Adobe To Drop PowerPC Support For After Effects CS4

[Eric S.]

The problem is that the newest software will not be available for machines that are still capable of running them (from a spec standpoint).

The fact that the G5 Quad won't be able to run this software after being out of production for just over 2.5 years seems ridiculous to me. Especially considering it was mostly PRO users who bought these machines for programs just like this (and not only the current versions when they bought them but subsequent versions). I know this isn't the case for most, but when I buy a pro machine I expect it to last upwards of 4-5 years with upgrades to things like RAM and video cards along the way. It would be nice if companies weren't so willing to ditch their PPC users so fast.

Application developers will follow Apple's lead on this. When Apple dumps PPC support in Snow Leopard, it's the same as announcing that PPC is dead. Developing an app on both architectures is costly in terms of time and resources, and if Apple is no longer supporting PPC the app developers are probably relieved to drop it too.

Apple is a business and they don't care about you or your investment. When the bottom line says that PPC support is no longer worth the resources they're investing in it, that's it.

 

[dasikes]

If Adobe is going to use the excuse of dropping PPC support to improve CS4, they better completely overhaul the UI and performance. Adobe After Effects has been stuck with the same workflow UI since the early 1990's.

Is that really a bad thing, though? It's a good workflow, in my opinion.

 

[dasikes]

I honestly don't know the rush to upgrade everything. For all we know, AECS4 may not bring that much more to the table: CS3 sure didn't. Yes, some neat features and presets, but nothing you couldn't have done in the previous versions.

I'm running a G5 at work. By the time we're ready to upgrade to CS4 (or even CS5. It all depends on how "worth it" CS4 is), it'll be time for a new machine, anyway. I'm not that concerned.

 

[Amdahl]

People seem to be under the impression ( at least, their doom-mongering posts ) infer that perhaps all the software they currently use quite happily on their PPC machines will suddenly implode and cease working, simply because new software isn't being written with their machine in mind.

Seriously - you will be able to do everything you can do now - nothing will change. Just other companies are moving on, and rightly so.-

And I will continue to call BS on this statement. When Apple drops PPC support, you won't be able to use a PPC Mac on the Internet. When Adobe drops PPC support (and support for the last PPC release), you will be at risk when security issues are discovered in their Adobe products. Apple needs to commit to providing security releases for five years after the date of last sale of a computer and/or boxed OS.

Is it unreasonable to expect your brand new computer to be safe to operate on the Internet for five years?

 

[Amdahl]

You will still be able to use all the software you use now.

Where's the problem?

Nobody buys a computer without the assurance that it has future compatibility with future software, so stop making that stupid argument.

 

[Amdahl]

A
Apple is a business and they don't care about you or your investment. When the bottom line says that PPC support is no longer worth the resources they're investing in it, that's it.

Apple is a software platform vendor. They absolutely have an interest in showing commitment to the platforms they sell, past, present, and future. Microsoft knows this, and Microsoft acts accordingly. Apple needs to recognize this as well, or their market share rise is going to hit a brick wall.

 

[ChrisA]

How is the API that they are programming to different between Intel and PPC? The only issue they should have is testing, not development. So they are only partially correct in saving testing time, engineering time should not be impacted.

They are only dropping PPC support in After Effects, not in all of CS4. I thing After Effects might us a lot of CPU specific code. Certainly the vector instructions are differnt. This kind of stuff is hand coded in assembly. The "API" in this case (if you want to call it an API) is just the bare hardware which of course is different on the PPC and X86.

 

[Eric S.]

Apple is a software platform vendor. They absolutely have an interest in showing commitment to the platforms they sell, past, present, and future. Microsoft knows this, and Microsoft acts accordingly. Apple needs to recognize this as well, or their market share rise is going to hit a brick wall.

They do have an interest in it, but only a limited interest. Limited in the sense that when they believe that support of legacy platforms (i.e., HW they no longer sell) is not worth the cost of development and test for those platforms, they will pull the plug.

