Apple Announces New Space Gray Mac mini With 4-Core or 6-Core Intel Processor and Up to 64GB RAM, Starting at $799

[Zdigital2015]

Analogue to HD3000/HD4000 is Iris, not this. This is below Iris in performance.

Yes, the iGPU is now GT2 instead of GT3. The question is whether or not you would rather have 28w U-Series or 45w H-Series in this Mac mini instead. Frankly, I think that is a matter of individual preference. For myself, I would rather have the 65w desktop part in the mini and add an eGPU later if my needs actually merit discrete GPU. I suppose Apple could have used Kaby Lake-GL instead, but I would rather have cores than a Vega GPU that is permanently attached forever.

I saw only two paths, yet Apple offered us a third path. Not everyone is going like the path Apple takes, some will though. The mini is going to have a cult following and a little mainstream success, but it isn’t the gateway to Apple anymore and hasn’t been for a long time.
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But this is what I'm talking about the base model with the I3,128gb storage, isn't worth 800$+taxes, this is the 500$ machine that apple for no reason other than even bigger profit decided to up the price to 800$.

Apple gets to decide pricing whether any of us like it or not. You always have the option of building your own Windows PC.

 

[StellarVixen]

Yes, the iGPU is now GT2 instead of GT3. The question is whether or not you would rather have 28w U-Series or 45w H-Series in this Mac mini instead. Frankly, I think that is a matter of individual preference. For myself, I would rather have the 65w desktop part in the mini and add an eGPU later if my needs actually merit discrete GPU. I suppose Apple could have used Kaby Lake-GL instead, but I would rather have cores than a Vega GPU that is permanently attached forever.

I saw only two paths, yet Apple offered us a third path. Not everyone is going like the path Apple takes, some will though. The mini is going to have a cult following and a little mainstream success, but it isn’t the gateway to Apple anymore and hasn’t been for a long time.
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Apple gets to decide pricing whether any of us like it or not. You always have the option of building your own Windows PC.

I have second thoughts. I still think that it might have been better to include the laptop CPUs in Mini, due to thermals.

These thermals would probably hold up very well to i3-8100U/H, i5-8100B and i7-8700B, they would keep it cool and therefore CPU could achieve maximum performance without throttling. i7-8700 with 65 watt TDP is gonna heat up a lot under heavy load. I really, really hope that i3-8100, i5-8500 and i7-8700 in Mac Mini with those thermals are gonna reach their full potential without throttling, but, my optimism regarding that is weak.

If the CPU is gonna throttle under heavy load, then it will be equal to i5-8500B and i7-8700B in performance, under heavy load. But, thing is that with those you would have better graphics and CPU that can reach the full potential. On other hand, you will have a beast that cannot spread it's wings in that tiny case. It would be such a waste.

 

[citysnaps]

I have second thoughts. I still think that it might have been better to include the laptop CPUs in Mini, due to thermals.

These thermals would probably hold up very well to i3-8100U/H, i5-8100B and i7-8700B, they would keep it cool and therefore CPU could achieve maximum performance without throttling. i7-8700 with 65 watt TDP is gonna heat up a lot under heavy load. I really, really hope that i3-8100, i5-8500 and i7-8700 in Mac Mini with those thermals are gonna reach their full potential without throttling, but, my optimism regarding that is weak.

If the CPU is gonna throttle under heavy load, then it will be equal to i5-8500B and i7-8700B in performance, under heavy load. But, thing is that with those you would have better graphics and CPU that can reach the full potential. On other hand, you will have a beast that cannot spread it's wings in that tiny case. It would be such a waste.

My sense (in other words, conjecture), is Apple improved the Mini's cooling.

Kind of like the difference between the 2014 5K iMac which would throttle under a heavy load, and the improved cooling in the 2015 5K iMac which will not throttle.

 

[StellarVixen]

My sense (in other words, conjecture), is Apple improved the Mini's cooling.

Kind of like the difference between the 2014 5K iMac which would throttle under a heavy load, and the improved cooling in the 2015 5K iMac which will not throttle.

