Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Status
Not open for further replies.
Nice try muffin, you love twisting my words to take a stab at me eh? My statement was that calibration of glass front LCD displays is possible, but that it still does not account for the glare that is produced. To compensate for the glare in any light environment, the lighting inside the room needs to be the same level as the brightness of the display. Doing this produces an over lit image (as most offices have lots of windows, lights, etc. making for a very bright environment), rendering it useless to photoshop, etc. There should not be any reason a high end display needs to compensate for room brightness, sacrificing the image quality in order to deter reflection issues is unacceptable, plain and simple.

Flame me all you want, this whole discussion has gotten way out of hand. If you don't agree, MOVE ON. I'm sure there are more important things for you to do.

I never said you said that. I said you quoted an article that said that. See attachment for proof. Whoever you quoted is completely full of nonsense, a sheet of glass does absolutely nothing to the ability to have a display calibrated.

As for the rest of your post, the same is true for matte displays. Not in terms of reflection, but in terms of the light dispersed. I feel like I'm a stuck record here, but I'll say it again. Light is handled differently by matte and glossy, glossy panels reflect the light causing glare problems, matte displays disperse the light across the display causing colour accuracy problems. Whether you use a matte or glossy display, for colour critical work you should be working in a dark or low lit room, because any light shone on the display will cause problems with the quality of your work.

Go to a design studio, they work in dark conditions so that light does not effect the display. If you are into design in a serious way, then you should be mirroring the exact same conditions. Glare becomes a non issue, because there is no light shining on the display. And you don't have to increase brightness to compensate for glare, because there is no glare.

If you are experiencing glare, then you are not using your display correctly. If you are turning up the brightness to compensate for room lighting then you are not using your display correctly. There should be no light shining on the display and little if any ambient light.
 

Attachments

  • Picture 3.png
    Picture 3.png
    15.1 KB · Views: 87
I never said you said that. I said you quoted an article that said that. See attachment for proof. Whoever you quoted is completely full of nonsense, a sheet of glass does absolutely nothing to the ability to have a display calibrated.

As for the rest of your post, the same is true for matte displays. Not in terms of reflection, but in terms of the light dispersed. I feel like I'm a stuck record here, but I'll say it again. Light is handled differently by matte and glossy, glossy panels reflect the light causing glare problems, matte displays disperse the light across the display causing colour accuracy problems. Whether you use a matte or glossy display, for colour critical work you should be working in a dark or low lit room, because any light shone on the display will cause problems with the quality of your work.

Go to a design studio, they work in dark conditions so that light does not effect the display. If you are into design in a serious way, then you should be mirroring the exact same conditions. Glare becomes a non issue, because there is no light shining on the display.

If you are experiencing glare, then you are not using your display correctly. If you turning up the brightness to compensate for room lighting then you are not using your display correctly. There should be no light shining on the display and little if any ambient light.

:confused: So then serious design industry offices should have very little if any light in their offices along with hoods on all their displays? Not exactly. Most have their displays in a fairly lit room, and most have hoods to compensate for any unnecessary glare. That's where it usually stops. Apple's new displays have so much glare it's not even funny. Let's not get off topic on a tangent of hypotheticals, the OP was referring to Apple's new glass displays. I've seen hoods on a few, and even the hoods don't deter glare on all of it.
 
So you're upset with his methodology for getting to the right conclusion (thanks for admitting he was right and your were off base)? Doesn't make sense.

No, if you took the time to actually read my posts, I said from the beginning that for certain applications a matte screen might be the better choice. I didn't agree with his statement the glass display magically messes the image up just by adding the glass and the matte displaying correctly, when the matte layer is actually actively changing the presentation of the display.
 
No, if you took the time to actually read my posts, I said from the beginning that for certain applications a matte screen might be the better choice. I didn't agree with his statement the glass display magically messes the image up just by adding the glass and the matte displaying correctly, when the matte layer is actually actively changing the presentation of the display.

The OP never made such a statement. I don't think it's me who should be taking the time in reading the threads.
 
chilllll-ax dude. Sure, glass itself doesn't mess it up, but the reflection absolutely does. The op never said glass did this, they said increasing the monitor brightness or simply working the brightness of the display to take room lighting into account to avoid reflective qualities is what brightens the monitor and images to unnatural levels, and leads to oversaturation. Why don't you beam a flashlight at that glass next time you're working on it, or trying lowering the room lights and messing around with brightness balance while keeping the monitor brightness right where it should be for digital editing. Laws of physics indeed.

