amazing, especially the colour gamut on the iPad air and rMBP. It's such a shame that backlight bleeding mostly cannot be avoided due to manufacturing variances. I believe a tiny variance in applying the backlight panel to the display causes exessive backlight bleeding. My rMBP late 2013 and my iPad air 2 have basically no backlight bleeding but I had to exchange both before I got good ones.
To be fair most people will not use a screen in a dark room on full brightness looking at a black image. However if the bleeding is so bad that it can be noticed while watching movies its not acceptable.
I hear that OLED screens don't have bleeding because they don't use backlights. What's the main difference between OLED IPS displays? I understand that OLED displays have better black levels but that's about all I know.
I can clearly see extensive backlight bleeding when watching videos that have night scenes in them. So basically the entire time during Sin City: A Dame to Kill For. Simply watching a movie apparently isn't considered normal use to you, something that strikes me as odd. I don't obsess about it, but I do find the issue incredibly annoying for a machine of this price. I can also assure you I'm not imaging backlight bleed when there actually isn't. My 2010 iMac didn't have the problem.
backlight bleed - 2nd copy
2nd copy on the right, slightly better. Much better in the bottom right corner, slightly worse at the top left corner.
And yes, it looks much worse on the pictures than it is in reality. Yet, as other members have mentioned, it is distractling when you watch a movie, especially if it is a letterboxed movie.
Anybody else exchanged their iMac because of the backlight bleed issue?
My guess is that the issue is caused by tensions in either the display or the case because the pattern changes if you apply slight pressure to the glass or if you slightly flex the case.
2nd copy on the right, slightly better. Much better in the bottom right corner, slightly worse at the top left corner.
And yes, it looks much worse on the pictures than it is in reality. Yet, as other members have mentioned, it is distractling when you watch a movie, especially if it is a letterboxed movie.
Anybody else exchanged their iMac because of the backlight bleed issue?
My guess is that the issue is caused by tensions in either the display or the case because the pattern changes if you apply slight pressure to the glass or if you slightly flex the case.
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Just got my 5K retina display and definite backlight bleeding issues specifically in top left hand corner. Debating whether to exchange or not. I opened a case with Apple and they are having engineering look at the photo. For 3K you shouldn't have backlight bleed issues. I have never had this issue on any Mac until now.
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I've had 2, a base and BTO and they both have/had the backlight bleed in upper corner like that. Also other posters of panels with backlight bleed, their panels showed a similar effect as well. I think it how these panels are manufactured. Do what you need to but I think this it for this generation of panels, and if panel has uniform whites and no dead pixels your replacement might not be better or have other issues. Nature of LCD tech.
You can try slightly "massaging" the panel with a microfiber cloth. I've found sometimes this can smooth out some of the bleed, won't remove it completely but might help mitigate the issue. Good luck.
For those who are thinking that they can't get a better screen if they return theirs, here is some contradictory evidence. I am returning the one on the left and keeping the one on the right. While it is not perfect (the left part of the screen has some bleed), I feel it is still better than the last one and I will at least give it a try.
The second screen is less bright (and less intense) and a little more yellow (less blue). I find it less spectacular than the first one, but it feels more confortable.
I also felt the first screen had a "fisheye" effect on some parts. I mean by that that I sometimes felt that the screen was curbed in some places. I don't know how to describe it otherwise, but the new screen feels "straighter", even if I still get a little bit of what I called the "fisheye" effect.
The second screen is less bright (and less intense) and a little more yellow (less blue). I find it less spectacular than the first one, but it feels more confortable.
I also felt the first screen had a "fisheye" effect on some parts. I mean by that that I sometimes felt that the screen was curbed in some places. I don't know how to describe it otherwise, but the new screen feels "straighter", even if I still get a little bit of what I called the "fisheye" effect.
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You got to love the screen on the Samsung Galaxy Tab S. Here's my Samsung, next to my retina iPad, both showing full screen black jpegs on half brightness. (And incidentally the Samsung screen is WAY brighter on half brightness):
1 second exposure, f/2.8 ISO 1600. (And if you are really picky, the hot pixel is on my camera sensor, not the Samsung screen!)
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You do know how blacks work on AMOLED, yes?
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New one is indeed better. But....fisheye??
Indeed.
Perhaps a different way of phrasing it would be "you do know what a load of garbage LCD is, don't you".
For this reason I've had plasma TV's since 2000 (the first Panasonic 3 series, with the decent black levels) and only recently have found any LCD TV's to produce even vaguely acceptable black level or screen uniformity (though they are all "poor" at best). My main TV is still a Pioneer Kuro.
