classicMBP = Old apple, new MBP = new "chuzpe" Apple way.
You will see how the nMBP will get more and more like the "minimalistic" MB12"
Do you understand now why I posted this here?
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Am I the only one who loves the "old" MBP?
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classicMBP = Old apple, new MBP = new "chuzpe" Apple way.
You will see how the nMBP will get more and more like the "minimalistic" MB12"
Do you understand now why I posted this here?
The MBPs should have real matt screens, not coated glass people are afraid to breath on.
I know EXACTLY what you meanThis as well but I thought I might have been asking too much
A retina Cmbp with up to date specs would be my dream machine.
Indeed, or at least the option to pick like they used to do. Another plus to the cMBP.
Yet another option would be the last thing Apple needs. They've got comparably too many already ...
I am still using a 2011 Macbook Pro 17" late 2011 2.4GHZ with 240 SSD and it's still fast.
The last year they made the 17" model. I like the big screen. I also bought a new 15" Retina, and still prefer the 17.
I guess Apple will never make another 17" and that's a shame.
The last year they made the 17" model. I like the big screen. I also bought a new 15" Retina, and still prefer the 17.
I guess Apple will never make another 17" and that's a shame.
And while the rest of the market saw a decrease in Sales, Apple grew.
If your product portfolio is too big, it becomes increasingly difficult and expensive to handle it properly. Each product needs logistics, testing, software development, design, purchasing of unique parts and much more. If you multiply the options for their products, you will get a surprisingly high number of variants.
The MBP alone with it's seemingly 2 models (13"/15") accounts for a total of 29(!) possible combinations already - not counting in the various country-specific keyboards and cables/power adapters as further multiplicators. Or the different local regulations (e.g. warranty, spare part supply, product safety) and approval processes in the many countries worldwide where Apple sells its products. Okay, make that 30 MBP combinations for considering the last cMBP still on offer.
The two Macbook Air models account for 24 combinations. And with the rMB we also have different colors as additional multiplicator.
It may sound trivial to just change one component in a product (like e.g. the CPU or Ram size or SSD size), but from a logistics, production or product and software development/testing point of view it is not. Far from it!
Just as a good restaurant offers a smaller menu card to be able to focus on doing those meals properly, Apple needs to be really careful with further increasing the number of product variations they offer. They've been severely bitten once by letting their portfolio grow seemingly uncontrolled - hopefully they stay twice shy.
Same here, upgrade the RAM, HDD and it has had to have 1 logic board replaced due to the GPU soldering issue but despite that it works great, is in perfect condition, mainly used in Clamshell mode.
When I took it to the genius bar to have the logic board replaced the Apple employee was astounded the shell had 0 scratches on it as they do a check of the condition of the machine before you hand it over to them, so you cant say they have caused 1 or 2 extra's.
I love the fact its a 17" and if only I could upgrade to another with better CPU/GPU but alas Apple have given up on the PRO market, the name is just for kicks nowadays.
Still using my MacbookPro 17" (16GB Ram and SSD upgrades). Guess it will be my last Macbook as I am spoiled with the 17" size. I am also running one of the last 2012 MacPro towers - if it dies I will probably look for a used one of the same type and then I guess switch from Apple after 25 years of loyalty. I just can't see buying one of the new trash can style MacPros and stringing cables all over the place - it has Pro speed, but it is not a Pro solution IMO - I am not looking for a piece of furniture, but rather an all inclusive expandable self-contained box (like what I have from 2012).
The MAcPro 2012 can easily be upgraded in every sense: faster CPUs (up to 12 core, 3,46 MHz) , more performing Graphic cards (have a look at MacVideoCards, they modify the EFI of 3rd party Cards, you can even work with 5k-Displays!), USB 3.0-PCI (30 USD) , more RAM (up to 96 GB) and even PCIe Cards for extremely fast SSDs with Writes/Reads of 500/500 up to 1200/1200 MB/s !!! ) … There exist people who´s "old" MacPro of 2009 is MORE performant after 1000 USD of investments than the NEWEST and most expensive Trash-Can MBP for more than 7,000 USD!
So - NO NEED for a glittery gimmick-TrashCan by Jonny Ive…
just have a look at all the Treads about all this here in this MR-forum..
I have the mid-2011 i7 model and upgraded it to a 256 GB SSD, 1TB HDD, and 16GB RAM. It runs fine but I really want the improved battery life and upgraded graphics of the newer models.
