*** Anyone think Jobs should STEP down?***

Discussion in 'Apple, Inc and Tech Industry' started by hiimamac, Nov 10, 2008.

  1. hiimamac macrumors 6502a


    Jun 7, 2007
    With the snafu of no FIREWIRE in the recent macbooks, talking to my 20+ Apple retail/genius/specialist friends who say they are not selling (store in top 10 (PASADENA CA)), plus many DOA computers.

    If you look at the 1st gen MB, the benchmarks went as such, with regard to OPEN_GL (i.e. graphics).

    MB 1st GEN 71%, then 130%, 140%, 171% with Leopard.

    Now, keep in mind, the OPEN GL high marks still wouldn't let you play games but as barefeats and others reported, you could run MOTION and other PRO applications. Now take in to consideration that the PRO market makes up less than 1% of the retail sales, however, Apple realizes some pro's may use the cheap solution so they release the last MB with X300 and the benchmarks drop to 70%, hurting, just the PRO.

    Now the new MB has GREAT graphics yet no firewire after pushing iLIFE to the MOM AND POP user yet says NO TO THE PRO, the user that kept them afloat for years, the user that made them who they are, yet apple punishes them. Why! I mean, the PRO user more than likely will buy both the low end as well as high end model.

    What else has apple done to the PRO user? Well, they changed the firewire chipset on the MB and iMac. The standard is TEXAS INSTRUMENTS, but they wanted to save a few pennies and released a firewire chipset that sometimes caused problems. Hmm. Again, if you're a pro, you need a MBP or MAC PRO as this is the only computer that doesn't have AUDIO/VIDEO problems and uses TEXAS INSTRUMENTS FIREWIRE.

    Some could further argue that the imac is so strong now that the reason all machines are glossy is due to the fact that if you want to do graphics, or COLOR CORRECTION, you can't use an imac, (NO MATTE).

    So ask yourself. Why is it that APPLE really sticks it to the PRO user?
    The THEATRE used to be LOGIC, SHAKE, FCP and is now classes about emails and adding attachements and punishes the PRO user.

    Why does Apple continue to stiffle the PRO user, the real creative that made them who they are. The company that made the MB great for the bedroom musician as the FIREWIRE was a great thing and many musicians I know went for the MB, except for now.

    Just wondering if you think it's time for Jobs to step down and let Ive's take the helm. The marketing choices are simply horrible. Firewire needs to be on all devices - however, when I heard about the specs on the new machine, I just new there had to be a catch, and sure enough, there was. No firewire.
    It's 's way of screwing the real creative user, not the person playing a game or using iDVD for cue collections.

  2. gibbz macrumors 68030

    May 31, 2007
    No he shouldn't step down.

    In regards to firewire, the creative user should get creative and use something with USB or Ethernet. If said creative person cannot do so, then get creative with another machine. This is a purely optional machine last I checked. I am getting so sick of people bitching about the firewire.

    The latest quarterly earnings report seems to indicate that Jobs stepping down would be stupid, plain and simple.
  3. 63dot macrumors 603


    Jun 12, 2006
    Jobs was a genius the first time around marketing a product but had issues with the big picture of market share. But the second time around he kept his marketing genius but had a pretty decent overall picture on the market, thus think iMac, iBook, iPod, iTunes, and iPhone. Excellent products to move Apple Inc. ahead of others in the MP3 and phone markets, especially.

    I think the lack of firewire was a small mistake next to the great achievements of Jobs at Apple Inc. over the last decade. He also made the mistake of the dalmation iMacs and the Cube, but those were small bumps in the road.

    But that being said, I love Jonathan Ivie and I think he can be the next great CEO of Apple Inc. and soon, I hope he gets his chance. Jobs brought Apple back from dissolving, and Ivie can take Apple further into market share dominance.

    Ivie can be up there with the Apple greats like Woz, Jobs, Kawasaki, and any early investors who believed in Apple Inc. when most thought a computer was only for large organizations and educational institutions.
  4. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere


    May 16, 2008
    :rolleyes: Note to self: "Don't laugh out loud at the ridiculous post. Don't laugh out loud at the ridiculous post. Don't laugh out loud...."

    Yeah, um, just taking a look at Apple's Fourth Quarter Results:

    Yeah, we need to get a CEO who can DO something with this company and turn it around! Oh wait! Turning it around would mean driving it into the ground! :rolleyes:
  5. synth3tik macrumors 68040


    Oct 11, 2006
    Minneapolis, MN
    you can't blame the MB on Jobs. He knows how to run a company. I mean I know no other company that is like "We know the economy sucks, but we have billions to play with".

    If sales on the new MBs are so bad, then I would hope Apple would reconsider the ideas behind the newest rev.
  6. rtmadden macrumors regular

    Jun 18, 2008
    Steve Jobs is amazing. I don't think that needs to be further explained.
  7. Randman macrumors 65816


    Jul 28, 2008
    Jacksonville, Fla
    A bunch of gossiping nellies not realizing the economy sucks right now as they sip their Starbucks mochas?