Apple's market share is largely dependent on their financial success and their perception as a dynamic, growing company by investors and the media. Market share is tied to their bottom line, which drives the decisions to support or drop platforms, not the other way around.

Apple and Microsoft have different business models. Apple makes its revenue margins from HW sales, therefore it has incentive to move customers to buy new systems. Microsoft makes its revenue margins from SW, therefore it has incentive to see that its SW runs on as many platforms as possible.

I have a PPC system running Leopard, and I don't like the fact that Apple is dropping support for it either but I have seen it coming for some time now. It's not for technological reasons; it is driven by marketing.

 

[Amdahl]

They do have an interest in it, but only a limited interest. Limited in the sense that when they believe that support of legacy platforms (i.e., HW they no longer sell) is not worth the cost of development and test for those platforms, they will pull the plug.

I accept that behavior in a toy maker, such as Nintendo. I do not accept that behavior in a computer company.

The irony in my statement, is that Nintendo provides better support for their old products than Apple.

 

[macworkerbee]

Application developers will follow Apple's lead on this. When Apple dumps PPC support in Snow Leopard, it's the same as announcing that PPC is dead. Developing an app on both architectures is costly in terms of time and resources, and if Apple is no longer supporting PPC the app developers are probably relieved to drop it too.

Apple is a business and they don't care about you or your investment. When the bottom line says that PPC support is no longer worth the resources they're investing in it, that's it.

I understand your point but also feel that 3 years is a very short time to be dropping support for customers who have invested in your business. If you can't tell, I'm not a big fan of dropping PPC support in Snow Leopard. I know that current Intel users are calling for a more streamlined OS with less legacy issues, but I think that a company like Apple, who has built a reputation for it's customers' brand loyalty, should think about a greater majority of it's customers, past, present, and future.

I would be happy if we could have Snow Leopard and CS4 for both Intel and PPC machines. After that, I understand that the machines are officially "over the hill" and won't gripe at all if developers drop support. By then I can buy a new Mac Pro anyways.

 

[Eric S.]

I accept that behavior in a toy maker, such as Nintendo. I do not accept that behavior in a computer company.

Well, the problem is that Apple doesn't care whether you (or I, or anyone) accepts their behavior or not. They are driven by market forces. 20 or 30 years ago, companies could start up in the tech business and just do things that were cool and innovative. Even eight or ten years ago in the dot com boom some companies were able to do that for a while (although most went bust or got swallowed by a bigger fish). But today there is a ruthless, cutthroat bottom-line environment.

I understand your point but also feel that 3 years is a very short time to be dropping support for customers who have invested in your business.

I agree, and it isn't even 3 years. Two years ago this month the Mac Pro was released and, as someone else pointed out, G5's were sold for a while even after that. I have nothing to complain about because my Power Mac G4 is eight years old and still able, as of now, to run the latest OS X. But owners of late model G5's unfortunately got stuck at the wrong point of the technology wave. When Jobs announced the Intel switch at the 2005 WWDC, he declared that Apple would support both architectures "for a long time." If and when PPC support is dropped in Snow Leopard next year, will Apple have fulfilled that promise? All I know is that corporations will always act in what they consider their own best interest.

 

[Little Endian]

You will still be able to use all the software you use now.

Where's the problem?

My Problem is that my PowerPC mac is still the fastest mac i own despite buying a nearly top end MBP just a few months ago. My problem is that I own a PowerPC based Mac that is still faster than probably 90% plus of all of the Mac's installed user base.
My Home desktop is far from dead. PowerPC Mac Users still account for roughly half of all of the Machines running OSX. Power PC has been around for well over a Decade remember that.

 

[djellison]

What if Adobe decided to not make CS4 at all?

Would you be screaming murder then?

If you bought a G5 mac with the hope of using CS4 - you're an idiot. If you bought a G5 mac without that hope, you've nothing to complain about. CS3 was their transition platform - that's for you on your old G5's. What next, moaning that CS5 isn't supporting 68K?