My workplace doesn't give reflection on my screen, period. Not where I can see them at least. If you are bothered by reflections, your screen is incorrectly positioned.

Try holding a flashlight to your precious matte screen, or better, direct sunlight. Instant wash out on the entire screen and a completely unusable display.

Lighting and how it is positioned is important regardless of the display used. Don't pretend it is not.

The OP never made such a statement. I don't think it's me who should be taking the time in reading the threads.

Don't make me get quotes in 3 pages of replies.
 
My workplace doesn't give reflection on my screen, period. Not where I can see them at least. If you are bothered by reflections, your screen is incorrectly positioned.

Try holding a flashlight to your precious matte screen, or better, direct sunlight. Instant wash out on the entire screen and a completely unusable display.

Lighting and how it is positioned is important regardless of the display used. Don't pretend it is not.

Dude, no one ever said it is not. And what do you mean by my "precious matte screen"? :confused: No one stated any thing about matte screens doing any thing, you are the one bringing them up. The OP and a few others simply stated that glass over an LED panel makes editing more difficult due to exaggerated glaring, simple as that. Anything else is being pulled out of thin air.

Don't make me get quotes in 3 pages of replies.

Please do, I'm curious to read what you reading into. (but I have to warn you, I'm done with this, it's been beaten TO DEATH and now people are arguing for the sake of arguing, it's silly)
 
Ok, let's state for arguments sake that the Apple LED LCD display's are acceptable for design work. What would you recommend in doing for them? Honestly, I would rather have two of those than one expensive or even two more expensive EVIO or NEC displays.
Could you rephrase that please, I don't understand.

Not being patronising or sarcastic or w/e, genuinely didn't understand it.


:confused: So then serious design industry offices should have very little if any light in their offices along with hoods on all their displays? Not exactly. Most have their displays in a fairly lit room, and most have hoods to compensate for any unnecessary glare. That's where it usually stops. Apple's new displays have so much glare it's not even funny. Let's not get off topic on a tangent of hypotheticals, the OP was referring to Apple's new glass displays. I've seen hoods on a few, and even the hoods don't deter glare on all of it.

I can think of no scenario where glare would be a problem if the display is correctly positioned.

The only main point I've tried to make in this thread is that matte and glossy handle lighting in different ways. Glossy handles it better in my opinion, because it reflects it instead of dispersing it across the screen. Whilst this can be annoying to some, it preserves the image quality and viewability. Most people can just look past those reflections anyway.

The attachment proves my point. Although reflections are heavy, the glossy computer is still usable. The matte screen when immersed with heavy lighting, becomes useless, washed out and dull. Of course this an extreme situation and wont be experienced in a design studio, but even some lighting will directly alter the matte display even if a tiny amount.

I will say that you are better suited to a matte display if transferring to print, simply because paper shares the same texture (unless of course it's like a glossy poster or something, then you would be better suited to a glossy display). I will also say that I'm not a glossy fanboy, if your paying that much for a screen, you should have a choice in what panel you want. I can't abide however, those who invent problems and FUD because they don't like something.

There isn't a guy in the industry who would stake their reputation on working with a glass monitor that isn't coated or at least non-reflective. You'd be nuts to think otherwise.

Again, if glass does not negatively impact image quality, clarity and accuracy, THEN WHY AREN'T HIGH END DISPLAY MANUFACTURERS UTILIZING GLASS? I guess EIVO, NEC, etc. should hire you to work on their display line as you seem to know so much more about it than any one :rolleyes:.

Five words.

Tradition
Peer Approval
Comfort Zone

These words are the biggest setback to the computer industry.

10/11 years ago if you were using an LCD for design work you would have been laughed at. Technology advances, people can't accept that. Glossy panels are technologically superior, there method of handling light is better, there crispness of text is better, there colour is truer and more vibrant.

They will replace matte panels altogether within a couple of years. Pretty much whatever Apple adopts, drops or replaces is mirrored in the PC industry a couple of years later. People bitch for a while, then realise Apple were right all along.
 

Attachments

  • Picture 4.png
    Picture 4.png
    196.7 KB · Views: 96
Now the consumers get aluminum just like we do, what gives?

Why do you care what material the consumer notebooks are made out of? Do pro mechanics care that the $1 wrenches you can buy at sears are chrome plated?

