That’s because you use the PIN for larger transactions. We haven’t adopted PIN except for Diners Club. It sounds like the issuers are going to do away with the signature charade altogether and not require PINs either.
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American Express, Mastercard and Discover to Eliminate Signature Requirement for Purchases in April 2018
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Nothing suggested Apple is responsible for everything... Apple Pay brought about a widespread removal of signatures through biometric verification instead. I was just wondering if they noticed a drop in physical card use because of Apple Pay that spurred this change on.
Be careful. From your response, its clear you’re getting close to irrational Apple hatred. It’s not a pleasant place to be - you’ll run away from facts, despite that discussions with facts should be enjoyable.
I’ve been signing my signature with stars and smiley faces and weird stuff for years now. No one, I mean absolutely no one reads or looks at those signatures so I don’t know what the hell they even have them for.
Pay at the table the way you're referring to is extremely disliked by Americans, so much so that the few restaurants that tried it had to go back to taking cards away. Ziosk and similar, on the other hand, are better accepted--but are a much larger investment that many restaurants can't justify.
More likely what'll happen (if contactless payment becomes more popular) is that restaurants will switch to having people pay at the front, like what IHOP and Denny's do now. Mainly because it's better accepted by people but also because there's very little additional investment required given that the stuff they're buying is capable of that already.
I suspect the fact that the server's standing there at all is what makes it unacceptable here, not the server seeing the tip. They could leave the terminal and go do something else but restaurants probably don't trust customers too much either.
As noted above, those are extremely difficult to justify for most since you'd need to buy one for every table, not just one or two for the entire restaurant. The chains that have adopted them (it's never mom and pops) seem to use them more to upsell customers on extra food/drinks/games than to take payments.
This makes zero sense to the rest of the developed world.
The server typically leaves. They only stay there if they need to grab the terminal and enter in a new amount (if people are splitting up the bills into percentages, groups etc.). I'd rather that than have to go all the way to the counter and still have someone there staring at me in the end, let alone trying to "upsell me".
What do you mean pick up the bill with the credit card? The server always brings the pin pad to the table, you tap, choose your percent on the pin pad, and you're done. No signing or pins or anything. That's how it's worked for years.
Visa get it together plz
And yes, everyone, we know the rest of the world doesn't use signatures any more. Cool, good for you. This is big news for the US and if card issuers are willing to drop the signature requirement AND not require PINs either while still not holding cardholders liable for fraud that sounds even more convenient for consumers.
I think this would actually put us ahead of the rest of the world when it comes to credit card payments. PINs are another unnecessary annoyance, albeit a minor one.
And yes, everyone, we know the rest of the world doesn't use signatures any more. Cool, good for you. This is big news for the US and if card issuers are willing to drop the signature requirement AND not require PINs either while still not holding cardholders liable for fraud that sounds even more convenient for consumers.
I think this would actually put us ahead of the rest of the world when it comes to credit card payments. PINs are another unnecessary annoyance, albeit a minor one.
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A lot of things don't, but here we are.
You have to go that way to leave the restaurant anyway so it's not really much of a hassle to pay up front. Not to mention that it's usually another employee accepting payment and not the server.
My chip failed on my card last year, I had to actually 'swipe and sign' when buying petrol, the cashier remarked he hadn't seen anyone sign for about a decade.
We don't tip for anything here, and we don't wait for bills at tables, so we don't have the same problem. We also haven't had to sign for anything for over a decade. However, the credit card machines have the capability to request a tip. The machine can optionally ask if you want to add a tip to the total before the customer waves or swipes their card. Don't worry, I'm sure your country will catch up eventually
Yeah, y’all don’t tip for s*** in our country. Leaving $100 bill on a 97.89 dollar tab with a “keep the change” mentality is not okay. Learn how to dine, or go cook at home.
I am in US and I hate tipping. It is as stupid as the upcoming vote for the net neutrality.
I always thought Germany was way behind when it comes to payment methods but then i went to the US and was puzzled to find out that nota single store i went to supported tap credit cards and when i entered my pin instead of signing a piece of paper (some cashiers didnt have a clue and were so confused when the receipt showed PIN verified instead of a signature field) that i quickly changed my mind.
Also your machines r soooooo slow!
Or idk. Just pay the staff properly in the first place and dont have them rely on customers to survive?
The worst was going to Miami where they added „20 % tip for our convenience“ automatically and the silly resort tax
Maybe its a cultural thing but i dont care for the „great service“ like just bring me my stuff and leave me the hell alone without showing up every few minutes to check if everything is alright. Everyone knows that friendly smile is fake to get a good tip anyway. If i need something i am gonna raise my hand
Also your machines r soooooo slow!
