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5K light bleed (and lag)

teknikal90 said:
why doesnt apple swicth to OLED screens then especially on the super high end product where price is no object on its intended market.
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I have no idea. If I was to guess, I'd say perhaps it's because they are not easy to make (currently) at a competitive price point and only Samsung seem to be able to do that right now. And since Samsung and Apple aren't exactly bosom buddies, then Apple aren't going to source screens from Samsung.

But it you read reviews of the Apple iPad Air2 (or Air) vs the Samsung Galaxy Tab S (only the S has the OLED screen), you will see all sorts of opinions, with perhaps most reviews saying the Apple is slightly better overall. But virtually every review says the Samsung screen is better. And believe me when you see them side by side, the Samsung screen is just miles better. Really miles, it's not a subtle difference.

Here's what the same review site says of the Samsung display:

"Best Tablet Display: Based on our extensive Lab tests and measurements, the Galaxy Tab S is the Best Performing Tablet Display that we have ever tested... The Galaxy Tab S establishes new records for best Tablet display performance in: Highest Color Accuracy, Infinite Contrast Ratio, Lowest Screen Reflectance, and smallest Brightness Variation with Viewing Angle."

The whole review is here:

http://www.displaymate.com/OLED_Tablet_ShootOut_1.htm
 
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Chippy99 said:
I have no idea. If I was to guess, I'd say perhaps it's because they are not easy to make (currently) at a competitive price point and only Samsung seem to be able to do that right now. And since Samsung and Apple aren't exactly bosom buddies, then Apple aren't going to source screens from Samsung.

But it you read reviews of the Apple iPad Air2 (or Air) vs the Samsung Galaxy Tab S (only the S has the OLED screen), you will see all sorts of opinions, with perhaps most reviews saying the Apple is slightly better overall. But virtually every review says the Samsung screen is better. And believe me when you see them side by side, the Samsung screen is just miles better. Really miles, it's not a subtle difference.

Here's what the same review site says of the Samsung display:

"Best Tablet Display: Based on our extensive Lab tests and measurements, the Galaxy Tab S is the Best Performing Tablet Display that we have ever tested... The Galaxy Tab S establishes new records for best Tablet display performance in: Highest Color Accuracy, Infinite Contrast Ratio, Lowest Screen Reflectance, and smallest Brightness Variation with Viewing Angle."

The whole review is here:

http://www.displaymate.com/OLED_Tablet_ShootOut_1.htm
Click to expand...

I'm surprised Apple wasn't the first to jump on that tech.
 
Chippy99 said:
I'm sorry mate, but I think you're misinformed here. I have no idea what sub-standard device you've been looking at, but OLED is clearly superior to LCD in pretty much every parameter. And it certainly has no issues with whites whatsoever.

EDIT: You do know that the HTC One M8 has an LCD screen, don't you?

Googling "oled colour gamut greyscale tracking" brings you this on line 1:

LG OLED TV Display Technology Shoot-Out

http://www.displaymate.com/LG_OLED_TV_ShootOut_1.htm

In particular, note the paragraph on colour accuracy: "The detailed Lab Measurements section shows that the THX Cinema and ISF Expert modes are calibrated so accurately that they are visually indistinguishable from perfect. The Color Gamut is 99% of the sRGB/Rec.709 Standard. White Point, Primary Colors, Reference Colors, and Color Tracking Accuracy are all close to 1 JNCD (Just Noticeable Color Difference), so the eye sees them as visually indistinguishable from perfect"

This entirely consistent with other reviews.

Not only does LCD suffer from all the problems we know about - clouding, backlight bleed, poor black levels, poor viewing angles, motion blur, lack of colour uniformity - it doesn't surpass OLED with respect to colour gamut, nor white levels, greyscale tracking, gamma response or power consumption. OLED is already much better overall than LCD and will only get better.

If you take a look at the (admittedly eye-wateringly expensive) Sony BVM-X300 40" OLED monitor, it is a thing of unimagineable wonderfulness, far surpassing the performance of any LCD monitor in every conceivable way.!
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My mistake. I meant Galaxy S5. Not HTC One M8 (me stupid). Like I said, I've yet to see ANY mainstream OLED devices that can get whites correctly. Maybe these outrageously expensive TVs can do it. But nothing in the mainstream. iMac is mainstream (albeit on the high-end), iPhone is mainstream, iPad is mainstream. An undoubtedly wonderful $20k Sony monitor is not even slightly mainstream.

I've used SO many mainstream OLED devices in my years as a tech nut, and I can tell you I wouldn't switch at this moment in time. LCD is of course not even close to perfect, and I find LED backlighting to really bother my eyes, but again... I'll wait till OLED is better. That's why I did say "not yet" in my previous post. Not "not ever."
 