No one is forcing people to buy CS4 and then have it not run. You're not out of pocket. And if history is anything to go by, there is nothing that you will be unable to do in CS3 that CS4 will. It's like Adobe have raided your homes and burnt your computers or something. Seriously - what's wrong with using CS3?

Doug

 

[macworkerbee]

What if Adobe decided to not make CS4 at all?

Would you be screaming murder then?

If you bought a G5 mac with the hope of using CS4 - you're an idiot. If you bought a G5 mac without that hope, you've nothing to complain about. CS3 was their transition platform - that's for you on your old G5's. What next, moaning that CS5 isn't supporting 68K?

No one is forcing people to buy CS4 and then have it not run. You're not out of pocket. And if history is anything to go by, there is nothing that you will be unable to do in CS3 that CS4 will. It's like Adobe have raided your homes and burnt your computers or something. Seriously - what's wrong with using CS3?

Doug

Really, an idiot? I don't think I'm an idiot, just backed into a corner by Apple and Adobe when it came time to buy a new pro machine and only the G5 Quad was available. I expect my machines to last 4-5 years and that it will be able to run the newest versions of creative software for that long (especially when I bought the highest pro configuration available).

 

[djellison]

I expect my machines to last 4-5 years

Yet in full knowledge of the switch to Intel you bought an old generation machine. You can claim you 'had' to - that's fine. But you can't expect developers to compromise their development plans simply because of out-dated hardware. They services your needs with CS3. Now it's time for them to move on.

And guess what - You'll still be able to use CS3 on that machine until it falls apart. If your life depends on the differences between CS3 and CS4 ( which, by experience, will be 4/5ths of 9/10ths of F-all ) then I pity you. You were not backed into a corner - you were given an Olive branch with CS3.

Seriously - people are bitching that they wont be able to use CS4...and they don't even know what, IF ANY, benefit CS4 will be to them. That is idiotic.

 

[macworkerbee]

Yet in full knowledge of the switch to Intel you bought an old generation machine. You can claim you 'had' to - that's fine. But you can't expect developers to compromise their development plans simply because of out-dated hardware. They services your needs with CS3. Now it's time for them to move on.

And guess what - You'll still be able to use CS3 on that machine until it falls apart. If your life depends on the differences between CS3 and CS4 ( which, by experience, will be 4/5ths of 9/10ths of F-all ) then I pity you. You were not backed into a corner - you were given an Olive branch with CS3.

Seriously - people are bitching that they wont be able to use CS4...and they don't even know what, IF ANY, benefit CS4 will be to them. That is idiotic.

This isn't a matter of being able to use a specific feature of a specific program. It is about a major software developer who is rumored to be disregarding a very established customer base. And no, my life doesn't depend on using CS4 when it comes out but it is about a major investment being valuable for more than 3 years. I understand that technology has to move forward and some will be burned by it, but I just don't think it is unreasonable for a top of the line pro machine (its not like we're talking a mac mini or an imac here) to be expected to be able to run the latest OS and mainstream programs for 4-5 years (Intel switch announced or not).

Oh yeah, and don't tell me what I needed and when I needed it as you have no idea what my situation was when I bought my G5. I understand the difference between need and want and wouldn't have bought this machine if I could have waited for the Mac Pro.

 

[mBox]

...Oh yeah, and don't tell me what I needed and when I needed it as you have no idea what my situation was when I bought my G5. I understand the difference between need and want and wouldn't have bought this machine if I could have waited for the Mac Pro.

Sadly this is common practice for most of us in this field. Ive thrown money at apps such as Electric Image just to watch it go from a 12k price down to nothing hardware is no diff. I can honestly say that my G4 QuickSilver (home) is still running Protools 7LE but forget about Adobe products
Im running MacIntels/XP with Adobe Master Collection. Worse upgrade ever!!!
Do I still use it even though it crashes on both platforms, we have here...yes

 

[SpinThis!]

