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From my understanding of Regulation E, the additional liability applies only if the card itself is lost or stolen. If it's cloned or defrauded through some other means, it wouldn't be an "accepted access device" and thus liability couldn't transfer to the cardholder. (Someone correct me if I'm wrong on this.)

From talking to a few friends at the Fed, your reading is technically correct. The problem is that the consumer may have to prove that he or she was not at fault. For good banks, this is not an issue, but for others, it can be a real problem.

Additionally, there is a $50 maximum for credit cards too, not $0. But as you mention, it's $0 in practice. Plus, it's your own money that goes missing in the meantime with debit card fraud, even if it's only for a day or two.

Absolutely correct, hence my statement “$0 for most cards”, including the Apple Card, the topic of this thread. :)

You did raise an interesting point, that baymowe335 also raises in a different way. One benefit to some of a non-cash reward is that one is encouraged to save it, where as cash just gets spent pretty quickly. While in some cases, of people would be better off saving the cash towards a goal, it is hard for many people. It is why people like getting bigger tax refund checks, where they would be better off just having kept the extra and had a tiny refund.
 
The only good thing i like (apart from the design), is the one-time virtual number...

How does one prove you own the card at a merchant if they don't support Apple Pay? If there is no signature to prove its you.

The interest rate is a tad high.... Mine CC is only 13.49%pa

The only think i wish banks still did the virtual one-time CC.

You don’t. The issuing bank does not require a signature. The network does not require a signature. So no signature required. Like other banks, they will rely on knowing your spending patterns, travel plans, etc. to flag potentially fake spending.

Traditional security measures will likely be used but the Apple Card differentiates itself from other credit cards in that all important information needed to process a transaction is all located in Apple Wallet on your iPhone. As far as I understand it, you just can't go to a non-Apple Pay terminal and tap - tap is only available via iPhone, instead you need to insert chip and enter in the code. Assuming you are the only who knows the code, fraud is less likely in that there is only one way of using the physical card (chip) and the code/authentication is only available in Wallet, which is likely going to be secured.
 
Traditional security measures will likely be used but the Apple Card differentiates itself from other credit cards in that all important information needed to process a transaction is all located in Apple Wallet on your iPhone. As far as I understand it, you just can't go to a non-Apple Pay terminal and tap - tap is only available via iPhone, instead you need to insert chip and enter in the code. Assuming you are the only who knows the code, fraud is less likely in that there is only one way of using the physical card (chip) and the code/authentication is only available in Wallet, which is likely going to be secured.
There is no code in america (assuming you refer to chip and pin - we don’t do that for credit cards).
 
There is no code in america (assuming you refer to chip and pin - we don’t do that for credit cards).

There are actually a very few that do. That said, it's very possible you'll almost never be asked for it in the US considering that stores seem to be disabling support on their terminals (and why wouldn't they when PIN's probably uncommon enough that supporting it would possibly be more of a hassle than not).
 
Yeah, you just repeated yourself again...think what you want.

United is joining Delta in further devaluing their miles. These changes will make it even harder to arbitrage between cash and award miles. Since I joined Milage Plus and American Advantage in the early 80’s, miles have continued to devalue. This latest change will only accelerate that change.
 
United is joining Delta in further devaluing their miles. These changes will make it even harder to arbitrage between cash and award miles. Since I joined Milage Plus and American Advantage in the early 80’s, miles have continued to devalue. This latest change will only accelerate that change.
Miles have been devalued, but they are FAR more valuable than 1 cents per point. I just booked a trip to Tokyo with 30,000 miles on Japan Airlines. I only had to spend $10,000 on travel and food to get those 30,000 points, and the ticket was worth $2,100.

Converted to cash, the 30,000 points would be $300.

Thinking another way, I got a 20% rebate on my $10,000 in food/travel spend I would have spent no matter what.
 
Miles have been devalued, but they are FAR more valuable than 1 cents per point. I just booked a trip to Tokyo with 30,000 miles on Japan Airlines. I only had to spend $10,000 on travel and food to get those 30,000 points, and the ticket was worth $2,100.

Converted to cash, the 30,000 points would be $300.