Just can't justify one at the moment with how ridiculous Apple's prices are for a 15" rMBP with a decent amount of storage.
Just can't justify one at the moment with how ridiculous Apple's prices are for a 15" rMBP with a decent amount of storage.
Very soon it (spinning disk) will be irrelevant.
You can pick up 1 TB SSDs now for about 500 dollars and the price is falling - and very few people need > 1 TB or so internal storage on a notebook. If you do, you're probably "doing it wrong" and should have that data on a server with RAID and regularly backed up from there.
Optical media is dead (i haven't used in 2-3 years, and i have machines (including a 15" MBP classic, and my PC) with drives in them.
RAM - yeah that's a sticking point, but that's just a case of buying appropriate spec.
My 2 machines, a 2011 MBP 15 and a 2015 MBPr 13 are night and day. The 13" machine absolutely smokes the 15 at everything other than transcoding video, much much lighter, much better screen, over 1 gigabyte per second SSD read/write... there's no way i could even upgrade my 15" classic to match its performance other than in a few very specific tasks that are better done on a desktop anyway.
A friend has a 13" 2010 model and I'd take the retina every day of the week...
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re: ethernet on board.... i bought a gigabit adapter for $39. i've used it maybe 3 times. its no big deal, doesn't take much room in the bag, and most places have wifi now anyway.
YMMV, but a lot of the things ditched on the retina model are stuff that are very much edge-case usage. personally i'd trade the built in gigabit ethernet for the second thunderbolt port and a the potential for a future 10 gigabit ethernet adapter (or fiber-channel, etc.) no question.
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Also, it makes it harder for people to make up their mind. The vast majority of people really don't need some special custom build, they need something that hits good bang for buck, quality components and at a reasonable price point.
Apple for the most part hit that.
Pick size, pick good/better/best, move on with your life.
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HDD will not die. It will still have its place for mass storage for years.
While we all are fascinated by the evidently enormous advantages of SSDs for main diskspace in Computers, the "Spinning wheels" have also their advantages in mass storage of both consumer and (for years) professional use:
- Price of SSD will stay multiple fold in comparison with similar-capacity HDDs though continue getting less.
- Consumers dot need mass-storage (such as NAS) that offer the enormous transfer-rate of SSDs. Not for storage of music, neither for photos nor other consumer-type files. Especially not for backups (as long as you backup regularly, the amount of backup-actualization every day or even every week is of minor quantity).
- Recovering data from HDD is technically simple: You just dissemble the HDD and read every platter out under clean-room conditions. Expensive (takes time and expensive equipment) but it is simple. BUT data recovery from SSD is not that simple! I learned this once the hard way after neglecting backups for a certain time when my OSZ SSD failed one day. Even a high-professional Specialized enterprise failed to recover, because (in contrary to HDD) you need the information of the "data-logistic" system on SSDs which is not a standard-one but nothing but proprietary. For some SSD is works to recover, for some it don´t.
Nevertheless - SSDs are nowadays much more reliable and the up-to 10 years warranty shows their today´s higher reliability compared to just some years ago.
HDD as main "disk" will be out soon.
But that´s not the end for the HDD concerning all other than performance-demanding or rough environmental (mechanical challenging) usage.
As for optical media:
I still use the optical bay (ripping, DVDs, …) With RW-media you have nowadays a lot of comfort as well. It´s getting less and less that I use it, but I still am very happy to have an optical bay. Just a week ago this helped me a lot: Upgrading Firmware on SAmsung SSDs in a MAC is much more complicated doing it by USB-stick, but takes just 2 minutes by creating a system disk for upgrade with a DVD-RW.
Just my 2 cts.
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See this is where i think some people may be surprised.
I expect SSD to drop in price below that of HDD, especially when reliability (i.e. manufacturer builds in failures under warranty into their pricing - with SSD these will be way less) is taken into account. HDDs have plenty of moving parts to fail or be DOA on assembly.
Enterprise is already going hybrid flash, and all flash arrays, simply because to get reasonable speed you need so many spindles vs. SSD. There's no point having hard drives of 4 or 10 TB when it takes forever to get data on and off of them.
I expect that for consumers, inside of 2-3 years, HDD will be totally dead, and enterprise inside of 5-10 years. The density in terms of capacity per rack is already on the verge of favouring SSD and progress is not stopping or even slowing down.