I really, really hope that you are right. In fact, we all do!

 

[Zdigital2015]

I have second thoughts. I still think that it might have been better to include the laptop CPUs in Mini, due to thermals.

These thermals would probably hold up very well to i3-8100U/H, i5-8100B and i7-8700B, they would keep it cool and therefore CPU could achieve maximum performance without throttling. i7-8700 with 65 watt TDP is gonna heat up a lot under heavy load. I really, really hope that i3-8100, i5-8500 and i7-8700 in Mac Mini with those thermals are gonna reach their full potential without throttling, but, my optimism regarding that is weak.

If the CPU is gonna throttle under heavy load, then it will be equal to i5-8500B and i7-8700B in performance, under heavy load. But, thing is that with those you would have better graphics and CPU that can reach the full potential. On other hand, you will have a beast that cannot spread it's wings in that tiny case. It would be such a waste.

You do know that there is no difference between the Core i7-8700 and the Core i7-8700B that is in the Mac mini, right? Same goes for the Core i3-8100(B) and the Core i5-8500(B). They are simply BGA version of the socketed CPU.

The only thing you gain with using the H-Series found in the 2018 MacBook Pro is a higher price tag and Iris Plus GT3e iGPU. I will take the 65w CPU any day.

I am cautiously optimistic that they have fixed the thermal issues...I don't hear anyone complaining about the iMac Pro. Yes, it uses slightly down clocked CPUs, but still that is a massive thermal load inside that chassis. I think Apple may have learned its lesson the desktop side, at least. MacBook Pros and those silly thin heatsinks is a completely different story.

 

[Upgrader]

No, your warranty is void if you break something while you’re attempting the upgrade. Simply upgrading it, even on day one, doesn’t void the warranty. That’s true in the US and EU, at least, and other areas too I’m sure.

I spoke to an Apple salesperson online. They told me this directly.
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Do you have a reference for that claim? As far as I know, Apple doesn't void your warranty if you replace a user-serviceable part.

I spoke to an Apple salesperson here in the UK yesterday. They told me this. They also described it as 'serviceable at a service centre' as opposed to explicitly 'user-serviceable'. Maybe they're defining a difference there? Either way they told me my warranty would be voided.

 

[StellarVixen]

You do know that there is no difference between the Core i7-8700 and the Core i7-8700B that is in the Mac mini, right? Same goes for the Core i3-8100(B) and the Core i5-8500(B). They are simply BGA version of the socketed CPU.

The only thing you gain with using the H-Series found in the 2018 MacBook Pro is a higher price tag and Iris Plus GT3e iGPU. I will take the 65w CPU any day.

I am cautiously optimistic that they have fixed the thermal issues...I don't hear anyone complaining about the iMac Pro. Yes, it uses slightly down clocked CPUs, but still that is a massive thermal load inside that chassis. I think Apple may have learned its lesson the desktop side, at least. MacBook Pros and those silly thin heatsinks is a completely different story.

Yeah, you are right. I was thinking of the CPUs that are in 2018 MBP. My mistake.

I know, I would take the 65W over 45W also, but ONLY with proper cooling. If the cooling is insufficient, I think that other CPUs might have been better solutions.

 

[Peperino]

Probably incorrect. Simply use a bootable external USB 3.0, USB-C, or Thunderbolt SSD in order to attempt a data rescue and/or disk repair of the internal SSD. More than likely to regain use of the internal drive. Or worst-case scenario: continue to use the bootable external drive.
Whether the T2 controlled internal drive can still be accessed when the machine is booted from an external (T2 controller bypassed) drive? Needs further research on that question.

There is nothing to research. I am not talking about data rescue. I am talking that if your internal drive is dead you have a dead computer. YOu cannot replace the Hardrive. Yes, you can add maybe an extrnal bootable, but that defies the purpose of a portable computer. Furthermore, Apple claims to make the computer with recycable material. How is that good when you are creating disposable computer...??

