Apple Addresses Alleged Throttling of iPhones With Degraded Batteries

[opfreak]

I'd rather have a failing battery pop up warning as well and I think most people would also. The fringe would consider a personal offense regardless but that's expected.

A better designed phone, would work at full speed even when the battery degrades, and the battery should just not hold a charge as long. Apple seemed to have designed the iPhone to only function correctly when batteries are new.

Built in obsolescence from day 1.

 

[adamski23]

Of course they do when the phone is throttled. It’s just the lesser of two evils here.

Would you agree that consumers should be informed when that happens to make them aware? Not necessarily give them a choice to toggle on/off throttling, but point out how it can be remedied.

 

[Act3]

A better designed phone, would work at full speed even when the battery degrades, and the battery should just not hold a charge as long. Apple seemed to have designed the iPhone to only function correctly when batteries are new.

Built in obsolescence from day 1.

well said, better voltage regulation needed

 

[Altis]

Imagine buying that same 300 hp petrol car and on a trip your radiator cracks.
You have 10 miles to the next exit and your car gives you a choice:
A. 2 miles at full hp or,
B. Unlimited miles at 25% hp.

This is more of an apt analogy.

How is this an even remotely accurate analogy?

These phones aren't broken (defective battery in some cases of the 6S, perhaps). Apple would say many are perfectly fine if you brought them to the store because the battery reports "healthy" and not worn to the threshold of replacement.

Imagine having your 25% hp but having no idea why, manufacturer says it's perfectly fine, only to find out via some 3rd party testing that it was done deliberately without consent or disclosure to mask an unrelated issue.

 

[Analog Kid]

But an Apple evil is treated as an ‘Atta boy’ by Apple apologists.

Don't you mean an Apple "atta boy" is being treated as evil by Apple trolls? Flip the coin over, mate, there's another side to it.

Cook says your check is in the mail

Nah, I never enrolled in that program, I'm not good at astroturfing. I tend to get caught up in facts, logic, and seeing multiple sides of things as opposed to name calling and petty, baseless digs.

 

[blackdogaudio]

Maybe deceitful was a poor choice in words, as I can see the reasoning as well from their perspective. However, can’t Apple come up with an Applesque solution that informs the user of a bad battery without being annoying? How about a different coloured battery indicator - instead of green change it to a different colour. Simple yet gets the message across.

That would have been fine in the distant past but today when prisoners can sue if they don't get their preferred brand of peanut butter while incarcerated?...Apple wouldn't stand a chance. They are going to be crucified either way.

 

[C DM]

If a phone shuts down unexpectedly with the battery at 40% most users will question battery integrity. If a phone is very slow, laggy, and unresponsive most users will assume the phone is getting old.

That is a fairly reasonable assumption. At the same time, given the vast majority of the typical iPhone consumers, it seems that the assumption that a lot of people faced with a device that randomly dies on them would think that it's just broken and would look to get a new one to replace it, possibly even sooner that they would if they had a somewhat throttled device that more of them might be able to put up with (if they even really notice it) for longer period of time.

 

[jaredh]

It absolutely does not take 10-15 seconds for that phone to open the camera app. I’ll eat my shoe if you show credible evidence.

“10-15 seconds” sounded good when you typed it, but that’s undoubtedly an exaggeration. Seriously - count to 15 in your head right now. That’s ridiculous. I’d bet it’s actually around 5 seconds, but just feels much longer because we’re used to these phones being so fast nowadays.

If her 6/6S plus takes that long to perform such a basic task, there’s larger issues at play than just performance throttling secondary to a degraded battery.

I just signed up to this forum to reply to your specific post.

I hope you like the taste of your shoe. I can record video of my wife's 2 year old 6 taking over 15 seconds to open the camera app....every day of the week.

You're just wrong on this, and you should stop being such a defender of Apple on this. EVERYONE has been telling you for years phones were doing this, and you didn't believe them

 

[Sefstah]

How about a notification stating that the battery is degraded and the phone is being optimised for performance?
Finding out this way is wrong. Makes you realize how poorly Apple treats its loyal customers.

 

[Altis]

I wouldn't call it deceitful, rather a poor choice. I could see why they made their choice considering they'd be burned at the stake if they opted for nagging popups alerting users their batteries are failing however. The inflammatory remarks would simply be different.

"Damned if you do, damned if you don't" and all...

Well it sure would be annoying to have the phone tell you it's throttling due to battery wear, only to go to the Apple store and have them tell you the battery is healthy and not eligible for a new one.

 

[Act3]

That is a fairly reasonable assumption. At the same time, given the vast majority of the typical iPhone consumers, it seems that the assumption that a lot of people faced with a device that randomly dies on them would think that it's just broken and would look to get a new one to replace it, possibly even sooner that they would if they had a somewhat throttled device that more of them might be able to put up with (if they even really notice it) for longer period of time.

or they would take it to the apple store and have it diagnosed what the issue is. People are conditioned with iphones running slower with each major iOS version. I hate to say it but apple does no wrong in your opinion? I rarely see you side with the non trillion dollar consumer.