Let this argument go. Buy the best tool for your job. That's what the rest of us do. It just so happens that my Mac is the best tool for my job... if it weren't, I'd buy a different computer.

My workplace doesn't give reflection on my screen, period. Not where I can see them at least. If you are bothered by reflections, your screen is incorrectly positioned.

This is a great point. If your workspace isn't configured properly, don't blame your monitor.
 
Thanks to everyone who's posted, it's been a fairly long read, but it has been worthwhile. In the three pages, after I've filtered out all the opinion, there has been some useful facts and explanations of the workings. I feel I've come away knowing something more.

I read a lot of mentions of "basic physics" and "laws of physics", but which ones ? I know my physics and I can only guess at the laws you are referring to. Please elaborate.

Whilst we're all now aware of the distortion caused by a matte screen finish, does anyone have any figures for the coarseness of the finish. I'm intrigued how this compares to my 96dpi screen resolution.
I'm also interested if anyone has the "laws of physics" that explain how much distortion s caused by the light only coming through the matte finish, rather than being "reflected" by it.

Aside from the facts, it's just a matter of personal opinion.
I've got a couple of old Apple ACDs and a new one. Nice brightness on the new one, but even with minimal lighting (I need some to see the keyboard) I hated the new screen because of the reflections. The ACD was extremely good at anti-glare, even with limited direct light, the glass screen was like a mirror and would reflect dimly lit objects at the back of the room.

I even tried it against my original (plastic case, ADC connector) 23" ACD, hated the new display just as much. Nothing to do with the old display costing me just under £2000, with another £100 for the DVI-ADC converter.

Your experiences may differ, and I won't dis you if you prefer the new displays.

Maybe they'll just take some getting used to, may be just my eyesight, may be just the high resolution displays - tried a few Dell and HP (under Windows) for a few months at a time - the resolutions above 96dpi made working with any text unbearable. Switching below the optimum resolution to 96dpi (or close) made the text even more unreadable.

All just my own personal opinion, which I'm sure many share. If you think high-gloss glass screens provide for better viewing of text, photos and video in the real world, tell me why I'm wrong explaining the science behind it, I'd like it to be a learning experience.
 
If you think high-gloss glass screens provide for better viewing of text, photos and video in the real world, tell me why I'm wrong explaining the science behind it, I'd like it to be a learning experience.

Simple. Glossy screen makes a picture (be it photo or video) more alive and vivid. Thats why most people prefer having glossy displays.

As for text, I think its better on glossy because there's no matte texture distorting it and if there's light shining on the screen that can't be avoided (like on laptops when outside) its still possible to read, unlike with matte screen that becomes completely unusable.
 
Simple. Glossy screen makes a picture (be it photo or video) more alive and vivid. Thats why most people prefer having glossy displays.

As for text, I think its better on glossy because there's no matte texture distorting it and if there's light shining on the screen that can't be avoided (like on laptops when outside) its still possible to read, unlike with matte screen that becomes completely unusable.

Glossy screens don't "make" any such thing. In fact, it's quite the opposite. Matte screens typically decrease the "vividness" of the picture. Glass is quite transparent (assuming it's clean). It would be like saying I get a more vivid view of the world wearing glasses (assuming they're glass and not some form of plastic) than without. Other than reflections, glass should have no effect what-so-ever on an image. Admittedly, reflections are a major problem and so I tend to use matte screens. I can't stand reflections. In fact, my own glasses (which are high-index plastic) have an anti-glare coating that is nothing short of spectacular. The difference between having it and not having it is literally night and day for reflections. Nothing else appears to be affected. Apple would do well to look into anti-glare coatings for their glass screens in the future. You could potentially have the best of both worlds.
 
Glossy screens don't "make" any such thing. In fact, it's quite the opposite. Matte screens typically decrease the "vividness" of the picture. Glass is quite transparent (assuming it's clean).

This part makes no sense, unless you wanted to say glossy.

And what I meant is that a bit of reflections make the image more vivd and alive. Of course there's no difference when there's no ambient light at all -_-
 
LOL.

I'm calling it now....


bedifferent and OneFortheMoney are the same person.

Thread started May 16th.
OneFortheMoney join date of May 17th?


LOL.
 
Apple would do well to look into anti-glare coatings for their glass screens in the future. You could potentially have the best of both worlds.