WilliamG said:
My mistake. I meant Galaxy S5. Not HTC One M8 (me stupid). Like I said, I've yet to see ANY mainstream OLED devices that can get whites correctly. Maybe these outrageously expensive TVs can do it. But nothing in the mainstream. iMac is mainstream (albeit on the high-end), iPhone is mainstream, iPad is mainstream. An undoubtedly wonderful $20k Sony monitor is not even slightly mainstream.

I've used SO many mainstream OLED devices in my years as a tech nut, and I can tell you I wouldn't switch at this moment in time. LCD is of course not even close to perfect, and I find LED backlighting to really bother my eyes, but again... I'll wait till OLED is better. That's why I did say "not yet" in my previous post. Not "not ever."
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Perhaps you might be interested in the link I first posted above?

http://www.displaymate.com/OLED_Tablet_ShootOut_1.htm

I tend to get a bit carried away with too many words and perhaps it was lost in the "noise". Suffice to say that the screen on the Galaxy Tab S is technically the best tablet screen they have ever tested.

Incidentally they found the same of the Galaxy S5 phone screen as well, which contradicts your experiences completely, which is a puzzle. I've seen many Samsung OLED devices (including the S3 that I own) and all of them have better screens than any of my Apple products.

To be clear, I am not just being a Samsung fan-boy, quite the contrary. I own precisely two Samsung products, compared to the 3 iphones, 2 iPads, iMac, Mac Mini, Apple TV & 2 iPods. I love my Apple products, but they are not unequivicably the best in every parameter.
 
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Chippy99 said:
Perhaps you might be interested in the link I first posted above?

http://www.displaymate.com/OLED_Tablet_ShootOut_1.htm

I tend to get a bit carried away with too many words and perhaps it was lost in the "noise". Suffice to say that the screen on the Galaxy Tab S is technically the best tablet screen they have ever tested.

Incidentally they found the same of the Galaxy S5 phone screen as well, which contradicts your experiences completely, which is a puzzle. I've seen many Samsung OLED devices (including the S3 that I own) and all of them have better screens than any of my Apple products.

To be clear, I am not just being a Samsung fan-boy, quite the contrary. I own precisely two Samsung products, compared to the 3 iphones, 2 iPads, iMac, Mac Mini, Apple TV & 2 iPods. I love my Apple products, but they are not unequivicably the best in every parameter.
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See, I don't think the S5 doesn't have even close to the best screen out there (in my humble opinion, of course). I hear the word "PenTile" and run for the hills...

I'll have to play with a Galaxy Tab S 10.5 since I believe that uses an RGB stripe setup, vs the diamond PenTile setup of the 8.4 I've played with. I did NOT like text on the 8.4, despite the high res. It just takes on an aliased/jaggy characteristic I really don't care for. PenTile blech!

But back to the Galaxy S5, even aside from that inferior subpixel layout, the S5 doesn't get anywhere NEAR as bright outside as an iPhone. I struggle to use my neighbor's S5 in the sunlight, whereas an iPhone 6/6 Plus is really, really daylight friendly. Contrast? Yes, absolutely the S5 is better, but... again... what do I care about black levels when the 6/6 Plus have EXCELLENT black levels, and much better white levels! And again, when 99.9% of my phone consumption is done on white backgrounds, an IPS LCD just wins... for me. Perhaps if I hid under my blankets and watched horror movies set at night, I might prefer the S5... but I don't, so I don't. :D

Oh, and no worries about getting carried away. This is the Internet, which as we know - means serious business. :) :)
 
Receiving my second iMac today to compare screens and decide which one I keeping, how do I check the other iMac without setting up an account? Is there a way? Thanks in advance
 
Nautigar said:
2nd copy on the right, slightly better. Much better in the bottom right corner, slightly worse at the top left corner.

And yes, it looks much worse on the pictures than it is in reality. Yet, as other members have mentioned, it is distractling when you watch a movie, especially if it is a letterboxed movie.

Anybody else exchanged their iMac because of the backlight bleed issue?

My guess is that the issue is caused by tensions in either the display or the case because the pattern changes if you apply slight pressure to the glass or if you slightly flex the case.
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I'm receiving a second one today to compare screens next to each other and decide which one I am keeping, did you set up your accounts on both computers? Or is there a way around that?
 
WilliamG said:
See, I don't think the S5 doesn't have even close to the best screen out there (in my humble opinion, of course). I hear the word "PenTile" and run for the hills...

I'll have to play with a Galaxy Tab S 10.5 since I believe that uses an RGB stripe setup, vs the diamond PenTile setup of the 8.4 I've played with. I did NOT like text on the 8.4, despite the high res. It just takes on an aliased/jaggy characteristic I really don't care for. PenTile blech!

