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OS X Absolutely Fed Up....

I have a desktop PC and an MBP. At some point either computer could boot to OS X or Windows.

For the past months however I've noticed that I tend to use OS X on the MBP (web, email, iMessage, Spotify...) and Windows 8 on the PC solely for gaming. Seems to be the way to get the best out of both worlds. The only downside is that I have substantial money tied to HW and I have 2 computers taking up physical space.

MBP was otherwise OK for gaming, but the fan speed got irritating at high loads. At low-average loads its silent.
 
Irishman said:
Have you played any current games on one of those "low end iMacs"?
Click to expand...

No I have not, but I know they play current games. But games released in 1-2 years? After 1,5-2 years most new games will only be able to run on low settings and even then sometimes become a diashow. At least that's my experience with these machines before I got my Mac Pro in 2010.

If I wouldn't also use this machine for work I probably would do it like the poster before me. MacBook for everything + PC tower for gaming.
 
chaosbunny said:
No I have not, but I know they play current games. But games released in 1-2 years? After 1,5-2 years most new games will only be able to run on low settings and even then sometimes become a diashow. At least that's my experience with these machines before I got my Mac Pro in 2010.

If I wouldn't also use this machine for work I probably would do it like the poster before me. MacBook for everything + PC tower for gaming.
Click to expand...

My point is that I have one of those "low-end iMacs" you're placing such little value on. (Specifically, the 2.9GHz 21.5" with the NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M 512 MB gpu).

Here are the benchmarks I've run:


Rage (transcode benchmark) - 70 MT/s
XBench - 242.79
Geekbench - (32 bit) - 9312
Novabench - 955
Blackmagic - 107 Write / 99 Read
Unigine Heaven (default) 20.3 FPS (with 4x AA)
Unigine Valley (default) 18.5 FPS (with 4X AA)
 
Irishman said:
My point is that I have one of those "low-end iMacs" you're placing such little value on. (Specifically, the 2.9GHz 21.5" with the NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M 512 MB gpu).

Here are the benchmarks I've run:

Rage (transcode benchmark) - 70 MT/s
XBench - 242.79
Geekbench - (32 bit) - 9312
Novabench - 955
Blackmagic - 107 Write / 99 Read
Unigine Heaven (default) 20.3 FPS (with 4x AA)
Unigine Valley (default) 18.5 FPS (with 4X AA)
Click to expand...

Decent benchmarks. More than fine for most users over the longer-term if gaming is a secondary interest. Otherwise, no non-upgradable AIO computer is anywhere near the best option. Not unless, mindful of 2nd user Macs maintaining good monetary value, you plan on replacing a "low-end iMac" every couple of years or so. I know some Mac users regularly do this before their 3-yr Apple Care runs out.

IMHO, for those who can't afford a Mac Pro or don't need such power for OS X-related work, you can't go far wrong with a Mini or a low-end MBP for serious work & a computer with an upgradable GPU for gaming. For most gamers, the latter need seems best met by a Windows desktop. One then has the best of both worlds. :)
 
Irishman said:
My point is that I have one of those "low-end iMacs" you're placing such little value on. (Specifically, the 2.9GHz 21.5" with the NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M 512 MB gpu).

Here are the benchmarks I've run:


Rage (transcode benchmark) - 70 MT/s
XBench - 242.79
Geekbench - (32 bit) - 9312
Novabench - 955
Blackmagic - 107 Write / 99 Read
Unigine Heaven (default) 20.3 FPS (with 4x AA)
Unigine Valley (default) 18.5 FPS (with 4X AA)
Click to expand...

I'm sorry if I sounded arrogant or something - I didn't mean to place little value on these machines by saying "low end". Just didn't know a better word. Mac Minis, 13" MBPs and 21,5" iMacs are certainly not bad AT ALL! No surprise your iMac has good benchmarks, it has a desktop i5 processor as far as I know.

But the 512mb NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M is a mobile gpu, and will become a bottleneck for gaming in 2 years. How important this is everybody has to decide for themself. For most other uses that are more cpu than gpu bound you have a great machine for years to come.
 
gregorsamsa said:
IMHO, for those who can't afford a Mac Pro or don't need such power for OS X-related work, you can't go far wrong with a Mini or a low-end MBP for serious work & a computer with an upgradable GPU for gaming. For most gamers, the latter need seems best met by a Windows desktop. One then has the best of both worlds. :)
Click to expand...

Pretty much this. I have a dual-boot Hackintosh and a 13" MBP. Definitely the best of both worlds.