That's an idea^^.

As for me and for what it's worth, I prefer image editing on glossy screens. Maybe because my eyes are the sh^t and the screen brightness on my previous matte MBP never went up high enough for me to see clearly.
 
I can't believe how you can state this with a straight face. Please tell me how a piece of glass increases saturation. I never noticed that looking out of a window. And the world doesn't change when I look through the finder of my camera either. It does not happen.
...
If you want to say a matte screen works better for you and the work you do, ditto. But bluntly stating any glass display sucks because of colors are off and it is impossible to do any serious work on them, is ridiculous and simply not true.

+1

I read a lot of mentions of "basic physics" and "laws of physics", but which ones ? I know my physics and I can only guess at the laws you are referring to. Please elaborate.

Classic forum arguing. If you're unable to elaborate your argument with words, typically because your understanding of an area is poor, simply state 'it's basic [insert topic here]'. The aim is to make people think 'oh crap, he knows [topic], I'll back down on this point'. Hollow victory but a victory nonetheless.

http://www.annoyances.org/exec/show/article09-208

So you're upset with his methodology for getting to the right conclusion (thanks for admitting he was right and your were off base)? Doesn't make sense.

It makes absolute sense. Otherwise you're advocating people can make irrational decisions, as long as they reach the right output? What if criminal law operated like that? Ridiculous. No offense intended*, but how old are you?

Also why are you thankful that he said the OP was correct? I smell a rat.

AppleMatt
*it's really not. You just can't ask that question without sounding like a patronising d**k. It's impossible.
 
Apple isn't even "dumbing down for the consumer", unfortunately. They're just dumbing down period, IMO. By this I mean that a consumer wants a mid-range tower to compete with the most common PC configuration out there (i.e. a mini-tower or tower with a good GPU, reasonable expandability for more hard drives and a few cards and a price gamut between $800-1500). This market is just plain IGNORED by Apple. Their ONLY tower starts at $2500 these days. That's just plain ridiculous when you can get an Intel Quad-Core with 8GB of ram, a 1.5TB drive and a better graphics card (take your pick really including SLI for PCs) for $800-1200 (depending on GPU) that will run circles around that Mac Pro for most prosumer applications and gaming. Apple literally has *NOTHING* that can compete with such a PC. NOTHING.

So is it any wonder then that some of us are contemplating building or buying a Hackintosh for our next "Mac" ? Apple provides NO VALUE these days in its Mac lines. I only bought my MBP last fall because I saved $600 off retail when they had a clearance sale of the old models as the new ones came in (essentially getting me a MBP for the price of the new regular Macbook). Otherwise, $2000 isn't reasonable IMO for the MBP. It comes with a cheap webcam, small hard drive and you better buy your own memory and put it in yourself or you'll get ripped off royally. I continually have issues with my either my USB mouse or keyboard not working when waking from sleep (unless I pull the hub and plug it back in) and for all the talk about how reliable Unix/OS X is, I've had more than a few kernel panics on the thing after several wake/sleep cycles (I guess it's not just my old upgraded PowerMac that gets kernel panics). Kernel panics are EXACTLY the same thing as the blue screen of death on Windows. Apple pretending like they don't have them is utterly laughable. I almost never see kernel issues like that with Linux. X-Windows might crash itself silly, but to force a reboot? (i.e. some magic key combos will usually reset X without requiring a reboot) I've had to do it a few times over the years, but nothing like OS X. Frankly, XP Pro has been pretty reliable on my PC. I'm not sure it's any less reliable than OS X in that regard. Yes, Windows98 was a crash test dummy, but that's ages ago and more akin to OS9 which was no better, IMO.

The thing is Apple has continually ignored the gaming market segment and so you would think that would have meant that their operating system would be the most stable thing known to man by now. They don't have to support every hardware configuration out there and they don't have to support their own 3D gaming library like Microsoft does with DirectX and Direct3D. They use the open source (i.e. SLOW) OpenGL instead of smartly licensing DirectX from Microsoft (which would make porting games to OS X 100x easier and faster than something like Cider that has to convert everything to OpenGL, leaving the games running like molasses even on the same hardware, but it would never compare in terms of hardware since OS X doesn't support real gaming hardware like SLI or Crossfire in the first place). So in summary, Apple is not a gaming computer AT ALL but yet it's still got a long way to go to be a truly stable Unix platform. I was running Final Cut Pro on my MBP when it got those kernel panics, not Call Of Duty. Pro should mean that doesn't happen.

