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If you are using Adobe apps daily and you earn money from them, then they are cheap and useful. If you need them intermittently like me it becomes too expensive. If they had a per use model I would be more tempted to keep my licences, but not at annual subscriptions [except when I am earning a tonne of cash and I dont care about the cost....]
In the begining the subscription model was not too bad as it allowed people to spread out the cost of the expensive software and get the version updates far cheaper. However, they messed with it and got greedy. Either way, I prefer to own/perm licensing of the software than to be force to continually pay.
 
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I bought them and regretted it.

They're just bad. I can growl at Adobe all day for things like bugs, but I'm not going to suicide my career by using slower Temu quality apps.
This is exactly what I’m trying to say. A pile of marginal moaning “users” try to convince those apps are just fine. Maybe it’s true for their home projects but not for serious business. BTW, here’s a fresh release of Gimp around. “Get it!” 😂
 
I have to have it due to work, unfortunately. I hate Adobe though for all they're worth and wouldn't pay for it otherwise.

BUT, a serious question to mainly Lightroom users and then Lightroom converts to something else. I would love to use Lightroom and have had the subscription for it, again the whole CC package only for work. But, I do have it. So that includes Lightroom.

However, I always fear being locked into the Adobe ecosystem, and I don't even really use Lightroom because I don't want all of my photos locked to Adobe if I ever decide to get out, which I hopefully will at some point.

There are some other options that I've seen passed around as alternatives, but with Apple's recent Pixelmator acquisition, I'm very curious about how Photomator mainly on the Mac compares?
I know it definitely won't fully compare, but I see that it does handle RAW, etc. I'm sure it's editing feature set is much less?

I know there are whole threads on this, but it's hard to find an answer with everyone recommending something different. So, can anyone say how well Photomator (not Pixelmator, while it's also a great editing app) stacks up compared to Lightroom for overall things like library management, editing and so on?
Can I ask a question? I’ve recently been using LR for iPad, I’m not fully knowledgeable about Adobe and their licensing. Do you mean that any raw photos I edit with LR now “belong” to Adobe or at least the edits. So, if I was to stop using or paying a fee those edits disappear, even if I export the photos to another app. That would be a deal breaker for me. Thanks for any insight or knowledg.
 
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That's always been the case, though. Even before Adobe went with subscriptions.

The average consumer wasn't paying $700 for Photoshop or $2,600 for Adobe Master Collection back in the day.

It was professionals who were paying for that... not moms and dads. Adobe was, and still is, for people who make money with their creations.

There were always cheaper and more consumer-oriented software options for regular people.
They also had special prices for education and things of the like.
 
This is exactly what I’m trying to say. A pile of marginal moaning “users” try to convince those apps are just fine. Maybe it’s true for their home projects but not for serious business. BTW, here’s a fresh release of Gimp around. “Get it!” 😂

For 20 years I've had freetards on the web try mental gymnastics to convince me why I should dump Photoshop for Gimp or whatever the latest 50 dollar app is. These people just make cat memes and Elon worship images. They aren't professionals at anything.

Their hypocrisy is even more obvious when they scream "AI is STeAlinG fRoM ArTisTS!" but there they are torrenting apps, torrenting anime and torrenting movies. They spend no money supporting artists and software engineers in these industries. If they did buy software and movies the industries would be more stable, jobs would be more stable, and the cost of apps and movies might be better today.
 
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I bought FCPX 12 years ago (Premiere), Pixelmator a few years ago (Photoshop) and Photomator last year (Lightroom).

Grand total : ~$460 taxes included. One time payment only.

I don't need anything from Adobe.
 
Thanks Adobe for helping me discover Pixelmator and Photomator!!
They are the best substitutes, if you ask me. Let's see what their acquisition by Apple brings
Years of stagnation and lackluster, untimely updates before cancelling them with a cold press release announcing the discontinuation at most, if Aperture’s demise is any indication.
 