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if you're attempting data recovery from failed drives you already screwed up and are doing it wrong. backups... use them... disk failure isn't the only way you can lose your data... theft of machine, etc. also hurts.
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I propose to "make an appointment" for 2018/2019… then we will see if HDD is already "dead" or not.
read again what I wrote:
I agree absolutely that SSDs are best choice a s primary disk in the machines. BUT:
backup or NAS store for consumer needs is NOT AT ALL about high transfer rates. You ail never see any difference of "high Speed" storing media (SSD) and classic HDD if you are streaming by NAS for mp3/4, FLAC, Photos or other consumer things. copying high quantity is very rare and easily done in the background during doing other work.
Hybrid-Disks are NOT for storing purpose, they are for replacing classic HDD as a primary disk. And they show that the SSD technology is still too expensive to compete with HDD. THAT is the only reason why these hybrid-disks exist: It´s a compromise between SSD and HDD as for cost/benefit reasons and concerning nothing but use of them as a PRIMARY disk, NOT storage.
See you here in 2018/2019 again to complete our discussion?
edit: I do backup regularly but I am honest enough to confess that I once did not - and learned it by the hard way to do it strictly.
read again what I wrote:
I agree absolutely that SSDs are best choice a s primary disk in the machines. BUT:
backup or NAS store for consumer needs is NOT AT ALL about high transfer rates. You ail never see any difference of "high Speed" storing media (SSD) and classic HDD if you are streaming by NAS for mp3/4, FLAC, Photos or other consumer things. copying high quantity is very rare and easily done in the background during doing other work.
Hybrid-Disks are NOT for storing purpose, they are for replacing classic HDD as a primary disk. And they show that the SSD technology is still too expensive to compete with HDD. THAT is the only reason why these hybrid-disks exist: It´s a compromise between SSD and HDD as for cost/benefit reasons and concerning nothing but use of them as a PRIMARY disk, NOT storage.
See you here in 2018/2019 again to complete our discussion?
edit: I do backup regularly but I am honest enough to confess that I once did not - and learned it by the hard way to do it strictly.
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After 24 hours of use I still can't believe my 15" rMBP is lighter than my 13" MBP. And weight is important to me as I carry my MBP with a Lenovo Thinkpad everywhere. The screen doesn't really matter to me except I do like the text being sharper. I still like my older MBP but this guy with flash is so much snappier at everything I do. I will be upgrading my Thinkpad to an SSD now.
I read through the first two pages of this thread yesterday and found it very refreshing.
I really thought this forum might be full of diehard fanboys who defended every last apple hardware release to the last, but instead I'm finding very reasoned and balanced critiques and assessments.
My first laptop was a powerbook G3 fully swappable, hot moddable and upgradeable. I could upgrade RAM and hard drives at will, and even run dual batteries or dual optical drives! Or, I could use an 'empty block' and save weight.
Plus, it had the perfect screen size at 14."
That computer lasted through 7 years of hard use. I can safely say that I abused it.
The next was a black macbook. I didn't like the 13" screen as much, and the fans were just totally unacceptable.
Amazingly, the powerbook G3 500 mhz ran 1st person shooter video games with ZERO fan noise. It was just an amazing computer.
well i used 2 MBP 15" and 1 MBA 13"before..1st one was 2.6ghz intel core duo..i think 2009 then MBP 15" 2.2ghz i7 and MBA 13"..cant remember what was the spec before i bought this wicked MBP ever in my life..
Im using Macbook Pro 13" Mid 2012 2.9ghz i7 ,16GB Kingston Hyperx Impact Black 1600mhz & 2 x 1TB Samsung 850 Pro SSD (RAID 0) Intel HD Graphics 4000 1536 MB
wish can upgrade more especially on RAM....
Im using Macbook Pro 13" Mid 2012 2.9ghz i7 ,16GB Kingston Hyperx Impact Black 1600mhz & 2 x 1TB Samsung 850 Pro SSD (RAID 0) Intel HD Graphics 4000 1536 MB
wish can upgrade more especially on RAM....
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There's nothing wrong with the old style keyboards.
The big problem with the classic MBP is that its CPU is several generations out of date and missing a heap of the newer CPU features, old, old integrated GPU which is many times slower, etc.
thro: I'd say stay away from dGPU's on MacBooks because most of them stop working due to soldering issues. I know its better post 2011 machines but I'd still stay away from dGPU's if I were to get a 15 inch machine.