But back to the Galaxy S5, even aside from that inferior subpixel layout, the S5 doesn't get anywhere NEAR as bright outside as an iPhone. I struggle to use my neighbor's S5 in the sunlight, whereas an iPhone 6/6 Plus is really, really daylight friendly. Contrast? Yes, absolutely the S5 is better, but... again... what do I care about black levels when the 6/6 Plus have EXCELLENT black levels, and much better white levels! And again, when 99.9% of my phone consumption is done on white backgrounds, an IPS LCD just wins... for me. Perhaps if I hid under my blankets and watched horror movies set at night, I might prefer the S5... but I don't, so I don't. :D

Oh, and no worries about getting carried away. This is the Internet, which as we know - means serious business. :) :)
Click to expand...

Your experiences are not shared with most people. Here's what CNET say in their iPhone 6 vs Samsung S5 review:

"we think the Samsung has the superior display for most viewing situations and content. Apps and websites increasingly favor colorful images over black-and-white text, and in many images the screen of the S5 actually looked brighter than that of the iPhones thanks to its pop and contrast. The S5 also lost very little in high ambient light and outside."

"The iPhones have excellent displays with great color and a lot of brightness, but because they're not OLED they simply won't pop in most lighting situations with the same vivid contrast Samsung's display has. The iPhones have great displays. It's simply that Samsung's GS5 screen is, for most use cases, a bit better."
 
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mgb1120 said:
I'm receiving a second one today to compare screens next to each other and decide which one I am keeping, did you set up your accounts on both computers? Or is there a way around that?
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You can just set up a temp account on the new one and then if you decide to keep it, use Migration assistant to replace it with your other account. Let me know what you decide.
 
Chippy99 said:
Your experiences are not shared with most people. Here's what CNET say in their iPhone 6 vs Samsung S5 review:

"we think the Samsung has the superior display for most viewing situations and content. Apps and websites increasingly favor colorful images over black-and-white text, and in many images the screen of the S5 actually looked brighter than that of the iPhones thanks to its pop and contrast. The S5 also lost very little in high ambient light and outside."

"The iPhones have excellent displays with great color and a lot of brightness, but because they're not OLED they simply won't pop in most lighting situations with the same vivid contrast Samsung's display has. The iPhones have great displays. It's simply that Samsung's GS5 screen is, for most use cases, a bit better."
Click to expand...

Well CNET and I will have to disagree. :)

Anyway, thread hijack over.
 
BJB Productions said:
You can just set up a temp account on the new one and then if you decide to keep it, use Migration assistant to replace it with your other account. Let me know what you decide.
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Here is my replacement
 

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WilliamG said:
Original looks better to me. Less flash-lighting at the top and bottom of the screen. Not even close.
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Yeah think I am keeping the original, and be satisfied, not going to try another was debating trying one more but I don't think so
 
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Slightly yellow towards bottom on screen, not too bad I wanted to compare, but backlight bleed was more present on replacement
 
Not sure if someone mentioned it, but what your eyes see and what the camera sensor captures are two totally different things. These pictures are not accurate representations of backlight bleed.
 
The backlight bleed I can see with my eyes along with the slight yellowing, but the camera lens does pick much more up
 
mgb1120 said:
Slightly yellow towards bottom on screen, not too bad I wanted to compare, but backlight bleed was more present on replacement
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The bottom half of the screen is warmer because of the way the monitor is made, it's because of the angle you're watching the screen. Lower your head, and you'll see the bottom half has the exact same color/whiteness as the upper half. Returning one's iMac for this reason is a complete waste of time, as all recent iMacs are like this.
 
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Is the best way to check for light bleed to turn off the lights in complete darkness? I can't tell if I have some bleeding or if it's the glares from the iMacs light shining onto other stuff in darkness :/


teknikal90 said:
why doesnt apple swicth to OLED screens then especially on the super high end product where price is no object on its intended market.
Click to expand...

Because OLED isn't good for color reproduction.
 
forg0t said:
Is the best way to check for light bleed to turn off the lights in complete darkness? I can't tell if I have some bleeding or if it's the glares from the iMacs light shining onto other stuff in darkness :/




Because OLED isn't good for color reproduction.
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i think the previous posts have shown that they are tested to be better than LCD panels. ie. displaymate tests.
 
teknikal90 said:
i think the previous posts have shown that they are tested to be better than LCD panels. ie. displaymate tests.
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Ah I wasnt aware of that. I was just thinking about my old Note 3 phone. Loved the screen when there was anything black but felt like it was always burning my eyes.

Also, I remember someone saying the life of OLED is short compared to lcd. Not sure if that's still true.
 
My dad purchased a 5k received it today and the screen is terrible never seen such bad backlight bleed and too top of it the casing is all scratched around the bezel, plus the FaceTime camera is all fogged up looks like glue inside. Terrible QC I don't know what's going on with apple. Sending it back and he's getting a non retina, keeping my retina think I got lucky with a decent screen, sad that these computers are arriving by a 50/50 draw on a $3000 machine ridiculous.
 
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