 

[BaltimoreMediaBlog]

Just call it what it is people. It's "Planned Obsolescence." There should be laws on this but there aren't.

Furthermore, when my Apple battery failed on my iPhone 5s, I paid for a battery replacement, $79.99. To my surprise, Apple refused to replace the battery, but just sent me a brand new iPhone 5s just this month. I didn't even know they were still making them anymore, but apparently they are. Why I wondered? Well it dawned on me that my iPhone's case was bulging a bit, so apparently there was some sort of minor battery explosion that occurred inside. They must have wanted it hushed up quick. So the replacement ultimately was a good thing.

But here's where the problem comes in... Apple refused to let me re-store my IOS 10.3.3 backup on the new phone, so now I lost all my 32 bit games AND the phone is substantially SLOWER in IOS 11 EVEN WITH A NEW BATTERY!

So if your iPhone breaks now and you pay Apple to fix it, you're forced to upgrade to a slower OS that doesn't do what your phone did before? Apple, this is a problem, because even with a new phone, it's slow, buggy and less functional than the broken one! UGH!

 

[Strelok]

I just signed up to this forum to reply to your specific post.

I hope you like the taste of your shoe. I can record video of my wife's 2 year old 6 taking over 15 seconds to open the camera app....every day of the week.

You're just wrong on this, and you should stop being such a defender of Apple on this. EVERYONE has been telling you for years phones were doing this, and you didn't believe them

I have an iPhone 6 that was slowed down due to a degraded battery, it takes maybe 2-3 seconds to open the camera.

 

[C DM]

So your ok with your phone working at 50% its speed after a year?

Again, its the full phone that's designed badly. If after a year you can no longer use it at its original speed.

But does that just apply to older devices simply because they are older? Or does it apply to some subset of devices that might have some issues with batteries or something like that? (That's not to say anything about those devices and whether or not there might be some battery defect with those or something else of that sort.)

 

[PickUrPoison]

wrong, true that all batteries will degrade with use but larger capacity batteries will be able to maintain required voltage for longer period of time... its about storing the energy

No, because a worn battery (regardless of capacity) may not be able to deliver the required voltage for very long, if at all. So it’s not that simple.

Say the battery module needs to supply 4.15 volts in order not to trigger Apple’s downclocking. You could have a li-ion pack the size of a car battery and if its wear level causes it to only be able to provide 4.14 volts after an hour’s use (post recharge), you would see the CPU speed drop.

Of course, your phone might last for a month or two on that battery, since it would still be able to provide a lot of capacity at that lower voltage, but it would be downclocked that entire time.

 

[jaredh]

I do understand what you are saying.

BUT.. Without this patch, the iPhone would have spontaneously rebooted or shut down. I would argue that a slow phone is better than dead phone.

HOWEVER, I what I would really rather see is a warning message like this when I try to open such apps: "This iPhone's battery has been degraded and you may experience decreased performance."

I think the point here is these phones are defective and they are hiding it by throttling.

Under no circumstance is it OK for the device to shut off with 50% battery life. That's a design flaw. Their fix is illegal and is going to get all of us a new phone...

 

[blackdogaudio]

NO company on this planet can be trusted.

Evidence would tend to back up your statement however we have to start somewhere. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt that it was simply the wrong choice.

It's OK to admit Apple's technology isn't perfect, Apple ;-)

 

[I7guy]

How is this an even remotely accurate analogy?

These phones aren't broken (defective battery in some cases of the 6S, perhaps). Apple would say many are perfectly fine if you brought them to the store because the battery reports "healthy" and not worn to the threshold of replacement.

Imagine having your 25% hp but having no idea why, manufacturer says it's perfectly fine, only to find out via some 3rd party testing that it was done deliberately without consent or disclosure to mask an unrelated issue.

It’s better analogy than the original analogy, IMO.

It’s about the battery and not even about a defective battery. Remember the iPhone X in cold weather? I wonder if power management was part of the solution? And power management is part of cold weather usage and not so much as relating to defective batteries.

Frankly this entire thing is blown out of proportion, imo.

 

[Tubamajuba]

Just call it what it is people. It's "Planned Obsolescence." There should be laws on this but there aren't.

Furthermore, when my Apple battery failed on my iPhone 5s, I paid for a battery replacement, $79.99. To my surprise, Apple refused to replace the battery, but just sent me a brand new iPhone 5s just this month. I didn't even know they were still making them anymore, but apparently they are. Why I wondered? Well it dawned on me that my iPhone's case was bulging a bit, so apparently there was some sort of minor battery explosion that occurred inside. They must have wanted it hushed up quick. So the replacement ultimately was a good thing.

But here's where the problem comes in... Apple refused to let me re-store my IOS 10.3.3 backup on the new phone, so now I lost all my 32 bit games AND the phone is substantially SLOWER in IOS 11 EVEN WITH A NEW BATTERY!

So if your iPhone breaks now and you pay Apple to fix it, you're forced to upgrade to a slower OS that doesn't do what your phone did before? Apple, this is a problem, because even with a new phone, it's slow, buggy and less functional than the broken one! UGH!