Adobe is a criminal organization. You HAVE to pirate Adobe software. Otherwise you support criminals.

Adobe made it very hard to cancel a subscription. That goes against EU laws and I am sure it also goes against US laws.
Nah, this is a naive, thinly rationalized criminal attitude, bordering on simple trolling. Adobe's ridiculous, abusive behavior in this regard was crafted specifically to be legal in the U.S. That does NOT mean it's okay.

Sneaky subscription tactics appear to be subject to civil court litigation, and U.S. regulatory agencies and courts were about to side with our consumers in this issue; however, the incoming U.S. "administration" will soon put an end to attempts at court-enforced fairness. Adobe will drive the money truck up to Mara Lago's servants' entrance, and leave with carte blanche to continue abusing consumers - until their next tithe payment is due.

This. Despite owning and upgrading a pricey Adobe Design Collection for years, when Adobe forced its subscription model that holds one's intellectual property hostage if you fail to continually pay every month I left Adobe forever. Eff Adobe.

Pixelmator and Affinity products suffice very well.
I am very suspicious of subscription models, but getting held hostage is a choice. It might take extra work to extract intellectual property from online services and vaults, in an interchange format. And perhaps protect it from theft by AI crawlers. I simply do not use services that truly lock up content (common among database-oriented apps, like event management, collections management, inventory) or allow only proprietary data formats when downloaded.

But that' part of the game, today. The starting assumption is that all vendors intend to steal to pad their revenue. In Adobe's case, I use only local apps with strictly local storage, and collect copies software everything in TIFF, JPG, PS, PDF (Thanks, adobe, for that at least), RTF, etc., etc. It's not bulletproof, though. Adobe is 100% positively proven to transmit indexes of locally user-created content to servers under their control. It would be naive to assume that they're the only ones.

Affinity is my go-to, now that I'm out of the industry. Photo, Designer and Publisher are... Okay. Adequate. Usable. Tolerable. Forgivable at the price point. However, as a working professional with deadlines, there is NO ***** way I'd trust Affinity with my career and customers' business. Affinity's apps lack features most pros consider essential, and the code is just plain buggy. That's it. End of debate.

It would be nice to see Apple up its game with the recent 'Mator acquisitions. There are some credible competitors to Lightroom in the market, but, again, Lightroom has the pro-time-in-grade advantage in features, fidelity and reliability.

Adobe went subscription-only 11 years ago.

But for all the complaining I hear on forums about people hating subscriptions... apparently not enough people have cancelled their subscriptions to make Adobe to feel the pressure.

In fact... there are more people using Adobe software today than any other time in history.

Fascinating.
What the modern Affinity has accomplished (since their grade-b efforts as Serif, back in the day) is impressive. In a few short years, they have pushed well into "Advanced Hobbyist" territory. The 'Mators, likewise. I'm looking forward to a worthy Lightroom replacement. And Acrobat Pro, too, for that matter. Though I will be dead soon, so, pfft.

Adobe is closing in on effectively FIFTY YEARS in the biz! They are effectively the OG of DTP. It used to be extremely costly to buy Illustrator, Photoshop, PageMaker and Acrobat, plus quality typefaces, for several seats, with only a 50% discount for upgrades, if you stayed within a couple versions. Do the math today, for keeping current, plus fonts and stock. Adobe is cheaper than it's ever been for professionals. Though still way too expensive (and abusive) for hobbyists.

There's never been a precedent in human history for poor people to have cool ****. Seemingly good, cheap/free stuff is always an illusion; consumers just get screwed some other way. That's what supply and demand means. Software was never an exception (apart from betas, early adopter loss-leaders, and plain dumb marketing or security mistakes). Same with Affinity and the 'Mators; they couldn't get over the next hump at the prices they were charging.

<shug> Pay money. Do work. Don't steal. And also don't complain about deals with the devil.
 
I bought them and regretted it.