 

[Sabelonada]

Apple keeps saying that these are desktop CPUs in Mac Mini, not laptop ones. And, here they explicitly say that RAM is upgradable. This was shared by one member here earlier today, apparently is is from some pdf from Apple's site, but I cannot find which one and where:

View attachment 800107

I hadn't seen that yet. That's very comforting news.

 

[Peperino]

Rubbish! These prices are very similar to the old Mac mini prices with SSD options, but will give much better performance.
The only losers are those that wanted a cheap dual core HDD option. Or those that wanted internally upgradeable storage drive (I did...but on a mini I am happy to go external using TB3. It sits on my desk, so no problem with permanently attaching external storage unlike with laptops.)

Before long there will be mini shaped eGPU enclosures and mini shaped TB3 HDD and SSD drive arrays. OWC is almost certainly planning something.

What is Rubish is the Mac mini prices. It has a core i3....?? almost outdated processor.
Furthermore, when you start increasing the RAM and the Internal, I rather buy an iMac with a core i7 for the same or even cheaper price. A fully loaded Mac mini, costs 4k...kind of a joke of bad taste...
4k for an core i3 or i5 machine... ???

 

[brendu]

But this is what I'm talking about the base model with the I3,128gb storage, isn't worth 800$+taxes, this is the 500$ machine that apple for no reason other than even bigger profit decided to up the price to 800$.

I agree it’s expensive but I also get that this is a low priority machine for apple and if they are going to allow us to replace the ram ourselves that cuts into their outrageous ram margins so I expected a price increase. Apple knows the majority of people who are going to buy this are willing to pay the extra money for it. I guess the way I see it is I’d rather it be available and expensive than cut altogether which is what it seemed like Apple was going to do.

 

[Sabelonada]

There is nothing to research. I am not talking about data rescue. I am talking that if your internal drive is dead you have a dead computer. YOu cannot replace the Hardrive. Yes, you can add maybe an extrnal bootable, but that defies the purpose of a portable computer. Furthermore, Apple claims to make the computer with recycable material. How is that good when you are creating disposable computer...??

This is a Mac mini, a desktop computer.

I agree that inability to replace the storage sucks. I think however it's something which is going to become industry standard and not exclusive to Apple.

The numbers from a business perspective probably make sense. The failure rate is probably sufficiently low so that by the time the storage fails, the compute is obsolete. It does reek of planned obsolescence.

 

[brendu]

What is Rubish is the Mac mini prices. It has a core i3....?? almost outdated processor.
Furthermore, when you start increasing the RAM and the Internal, I rather buy an iMac with a core i7 for the same or even cheaper price. A fully loaded Mac mini, costs 4k...kind of a joke of bad taste...
4k for an core i3 or i5 machine... ???

That “almost outdated i3” is as powerful as the i5 in the 4K and 5k iMacs that are selling today. People need to get over the name of the chip and focus on the performance.
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This is a Mac mini, a desktop computer.

I agree that inability to replace the storage sucks. I think however it's something which is going to become industry standard and not exclusive to Apple.

The numbers from a business perspective probably make sense. The failure rate is probably sufficiently low so that by the time the storage fails, the compute is obsolete. It does reek of planned obsolescence.

It isn’t planned obsolescence. It’s planned forcing users to pay way too much to upgrade the storage to usable levels at time of purchase. The drive can be replaced by apple if it goes bad. You’ll just have to pay way more than you should have to for it.

 

[Sabelonada]

What is Rubish is the Mac mini prices. It has a core i3....?? almost outdated processor.
Furthermore, when you start increasing the RAM and the Internal, I rather buy an iMac with a core i7 for the same or even cheaper price. A fully loaded Mac mini, costs 4k...kind of a joke of bad taste...
4k for an core i3 or i5 machine... ???

Could you provide another manufacturer who makes a similar sized and spec'd machine? I looked at Dell, HP, and Lenovo, the Mac mini is better than any of the options they provide in a similar footprint. Unfortunately, I couldn't determine if these products use soldered storage or replaceable SSDs. I am guessing SSDs which I too wish were the standard in the Mac lineup.