Don't even get me started about that mini-display port crap. The very idea that a Mac *PRO* would have a *MINI* display port instead of a full sized one (let alone the argument that DVI is entrenched right now and that HDMI options would be more usable for secondary ports) just smacks of the underlying causes of us even having a "Mini" display port in the first place. One would assume that Apple created it to save space on their notebook computers, but display port is ALREADY very small so this is hard to believe and clearly a Mac Pro has PLENTY of room for a full size display port. There is nothing professional about a mini-display port because no one but Apple uses the darn thing. It's clearly just another move to try and force people to buy Apple's overpriced monitors. The fact they'd do it on a Mac Pro is just unforgivable, IMO. The market is not even remotely the same as a Macbook. At the very least they should offer proper adapters for a reasonable price so you can connect what you WANT or NEED instead of what Apple wants you to buy. The fact they want $99 for something that would have cost NOTHING had they used the industry standard bears mentioning. The fact that they will go through several more GPUs before anyone else even begins to support mini-display port or provide a cheaper adapter just shows how Apple thumbs its nose at the consumer. I'm sure $99 for a $10 adapter helps pad those record breaking profits during a recession and increases their 22+ BILLION in cash reserves...all on the hands of the consumer who has limited choices and high prices to deal with if they want to run Mac software.

Yeah, I'm irked at Apple. I much prefer OS X to Windows, especially to Vista which is just awful, but Apple seems to be doing everything it can to ensure that if Windows7 is successful that it will go back to being a 4% player in the market. If rumors are true and Snow Leopard dumps PPC, there goes nearly half the Mac market share right there and Apple will be back to 4-5% because no one will release "Universal" software for Snow Leopard since it doesn't support Universal software. Thus, software for regular Leopard will dry up in less than a year, IMO since no developer in his right mind is going to want to maintain two separate builds just to support older PPC machines. Apple therefore thinks all those G4 and G5 users (including G5 Quads which still run circles around most Intel iMacs) will just give them MORE money to upgrade to a new Intel machine in order to get new software support. They better hope that doesn't backfire and those people buy new PCs instead.

Personally, I'll buy a Hackintosh the next time around and then I'll be covered on both ends. It'll be able to run Windows or Mac and if Apple screws it all up, I still have a usable machine. Yes, Apple's own computers can run Windows also, but only the Mac Pro supports better graphics cards, etc. that Windows can already use and that OS X will probably never support any time soon.

What's Pro about Macs these days? I'm not sure. The lack of viruses is the number 1 selling point to me followed by a better user interface. If the former ever changes (nothing is there to stop virus writers from attacking Macs in the future should their market share go up) that leaves OS X purely to the mercy of Microsoft NOT improving their OS and we all know that Microsoft is emulating the best features of the Mac as fast as it can script them. Call it copying, call it unfair, but regardless, it's what Microsoft does. They're very good at bullying their way to the top and shoving other computer companies out of business. That's what happened to the Commodore Amiga (which I used to love) and this idea that because iPods and iPhones are extremely popular right now that the Mac is somehow "safe" in the future is just absurd. Apple should have been competing and pushing for expanded market share all this time, not just milking consumers for the highest possible profits. It's market share that protects a computer from obsolescence not cash reserves (Look how fast GM burned through their billions in reserves when things went South). Apple once had almost 20% market share in the late '80s and early '90s and places like Best Buy had 2-3 rows of software for the Mac. Now they have 1/2 a row (and that's up from NONE just a few years ago). That 20% fell to 4% pretty fast. Imagine if it had been only 8-9% when it fell. Apple would be out of business right now. They came pretty close as it was.