Or idk. Just pay the staff properly in the first place and dont have them rely on customers to survive?
The worst was going to Miami where they added „20 % tip for our convenience“ automatically and the silly resort tax
Maybe its a cultural thing but i dont care for the „great service“ like just bring me my stuff and leave me the hell alone without showing up every few minutes to check if everything is alright. Everyone knows that friendly smile is fake to get a good tip anyway. If i need something i am gonna raise my hand
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Not when you receive great service. That’s what your paying for. You’re probably cheap I’m presuming
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It’s a common standard for servers to “hate” to get sat a table of foreigners. We know there will be a problem in the end.
My Apple Pay with Apple Watch requires a signature over an amount. Varies but around $50 signature required. Over a good many retailers.
The tipping culture in the US is pretty dumb, I'm not sure how anyone can defend it. It passes the responsibility of paying servers and others in hospitality a living wage from the businesses on to the customers, it's not a reward for good service any more it's just a required addendum to your bill. In a lot of instances it also allows servers to evade paying a significant portion of their taxes because they under-report their tips, while they often collect government benefits from being in a low income bracket.
There are a lot of situations where I have to make sure I have cash on hand because I'm expected to tip and you can't pay by credit card (Bellhops, Valets, Bus/Taxi drivers, Tour guides, etc.). I've regularly not had cash on hand and gotten attitude or have just felt bad in general because I couldn't tip. It's inconvenient.
Traveling in other countries that don't have a tipping culture is far less stressful, and I would say I even get better service than home in the US.
I fail to see any upsides, honestly.
There are a lot of situations where I have to make sure I have cash on hand because I'm expected to tip and you can't pay by credit card (Bellhops, Valets, Bus/Taxi drivers, Tour guides, etc.). I've regularly not had cash on hand and gotten attitude or have just felt bad in general because I couldn't tip. It's inconvenient.
Traveling in other countries that don't have a tipping culture is far less stressful, and I would say I even get better service than home in the US.
I fail to see any upsides, honestly.
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The basic reason is the US is so large the entire UK could fit in the space of a couple of US states, so it isn't a trivial task to make widespread changes like that.
It is up to the credit card companies what requirements they want to include in their merchant agreements. It generally isn't a country or state issue. The decision from AmEx will help.
Also, yes, sometimes we are seriously Neanderthal in a way that cannot be explained.
So hold up, US Mastercard and AMEX are removing the requirement for signature. But will they require PIN? Or will they allow EMV with no authentication check? As a Canadian, I am confused.
I imagine if the card's set up to prefer PIN, most places will continue to ask. But since the vast majority, if not almost all US issued cards, prefer signature, this in effect is saying that the US is now a chip and nothing country (as opposed to chip and signature before).
Me too, that's why when they ask me to sign after I use Apple Pay, I sign with "Apple Pay" on the line in the box
The way it works in my country is either:
1. When you decide leave, you meet someone at a kiosk desk either near the exit or somewhere convenient to do the payment. Larger venues will have a few or even several kiosks. Often one person at the table will get up and do this while the rest of the table continues socialising.
2. The waiter brings a wireless payment terminal a bit larger than a smartphone to your table and you tap/insert your card there. If you give them the card they'll tap/insert it for you, but that's your choice.
In all cases, you are given an opportunity to see the amount being paid on the payment terminal's screen before allowing them to pay and also offered a paper receipt confirming the amount.
It's extremely rare to allow customers to give staff their card and take it away to do the payment. This is only ever allowed at places that are specifically trying to offer a familiar experience for Americans. And if you're not American they wont expect you to take advantage of the service.
Also, here any payment over $100 requires a PIN and you are legally required to inform your bank immediately if anybody else ever learns your PIN number (so they can cancel recent transactions before they have been fully processed). It's pretty rare for to pay less than $100 at a full service restaurant so they can't really do the American style of payment at all.
No doubt there will be a transition period where signatures are still accepted. But that doesn't exist anymore in my country - banks will now reject any payment authorised by signature unless the card is registered to a bank account in some other country.
For chip cards, the issuers still allow the merchant to run them through the chip reader for greater than the actual bill to allow the customer to add a tip. With chip and signature it is seamless to the customer. However, I have one card with a PIN and the server has to either bring out the reader or call me up to enter a PIN.
The signature has been used to verify fraudulent purchases for a while. As long as your signature doesn’t vary much it’s a lot easier to contest a fraudulent purchase. Other than that you’re right, it’s useless.