Samsung PVA LCD panels are much better in this regard than the very dreadful IPS based panels that seem to have become preferred due to their better viewing angles and slightly better colour gamut. But the clouding and black level with IPS is dismal on an absolute basis, isn't it.
4k or 8k OLED is the way to go and will supersede LCD pretty shortly, thank god.
I sincerely hope not.
Why, you might ask? Well, yes, AMOLED does a great job with blacks because it turns off those LEDs. However, AMOLED absolutely, positively sucks with whites. And hey, guess what I use on my iPad 99% of the time. Web browsing, email etc. And guess what color the screen mostly is? Yep, white.
I wouldn't swap my my iPad Air 2 for any AMOLED-based device. I feel slightly embarrassed for my neighbor when I have to read on his HTC One M8 vs my iPhone 6 Plus. Lovely phone, mind, but AMOLED? No thank you. Not yet.
Here's my previous one, my replacement seems a little yellow on bottom but don't want to play the exchange game I'll stick with this one!
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I think it's a good choice to stick with it. If the photograph is representative, your new one is the best i've seen so far.
It looks so good i'm wondering if I should try my luck once again (knowing things could get worse).
But I enjoy the replacement I got.
I don't know if LG makes all the 5k displays, but the replacement I got feels like a completely different display (blacks are more profound, the whites feel more yellow than blue, easier to look at, even if less spectacular, etc.). I played with the calibration with the we computers side by side and they were two very different beasts.
I'm
Going to take another photo when I get home and I'll post it yes my whites are more warm yellow in color better on the eyes, I wanted to order another one separately and set them side to side before I decide In keeping it
My screen is even tone and un-noticable light bleed:
Of course if I crank the brightness up to the max in a blacked out room you would notice it.
Of course if I crank the brightness up to the max in a blacked out room you would notice it.
Looks like mine looks good yours have a slight yellow towards bottom portion of screen
ive owned allot of imacs and cinema displays/tb displays and all but 1 has ever been what i call perfect with all others bleeding like a fat girl on her time of the month.
You'd be surprised what a difference those black blacks make. I really do hope the 6s Plus comes with OLED and a 2K resolution to compete with Android offerings, as a good display means a lot to me (hence my choice of the 5K iMac).
Although your picture may be a tad overexposed.
I sincerely hope not.
Why, you might ask? Well, yes, AMOLED does a great job with blacks because it turns off those LEDs. However, AMOLED absolutely, positively sucks with whites. And hey, guess what I use on my iPad 99% of the time. Web browsing, email etc. And guess what color the screen mostly is? Yep, white.
I wouldn't swap my my iPad Air 2 for any AMOLED-based device. I feel slightly embarrassed for my neighbor when I have to read on his HTC One M8 vs my iPhone 6 Plus. Lovely phone, mind, but AMOLED? No thank you. Not yet.
I'm sorry mate, but I think you're misinformed here. I have no idea what sub-standard device you've been looking at, but OLED is clearly superior to LCD in pretty much every parameter. And it certainly has no issues with whites whatsoever.
EDIT: You do know that the HTC One M8 has an LCD screen, don't you?
Googling "oled colour gamut greyscale tracking" brings you this on line 1:
LG OLED TV Display Technology Shoot-Out
http://www.displaymate.com/LG_OLED_TV_ShootOut_1.htm
In particular, note the paragraph on colour accuracy: "The detailed Lab Measurements section shows that the THX Cinema and ISF Expert modes are calibrated so accurately that they are visually indistinguishable from perfect. The Color Gamut is 99% of the sRGB/Rec.709 Standard. White Point, Primary Colors, Reference Colors, and Color Tracking Accuracy are all close to 1 JNCD (Just Noticeable Color Difference), so the eye sees them as visually indistinguishable from perfect"
This entirely consistent with other reviews.
Not only does LCD suffer from all the problems we know about - clouding, backlight bleed, poor black levels, poor viewing angles, motion blur, lack of colour uniformity - it doesn't surpass OLED with respect to colour gamut, nor white levels, greyscale tracking, gamma response or power consumption. OLED is already much better overall than LCD and will only get better.
If you take a look at the (admittedly eye-wateringly expensive) Sony BVM-X300 40" OLED monitor, it is a thing of unimagineable wonderfulness, far surpassing the performance of any LCD monitor in every conceivable way.
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Of course! It's wildly overexposed or you would just see pure black jpeg! It was b****y dark in there when I took the photo!
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why doesnt apple swicth to OLED screens then especially on the super high end product where price is no object on its intended market.