Even with the DISASTER that is Vista, Microsoft is in no danger of going away because 90% means virtual invulnerability, especially when its competitor cares more about milking existing consumers that trying to attract new ones and would rather sue (litigate) companies that could help increase market share (like Psystar) than to actually COMPETE with them, which is what Capitalism is supposed to be about. To make matters worse, my 2001 era PowerMac was Made In the USA. Prices are actually HIGHER now for a Mac and they're all Made In China. Guess where the labor cost savings went? Right into Apple's cash reserves. Are Macs more reliable as a result? When 3 out of 4 MBPs have major defects as one poster in another thread mentioned happened to him, I'd have to say NO. My (since upgraded) PowerMac is 8 years old and runs perfectly fine. I'm typing on it right now with 10.5.7. and it doesn't feel any slower for typical day-to-day stuff than my brand new (as of last October) MBP. In fact, app tests show that the MBP is typically only 3-4x faster and that's with two cores. Comparing only one core (since I chose the single CPU G4 upgrade instead of the double), it's only 1.5-3x faster at most. For an eight year span, that's a much smaller difference than I would have expected. All this talk about how Snow Leopard should just dump all PPC support because they're completely outdated is ridiculous, IMO. A Quad G5 is faster than most Core2Duo Intel models with many applications. But Apple doesn't make "new sales" on them so force them all to upgrade or move on and reduce the market share to 5-6% in one fell swoop. Go for it Apple. You'll have even less room to fall when Windows7 comes out and people realize they can get a PC that costs 1/3 as much that is twice as fast as a comparably priced Mac and runs nearly or just as well.

I can easily prove already that a $900 Hackintosh Quad-Core can outrun a $2500 Mac Pro for most applications. Apple has nothing that could touch it. If the Mac Pro truly were a PRO computer, Apple would not be worrying about whether a reasonably priced mid-range tower would usurp some Mac Pro sales because those sales would be from CONSUMERS (not professionals) that are currently being forced to buy a professional machine because Apple's mid-range computers are JOKES (iMacs are SLOW laptop based machines, not true desktops; a $799 Dell can run much faster!) Apple has a huge hold in its lineup and if they don't want to fill it, they should let someone else like Dell or Psystar do it. I have no doubts that the Mac market share could be 50%-100% more than it is right now if they offered truly competitive hardware or opened their doors to clones. This market is nothing like the one in the late 1990s. Cloning could be a good thing long term for Apple, particularly if they had a good degree of control over it. It would let them focus on the odd machines like iMacs and professional machines like the Mac Pro and leave the consumer Macs to the PC switchers they claim they want to court. Jack up OS X by $200 and they could make $300 in pure profit from each clone sold just on the OS itself, let alone licensing costs. If that boosted market share by 50%, they'd be protecting their long term investments, increasing the software base and therefore the software offerings and all around improving the Mac's standing in the world. But no, they look to short term profit wind-falls instead of the long-term picture. It's the same mistake Detroit made with cars compared to the Japanese and look where it got them in the long run....

Agreed. Unless Apple addresses this, I'll be going the Hackintosh route or I'll get a Psystar. Two of my friends have them already and say they're great.

As this isn't an Empirical study, and only opinion based, methodology really has no place. Conclusions are based solely on my personal experiences and the experiences of my colleagues in the field. My purpose was to express my disappointment in not being able to upgrade to Apple LED LCD display, I would love nothing more than to be informed that the displays can and do work well in this particular segment, without having to crank up the display brightness to unnatural levels to compensate for reflection, which over-saturates, lights and essentially distorts the image. Instead of well informed posts, I was sarcastically blasted for my opinion by being called stupid, ignorant, and apparently I have a split personality with someone else on Macrumors :rolleyes:. I even posted a statement that if I am wrong, how may I utilize two Apple LEC LCD's displays (meaning what would be the best way to replace my current two 23" Apple CCFL LCD display system with two Apple 24" glass front LED LCD displays without having to sacrifice quality by either moving everything in the office around, or working in a dark room). Instead of an answer I got a sarcastic response. This is one of the reasons I avoid the comments sections on the first two pages (especially in the OS X versus Windows OS debates, it's enough to make one's head hurt). Again, I would love nothing more than to walk out with 2 24" LEC LCD displays, especially as I can get them each for $799 (grad student), thus two displays would cost the same as ONE comparable EIVO or NEC. I was also hoping that more information regarding Apple's display may have been out there that I wasn't aware of, such as Apple officially releasing more desktop LED LCD displays to replace the CCFL models (the 24" is the only one out, and that was initially tailored for the portable line, and individuals who purchased them for their Mac Pro's had to return them as the chords were so short the Mac Pro needed to be on the desk for two to work).

