>80% @ 1000cycles MBP Battery Apple Claim

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by jsnuff1, Nov 18, 2016.

  1. jsnuff1 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2003
    Location:
    NY
    #1
    So when I bought my MBP in 2012 I was like cool, this battery will last me at least 5 years with Apple's claim on retaining 80% capacity up to 1000 battery cycles. This was especially important since these batteries are glued to the top case and not really user replaceable.

    Forward 4 years, and I'm at only 682 cycles and my battery is currently at 67% capacity, in "Service Battery" condition, and once battery charge goes below 50% it will decide there is no battery left and shuts down.

    So the battery is pretty much useless and ill get at most an hour of unplugged use out of it.

    This is rather disappointing especially when I'm no where near 1000 cycles, and the battery is toast already. Adding insult to injury, Apple decided to keep RAM @ 16GB so I refuse to buy a new MBP until they have a 32GB option (yes i actually NEED the ram).

    So I went to the apple store thinking this would be a clear case of a defective battery and apple would stand buy their numbers and claims and replace the battery for me. Well...i was obviously disappointed in that department. Apparently you have to go through 1000 cycles in the first year for apple to stand behind those numbers, which is ridiculous.

    Looks like it was all marketing hype...so my question is has anyone been able to make apple keep its word about the MBP battery and get it replaced because of it?
     
  2. leman macrumors 604

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    Oct 14, 2008
    #2
    Its not ridiculous. Batteries degrade both with time AND with use. They are designed to last at least 1000 cycles, but that of course only makes sense if the battery has not already aged. Its like a car tyre. They are often designed for a particular mileage under certain conditions but because rubber deteriorates with time, you can't just store the tyre for ten years in a garage and then expect it to perform properly.

    At an rate, Apple's batteries are among the best in the industry and they last much longer than of your average laptop. But you'll still have to replace them every 4-5 years though.

    In all likelihood you'll probably have to wait until 2018, because I don't think that the CPUs with LPDDR4 support will be out before that. So if you really need it, it might be the time to look for an alternative.
    --- Post Merged, Nov 18, 2016 ---
    Yes, a lot of people have. If the battery is defective and does not perform up to specs, Apple will replace it. But again, this applies only to batteries that are still under warranty. Too old, and the battery will degrade.
     
  3. Freyqq macrumors 68040

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    Dec 13, 2004
    #3
    Might be worth asking about a replacement, as it didn't meet their spec.
     
  4. leman macrumors 604

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    Oct 14, 2008
    #4
    Did you even read the post?
     
  5. Freyqq macrumors 68040

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    Dec 13, 2004
    #5
    I've gotten batteries replaced before under warranty.
     
  6. vmac556 macrumors newbie

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    Nov 11, 2016
  7. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    Feb 5, 2011
    #7
    The battery warranty term is the same as the warranty term for the system. 1 year without AppleCare. 3 years with AppleCare.

    It's explained here: https://support.apple.com/HT204054

    In either case, you are outside the warranty period.
     
  8. Compa49 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2014
    #8
    I just recently had the same experience. I have noticed my battery not lasting as long as it should and unexpectantly shutting down. So I chatted with Apple support and they set up an appointment at a store. Once at the store they confirmed my battery had reached the end of it's life and it was time to replace it. They gave me a $299 estimate but said since they have to send it out it would only be $199. I like you aren't really excited about the current lineup and want to wait until next year. I know the first edition of any major change always inherently has issues only discovered once it has been out for a while. I will let them work the bugs out of the current lineup and get a new one next year.
     
  9. cmaier macrumors G3

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    California
    #9
    The warranty is the warranty and is clearly laid out.
     
  10. bcave098 macrumors 6502

    bcave098

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    #10
    I would say Apple's only "claim" is that it will retain 80% within the first 1000 cycles, and if not, it will be covered under the warranty. No "claim" from Apple extends the warranty beyond one year, or three years for AppleCare.
     