Thinking another way, I got a 20% rebate on my $10,000 in food/travel spend I would have spent no matter what.

A realistic expectation for most trips is somewhere in the range of 1.5-1.75cpp, at least based on my experience. Of course, depending on the airline and destination, you could very well end up doing a lot better than that.

That said, the thought of going back to collecting cash back has crossed my mind a few times recently.
 
A realistic expectation for most trips is somewhere in the range of 1.5-1.75cpp, at least based on my experience. Of course, depending on the airline and destination, you could very well end up doing a lot better than that.

That said, the thought of going back to collecting cash back has crossed my mind a few times recently.
With Chase, you can always do cash back. As I said, the miles or point transfer to other programs like hotels are soooo much better than cash. It isn’t close, as I showed in my example.
 
There is no code in america (assuming you refer to chip and pin - we don’t do that for credit cards).
I don't know what is required in the U.S. but knowing that you cannot use the physical Apple Card for contactless payment , there will need to be some sort of authentication while using the chip.
 
I don't know what is required in the U.S. but knowing that you cannot use the physical Apple Card for contactless payment , there will need to be some sort of authentication while using the chip.

The US typically doesn't use PIN for credit cards, even chipped ones. (And arguably debit cards aren't actually chip and PIN either since the latter can be skipped.)
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With Chase, you can always do cash back. As I said, the miles or point transfer to other programs like hotels are soooo much better than cash. It isn’t close, as I showed in my example.

Oh I'm not disagreeing. I probably wouldn't solely use Chase if I went straight cash back though; something like Citi Double Cash combined with either Chase Freedom or Discover It would net the most if I went that route.
 
The US typically doesn't use PIN for credit cards, even chipped ones. (And arguably debit cards aren't actually chip and PIN either since the latter can be skipped.)
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Oh I'm not disagreeing. I probably wouldn't solely use Chase if I went straight cash back though; something like Citi Double Cash combined with either Chase Freedom or Discover It would net the most if I went that route.
Reserve is 3% on all dining and travel.
 
The US typically doesn't use PIN for credit cards, even chipped ones. (And arguably debit cards aren't actually chip and PIN either since the latter can be skipped.)
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Interesting. So everything is tap? What happens if tap is not accepted?
 
Interesting. So everything is tap? What happens if tap is not accepted?

Contactless cards aren't really a thing in the US either (but they're slowly being issued more and more). Typically you insert and remove and that's it, though you may occasionally be asked to sign for purchases.
 
Contactless cards aren't really a thing in the US either (but they're slowly being issued more and more). Typically you insert and remove and that's it, though you may occasionally be asked to sign for purchases.

All my credit cards just recently got upgraded to contactless. Too bad there’s still a slew of places that don’t support it at a minimum, let alone Apple Pay.
 
All my credit cards just recently got upgraded to contactless. Too bad there’s still a slew of places that don’t support it at a minimum, let alone Apple Pay.

I only have one card that is contactless (Cosco Visa) and when I tried to use it at few stores that accept Apple Pay, I could not - go figure; however, it works great at Costco and oversees. The payment system in the USA is such a cluster f...
 
All my credit cards just recently got upgraded to contactless. Too bad there’s still a slew of places that don’t support it at a minimum, let alone Apple Pay.

Most do now. They might not know that they do, though, and insert anyway (if they're one of the places where customers generally don't handle the terminal).

As for whether we'll ever reach 100%, I feel like we won't without it being made mandatory.

I only have one card that is contactless (Cosco Visa) and when I tried to use it at few stores that accept Apple Pay, I could not - go figure; however, it works great at Costco and oversees. The payment system in the USA is such a cluster f...

It's because Citi neglected to have support for the older contactless standard (MSD) that's still used here. Chase, OTOH, included support in theirs and thus their contactless cards work pretty much anywhere AP does.
 
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TIL; all my financial information is only worth one small piece of titanium. Because I gave it all away to get my piece shipped in 3-5 days.
 
TIL; all my financial information is only worth one small piece of titanium. Because I gave it all away to get my piece shipped in 3-5 days.
I wouldn’t worry about it too much, Equifax already gave that away a couple years ago!
 
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