It's almost like they had the T2 chip and said, "we have a solution, let's find a problem we can apply it to." I think the T2 and soldered storage are steps to further lock down Mac hardware.

 

[Spectrum]

But this is what I'm talking about the base model with the I3,128gb storage, isn't worth 800$+taxes, this is the 500$ machine that apple for no reason other than even bigger profit decided to up the price to 800$.

But the base model is now a quad core desktop CPU with SSD. I Do also think 128Gb is small...but it is comparable to a base level MBPro now and much much cheaper, and a big upgrade from the outgoing 2014.
A 500 dollar base model would have been dual core CPU without hyperthreading, 1TB HDD, and 4GB RAM. Add 100 dollars for each of those components upgraded and ther you have the 800 dollar price.

 

[Peperino]

Afraid I have to disagree with you there. No Mac mini outside of the mid-2011 has ever had a discrete GPU (AMD 6630M) and the BlackMagic eGPU is $699 USD, not $799. Buying an equivalent RX580 8GB card is right at $250 plus or minus depending on the day of the week and the brand or if it’s OC’ed. An eGPU case starts at $200 and goes to $400 to hold that card and provide adequate power. The cost differential ends up at $250, $150 or $50, depending on which enclosure you choose.

As for the integrated GPU, I suggest you go to YouTube and search for “iGPU” and Adobe Premiere before you too incensed about the UHD630. It will do a fine job for most everything people need it to do...at least, let’s see what users find out when they get it in their hands. It’s not Iris Pro, but, well, blame Intel.

Also, 8GB of DRAM is pretty standard for a computer in this price range. Are you expecting more?

Yes, Apple charges too much for DRAM and SSD Storage, it is what it is. Fortunately, we can install our own DRAM now. DDR4 is still expensive, period. DRAM is expensive all the way around right now, DDR3 and DDR4.

Lame excuses for a poor spec overpriced disposable computer.
They are using an outdated core i3 and trying to charge premium price for it?
And do not try to blame it on Intel. It is not Intel who is building this machines. They had 4 years to plan it.
Plenty enough time to put at least a core 5 as a default with a 16gb Ram.
If you are telling me that the price is $499 or $599 for a core i3 machine, then it might be more in line with what they are delivering. but not $799.
Tim Cook greed is beyond belief.

 

[Spectrum]

Dang, looks like no Mac Mini with that integrated GPU.

Everything else was so perfect for me. I don’t need an external gpu, but I am not going to put myself in a bind for another 3-4 years because the graphics card underperforms.

What about living with it now and then buying an ePGU down th line when costs come down? (And performance goes up?)
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Lame excuses for a poor spec overpriced disposable computer.
They are using an outdated core i3 and trying to charge premium price for it?
And do not try to blame it on Intel. It is not Intel who is building this machines. They had 4 years to plan it.
Plenty enough time to put at least a core 5 as a default with a 16gb Ram.
If you are telling me that the price is $499 or $599 for a core i3 machine, then it might be more in line with what they are delivering. but not $799.
Tim Cook greed is beyond belief.

Why is an 8th Gen i3 outdated? 3.6 GHz and 4 separate cores seems pretty good to me.

 

[Sabelonada]

i'm not sure a NAS based device is even comparable as those NAS boxes do not allow you to run your OS of choice.

Have several QNAP based storage devices at work. I can assure you that their built in OS is in no way suitable for day to day use.

Not as a VM solution but as a fast, yet remote storage option. With TB3 and 10Gb Ethernet, it can provide access similar to a spinning platter. It's less than ideal and slower than on board SSD. But I balance that against RAID and NAS characteristics.

I don't consider it a Mac mini replacement, rather a storage option instead of a TB3 SSD drive.
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It isn’t planned obsolescence. It’s planned forcing users to pay way too much to upgrade the storage to usable levels at time of purchase. The drive can be replaced by apple if it goes bad. You’ll just have to pay way more than you should have to for it.