I have demonstrated that I compared the displays to EVIO and NEC models, and that the glare and brightness made image editing difficult. My colleagues have experienced the same issues. For expressing my opinion I've gotten a lot of **** from the Macrumors forum "police". This whole thread was supposed to be a civil conversation, but has gotten woefully out of hand. :(

*

I'm sorry, but your same comment can be applied to your condescending remark regarding my age in an attempt to discredit my statement(s). Lord people, is everyone on Macrumors just full of angst, waiting to use those little quips on each other to make themselves feel superior??? I find it ironic that someone uses a juvenile tactic to call my age into question.

Don't worry- there are plenty of us who agree with you. But there will always be those who think Apple can do no wrong. Believe me- they can, and are. There is not one computer in Apple's line up right now that I would spend money on. NOT ONE. And that's a shame. I've been using Macs for as long as they have been around.
 
Your whole post is about how apple has been dumbed down by.... Glossy displays?

Riiiiight.

Everyone has a right to their opinion. Apple has been making mistakes in it's pro line up in several areas. Those of us who've been using Macs for professional work are getting increasingly frustrated with them. If they don't start listening, we'll vote with our wallets. It's that simple.
 
Agreed. Unless Apple addresses this, I'll be going the Hackintosh route or I'll get a Psystar. Two of my friends have them already and say they're great.



Don't worry- there are plenty of us who agree with you. But there will always be those who think Apple can do no wrong. Believe me- they can, and are. There is not one computer in Apple's line up right now that I would spend money on. NOT ONE. And that's a shame. I've been using Macs for as long as they have been around.

It seems the majority of them are recent Apple converts, as seasoned Apple Pro users such as ourselves are feeling the impact of Apple's recent changes. Some good, but a lot of it is negatively impacting the Pro end. A friend of mine who is in video production (more as a hobby) owns an older PowerMac G5 with a studio cinema display. He needs to upgrade, but can't afford $2500+ for a Mac Pro, and the iMac's mobile processor isn't powerful enough for Final Cut Pro work. I suggested building him a Hackintosh (admittedly I really want to for my own selfish interest lol), but he isn't computer savvy enough to trouble shoot it if something were to go wrong, and future OS X updates might pose an issue, possibly keeping him from upgrades. There are pro's and con's, but I'm going to push the Hackintosh option as it seems the best given his situation. It's a shame that Apple has been dropping the professional segment so much as of late.
 
It seems the majority of them are recent Apple converts, as seasoned Apple Pro users such as ourselves are feeling the impact of Apple's recent changes. Some good, but a lot of it is negatively impacting the Pro end. A friend of mine who is in video production (more as a hobby) owns an older PowerMac G5 with a studio cinema display. He needs to upgrade, but can't afford $2500+ for a Mac Pro, and the iMac's mobile processor isn't powerful enough for Final Cut Pro work. I suggested building him a Hackintosh (admittedly I really want to for my own selfish interest lol), but he isn't computer savvy enough to trouble shoot it if something were to go wrong, and future OS X updates might pose an issue, possibly keeping him from upgrades. There are pro's and con's, but I'm going to push the Hackintosh option as it seems the best given his situation. It's a shame that Apple has been dropping the professional segment so much as of late.

I agree. It is too bad. And I refuse to go broke buying a MP, when I can go the Hackintosh route so much cheaper. It's the OS I like, not the aluminum case. One of these days, let's hope Apple pays attention to our needs again. I have the last G5 they made. I'll stick with it as long as I can.
 
totally agree with the OP and those who mentioned hackintoshes. All I've wanted from apple since I realized my G5 iMac was woefully underpowered for my needs was an ACD with a more up-to-date panel and HDCP compliance and a mini tower to go with it so that I can hang on to the display and upgrade the mac every coupla revisions. I only do a few hours of high-bandwidth work a week at home, and I can't afford the latest and greatest.

But even if I could afford it, no way am I dropping that much cash on a glossy display. No way am I buying an MBP with a glossy display. Apple has literally NO solution for me other than an Eizo and a MP which together cost 2-3x what anyone should spend on a computer they only max out for a few hours a week.

Yes, Apple have walked away from the pro market. They don't even make Shake (the software I use) anymore. They walked away from an industry-leading software line and whilst its successor remains vapourware, all of the developers have defected to other companies that are now fast overtaking Apple's product, even though it is still the market leader, despite being unsupported for 3 years. I don't see Adobe or even MS doing that to any of their successful products, no matter how niche they are.

But since the matte finish is available for 17inch MBPs now, maybe it will be offered BTO in other parts of the line? It will be interesting to see what direction they take the 30-inch LED display...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.