This isn't a matter of being able to use a specific feature of a specific program. It is about a major software developer who is rumored to be disregarding a very established customer base. And no, my life doesn't depend on using CS4 when it comes out but it is about a major investment being valuable for more than 3 years.

I hate to break it to you but computers and software are never an investment. Adobe's suite and Apple's pro line are designed to make money. If you're not making money with your hardware or it takes you 3 years to recoup your investment, you're doing something wrong or you're a hobbyist with a lot of money to burn.

Adobe never said they would stop supporting CS3 and that doesn't stop you from making money from it either. If you're one of those people who compulsively stop working because they're not completely up-to-date, I hate to say this: you're in the wrong business. Maybe you should consider selling your G5 on eBay for around $1000+ while it's still worth something, and stick that money into a new Mac Pro and get back to work.

From Adobe's blog:

The vast majority of our professional Mac customers will already be using After Effects on a Intel-based mac by the time we ship the next version. Not surprising, really. The performance advantage of multi-core Intel Macs is impressive. There are plenty of reasons for this trend to continue...

Especially for the intended purpose of After Effects, the PM G5 is downright a little anemic for processing effects onto video these days when compared to Intel's core architecture. And with the GPUs these days helping out (that simply weren't available in the PowerMac days), imho it seems Adobe's rationale is pretty solid. A lot has changed in the last few years. Either get on the Intel ship and reap the benefits or stick it out with slightly outdated hardware and software (I'm not gonig to say obsolete if it still serves a purpose) until you decide to eventually upgrade.

 

[macworkerbee]

Really, a computer is not an investment? Hmmm, I would say that it is business equipment that allows me to work, as a professional by the way and not a hobbyist as you say, and make money.

Of course I have made back the investment of my computer through my work, but what's wrong with wanting to keep profits higher by keeping my computer a year or two longer than a 3 year replacement cycle? ESPECIALLY when that computer can still keep up with many other pro machines.

You're right, I don't necessarily need the newest version of software and can continue to operate my business on CS3 but I truly believe that I shouldn't have to do so on a 2.5 - 3 year old machine that has four cores and a lot of room for RAM upgrades etc.

Yes, considering the upcoming rumors I should start considering selling my machine but I still can't believe that I'm getting this bashed for being angry about being left behind by Apple and Adobe after only 2.5 years from when I purchased my top of the line machine.

 

[Eric S.]

Yes, considering the upcoming rumors I should start considering selling my machine but I still can't believe that I'm getting this bashed for being angry about being left behind by Apple and Adobe after only 2.5 years from when I purchased my top of the line machine.

That tends to be the nature of the rumors forums. You might try the Mac Pro, Power Mac forum for more kindred spirits. I'm also on another email list where people are still excited about the capabilities of their G4 systems!

 

[Amdahl]

Yes, considering the upcoming rumors I should start considering selling my machine but I still can't believe that I'm getting this bashed for being angry about being left behind by Apple and Adobe after only 2.5 years from when I purchased my top of the line machine.

Welcome to the cult.

 

[macworkerbee]

That tends to be the nature of the rumors forums. You might try the Mac Pro, Power Mac forum for more kindred spirits. I'm also on another email list where people are still excited about the capabilities of their G4 systems!

Thanks! I'll look into the subforum.

 

[rjboger]

Personally I will stick with Photoshop 1.0 on my Mac Plus! Who needs color or hard drives!

 

[macworkerbee]

Personally I will stick with Photoshop 1.0 on my Mac Plus! Who needs color or hard drives!

Wait a second . . . where are all the layers?

 

[djellison]

what's wrong with wanting to keep profits higher by keeping my computer a year or two longer than a 3 year replacement cycle?

Nothing. Nothing at all. So what is it, exactly, that will happen at midnight on the day CS4 gets launched that will make your G5 explode and your CS3 licence fly out the window?