I don't know how much replacing of chips Apple will perform. I would guess if it's under AppleCare they will just provide a replacement and refurbish the formerly "broken" machine.

I am not endorsing the move to soldered on storage. I would prefer Apple use industry standard SSD. It would be great if it offered 2 M2 slots. I have arrived at stage 5 in the grief spectrum, acceptance.

The result is that now we are forced to either pay Apple's premium prices, find an external storage solution, or both.

 

[definitive]

Was it SSD?

Today, a ~250gig SSD can be bought for about the same price as a 500gig HD...

 

[Zdigital2015]

Yeah, you are right. I was thinking of the CPUs that are in 2018 MBP. My mistake.

I know, I would take the 65W over 45W also, but ONLY with proper cooling. If the cooling is insufficient, I think that other CPUs might have been better solutions.

I cannot cogently make an argument that you are wrong on that front. I am eager to see reviews regarding cooling under load, as there is no reason why someone could not use this Mac mini for Logic, Final Cut Pro X or DaVinci Resolve (I know they say the iGPU is less than ideal, so maybe not). It certainly has the grunt, the storage speed and the DRAM expandability to run any of these apps along with others.

I know I sound like a broken record, but I lay the blame for the lackluster performance of the GT2 iGPU right at Intel's feet. They were making real strides and then, boom, nope, we are stopping here and moving people to dGPU development because - we think we can do better than NVIDIA, or some other nonsense.

Looking forward to reading reviews next week when people have these in hand.

 

[Sabelonada]

I cannot cogently make an argument that you are wrong on that front. I am eager to see reviews regarding cooling under load, as there is no reason why someone could not use this Mac mini for Logic, Final Cut Pro X or DaVinci Resolve (I know they say the iGPU is less than ideal, so maybe not). It certainly has the grunt, the storage speed and the DRAM expandability to run any of these apps along with others.

I know I sound like a broken record, but I lay the blame for the lackluster performance of the GT2 iGPU right at Intel's feet. They were making real strides and then, boom, nope, we are stopping here and moving people to dGPU development because - we think we can do better than NVIDIA, or some other nonsense.

Looking forward to reading reviews next week when people have these in hand.

It was probably more like, "Oh Crap! NVidia is eating our lunch in the booming AI field." rather than a deliberate intent to hobble iGPU development. Heck, they even partnered with AMD for a graphics solution. An NVidia chip may have been a better fit for the money.

 

[kazmac]

What about living with it now and then buying an ePGU down th line when costs come down? (And performance goes up?)
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Why is an 8th Gen i3 outdated? 3.6 GHz and 4 separate cores seems pretty good to me.

Two reasons: I need that power out of the box, and I’d rather pay for everything I need when I order the computer, not have to put more money into it later.

It annoys me, because it’s a terrific update (to me) in all other areas.

 

[ignatius345]

I'm surprised nobody seems to have mentioned it yet, but this can no longer be used as an HTPC. At least not the way I use it. As far as I can tell, they ditched the IR.

Could one plug in an IR receiver, I wonder? I think one of the higher-end Harmony systems has a little base station thing you plug into all your AV stuff and it sends the appropriate signal to each of them. Getting that to play with a Mac might be a stretch though!

What I do myself to get audio and video from my Mac to my AV system is to use my iMac as a kind of glorified NAS and use 1) Home Sharing and the "Computers" app on ATV to play video on my projector and 2) for music, I use the Remote app on iOS and pick which set of speakers to route the audio to via AirPlay. Been doing this for a number of years and it's generally a great and low-maintenance setup. I've tinkered with the idea of figuring out Plex or something, but generally Apple's out of the box tools are working for me.

Every once in a while (particularly with more recent versions of iTunes) I find I have to quit/reopen iTunes because it gets unresponsive, but it's not terribly frequent. I have also found that since I upgraded my Airport Express firmware to support AirPlay 2, AirPlay to that device has gotten a bit less reliable. Still works, but it craps out more frequently.
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My sense (in other words, conjecture), is Apple improved the Mini's cooling.