  11. shareef777 macrumors 68000

    shareef777

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    Jul 26, 2005
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    #11
    Same issue with my 2012. Lesson learned, at the 2.5 year mark if I'm over 800 cycles and near or below 80%, I'll just have to cycle the battery daily to get over the 1k cycle limit before the 3 year AC agreement ends. Though I have heard that Apple has argued that this is wear and tear of a consumable item and that they wouldn't replace it anyway. And to completely flip-flop, I took in said 2012 rMBP to Apple to get the logic board replaced under the nVidia video card failure issue and they offered to replace the battery too at no charge (they'll actually be replacing the entire top cover which includes a new keyboard, which is great as I've got a few letters that are worn off).
     
  12. Cvx5832 macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2014
    #12
    Sorry to hear about your battery troubles. I've seen it over the years where one battery outperforms another within the same use and product line. I'm guessing they won't stand by them because there's no reliable baseline.

    Over the years I've seen Apple battery life all over the place. My iPad Air 2 which I hardly use is down to 82%. My son's iPad Air 1 which he uses every day is still at 96%. My rMB is down to 87% at just 100 cycles, and this 2012 13 MB Pro (wife's machine) is astonishingly still at 99.7% after 373 cycles.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. shareef777 macrumors 68000

    shareef777

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    #13
    Wow, talk about hit or miss. Guess there's no telling. My 2012 was pretty pathetic. Just after 3 years it dropped to 79% with 650 cycles and was getting me just 2 hours of battery life. At 4 years it was down to 72% with 800 cycles and getting just over an hour. I just wish that Apple made the batteries 3rd party replaceable and provided OEM parts for sale to them. $200 is a bitter pill to swallow after 3 or 4 years when we have to decide between sinking that money into an aging machine or a new one.
     
  14. jsnuff1 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    NY
    #14
    I understand what a warranty is. Thats not my issue and don't expect Apple to cover things past warranty. My issue is that Apple claims >80% within 1000 cycles.

    Obviously no one in any type of usage scenario will get to 1000 cycles before the first year warranty is up, so no matter what Apple has itself covered since they will just claim its past warranty unless you have Applecare. The whole point of this post is that I planned on the battery lasting up to 1000 cycles, which is clearly not the case and seems to be a marketing gimmick by Apple.

    If I knew ahead of time that the battery would not last 1000 cycles, then I would have got Applecare and replaced the battery at the 3 year mark.
     
  15. AlanShutko macrumors 6502a

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    Jun 2, 2008
    #15
    FWIW, the replacement cost on a 2012 MBP at $199 is probably less than the cost of AppleCare for that machine.
     
  16. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    Feb 5, 2011
    #16
    Alright. Let me put it another way then.

    Back in 2012, which is when you said that you bought your MacBook Pro, Apple's statement about battery life made mentioned the 80% within 1000 cycles, and even back then said defective batteries were covered under the standard 1 year warranty.

    This was Apple's support page about batteries in November, 2012:

    https://web.archive.org/web/20121119220712/http://www.apple.com/batteries/notebooks.html
     
  17. ixxx69 macrumors 6502a

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    #17
    I understand it's a drag, but you're not going to hear the answer you want.

    Emphasis mine.

    Apple computers are also designed to work, but occasionally they stop working... if it's not under warranty, you have to pay for repairs. You can make the argument all you want that they're meant to work, and that Apple let you down because it stopped working, but stuff occasionally stops working earlier than expected... that just happens sometimes. If you can't live with that, either pay for the warranties or stop buying their products.
     
  18. PaulWog, Nov 22, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2016

    PaulWog Suspended

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2011
    #18
    Their 1-year guarantee probably doesn't take time into consideration (hence the 1 year guarantee). I bet you any consumer who goes through 1000 cycles in 1 year will get a free battery replacement (1% battery life loss per 50 cycles = 20% loss, plus 5% loss from 1 year of age = 25% battery life loss). They're just banking most people won't hit 1000 in a year.