    And getting rid of the company's best asset would do anything differently? Get real.

  8. 63dot macrumors 603


    Jun 12, 2006
    Jobs is the type of CEO, with great success with Apple and Pixar, who could run even bigger companies like Sony and GM. I can actually picture him in politics or public service someday.

    Think David Packard and later public service.
  9. gnasher729 macrumors P6


    Nov 25, 2005
    If he wants to run GM, Apple can buy the company for about half of last quarter's iPhone profits. I suspect Apple has better use for the money. Keeping it in the bank would be better than spending it on GM. :rolleyes:
  10. wako macrumors 65816

    Jun 6, 2005
    If Pro users are honestly buying MACBOOKS, their not very professional. If they really are trying to work on a Laptop in general, I wouldnt really consider them a pro either. Real "PROS" know to buy a damn desktop for god sake.

    And i dont know why you are so caught up on Firewire. That is a dying technology that nobody really cares for. USB has become the standard, and with USB 3.0 rolling out, there is absolutely no reason why to bother with anything but USB. Get over it.

    If you honestly think Steve Jobs stepping down will somehow help the company you are wrong. I dont know if you have been paying any sort of attention, but since Steve came back, Apple has become an iconic American brand. He brought the company from bankruptcy, and has made the company worth BILLIONS. If you somehow think Apple should throw him away now, you are still a complete fool for thinking so. Apple literally lost MILLIONS of dollars IN ONE DAY, when idiots on the internet decided to post a fake rumor about Steve Jobs having a heart attack. Which means investors DO NOT trust Apple, the company itself, without Steve Jobs.
  11. 63dot macrumors 603


    Jun 12, 2006
    Actually, if you have ten cents in your pocket right now, you are worth more than GM. They have a negative net worth.

    In their heyday, they had a trillion dollars in assets, and that's in 1950s dollars. They were the one of the early companies to have such a net worth. Detroit in those years was like San Jose before dot.bomb but bigger.


    Early 20th century railroads had what is in today's money, trillion+ dollar net worths, much of it in cash. When people think about the richest person in the world, Bill Gates, where his net worth at its peak was just shy of 100 billion, people in the robber barron days, had net worth in real dollars that would amount to hundreds of billions, perhaps more. Gates, in his glory, believe it or not, did not even come close to the robber barons who were billionaires when a billion was a completely unimaginable amount of money. Gates runs the office suite software industry and the operating system industry. The robber barrons owned the train industry or the steel industry. Somebody like that would be akin to owning half to all of the computer manufacturers in the world, or half of all the major software titles in the world. Basically, a person approaching being worth trillions.

    Yesteryear's millionaire is today's billionaire. Yesteryear's billionaire is what is close to a 500-700 billion dollar mogul approaching, eventually, a true trillionaire.

    Apple is doing phenomenally well compared to many companies its size, but Apple is not a potential giant like GM when things are good for GM. IBM and Microsoft are also companies so much bigger than Apple there is no real comparison. Look at Apple's position on the Fortune 500 for scale and reality. Just because GM is negative now in its net worth doesn't mean that it will stay there. They can get out of their hole and become great again when economic times get better, which they eventually will.


    Fortune 500, Apple #103, GM #4, Wal Mart #1 (revenue $379 billion, and just last year)...and while that's a lot of dough, in real dollars it's miniscule compared to US Steel in their dominance.


    But under current trends Bill Gates will reach a Trillion personal net worth by age 61 and if he lives to 103, he will be worth over a quadrillion ($1,000,000,000,000,000.00 dollars) or something like being able to spend a cool million dollars a day for 3 million years.
  12. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere


    May 16, 2008
    What kind of computer a person chooses to use does not, in itself, define whether they are a professional. I know many very successful professionals who don't use a computer at all... they hire people to do that for them. Assuming someone is NOT a professional because they use a notebook instead of a desktop makes as much sense as assuming someone IS a professional, just because they wear a necktie. REAL "pros" don't make ridiculous assumptions about people based on irrelevant criteria.
    Firewire is far from being a "dying technology." It's much faster than USB 2.0, and while USB 3.0 is rolling out, so are FireWire S1600 and S3200.
  13. Scarlet Fever macrumors 68040

    Scarlet Fever

    Jul 22, 2005
    A lot of photographers take a notebook out on the field, as a desktop is too cumbersome to lug around. A Macbook is more than up to this task (assuming the camera is connected via USB). That said, they often take the notebook back to a studio and edit the pics on a desktop.

    Even Firewire 400 is much faster than USB 2.0 when transferring a lot of data. Firewire 800 destroys USB 2.0. The new spec for FW3200 will probably be faster than USB3 as well.

    I won't deny that Jobs has done wonders for the company, and he did save it, but I think the company will survive without him as CEO when he eventually retires.
  14. mrfrosty macrumors 6502

    Oct 1, 2005
    Steve is a legend, but he should step down. The company is doing better than ever e.t.c. e.t.c. i don't dispute that, i just think now would be a good time. Minimise the inevitable damage.
  15. 63dot macrumors 603


    Jun 12, 2006
    Steve's 53, so why not a gradual 5-7 year transition grooming Ivie for the CEO spot. It can be done. Or make it a ten year transition.

