Apple CEO Tim Cook: Sideloading Apps Would 'Destroy the Security' of the iPhone

[Haiku_Oezu]

As a dev I can easily sideload ipa’s on my iPhone with Cydia Impactor and my phone still hasn’t been destroyed

What Tim really fears is devs ditching the store so they don’t have to pay 30%.
Honestly I’d respect Apple more if they just admitted this.

Like yes, technically speaking it’s dangerous to sideload apps from random sources, but a) it’s not catastrophic (the sandbox and other restrictions still apply, sideload is not jailbreaking) and b) it’s completely optional
If iOS started allowing sideloading tomorrow most devs will likely stay on the App Store, only Spotify, Epic Games and similar behemoths will have the resources to handle this business model.

Devs and power users however will greatly appreciate the hassle-free way to make more with their devices.

It’s really that simple.

 

[Absolute Trainwreck]

Can someone name an app that they’d side load on their iPhone right now? And why they aren’t able to get it in the App Store?

xCloud and YouTube Vanced in a heart beat (although the latter is android only but I’m sure that’d change quick)

 

[Robospungo]

You heard it from Tim Cook himself: MacOS has “destroyed security”.

Avoid MacOS at all costs if you want to stay secure.

 

[alex2792]

Can someone name an app that they’d side load on their iPhone right now? And why they aren’t able to get it in the App Store?

Torrent clients, emulators, cloud gaming apps, alternative web browsers (not safari wrappers). They’re kept out of the App Store due to Apple’s arbitrary and anticompetitive policies.

 

[machinesworking]

What blows me away is we has a tech conference talking to the Apple CEO, and the video sound is a total absolute mess. muted at the beginning, feedback delay, then just quiet, about 1/4 the volume of a regular video.

 

[IG88]

Disagree. macOS security isn’t “destroyed” by allowing side loading. There are ways of allowing apps from outside the AppStore in a secure fashion.

What he really meant to say is that it’d destroy App Store revenue and entirely eliminate the embarrassment that is apple arcade.

this excuse might fly over certain peoples heads but anyone with even a modicum of technical knowledge will roll their eyes reading that headline

Agreed. Tim has already testified under oath that blocking sideloading is about protecting their revenue stream. He can't put that cat back in the bag now.

Cook, under oath:

"If we allowed developers to link out like that, we would give up our monetization."

He was specifically referring to subscription links, but same effect. If side loading is allowed, they're giving up monetization as well.

 

[Rogifan]

Ok fair enough re the point about side loading.

But that doesn’t mean that because there’s no side loading, that also means that we also have to have:

- Apple needs to take 15 or 30 percent commission
- the only payment method is Apple Pay
- and that Apple can use iOS/Mac fo constantly promote its own bolt-ones, disadvantaging 3rd parties.

It’s PR rubbish that Apple is bundling all of these things together.

Matt Yglesias wrote an interesting piece about Apple and the App Store. That basically Apple stumbled on to a revenue stream that they can’t give up but it’s one they don’t really need and one that is causing them a lot of headaches.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1405113165940248582

I always felt categorizing the 30% commission on IAP as ‘services’ was wrong. To me charging rent or a fee to developers for access to customers isn’t a service like Fitness+ or TV+. Grow the other components of services and dramatically reduce the rent seeking portion.

 

[jk1221]

Can someone name an app that they’d side load on their iPhone right now? And why they aren’t able to get it in the App Store?

Look at the cydia repos and there are literally hundreds of "apps"

Stuff Apple would not approve to get into the App Store. Or smaller devs who don't want to pay Apple to distribute it.

 

[Rogifan]

Torrent clients, emulators, cloud gaming apps, alternative web browsers (not safari wrappers). They’re kept out of the App Store due to Apple’s arbitrary and anticompetitive policies.

To me none of those except maybe torrent clients should be kept out of the App Store. And I’ve been clear I don’t think Apple deserves 30% of every digital transaction. Especially if it’s a transaction that happens once the app is downloaded. As far as I’m concerned once you download an app and open it up you’re no longer in Apple’s App Store.

 

[macsound1]

I know most people on this forum are computer people. They know their way around.

What I worry about are those who aren't pros or nerds. They're the majority.
They're the ones who'd install something accidentally from a website, clicking through those confirmation dialog boxes just to get them to go away.

While I think it would be nice, I can see it becoming a huge problem quickly.

As far as the Mac being ok, well the Mac was the underdog and for the most part it still is. Everyone knows that iPhones are the norm, at least for the type of person who hackers want to target. No one targets someone with the low price S10 who doesn't have anything of value to hack.

 

[jk1221]

I know most people on this forum are computer people. They know their way around.

What I worry about are those who aren't pros or nerds. They're the majority.
They're the ones who'd install something accidentally from a website, clicking through those confirmation dialog boxes just to get them to go away.

While I think it would be nice, I can see it becoming a huge problem quickly.

As far as the Mac being ok, well the Mac was the underdog and for the most part it still is. Everyone knows that iPhones are the norm, at least for the type of person who hackers want to target. No one targets someone with the low price S10 who doesn't have anything of value to hack.