Now, if Apple wants to offer me a $999 consumer level tower with that 7970 as an upgrade, I'll pay attention. But I don't see that happening ever.
 
Cougarcat said:
Pretty much this. I have a dual-boot Hackintosh and a 13" MBP. Definitely the best of both worlds.

Now, if Apple wants to offer me a $999 consumer level tower with that 7970 as an upgrade, I'll pay attention. But I don't see that happening ever.
Click to expand...

I'd love to be able to devote the time to keep a Hackintosh fully operational, but it's something that'll have to wait. Maybe one day.

Much agree with the latter point & if only! :) Ever since I joined this forum in 2006 (a few months after buying my 1st Mac), I've read no end of mostly interesting debate about this. IMO, if ever there was a realistic chance of such a Mac being released, it was probably back then, ie. before a time when laptops & mobile devices heavily outsold desktops.

Will still be interesting to see how Apple price their new range of upcoming Mac Pros, but anything much less than $2,500 on the lower-end, let alone $2K, will surprise me.
 
gregorsamsa said:
I'd love to be able to devote the time to keep a Hackintosh fully operational, but it's something that'll have to wait. Maybe one day.
Click to expand...
That day should be now rather than later. Hackintoshes require practically no maintenance, just as with a genuine Mac.

Powerful computer hardware these days is also less important for gaming, given the general trend toward consoles and their downward pressure on engines with all the bells and whistles. Sure helps laptops out.
 
If you care about PC gaming, for the most part, you are either (a) all PC or (b) have bootcamp. I was a hold out for a long time and didn't game much on my Mac as a result. I mainly console gamed. But I finally broke down and bought a Windows 7 license and loaded in on my iMac. I don't like switching into bootcamp to game, but I love the fact that I can buy anything right when it comes out.
 
Mackilroy said:
That day should be now rather than later. Hackintoshes require practically no maintenance, just as with a genuine Mac.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure I would say that. It is definitely more time consuming to set up, and to upgrade major OS revisions. There's also a bit more maintenance for point updates (combo updater, rolling back audio kexts.)
 
Cougarcat said:
I'm not sure I would say that. It is definitely more time consuming to set up, and to upgrade major OS revisions. There's also a bit more maintenance for point updates (combo updater, rolling back audio kexts.)
Click to expand...
Of course it's more work to set up–you have to actually build the computer. However, both for major OS updates and point updates, I've had an extremely minimal amount of work involved. With 10.8.3, for example, I updated one kext. That's it. If that's much more maintenance I'll eat my hat.
 
Mackilroy said:
Of course it's more work to set up–you have to actually build the computer. However, both for major OS updates and point updates, I've had an extremely minimal amount of work involved. With 10.8.3, for example, I updated one kext. That's it. If that's much more maintenance I'll eat my hat.
Click to expand...

You equated it with a genuine Mac, and it's not. Even putting the issue of building the computer aside, non-technical users shouldn't bother with a Hackintosh.
 
Irishman said:
Have you played any current games on one of those "low end iMacs"?
Click to expand...

All the time... They run the games fine as long as you don't expect to be able to play with high resolutions and settings especially on the retina 13" for example!

However they will get to old for gaming quicker than a Mac with dedicated cards installed.

Edwin
 
Mackilroy said:
That day should be now rather than later. Hackintoshes require practically no maintenance, just as with a genuine Mac.

Powerful computer hardware these days is also less important for gaming, given the general trend toward consoles and their downward pressure on engines with all the bells and whistles. Sure helps laptops out.
Click to expand...

Thanks. Assuming that my PC's motherboard (an ASUS M5A78LM USB3) is compatible for a OS X hack, I'd also want to be able to readily switch between OS X Snow Leopard & Windows 8. If that wasn't smooth, I'm in no position right now to be messing about looking for time-consuming solutions.

Disagree re the console viewpoint. There are still many gamers for whom a console just doesn't meet their needs. I include myself. For eg. no RTS like the Total War series. :)

Kindly note, sales of all consoles & console games have also gone down in recent years. IMO, that downward trend may continue, esp when PS3 & Xbox 360 gamers find that they can't play their older, disc-based games on the next generation without paying yet again for the same games in digital versions. PC/Mac gaming isn't going away.
 
gregorsamsa said:
Thanks. Assuming that my PC's motherboard (an ASUS M5A78LM USB3) is compatible for a OS X hack, I'd also want to be able to readily switch between OS X Snow Leopard & Windows 8. If that wasn't smooth, I'm in no position right now to be messing about looking for time-consuming solutions.