    At some point, I think somebody as innovative as Steve Jobs will want to make one more big splash in the business world.

    In his 20s, Apple Computer.

    In his 30s, Next.

    In his 40s-50s, Apple resurgence and Pixar domination.

    He has a lot of steam left in him to come up with something none of us could imagine and be considered an Edison or Ted Turner when he dies.
  16. garybUK Guest


    Jun 3, 2002
    Apple are too concerned with the iPhone to care about their core market.
  17. themoonisdown09 macrumors 601


    Nov 19, 2007
    Georgia, USA
    I don't think he should step down until his health keeps him from doing his job efficiently. He's what made Apple what it is today, and who knows where it will go once he's gone.
  18. 63dot macrumors 603


    Jun 12, 2006
    If the iPhone or iPod becomes a bigger portion of their net income, then that becomes their core market. If final cut pro sales explode and there is a huge movement among college students to become filmmakers worldwide and final cut pro becomes THE application, then that will become Apple's core market based on net income.

    Where the largest net income is coming from is any company's core market.

    At one time, Pac Sun, had a nice core market in surfboards. At some point they sold a few clothes in a surfing motif to go with the core market of surfoboards they sold. Then the net income from the clothes equaled the surfboards. Then there were two core markets. Today, Pac Sun is the world's largest surf and skate clothing retailer in the world. People who buy clothes, but in most cases don't surf or skate, are their core market.

    They have over 1000 stores worldwide and only a few in Southern California still sell their surfboards.

    The same analogy can happen to Apple. Their first core market were Apple IIe users like me, then Macintosh users, and now it looks like iPod/iTunes/iPhone (the small cute stuff) is quicly establishing themselves as Apple's core, net income market.

    People actually say when they see Macs, "Isn't that the company that makes the Apple iPod", or "That Apple computer is from that iPod company". Now ask me who makes Zune and I really, at this time, have no idea. It may or may not be Microsoft, and this coming from a field tech who was a Microsoft Certified Professional. Or is Zune from Creative Inc.?

    All that many people know is the Apple iPod/iTunes, not Mac this or Mac that. About 99% percent of the time I see an MP3 player, it's an Apple iPod. About 5% percent of the time I see a laptop, it's a Mac laptop. About 1% percent of the time I see a desktop computer in an office building/corporation, it's a Mac.
  19. hihater macrumors member

    Nov 8, 2008
    Right pass me what you smoking. :rolleyes:
  20. wako macrumors 65816

    Jun 6, 2005

    FireWire is created by Apple, and the only people that really put FireWire connections onto their computers is... well Apple. Not a lot of computer manufacturers put FireWire on their computers. And the ones that do, they only put one, while the rest is computer is littered with USB ports.

    Despite it being faster, it doesnt mean it is widely accepted.

    And ggjstudios, I guess I didnt make my point very well. But if you are looking for sheer power in a computer, and you buy a notebook for ALL your professional work, you obviously havent had enough experience to know that they simply WONT cut it. To me its common sense to buy a desktop if you are looking to work with a bunch of professional software that require a lot of power. I can understand having a laptop to take out on the field, but if you are reliant on that when you get back home to continue to do that work, you are just looking for trouble yourself.

    As for Jobs leaving, yes the company would of course survive. However if he left right now it would be a total disaster as Jobs still holds a very authoritative position in Apple. Without him, the company would lose direction. He still has a lot more to do for Apple before he leaves, and most importantly, make Apple able to stand on its own two feet. In my opinion, Bill Gates did it perfectly when he left Microsoft.
  21. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere


    May 16, 2008
    You should take some time to check your facts before posting bogus information. Just a few of the manufacturers who put Firewire on their notebooks include Dell, Lenovo, Sony, HP and Asus, so it's NOT just Apple! :rolleyes:
    "you obviously havent had enough experience to know that " professionals in many industries find a notebook is quite capable of satisfying all their computing needs. You're making a foolish assumption that you know what all "professionals" need, in terms of computing power. Not a wise move!
  22. Unspeaked macrumors 68020


    Dec 29, 2003
    West Coast
    Normally, I'd say no, he shouldn't - but the six asterisks in your title have totally changed my mind.
  23. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere


    May 16, 2008
    LOL!!! That's probably because the asterisks are the most intelligent part of the post!
  24. FrankieTDouglas macrumors 65816

    Mar 10, 2005
  25. liptonlover macrumors 6502a

    Mar 13, 2008
    And that's just on the port end... There's about 10 external hard drives sitting around me right now, all of them are firewire only.

    That being said... I don't care about the firewire. Even if I had an MB, I wouldn't care because firewire isn't the future. USB is.

    THAT being said... No he should step down. He should stay in the business as long as physically possible.

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