No one is saying free reign. It should come out of the box off. If you WANT to turn it on it will be a buried setting that you must intentionally turn on. The option.

It cannot accidentally be used.

I don't use Mac but isn't there something similar there already that you have to actively enable 3rd party apps to install? I don't see why the phone is any different.

Or why someone non-techy would be different on a phone than on a Mac under the same rule.

 

[Apple_Robert]

I don't believe a word this man says. Everything he speaks and does is in the best interest of one party - Apple. Sometimes those interests align with users, which is awesome when it happens, but other times it's the exact opposite. The difference seems more like a matter of luck or convenience rather than a company actually endeavoring to look out for its customers.

And how many Apple products do you own?

 

[icymountain]

One thing is for sure, sideloading would destroy some business plans...

 

[Apple_Robert]

I agree with Tim. If people want to sideload apps, go to Android. Apple shouldn't have to put themselves at risk, because some here think that Apple should let them do whatever they want. You knew about the walled orchard before you walked inside and bought products. If you no longer like how Apple is being run, you have the ability to leave any time you want.

 

[B4U]

Is that why I have to download the same damn app update on multiple iOS devices instead of once on iTunes and sync them all?

 

[Apple_Robert]

"We've been focused on privacy for over a decade. We see it as a basic human right. A fundamental human right".....except in China.

If I am not mistaken, you have made posts on the forum about buying Apple products. If my memory is accurate, your post would have more meaning if your actions followed suit and you didn't make any purchases from Apple. Seems to me, that if you truly believed Apple allowed abuse of its workers to happen in China, you wouldn't want to buy products from said company.

Your words are hollow.

Iphone 12 deals June (Verizon)

I love saving money as well, which is why I'll be getting the 13 pro for $700 off at launch. Saving money and getting what you want aren't mutually exclusive.

forums.macrumors.com

 

[gotluck]

I agree with Tim. If people want to sideload apps, go to Android. Apple shouldn't have to put themselves at risk, because some here think that Apple should let them do whatever they want. You knew about the walled orchard before you walked inside and bought products. If you no longer like how Apple is being run, you have the ability to leave any time you want.

I would if android was as good as iOS (IMO). It's kind of a lesser of 2 evils thing for me

sideloading isnt worth having what comes with a google OS

 

[citysnaps]

I think that if Apple was to allow side loading, they’d make it so that when you install any side loaded apps, it voids your warranty and whenever you try to contact support, they’d tell you that you have side loaded apps onto your device and they can’t help you, because they don’t know what’s happening on your device.

*Should* side loading be mandated, I'd absolutely be for that position by Apple. Of course there's going to be loads of moan-n-whines. But taking responsibility for your actions, including bad decisions, is part of life.

 

[firewood]

Developers can already sideload any app for which they have source code or a buildable Xcode project.

 

[Apple_Robert]

I would if android was as good as iOS (IMO). It's kind of a lesser of 2 evils thing for me

sidloading isnt worth having a google OS

Understood and smart not to get caught up in that trap. A lot of people around here buy Apple products after being informed ahead of time, and then complain that Apple isn't allowing them to do what they want. Apple has never promised a user can do whatever he or she wants with Apple's OS.

 

[zanoii]

Side loading should be up to the end user. It doesn't compromise the security of the phone if the user knows what the hail he's doing.

I agree with your second statement but disagree that it should be up to the end user. The problem is that the average phone user thinks they know what they're doing but rarely has a clue. Yes, Donning-Kruger.

I suspect we'll see the world's largest mobile botnet within 18 months from sideloading being enabled on iPhones.

 

[Cesar Battistini]

It would.

My grandma would click in a link, them Facebook or whatever will send her to a not so well regulated store.

And right there she is being tracked and using her card information god knows where.
And the intrusive ads, and the malwares that would be created.

The iPhone is the iPhone, because of the App Store, and most apps exist because of the popularity and ease of use/security of the iPhone.

 

[Zmmyt]

I guess if push comes to shove they would “just” start a new company called Peaches which offers similar hardware with compatible OS.

 

[RedRage]

Let the user decide. I can figure it out myself. If people are uncomfortable sideloading then don't do it. I don't need Apple to hold my hand for everything like a lot of people here.

 

[macsound1]

No one is saying free reign. It should come out of the box off. If you WANT to turn it on it will be a buried setting that you must intentionally turn on. The option.

It cannot accidentally be used.

I don't use Mac but isn't there something similar there already that you have to actively enable 3rd party apps to install? I don't see why the phone is any different.

Or why someone non-techy would be different on a phone than on a Mac under the same rule.

There kind of is a similar setting on NEW macs, but using my example, most people don't have new macs, even if they do have new iPhones, so they're not accustomed to these features.

Also, apps have the ability to move you out of the app, into settings and the screen where they want you to give consent. Some apps may not even function without this consent, even if they don't need it.

That's where the problem lies. Apps asking for control they actually don't need, so they can use it for nefarious purposes, without oversight.