Disagree re the console viewpoint. There are still many gamers for whom a console just doesn't meet their needs. I include myself. For eg. no RTS like the Total War series. :)

Kindly note, sales of all consoles & console games have also gone down in recent years. IMO, that downward trend may continue, esp when PS3 & Xbox 360 gamers find that they can't play their older, disc-based games on the next generation without paying yet again for the same games in digital versions. PC/Mac gaming isn't going away.
Click to expand...

To be honest, if you're looking to game in Windows, there's no reason to be looking at Windows 8.
 
Irishman said:
To be honest, if you're looking to game in Windows, there's no reason to be looking at Windows 8.
Click to expand...
Thanks. Valid point, but general opinion varies on this. Though I'm still new to Windows 8, from what I've read from many different sources, it retains excellent backward compatibility, for games included. Certainly no less than Windows 7, if not better.

The Metro interface is a bit pointless on a desktop, but soon easily by-passed.

Overall, I think both W7 & W8 are excellent for gaming, so I don't disagree with you. I went for W8 as I already have W7 on a mid-range laptop, but wanted MS's latest OS for a few tasks beyond gaming.
 
Buy a PS3 or an Xbox. Seriously, its far cheaper.

The tripple-A titles are on consoles anyways, and you can get cheaper/indie games from their respective online stores. Diablo 3 is going to be ported to a console for pete's sake.

Or you can build a gaming PC pretty cheaply (around $500 ish).

I built a PC almost exclusively for gaming on Windows. I am now building a second PC with even better specs to play games on (my 14 year old daughter is getting the current PC for her birthday in a few weeks, to play games on). That is my choice. As a Mac user, and a Geek, I liked building the PC as much as playing games on it.

Also, a lot of games are only on iOS devices these days, or iOS and maybe Windows ports (I see this a lot of on Steam). Heck the Apple TV may evolve into a gaming console of sorts for iOS games.

The Mac just isn't a gaming platform, sorry.
 
gregorsamsa said:
Disagree re the console viewpoint. There are still many gamers for whom a console just doesn't meet their needs. I include myself. For eg. no RTS like the Total War series. :)
Click to expand...
True, RTS games don't work so well on consoles, but RPGs, FPSes, platformers–those work just as well, or nearly so. I'm right with you, I prefer PCs to consoles, but at the same time I think a lot of people enjoy the party aspect of a console, as you're able to have multiple people all playing together on one screen. Not so easy to do with a computer.
 
I think it has to do with most Macs these days being notebooks without a snowballs chance in hell of running a contemporary game on low low low low low low low low low low low low settings. So, I doubt most developers would care about such things. My 2010 17" MBP can't play anything new. Literally nothing works well, everything is a huge compromise.

I simply couldn't imagine trying to play on a less robust Mac notebook.
 
To the OP. Whoever told you that Apple hasovertake MS in sales for operating systems is truly mis-informed.

Windows still control ~%80 of the market so naturally more games.

If you are a hardcore gamer, you need Windows.
 
Admittedly I've not been using Mountain Lion for very long, but it seems like its much more of a resources hog than Snow Leopard, with frequent spinning balls. I've not been playing much if any games native on MacOS lately, but I suspect this would have somewhat of an adverse effect unless you have 8GB Ram installed. Yes, no, possibly?

For reference, when I switch to Windows7 to play games, I use a program called Tuneup Utilities, which has a Turbo Mode which automatically shuts down non-essential resources. I see a distinct difference in performance between when turbo mode is on or off. I wonder if there is a utility for MacOS that does the same thing?
 
Huntn said:
Admittedly I've not been using Mountain Lion for very long, but it seems like its much more of a resources hog than Snow Leopard, with frequent spinning balls. I've not been playing much if any games native on MacOS lately, but I suspect this would have somewhat of an adverse effect unless you have 8GB Ram installed. Yes, no, possibly?

For reference, when I switch to Windows7 to play games, I use a program called Tuneup Utilities, which has a Turbo Mode which automatically shuts down non-essential resources. I see a distinct difference in performance between when turbo mode is on or off. I wonder if there is a utility for MacOS that does the same thing?
Click to expand...

There are apps for OS X that will let you pause processes, but note that due to architectural differences Windows games will always be able to utilize more resources.

I haven't noticed an increase in RAM usage in ML personally. You can see if the beach balls are due to a RAM shortage by examining your page outs in activity monitor. If it's a gig or more then you probably need more.
 
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