    I would say 5% battery life per year (time), and 1% battery loss per 50 cycles, makes sense.

    But with all those fair estimates taken into consideration, 4 years @ 5% lost per year, plus 682 cycles = 20% + (682 / 50)*1% = 33.64% battery life loss expected over 4 years and with usage. You're almost bang on with what is expected from age & usage combined.
     
  19. asoksevil macrumors 6502

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    Jun 7, 2010
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    Taipei, Taiwan
    #19
    It depends on usage as well. It is not the same as storing your battery for 5 years than using it continuously for 5 years. My MBA has been through my whole college and work life and it is still holding up great after 6 years (around 80% capacity) and don't know how many thousands of hours on it.
     
  20. thekev macrumors 604

    thekev

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    Aug 5, 2010
    #20
    Applecare doesn't guarantee you any kind of replacement. It only applies if it's within 3 years and the battery has less than 80% capacity. See here. Battery aging is unfortunately one of the worst things about Apple. Sometimes old ones swell up.
     
  21. ixxx69 macrumors 6502a

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    #21
    Do you guys have this backwards? You understand if you go over 1000 cycles, then they will NOT replace the battery, whether you have applecare or not (unless your applecare specialist is just happens to be feeling nice).

    If you go over 1000 cycles even in the warranty period, that would be considered extreme usage and not covered by the warranty.
     
  22. PaulWog Suspended

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2011
    #22
    I understand this perfectly. I don't think you know how to interpret what you read. I think you've got something or rather in a twist here. Calm down.

    If you go through 1000 cycles (as in, you have used 1000 cycles of your battery), within 1 year, then it is likely that you will have lower than 80% battery life. All you have to do is walk into an Apple Store and say "look, 76% battery life at 992 cycles 9 months into ownership". But how likely is that? Not many people run through their battery twice a day (that's just ridiculous).

    I already said, the math is about 50 cycles to 1% battery life, in an average Macbook.

    Their calculations do not take battery age into consideration. 1 year equates to about 5% (250 cycles) of battery life loss.

    These numbers are subject to differences based on the year/make of the battery, as well as where the individual battery in question sits from the average battery.

    I haven't looked at what Applecare offers, but it's likely worth it if they cover the same 1000 cycles over a 3-year period... if someone plans to run through 1000 cycles (that's still a lot of usage even in 3 years though). That'll be a battery replacement for most people.
     
  23. ixxx69 macrumors 6502a

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    #23
    I don't know how to read? I'm in a twist? Calm down? Really, I don't know how you so badly misinterpreted what I wrote. LOL, re-read my post. You have this so backwards, it's a chuckle.

    The rest of your post, I didn't try to follow the math, I have no idea whether it's wrong or right, nor do I care. The only thing I pointed out is that you appeared to suggest if you go over 1000 cycles and have less than 80% battery life within the warranty period, a replacement battery is covered by the warranty. And I don't think that's correct. If you keep it under 1000 cycles, and it's at less than 80%, and it's under warranty, then yes, the battery would be replaced under warranty. If you meant the latter, I guess I just misunderstood what I quoted you as saying... it wasn't intentional.
     
  24. leman macrumors 604

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    Oct 14, 2008
    #24
    There seems to be a lot of confusion here. It's not about getting 1000 cycles to get a free replacement. It's about the fact that your battery is most likely defective if it reaches below 80% before 1000 cycles AND is relatively new.
     
  25. shareef777 macrumors 68000

    shareef777

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2005
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    #25
    You're right, I'd get near the 1k (but stay under) to show how well below 70% it'd be and hopefully get it replaced. On a side note I sent in my 2012 to get the logic board replaced under the extended video support program and they sent it back to me with a new logic board, and top case (which includes a new battery and keyboard). They even replaced the bluetooth/wireless module as it wasn't the 'official one' as I had replaced it myself to get wireless AC. All in all, fantastic support coverage AFTER support ended. Pretty ironic.
     

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