Apple has no reason to "hush up" bulged batteries. Any lithium ion battery in any product is capable of bulging after a few years. It's a known issue with the battery technology. No secret there.

And if you want to stay on an old version of an OS using old apps, Apple isn't the ideal company for you anyways. Android would be much better for you.

 

[ftaok]

I just did a quick experiment. Here's the back story.

My 7 year old son recently updated his iPod touch 6 from 10.3 to 11.2.1 accidentally. I told him that he was going to be upset when his iPod's performance went into the crapper and the next time, he should read the screen.

Anyways, after it updated, he came down to tell me that "update 11" is the greatest. I kinda thought that he was fibbing just so that I wasn't right. I thought nothing of it until I read Gruber's post. No where in Apple's statement did they say anything about throttling iPods touch, so I figure I would check load speed between my "slow-ass" iPhone 6 (11.2 - 67% battery health) and my kid's iPod (11.2.1 - 100+% health).

I killed all apps on both devices to compare how quickly apps loaded and other stuff like how quickly the keyboard comes up. Well, the results were surprising. The iPod touch kicked the iPhone's ass.

Settings loaded almost instantly on the iPod. Takes about 5 seconds on the iPhone. Other apps load instantly on the iPod as well (I checked Health, Stocks, Notes, Calendar, Reminders) and take double/triple the time on the iPhone.

When creating a new note, the keyboard pops up pretty quick on the iPod. Takes an eternity on the iPhone.

I realize that this isn't a scientific test, but I would have figured that the iPhone would compare better, seeing as how they have the same processor, but the iPhone is at 1.4ghz vs. the iPod's 1.1ghz.

So I think there is hope that if I replace my iPhone's battery, I will get back the performance that I had with 10.3 ... I hope.

 

[C DM]

or they would take it to the apple store and have it diagnosed what the issue is. People are conditioned with iphones running slower with each major iOS version. I hate to say it but apple does no wrong in your opinion? I rarely see you side with the non trillion dollar consumer.

Some very well might, most likely a similar subset of people whether their device just shuts down vs. those who see truly crippled performance. Ultimately both of those type of issues can end up similarly driving people to getting new devices.

How does not doing any wrong or anything of the sort even come up here? Have I said anything about that? I'm asking some questions based on what people comment and make my own comments in relation to their comment. Does everything have to be pigeonholed somehow into either being an attack or a defense without room for just discussion of different details and aspects that are actually involved?

(Not that it's relevant here, or should be relevant in any way--which is why I really don't see a need to bring it up pretty much ever--but you've certainly overlooked plenty posts that I've made in all kinds of discussions about downgrading and various redesigns and other things.)

 

[jaredh]

This is another nonsense “scandal” that the nerdosphere is trying to make into a big deal because it’s Apple. Apple is not trying to force you to upgrade; they’re trying to make your battery more usable and reliable so that your older device can keep functioning. Apple cares about user experience more than they care about you upgrading your phone every year. If your user experience is that your battery unexpectedly shuts down because it can’t keep up anymore, you’re never going to upgrade anyway--you’ll just get angry and switch to something else.

And no, a toggle doesn’t make sense, not when the consequence is your phone shutting down at random. This is precisely the sort of decision not to leave in the hands of the individual consumer.

A device shutting down at randon is a design flaw that should cause a recall....that's why Apple hid the issue.

 

[adamski23]

That is a fairly reasonable assumption. At the same time, given the vast majority of the typical iPhone consumers, it seems that the assumption that a lot of people faced with a device that randomly dies on them would think that it's just broken and would look to get a new one to replace it, possibly even sooner that they would if they had a somewhat throttled device that more of them might be able to put up with (if they even really notice it) for longer period of time.

I think it’s all fairly accurate to describe the mentality towards these “disposable” gadgets when something goes wrong.

My issue with the situation mostly stems from the lack of prompt info made to the user of how the issue can be remedied.

 

[Altis]

It’s better analogy than the original analogy, IMO.

It’s about the battery and not even about a defective battery. Remember the iPhone X in cold weather? I wonder if power management was part of the solution?

Frankly this entire thing is blown out of proportion, imo.

It isn't blown out of proportion. I know that's your opinion, but frankly you seem like you hold shares in Apple and care more about their financial well-being than the consumers they're affecting.

I don't want Apple crippling my phone's performance any more than they already have with irreversible iOS updates. People paid to upgrade phones that didn't need to be replaced. This whole thing is dirty.

If they want to make throttling a user-enabled feature, by all means.

 

[Act3]

No, because a worn battery (regardless of capacity) may not be able to deliver the required voltage for very long, if at all. So it’s not that simple.

Say the battery module needs to supply 4.15 volts in order not to trigger Apple’s downclocking. You could have a li-ion pack the size of a car battery and if it’s wear level causes it to only be able to provide 4.14 volts after an hour’s use (post recharge), you would see the CPU speed drop.

Of course, your phone might last for a month or two on that battery, since it would still be able to provide a lot of capacity at that lower voltage, but it would be downclocked that entire time.

BS, a larger battery with a larger capacity will wear out slower and provide a constant voltage longer than a smaller capacity battery..