They're just bad. I can growl at Adobe all day for things like bugs, but I'm not going to suicide my career by using slower Temu quality apps.
Your response is completely out of context from who I replied. The person I replied to wanted to use it every once in a while (start/stop subscription every couple months), not someone who, like you, uses it full time for their career. I don't know what you do, nor do I care, but your assessment of the Affinity apps show some sort of bias against them. Good luck with Adobe -- if this thread is any example, you're in a minority in your support for them.
 
And one other infuriating aspect, they refuse to offer a simple Photoshop and Illustrator package. Those two are all I would really need but they can't allow that level of savings. No thank you.
Just get the affinity bundle and you have a perfect alternative for a fraction of the price for you to keep, beat of all you can get a licence for windows Mac and iPad os for a fraction of that.

Switched myself years ago, never looked back.
 
This is exactly what I’m trying to say. A pile of marginal moaning “users” try to convince those apps are just fine. Maybe it’s true for their home projects but not for serious business. BTW, here’s a fresh release of Gimp around. “Get it!” 😂
I use Affinity to make professional designs, and design secure labels for authentication and anti counterfeit how is that “a home project “
 
Final Cut Pro is Mac-only.

The real threat to Adobe's Premiere Pro is Blackmagic DaVinci Resolve. It's available on Mac and Windows.

It starts at FREE... with a $295 perpetual license for the pro Studio version.

And the free version is fully-functional. It's not a limited trial version. You only need to pay for the Studio version if you require advanced editing capabilities like 6K and 120fps.

If Adobe should be worried about anyone... it's Blackmagic!

:p
In fact, once I tried Resolve I quit my PremierePro subscription.
 
For 20 years I've had freetards on the web try mental gymnastics to convince me why I should dump Photoshop for Gimp or whatever the latest 50 dollar app is. These people just make cat memes and Elon worship images. They aren't professionals at anything.

Their hypocrisy is even more obvious when they scream "AI is STeAlinG fRoM ArTisTS!" but there they are torrenting apps, torrenting anime and torrenting movies. They spend no money supporting artists and software engineers in these industries. If they did buy software and movies the industries would be more stable, jobs would be more stable, and the cost of apps and movies might be better today.
Some professionals have jumped ship from Adobe. Some also like to publicly share their contempt for Adobe or their acknowledgment that some of those "latest 50 dollar app" offerings can do the job well enough. One might conclude that some will stick with Adobe and some will not, and it is not a measure of how much one is a professional.

AI is a mixed bag and as more is exploited in 2D work, the more one can find an audience that will accept mediocrity. AI can be extremely valuable in both time saved and results. Today, I see way too many click-and-submit uses of AI with photos. I say all of this and admit fully that the one feature I do appreciate about Photoshop is its newest AI features when used with care. Artists might be right to worry. Not so much about AI doing a great job but as mentioned, a willingness of the public to accept mediocrity in place of quality and real creativity.

I gather your point about the industry but find it a rather specious argument with respect to the costs of apps and movies. There are other factors that way in far more on stability within the movie industry and other art oriented fields that may use software such as Photoshop.

Btw, I have no desire to encourage you to dump Photoshop for Gimp or a 50 dollar app. I do, however, encourage others to investigate what is out there and what they believe their needs will be to find the right tool and not overpay or get into a pay model that somewhat obligates the end user to continue. I hope you get all the mileage you can out of Photoshop and are happy with the results of your efforts.
 
This is exactly what I’m trying to say. A pile of marginal moaning “users” try to convince those apps are just fine. Maybe it’s true for their home projects but not for serious business. BTW, here’s a fresh release of Gimp around. “Get it!” 😂

You're such a funny Adobe fanboy... 😁

I've been using the Affinity apps in my day-to-day professional work for several years now and these are often projects for large, well-known companies. I still kept Adobe just in case until recently. This spring I said goodbye to them with no regrets. It wasn't even about the money. I just naturally stopped using their software.
 
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