They mentioned that in the keynote the other day. I forget the number but they highlighted some big percentage increase in air flow over the internals. That vent on the back definitely looks larger too.

 

[Zdigital2015]

Lame excuses for a poor spec overpriced disposable computer.
They are using an outdated core i3 and trying to charge premium price for it?
And do not try to blame it on Intel. It is not Intel who is building this machines. They had 4 years to plan it.
Plenty enough time to put at least a core 5 as a default with a 16gb Ram.
If you are telling me that the price is $499 or $599 for a core i3 machine, then it might be more in line with what they are delivering. but not $799.
Tim Cook greed is beyond belief.

The Core i3-8100 CPU is not outdated. Intel has not announced or shipped any 9th Generation Core i3 CPUs as of today (11/1), unless you know something I do not. A currently shipping CPU with no successor is not outdated, no matter how much you want it to be.

Just for grins, I did a PC Part Picker list of decent, but not high end components to build an equivalent to the base Core i3 Mac mini. Here is the link - https://pcpartpicker.com/list/vgNmRJ

The end cost was $822.41

Before you tear it apart...remember that this is a DIY build meant to as closely approximate the Mac mini's functionality, fit and finish as is possible with a Windows PC. Citing the cheapest POS Core i3 on sale at Costco or Best Buy is a waste of my time and yours. Apple does not sell HP Pavilion level crap.

Nothing in this build is particularly extravagant. Anyone who wants to whittle away at the price can do so, but I really do not care, because any other motherboard without Thunderbolt 3 (on board or using an AIC) does not count, period. The SSD is not as fast as what Apple is shipping and the PSU is a bit much for an ITX build. Again, I do not want a NewEgg Shell Shocker $30 PSU or $50 ugly @$$ case.

You can sputter on all you want about Tim Cook, but his job is to maximize shareholder value and profit for the company. He works at the pleasure of the Board of Directors and Apple's shareholders. He is not Steve Jobs, nor can he act like Steve Jobs in how he runs Apple. He is not the visionary, the RDF generator or some mythical creature who had the fortune to be in the right place at the right time when the modern home PC was invented in a garage.

FWIW, I have my own set of issues with how he runs Apple, but unless I go back to school, get my Masters in Business from Duke Fuqua School of Business, and challenge him for his job, I am going to accept his and the other executives judgment in how Apple should be run.
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It was probably more like, "Oh Crap! NVidia is eating our lunch in the booming AI field." rather than a deliberate intent to hobble iGPU development. Heck, they even partnered with AMD for a graphics solution. An NVidia chip may have been a better fit for the money.

At this point, I am not the only one who is wondering what Intel is doing...I have to think that Apple is as well. However, they are really the only vendor who can actually wave goodbye to Intel. Microsoft cannot, which means that neither can HP, Dell, Acer, Lenovo or Asus. Can you imagine what its like to have Intel essentially controlling your destiny? If I was Apple, I would want to move to my own in-house CPUs as soon as humanly possible.

I do not care for NVIDIA either...I did not like the strong-arm tactics of the GPP earlier this year, and I think they get way too much of a pass from too many. There is too much emphasis on the GPU by way too many on these forums, as though moving to NVIDIA would fix everything for Apple. Its not as bad as WCCFTech or some other sites, but the over the top worship of any tech company is bad for everyone involved. Again, just my 2¢.

 

[vailr]

if your internal drive is dead you have a dead computer. YOu cannot replace the Hardrive. Yes, you can add maybe an extrnal bootable, but that defies the purpose of a portable computer.

What you like to call a "dead internal drive" is (more often than not) something that can be fixed with a 3rd-party software, such as SpinRite from grc.com. The only question would be: does SpinRite work on a T2-controlled SSD?
Of course, a Time Machine backup or a complete re-format and re-install of macOS (booted from a macOS installation USB thumb drive) may also be viable options.